Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks
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@accalia said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
I'll even install safari for them and put a custom mac-alike skin on their desktop so they can have a familiar experience as they navigate their way to the web browser they will do their entire job in.
That's more than I would do, since what I would do is say "If you want to work here, you use Windows just like everyone else. We're not doubling or tripling our hardware budget just so you can have an overpriced slab of style over substance with a half-eaten fruit on it."
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@RaceProUK i wouldn't object to it if their IT costs came out of their department budget. if they did then whatever it's their budget they're wasting.
no, it's the fact that it comes out of our budget that irks me.
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@accalia said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
no, it's the fact that it comes out of our budget that irks me.
Probably because IT fought tooth and nail to make it be part of your budget.
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@dkf said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
@accalia said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
no, it's the fact that it comes out of our budget that irks me.
Probably because IT fought tooth and nail to make it be part of your budget.
no one that is currently in the department did nor would have.
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@accalia said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
currently
What's that got to do with anything? Some previous odious empire-builder did it, then swanned off with the sweet smell of success wafting around him, while the people left (and hired in to replace him) are left with the stink that ensues.
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@dkf said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
@accalia said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
currently
What's that got to do with anything?
it means there's no one here i can yell at and say "this is your fault!"
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@RaceProUK said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
@accalia said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
I'll even install safari for them and put a custom mac-alike skin on their desktop so they can have a familiar experience as they navigate their way to the web browser they will do their entire job in.
That's more than I would do, since what I would do is say "If you want to work here, you use Windows just like everyone else. We're not doubling or tripling our hardware budget just so you can have an overpriced slab of style over substance with a half-eaten fruit on it."
That's why the company I am in the middle of helping get off the ground is expecting the employees to finance their own hardware. You want something? Pay for it yourself, and then put it on your taxes as an "unreimbursed business expense".
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@Lorne-Kates said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
Why are we even arguing about keyboards, when the future is touchscreen?
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@abarker said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
You want something? Pay for it yourself, and then put it on your taxes as an "unreimbursed business expense".
Welcome to having no control over what systems you work with. And you've got to work with it because you gave them permission. You'll also have no right to log in for administrative purposes; your employees will own the systems, not the company.
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@dkf No big deal. The only thing we will control are the cloud based Azure and TFS, and we'll control access to that based on corporate email accounts. We aren't planning on having any physical offices, and we aren't planning on messing with AD, so no worries there. In other words, if you buy something that you can't work on, you done fucked up.
Edit: I should mention that this is for a software company. If you can't manage your own shit, we don't want you. We'll have access controlled well enough to prevent issues from incorrect checking and idiots connecting to Azure when they shouldn't but you'd need that even in a traditional environment.
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@abarker said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
I should mention that this is for a software company.
Ah, that's mostly different. Anyone dealing with a company with many different disciplines involved will either not have that luxury or will have to man up and suck it up. (This second option is what we do, FWIW. It drives some of our IT management round the bend, but what we do is just too damn diverse to be able to use just the same old conventional kit for everything.)
Though will the secretary also have to follow the same rules? You'll want to have a secretary soon to take the load of silly administrativa off the shoulders of the developers, and the skill set there is usually different (and the payscale correspondingly lower).
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@Grunnen said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
the original Macintosh keyboard:
Except that it isn’t — the one you picture was apparently offered with the Mac II and SE (says Wikipedia). This is the keyboard that came with the first models of Mac:
Not sure what technology is underneath the keys, but I own a Mac Plus whose keyboard feels like it uses some kind of mechanical switch, so I suppose the earlier model might have as well.
@mott555 said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
The Dell ones are the worst of the worst
Around 2009 I found a couple of pretty old, and quite large, Dell keyboards that used a membrane, but typed a lot better than the newer Dell and HP ones we had lying around. The layout on the one that felt best (a tan and brown one, so it was old enough that it dated from before Dell switched to grey-black) was one I didn’t recognize so I swapped the keycaps with those from an identical grey one on which the keys didn’t feel as good.
@dkf said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
Recent Mac systems have been really tuned around laptops, much more than Windows ever was.
Which is why I specify the full-sized keyboard when I buy a new one.
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@mott555 said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
I'm guessing none of you guys actually type when you work.
Why would I?
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@aliceif Opens a mostly blank page in Opera here.
No love for Opera
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And now that I'm back at my desk at work, I see that my Mac external keyboard does have a delete key. delete ⌦ I just don't use it much.
This is the US version of the keyboard. (I've got the UK version which rarranges a few things elsewhere.)
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@dkf Do Home/End on that keyboard actually do anything?
There's a Windows keyboard plugged into mine and they did nothing on that, so I had to use Karabiner to tweak the mapping.
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@loopback0 said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
Do Home/End on that keyboard actually do anything?
Yes. They do the usual expected thing. (Just tested…)
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@dkf said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
Mac external keyboard does have a delete key. delete ⌦ I just don't use it much.
wtf is wrong with you?
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@dkf said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
They do the usual expected thing
Which is different to the usual expected thing on Windows IIRC
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@Jaloopa said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
Which is different to the usual expected thing on Windows IIRC
Yes.
I have it remapped to work like Windows does.
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@accalia said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
@blakeyrat said in Dev tools worth buying for myself?:
Because mechanical keyboards suck ass?
that may be your opinion. but that would be because you have never actually tried typing on a keyboard powered by Cherry MX Brown switches.
I know that the Cherry switches have a reputation for being good but I've never gotten around to actually trying them. I've just always used relatively inexpensive keyboards and really haven't had a problem. However, I have to admit, this one sounds ...... interesting:
"he N-key rollover function permits up to 104 keys to be pressed at the same time in PS2 mode without conflict"
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@El_Heffe hmm... rosewill. mixed feeling about them as a manufacturer.
when they make a good product they knock it out of the park, but when they don't they're.... just not there..... y'know.
havent tried their keyboards, but that one has decent reviews.
if you're interested give it a shot.
the black switches are a bit too heavy for typing on long term, they're good for kiosks or POS machines that need to stand up to massive amounts of abuse.
the blues, reds, and browns are about the same actrivation force and are good for typing. the blues are audible clicky with tactile feedback, the browns are tactile feedback only, and the reds are pure linear.
i recommend the browns. they're still fairly noisy compared tomembrane switches, but not so much that you'll get any but the most anal retentive coworkers complaining.
note though, that n-key rollover only works if you plug it into a PS/2 port. if you plug it into USB you only get 6 key rollover.
probably won't matter unless you are going to use it for gaming, but it's important to remember.
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@El_Heffe said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
@accalia said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
@blakeyrat said in Dev tools worth buying for myself?:
Because mechanical keyboards suck ass?
that may be your opinion. but that would be because you have never actually tried typing on a keyboard powered by Cherry MX Brown switches.
I know that the Cherry switches have a reputation for being good but I've never gotten around to actually trying them. I've just always used relatively inexpensive keyboards and really haven't had a problem. However, I have to admit, this one sounds ...... interesting:
"he N-key rollover function permits up to 104 keys to be pressed at the same time in PS2 mode without conflict"That's exactly what I have at home. I think I got an open-box deal or something for like $70. Brown switches are the way to go IMO. I've seen standard keyboards that are louder than brown switches.
Rosewill is Newegg's house brand. They're actually pretty underrated IMO.
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@mott555 said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
They're actually pretty underrated IMO.
very much so, there are big name brands that do worse than rosewill.
all in all i'd give rosewill a B++ grade, which puts it on par with most of the big-but-not-top-of-the-line brands.
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@accalia I know the Mac users have your panties firmly in a wad...how do you feel about $500 Chromebooks?
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@El_Heffe said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
Brown Switches
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chromebooks? fscking fantastic devices.
hell 99.9% of the time we're in the browser anyway so why not build a device around that.
$500 is a bit much for a chromebook, the $199 models are quite acceptable usually.
if your workflow supports it, go for it!
i own two, a pixel and a $199 throwaway that i take with me to robotics events, because the students are rough on laptops and it's nice to not have to worry about a 1k device. 200$ is an annoyance when it breaks, $1k is rage inducing.
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@accalia I was looking more for a comment about how only idiots would pay $500 for a Chromebook, when as you say you can get a good one for a hell of a lot cheaper.
But that model is "Enterprise grade".
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@Polygeekery said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
how only idiots would pay $500 for a Chromebook
it depends on what you are looking for. the cheaper ones are plastic bodied with ARM chips so they have performance issues with massive amounts of tabs, fullHD or 4k video, and with some online games. the 500is$ ones tend to be intel architecture and more powerful, so they handle the heavier loads better. they also tend to be aluminum or magnesium chassis and so are more durable, if that's what you're looking for.
i'd still recommend you get in on the $200 range to start with, and move up to a more expensive model if you find the lower end model can't quite keep up with your workload.
you probably don't need to go to the top of the line and get the chromebook pixel like i did. though it is nice to have the windows VM i can boot up when i need it on my chromebook.
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@accalia So to summarise:
Spending a lot of money on a keyboard: good
Spending a lot of money on a laptop: good
Spending a lot of money on a different laptop: bad
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@Jaloopa ITYM
Spending a lot of money on a mechanical keyboard: good.But yes, otherwise, correct.
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@Jaloopa said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
pending a lot of money on a keyboard: good
spending a lot of money on a good keyboard, yes that is good. i dislike typing on treacle to the point that i purchase a decent keyboard so i don't have to.
@Jaloopa said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
Spending a lot of money on a laptop: good
if it has sufficient value to you and you are spending your own money, go for it.
i'll offer council in choosing the one to buy, but it's your money mate, i'll not tell you that it would be better to flush it down the toilet than buy an iFriut.
@Jaloopa said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
Spending a lot of money on a different laptop: bad
spending a lot of my departments money on a laptop that costs 3 to 5x the standard issue laptop and needs additional expensive hardware to properly integrate with our work network, bad.
you want an apple laptop, buy your own, don't use my department's budget for it.
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@accalia said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
my work laptop [wa]s a clunker
I hear a razor carefully applied to a couple of circuit board traces can generate a new-equipment event.
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@FrostCat said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
I hear a razor carefully applied to a couple of circuit board traces can generate a new-equipment event.
yeah, it'll do that.
it's also amazing what a etherkiller can do.
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@accalia said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
you want an apple laptop, buy your own, don't use my department's budget for it.
What if they wanted a $2k HP laptop?
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@loopback0 said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
What if they wanted a $2k HP laptop?
is it the standard issue $700ish laptop?
No? then they can cough up the cash for it. if they want us to pay for it we'll provide a standard issue laptop, and they can be happy with it.
the standard issue laptops we're handing out now are nice i5s with 8GB of ram and a SSD. decent devices, they'll do anything a salesperson or fingerpainter can throw at them without complaint.
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@El_Heffe n-key rollover is more or less a PS/2 standard feature, btw. The fact that you don't see it in USB is apparently because hardware makers are too lazy to write a device driver.
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@accalia said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
it's also amazing what a etherkiller can do.
Yes, but that's a lot less subtle. The people in IT are likely to ask what that smoky smell is.
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@FrostCat that's when you plug one end into the wall jack and look at them meaningfully as you move the other end towards the nearest outlet.... slowly...
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@accalia said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
i5s with 8GB of ram and a SSD
Available on the $900ish Macbooks. So someone's not only been conned into buying servers, they're buying the wrong expensive laptops.
Your IT department needs better control over its own budget.
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@dkf said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
@abarker said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
I should mention that this is for a software company.
Ah, that's mostly different. Anyone dealing with a company with many different disciplines involved will either not have that luxury or will have to man up and suck it up. (This second option is what we do, FWIW. It drives some of our IT management round the bend, but what we do is just too damn diverse to be able to use just the same old conventional kit for everything.)
Though will the secretary also have to follow the same rules? You'll want to have a secretary soon to take the load of silly administrativa off the shoulders of the developers, and the skill set there is usually different (and the payscale correspondingly lower).
We already have an accountant (she also happens to be one of the partners and is married to the managing partner) who is handling all of that for us at the moment. She already has her hardware. If things get to the point where we need additional accounting resources, we plan to outsource the accounting and she'll keep handling the non-technical administrative shit.
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@accalia said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
the standard issue laptops we're handing out now are nice i5s with 8GB of ram and a SSD. decent devices, they'll do anything a salesperson or fingerpainter can throw at them without complaint.
What model laptop can you buy with those specs for $700?
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@Polygeekery HP Elite books, it's the bunk discount we get for purchasing a boatload of them at a time that drives the price down to that level.
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@loopback0 said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
Available on the $900ish Macbooks.
good, now get them on $700 machines like our PCs are, and eliminate the extra overhead costs of managing Apple devices and Windows devices on the same network and getting them to play nice and i'll withdraw my complaint about the macs on our network.
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@accalia said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
eliminate the extra overhead costs of managing Apple devices and Windows devices on the same network
Easy, install Windows on the Macs
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@accalia said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
HP Elite books
I will never touch another HP product in my life.
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@accalia said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
good, now get them on $700 machines like our PCs are
My point was rather that they don't need to be 3 times the cost, just a little bit more.
@accalia said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
eliminate the extra overhead costs of managing Apple devices and Windows devices on the same network
Easy. Turn off all those Apple servers someone told your IT department they needed.
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@Polygeekery said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
I will never touch another HP product in my life.
There have been some good Elitebooks.
I prefer them to the Lenovo Thinkpads solely because of the retarded trackpads the newer Thinkpads have (or had until recently, in fairness).
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@loopback0 said in Mechanical keyboards, now available at food trucks:
There have been some good Elitebooks.
I prefer them to the Lenovo Thinkpads solely because of the retarded trackpads the newer Thinkpads have (or had until recently, in fairness).Their product quality has went to hell in recent years, and their customer support is less than non-existent. In the past year I have fought those bastards on two printers that we POS from new, and 4 desktops that all shit themselves within the first 3 months and HP support was absolute shit on all of them. This was all with one client in under a year.
So fuck HP. I now advise the rest of our clients to not buy HP products.