Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition
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@hungrier said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
Instead of keeping it charged up, you
just charge the supercap from your carinstall a good battery in your carFTFY
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@TimeBandit Yeah, trying to "trickle-charge" off an already almost flat accumulator sounds to me like trying to make sure that the accu is completely dead afterwards.
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@Rhywden The idea is to use your battery to charge the supercap and have it deliver a 12V/whatever (I've seen claims of up to 800A) jolt at once to get the engine going, which will then start charging your battery like normal. If you don't have enough juice for that, then yes your car battery will be completely flat and you'll have to find something else to charge the supercap, or some other way to jump start.
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@hungrier said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
or some other way to jump start.
If it's manual, you can push-start it
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@FrostCat said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
You're probably pretty sure I'm kidding. I'm almost not. A significant fraction bus drivers are active assholes who try to fuck over drivers. (For example, the ones on a narrow two-lane two-way street who collect 10-15 cars behind them and don't pull over to allow some of their retinue to pass.)
If they're going at least the speed limit, I don't blame them. They have no obligation to break the law or to go out of their way to enable others to.
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@hungrier said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@Rhywden The idea is to use your battery to charge the supercap and have it deliver a 12V/whatever (I've seen claims of up to 800A) jolt at once to get the engine going, which will then start charging your battery like normal. If you don't have enough juice for that, then yes your car battery will be completely flat and you'll have to find something else to charge the supercap, or some other way to jump start.
Well, yeah, I got that. But there's usually a reason why it doesn't deliver the needed power anymore... and over-discharging an accumulator comes under the heading of Bad IdeaTM
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@jinpa said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
or to go out of their way to enable others to.
Actually, yes they do. If they're impeding the flow of traffic, even if that's over the limit, then they're in the wrong.
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@dcon said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@jinpa said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
or to go out of their way to enable others to.
Actually, yes they do. If they're impeding the flow of traffic, even if that's over the limit, then they're in the wrong.
I disagree absolutely. They are noble people, and I commend them for it. The fact that the kind of people who get angry at them get angry them is a sign that they're doing the right thing.
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Oh shit, not this argument again. (BTW, those who impede the flow of traffic are less safe than those who violate an arbitrary speed limit that isn't scientifically determined using the Solomon curve.)
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@lolwhat said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
Oh shit, not this argument again. (BTW, those who impede the flow of traffic are less safe than those who violate an arbitrary speed limit that isn't scientifically determined using the Solomon curve.)
Your BTW is incorrect.
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@jinpa You call down the thunder, and now you got it:
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@jinpa said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@dcon said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@jinpa said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
or to go out of their way to enable others to.
Actually, yes they do. If they're impeding the flow of traffic, even if that's over the limit, then they're in the wrong.
I disagree absolutely. They are noble people, and I commend them for it. The fact that the kind of people who get angry at them get angry them is a sign that they're doing the right thing.
Anger has nothing to do with it. If a driver is causing people to have to pass on the right, they are required to move to the right - regardless of how fast they're going. They are not "noble", they're self-righteous pricks.
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@lolwhat said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@jinpa You call down the thunder, and now you got it:
Can't watch it here, but there's no legitimate point that couldn't be made in text.
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@lolwhat said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
Solomon curve
Just an FYI:
Subsequent research suggests significant biases in the Solomon study, which may cast doubt on its findings.
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@jinpa said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@lolwhat said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@jinpa You call down the thunder, and now you got it:
Can't watch it here, but there's no legitimate point that couldn't be made in text.
And it's quicker to refer to a video that already hits the right points, than to write a summary.
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@Rhywden said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@hungrier said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@Rhywden The idea is to use your battery to charge the supercap and have it deliver a 12V/whatever (I've seen claims of up to 800A) jolt at once to get the engine going, which will then start charging your battery like normal. If you don't have enough juice for that, then yes your car battery will be completely flat and you'll have to find something else to charge the supercap, or some other way to jump start.
Well, yeah, I got that. But there's usually a reason why it doesn't deliver the needed power anymore... and over-discharging an accumulator comes under the heading of Bad IdeaTM
Fair enough, but usually (I think, anyway) the reason is something like "idiot left the headlights on overnight" rather than "battery has given up on life and gone to Greenland". And even then, it just means your engine will be running for long enough to drive to Canadian Tire and get a new battery.
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@Rhywden said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@lolwhat said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
Solomon curve
Just an FYI:
Subsequent research suggests significant biases in the Solomon study, which may cast doubt on its findings.
That's an interesting study in that footnote you referenced. At first glance, it appears to discuss rural roads (rather than, say, highways, which is the focus of the video I linked) and average speeds (rather than speed limits).
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@jinpa said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@dcon said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@jinpa said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
or to go out of their way to enable others to.
Actually, yes they do. If they're impeding the flow of traffic, even if that's over the limit, then they're in the wrong.
I disagree absolutely. They are noble people, and I commend them for it. The fact that the kind of people who get angry at them get angry them is a sign that they're doing the right thing.
I am always happy when I make the right people angry. Being happy isn't always the right thing, though.
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@dcon said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
< they'reself-righteousFixed that for accuracy. There's no such thing as "self-righteous", there's either correct or incorrect.
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@jinpa said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
there's no legitimate point that couldn't be made in text
Road speed limits are the same they where in 1970.
Think about how much improvement have been made in 50 years in cars. Way better breaking power and maneuverability, just to name those.
But the speed limit is the same
Another thing is, why is a semi-trailer, which take about 10 time the breaking distance of my car to stop and will make WAY more damages to other cars if it hit them, is allowed to go at the same speed as me?
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@hungrier said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
idiot left the headlights on overnight
The is a car that doesn't turn headlights off when you remove the key.
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@TimeBandit said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@hungrier said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
idiot left the headlights on overnight
The is a car that doesn't turn headlights off when you remove the key.
Gotta love the cars "ding ding ding - I know you left the lights on, I'm just gonna yell at you and not go anything about it - ding ding ding"
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@Tsaukpaetra said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@brie said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@HardwareGeek said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@boomzilla said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
motorboating
My instinct tells me this is something I don't want to look up on Urban Dictionary.
It'd be much more revelatory to look it up on PornHub.
Not that I think you will.
Why, when Google shows an easy definition right there!
But why would you rather look something up on Google, when you could look it up on PornHub?
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@brie said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
But why would you rather look something up on Google, when you could look it up on PornHub?
Some of us are actually at work. (Compiling! Yeah, that's the story - I'm compiling right now!)
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@dcon sure, but once someone tells you to look it up on PornHub, what's even the point of looking it up on Google? It's probably not something that you want to be searching for at work anyway.
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@TimeBandit said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
Think about how much improvement have been made in 50 years in cars. Way better breaking power and maneuverability, just to name those.
But the speed limit is the sameThink how much improvement hasn't been made in human beings.
Also the limits have to suit the old, or cheaply and/or poorly maintained cars which are still out there.
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@loopback0 said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@TimeBandit said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
Think about how much improvement have been made in 50 years in cars. Way better breaking power and maneuverability, just to name those.
But the speed limit is the sameThink how much improvement hasn't been made in human beings.
Also the limits have to suit the old, or cheaply and/or poorly maintained cars which are still out there.Also have to consider the ~80% of the U.S. which is rural and gets very little road maintenance, and that 118% of all drivers are playing with their phone and completely unaware that they're currently operating a motor vehicle on public roads.
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@mott555 said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
drivers are playing with their phone and completely unaware that they're currently operating a motor vehicle on public roads
We have laws for that
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@TimeBandit said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
We have laws for that
So do we. Plenty of people still do it.
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@TimeBandit said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
We have laws for that
So do we, there's just no enforcement.
Sadly, I think we're way past texting while driving. Now people are watching Netflix and stuff.
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@mott555 said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
Now people are watching Netflix and stuff.
I've seen a couple of people on Facetime calls while driving, and a chap watching Youtube videos while riding his scooter through London traffic.
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@mott555 said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
So do we, there's just no enforcement
But we must enforce arbitrary speed limits
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@TimeBandit said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@mott555 said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
So do we, there's just no enforcement
But we must enforce arbitrary speed limits
To be fair, those aren't enforced here, either. At least in my city.
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@mott555 said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@loopback0 said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@TimeBandit said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
Think about how much improvement have been made in 50 years in cars. Way better breaking power and maneuverability, just to name those.
But the speed limit is the sameThink how much improvement hasn't been made in human beings.
Also the limits have to suit the old, or cheaply and/or poorly maintained cars which are still out there.Also have to consider the ~80% of the U.S. which is rural and gets very little road maintenance, and that 118% of all drivers are playing with their phone and completely unaware that they're currently operating a motor vehicle on public roads.
I just watched (10 minutes ago!) an empty flatbed semi (18wheeler) lock up his wheels and the trailer start to slip sideways because traffic had backed up on the off ramp. (Our office building overlooks US101) He bailed at the last moment (no cars in the next lane, thank $deity) - missed the car ahead by about 1 foot (bet someone needs new underwear). To give the trucker some credit, the panel van in front of him (so possibly blocking his view) came in too fast too and had to bail onto the shoulder.
So, yeah. Drivers can't drive for shit.
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@loopback0 said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@mott555 said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
Now people are watching Netflix and stuff.
I've seen a couple of people on Facetime calls while driving, and a chap watching Youtube videos while riding his scooter through London traffic.
I love watching the bicyclists texting while riding. Come on Darwin!
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@mott555 said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@TimeBandit said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@mott555 said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
So do we, there's just no enforcement
But we must enforce arbitrary speed limits
To be fair, those aren't enforced here, either. At least in my city.
Toby faire, we don't need to because we're lucky to go 10mph on our 65mph highway. (But while driving home on Sun, I did see a couple cruisers out with their radar/lidar/whatever guns!)
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@TimeBandit said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@mott555 said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
So do we, there's just no enforcement
But we must enforce arbitrary speed limits
They're a bit more easily enforcable than driving-while-texting. Or do you know of an automatic measuring tool which reliably detects this?
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@hungrier said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@Rhywden said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@hungrier said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@Rhywden The idea is to use your battery to charge the supercap and have it deliver a 12V/whatever (I've seen claims of up to 800A) jolt at once to get the engine going, which will then start charging your battery like normal. If you don't have enough juice for that, then yes your car battery will be completely flat and you'll have to find something else to charge the supercap, or some other way to jump start.
Well, yeah, I got that. But there's usually a reason why it doesn't deliver the needed power anymore... and over-discharging an accumulator comes under the heading of Bad IdeaTM
Fair enough, but usually (I think, anyway) the reason is something like "idiot left the headlights on overnight" rather than "battery has given up on life and gone to Greenland".
Undervoltage is undervoltage. Further draining the battery will usually kill it. From what I've seen, a voltage of 12 Volt is considered "empty" and 11.8 V is "asking for it". If you go further you get into the realm of irreversible electrochemical reactions.
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@jinpa said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
The fact that the kind of people who get angry at them get angry them is a sign that they're doing the right thing.
Found the flat-earther!
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@brie said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@Tsaukpaetra said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@brie said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@HardwareGeek said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@boomzilla said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
motorboating
My instinct tells me this is something I don't want to look up on Urban Dictionary.
It'd be much more revelatory to look it up on PornHub.
Not that I think you will.
Why, when Google shows an easy definition right there!
But why would you rather look something up on Google, when you could look it up on PornHub?
LadybugPornHub has become too repetitive to be useful anymore...Edit: useful autocorrect.
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@dcon said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@jinpa said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
or to go out of their way to enable others to.
Actually, yes they do. If they're impeding the flow of traffic, even if that's over the limit, then they're in the wrong.
IIRC, in California if you have 5+ cars behind you unable to pass, you are obligated to pull over to the shoulder and allow them to pass when it is safe to do so.
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@TimeBandit said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@hungrier said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
or some other way to jump start.
If it's manual, you can push-start it
Not so easy if it's buried in snow.
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@HardwareGeek said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
Not so easy if it's buried in snow.
You're supposed to use the shovel in the trunk, if you can get to it
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@Rhywden said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
Or do you know of an automatic measuring tool which reliably detects this?
Cops doing their job
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@Rhywden said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@TimeBandit said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@mott555 said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
So do we, there's just no enforcement
But we must enforce arbitrary speed limits
They're a bit more easily enforcable than driving-while-texting. Or do you know of an automatic measuring tool which reliably detects this?
From what I've seen, as the owner of two fairly tall vehicles where I can easily see down into most other cars, all they'd have to do is pull over and ticket every single car for texting/Netflixing/etc. while driving and they'd be right about 90% of the time.
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@mott555 said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
From what I've seen, as the owner of two fairly tall vehicles where I can easily see down into most other cars
That's one thing they do here: they ride in a bus and look down in cars passing by.
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@Rhywden said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@hungrier said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@Rhywden said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@hungrier said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@Rhywden The idea is to use your battery to charge the supercap and have it deliver a 12V/whatever (I've seen claims of up to 800A) jolt at once to get the engine going, which will then start charging your battery like normal. If you don't have enough juice for that, then yes your car battery will be completely flat and you'll have to find something else to charge the supercap, or some other way to jump start.
Well, yeah, I got that. But there's usually a reason why it doesn't deliver the needed power anymore... and over-discharging an accumulator comes under the heading of Bad IdeaTM
Fair enough, but usually (I think, anyway) the reason is something like "idiot left the headlights on overnight" rather than "battery has given up on life and gone to Greenland".
Undervoltage is undervoltage. Further draining the battery will usually kill it. From what I've seen, a voltage of 12 Volt is considered "empty" and 11.8 V is "asking for it". If you go further you get into the realm of irreversible electrochemical reactions.
I thought lead acid batteries could tolerate more variance than that, but I'm not a car battery expert.
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@hungrier Isn't a fully charged lead-acid something like 13.6V?
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@PleegWat said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
@hungrier Isn't a fully charged lead-acid something like 13.6V?
It varies a bit, but pretty much yeah.
And at 12V you hit a steep drop off in how much amp the battery can produce.
And at 11V (or a bit higher) it's effectively empty.you can however get some power out of it at a very slow trickle, to pump up a capacitor.
And the damage to the battery is either already done, or the tiny extra amount you drain it with the capacitor starter will not make a difference anyway.
And of course, there is a large difference in how different types of lead acid batteries deal with deep discharge. The starter variety doesn't deal well at all with it, whereas batteries like the ones in fork lifts or for camping more or less are designed to take some deep discharge deal a lot better with it.
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@Carnage said in Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition:
The starter variety doesn't deal well at all with it
And since we're talking about a car accumulator...