Driving Anti-Patterns - Necro Edition
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The police don't recognize "but he waived me", they only recognize that you didn't obey the existing traffic controls.
The police wouldn't, but a judge might.
The police would if you could prove it, just as the judge. After all, they are interpreting the same law. However most likely they couldn't prove it (you'd need independent witness or dash cam) while the collision result itself is usually pretty good indicator of who had right of way.
I've always heard that you should never wave someone through unless you're 100% certain it's safe for them to go; if they go and get hit because you told them to do something stupid, it's partially your fault (and you can get sued).
You correctly said partly. The driver is ultimately responsible for safe operation of the vehicle and that responsibility is non-transferable, except possibly in corner cases where the driver relies (because they can't see themselves over some obstacle) on somebody indicating and the person indicating knows it.
So it wouldn't help the driver much. The person waving would also get fined, but the driver still would as well anyway. Because the driver could check whether it was safe to move and therefore should have done so.
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[video]
Providing evidence for suspending your driving licence does not look like a sane move. But I suppose Russian police is not up to the task.
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Inappropriate courteousness is sometimes worse than obnoxiousness.
God, I hate that. No, you cannot give up your right-of-way. Something happens and it's still 100% my fault even tho you waved me thru. 4-way stops are the worst. ("NO - you go, you were here first!")
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I was in an accident long ago (as a passenger) where someone waived the driver of my car through and he got hit by someone going around the waiver. The police don't recognize "but he waived me", they only recognize that you didn't obey the existing traffic controls.
I was in a car with my brother once at a very busy and complex junction and my brother called 'clear left' to help out. It wasn't and I thankfully only got stuck in the middle of the junction instead of in the middle of the lorry. That was the last time I listened to instructions given by anyone inside or outside my car.
Some time later a tractor with a very long trailer tried to wave me past for an overtake. I didn't as I couldn't see to my satisfaction and a few seconds later a car came past the other way at considerable speed. I think he was just hoping for some amusement or something
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I do come across the occasional spandex idiot riding in the road
I'm in favor of bicyclists riding on the sidewalk--you won't catch me on the major roads around here--but it is usually illegal.
Of course, if a cop ever stops me I'll just turn around, wave at the traffic and ask if he would ride in that shit.
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Wait, what? These lines are new? I remember following them when I was learning to drive in Endicott NY in 1983. You know, 32 years ago. How come you think this is a new thing?
Because, probably not everywhere had them 32 years ago?
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That's a stretch, but even if I accept this for the sake of argument, there are far fewer pedestrians than cars.
In places like Dallas you will generally find very few pedestrians. First, the city's not terribly walkable, plus, it's kinda hot to be out walking.
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You can pass a stopped school bus that doesn't have its lights flashing!
Some places, you can pass a stopped school bus that does have its lights flashing...if they're the yellow ones, not the red ones.
No, I don't know why there's two sets of flashing lights. But I want to drag the drivers on my street who drive with the yellow ones on in an attempt to keep cars from legally passing them. (If someone has an idea of what other behavior it could be, bear in mind as soon as they get off my side street and onto the main one, the yellow flashers get turned off.)
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In places like Dallas you will generally find very few pedestrians. First, the city's not terribly walkable, plus, it's kinda hot to be out walking.
Plus they're all busy fucking Debbie.
Some places, you can pass a stopped school bus that does have its lights flashing...if they're the yellow ones, not the red ones.
In Ontario, it's flashing red lights with the STOP sign out. Unless it's a divided roadway (divided by a cement median, that is, not just lines), then you can pass.
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@Lorne_Kates said:
In Ontario, it's flashing red lights with the STOP sign out. Unless it's a divided roadway (divided by a cement median, that is, not just lines), then you can pass.
Yeah, here too. Except, like I said, WTF are the point of flashing _yellow_s? That you don't have to stop for? That the drivers only use--in my experience--while they're driving?
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Yeah, here too. Except, like I said, WTF are the point of flashing yellows? That you don't have to stop for? That the drivers only use--in my experience--while they're driving?
I've seen some buses with a single flashing WHITE LIGHT on top of the bus, that flashes sporadically like a strobe. It's very bright, massively annoying and completely pointless. What the fuck's that?
(And no, it's not some sort of traffic-light changing strobe. Too slow, too human-visible, doesn't need to be on while the bus is driving, and finally WHY THE FUCK SHOULD SCHOOLBUS DRIVERS BE ALLOWED TO CHANGE TRAFFIC PATTERNS??!!!?)
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The white strobe is a fog / high-vis light.
Designed for people that are too Belgium-ing stupid to recognize that that big yellow box is, in fact, on the road in front of them.
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The white strobe is a fog / high-vis light.
Why is it on in the middle of a clear, sunny day? Stupid driver of Jefferful bus interface means it's easy to accidentally turn on and impossible to know that it IS on?
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Around where I'm at these days, the buses run with the strobe on all the time.
Probably figure it makes the bus easier to see when you're texting and driving? shrugs
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Driving with the stobe light on should carry the same penalty as driving with one's highbeams when they aren't needed.
(Getting dragged out of your car, having hot pokers shoved into your eyes, then shot in the head)
Filed under: Lorne for Minister of Transportation
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@Lorne_Kates said:
I've seen some buses with a single flashing WHITE LIGHT on top of the bus, that flashes sporadically like a strobe. It's very bright, massively annoying and completely pointless. What the fuck's that?
OH, yeah, I've seen that. It's a strobe. No idea why.
The latest innovation is the second stop arm, with a camera on it to record people who don't stop when they're supposed to.
At this rate I more or less expect sirens within 5 years.
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The latest innovation is the second stop arm, with a camera on it to record people who don't stop when they're supposed to.
We've got the stop arm. I think it's also to ensure that kids cross far enough in front of the bus that drivers have a good angle to see them, rather than them just popping out from behind the bus.
The cameras aren't a bad idea. Here, bus drivers are allowed to report people running the lights, and the cops will ticket the owner of the car. I don't mind enforcement cameras for offenses that are:
- Obvious and unambiguous
- Extremely hard to enforce otherwise
- Extremely easy for a driver to do, but extremely harmful for everyone else around that driver.
Bus-lights running seems to fit that bill. The bus has stopped. The sign's out. Pretty obvious to tell if a driver runs it. The only other way to enforce it is to hope a cop is nearby (and then the cop has to run the buses lights to get the offender).
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@Lorne_Kates said:
We've got the stop arm. I think it's also to ensure that kids cross far enough in front of the bus that drivers have a good angle to see them, rather than them just popping out from behind the bus.
No, I mean a second swing-out stop sign on the side, towards the back. In case you missed the first one, 20 feet forward.
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Providing evidence for suspending your driving licence
In the middle of the video he gets stopped for riding on the shoulder (which really is the mildest thing in that video) but nothing much happens - maybe he gave a bribe or something.
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OH, yeah, I've seen that. It's a strobe. No idea why.
Just Ask Us: Why do school buses have strobe lights on top?
Q. Why do school buses have strobe lights on top while city buses do not?
"The overall reasoning is to identify this vehicle as having school children," said Sgt. Gaetano Martino, of the State Patrol.
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Very Discointuitive...
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Very Discointuitive...
True. Still, if the school bus has no kids on it, then the strobe doesn't need to be lit.
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@Lorne_Kates said:
In Ontario, it's flashing red lights with the STOP sign out. Unless it's a divided roadway (divided by a cement median, that is, not just lines), then you can pass.
That's what I meant, I just wasn't in the mood to type it all out. Usually the flashing yellow precede the flashing red with the stop sign.
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Death Race 2000, starring David Carradine and Sylvester Stallone. One of trash cinema's greatest works.
I finally got around to watching it. You're right, it was wonderful trash cinema.
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No, I mean a second swing-out stop sign on the side, towards the back. In case you missed the first one, 20 feet forward.
Ah. Wow.
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"The overall reasoning is to identify this vehicle as having school children," said Sgt. Gaetano Martino, of the State Patrol.
:pedobear:
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trip the sensors so the light will change
cruise control
The problems here are much more exclusive to first world than anything in the FW problems thread.
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Providing evidence for suspending your driving licence does not look like a sane move.
Strictly, it's probably providing evidence that you can drive well enough to get cheaper insurance, or that it was the other idiot's fault that you ended up in a collision. If neither of those apply in your case, stay away from me you dangerous driver!
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The US school bus thing seems very weird to me as a UK resident. Our school buses don't have anything on them except, generally, the schools name and/or a logo. Quite a lot seem to be generic coaches on hire and have a bus company logo on them as well as a temporary sign. You can also overtake them as you like.
I wonder if anyone has done any research into whether US children suffer less injuries or deaths around their buses than ours or other similar countries.
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The US school bus thing seems very weird to me as a UK resident. Our school buses don't have anything on them except, generally, the schools name and/or a logo. Quite a lot seem to be generic coaches on hire and have a bus company logo on them as well as a temporary sign. You can also overtake them as you like.
I'm seeing more yellow-painted buses about than I used to (i.e., up from zero) but they're still not too common because they can't be used for other duties (e.g., driver training, peak-time commuter routes) without pissing everyone off. Bus companies seem to prefer to keep their livery visible for self-advertising purposes.
I don't think there's much in the way of special laws focussed on school buses here either.
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I wonder if anyone has done any research into whether US children suffer less injuries or deaths around their buses than ours or other similar countries.
That's a good question. People here would have you believe that kids run out into traffic all the time. I've never seen or even heard if it happening, and if it was really a problem, it wouldn't only be a problem around school buses.
There's also the "one is too many" crowd, but that anyone takes them seriously is a
in itself.
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I'd be willing to bet that those precautions pretty much remove any chance of those kind of accidents... Now whether or not that's a substantial amount to begin with is a good question, but it's probably a reasonable investment. Especially given how (in the US) most school buses are operated by government entities, so the buses aren't gonna be used for anything else.
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I'd be willing to bet that those precautions pretty much remove any chance of those kind of accidents
It certainly seems like it should be effective. But it come with some large repercussions in terms of lost time for people stuck behind them (I'm butthuming the no-overtaking thing is US-wide as Google wasn't any help).
I don't hate children but from 2003-2012 301 of them were killed in US school bus accidents, 65% of that was being hit by the bus itself! The rest was as passengers.
I couldn't find a single mention of a death from crossing the road to/from the bus and being struck by another car. I couldn't find any mention of that type of accident in the UK either.
Maybe the focus should be on bus crash safety/seatbelts and larger mirrors instead?Especially given how (in the US) most school buses are operated by government entities, so the buses aren't gonna be used for anything else.
Yep, that seems to be a major difference. I wonder if we would have similar things if ours were dedicated.
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I'm in favor of bicyclists riding on the sidewalk--you won't catch me on the major roads around here--but it is usually illegal.
Yes, this is a shining example of the law being wrong.
In places like Dallas you will generally find very few pedestrians. First, the city's not terribly walkable, plus, it's kinda hot to be out walking.
Yeah, places are very different in the types of traffic they get. You clearly shouldn't be riding a bike through the mobs on the sidewalks in Manhattan, but in typical American suburbia, 99% of the traffic is cars.
Yeah, here too. Except, like I said, WTF are the point of flashing yellows? That you don't have to stop for? That the drivers only use--in my experience--while they're driving?
I only see those here when they're about to stop. So, maybe a hundred yards or something to let you know that they're slowing down and about to stop. This is the signal to race around them.
@Lorne_Kates said:
I've seen some buses with a single flashing WHITE LIGHT on top of the bus, that flashes sporadically like a strobe. It's very bright, massively annoying and completely pointless. What the fuck's that?
Arg...yeah, all the buses have those now around me. I hate that shit.
People here would have you believe that kids run out into traffic all the time.
I had an idiot neighbor kid ride out into the street right as I was turning left onto the road. He never saw me. Fortunately, I saw him.
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He never saw me. Fortunately, I saw him.
Like a ninja in the night, BoomZ, AKA Boomzilla, stalks across his driveway. These are his stories.
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That's when you grin and wave "hi". Works really well on a bicycle too!
Bonus points for the bicycle, but you gotta pick your battles very carefully. The car driver has a protective cage around him and is at the controls of a guided missle that's already in motion. The cyclist has neither of those things.
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at a point where there was some sort of extended traffic island blocking my access to the other side of the road (one lane each way), they decided to do some sort of dance, occupying enough of my side to make passing impossible.
I don't know exactly the situation you were in, but:
The "dance" they were doing is deliberate. I sometimes ride well away from the kerb for the same purpose. The purpose is not to piss you off or block your access to the road in front of the cyclists. The purpose is to send a very clear message to the drivers behind, and the message is "You may think there's room for you to squeeze past me here, but you're wrong. Don't try."
Their road positioning makes it obvious to drivers that to pass the cyclists at that point involves likely homocide, a fact that many drivers won't notice without the positioning.
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Their road positioning makes it obvious to drivers that to pass the cyclists at that point involves likely homocide, a fact that many drivers won't notice without the positioning.
Don't try it with a milk tanker. Those guys are homicidal maniacs at the best of timesβ¦
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That's all very well, except that they shouldn't have been there at all. They had moments before ridden past the clearly marked entrance to a clearly marked separated cycle lane...
So yes, they were doing a stupid dance in the road.
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This is how bikes should be handled.
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you gotta pick your battles very carefully
That is true. Better carry a handgun also, to shoot the t[i|y]res out if things get sporty.
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Some time later a tractor with a very long trailer tried to wave me past for an overtake. I didn't as I couldn't see to my satisfaction and a few seconds later a car came past the other way at considerable speed. I think he was just hoping for some amusement or something
So your name is David Mann?
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Their road positioning makes it obvious to drivers that to pass the cyclists at that point involves likely homocide, a fact that many drivers won't notice without the positioning.
This. You need to keep at least 1.5 meters (5 feet) between you and the bicycle. I also commonly drive my bicycle far enough to the left that a driver needs to fully enter the lane used by opposing traffic in order to pass me.
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You need to keep at least 1.5 meters (5 feet) between you and the bicycle.
I always overtake bicycles with a huge gap, usually with at least half of my car in the opposite lane, and using indicators, of course.
Half of the time, after I merge back in my lane in front of them, I see them surprised and looking over their shoulder, as if expecting a car overtaking them in the same lane and me overtaking both of them, I guess. This is because pretty much noone besides me does that.On the other hand cyclists seem to feel fine with undertaking on the right extremely close to my mirrors.
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So your name is David Mann?
Sorry, don't get the reference. Google says US comedian?
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Ah! That makes sense
Although in this case it was this sort of tractor:
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That's what I imagine when I hear the word 'tractor'.
Although I got used to it being used for what I would be more likely to call a prime mover.
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"You may think there's room for you to squeeze past me here, but you're wrong. Don't try."
Ontario just introduced a law saying "If you pass a bike, you must****strong text leave at least 1 meter (3 feet for you backwater imperial folks), or get a hefty fine & points".
Cyclists are heavily encouraged to "take the lane" if they don't feel safe with passing traffic.
Duel (TV Movie 1971) β 7.6 | Action, Thriller
