WTF Office?
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Suppose that I want to use Microsoft Word and Excel. My options are
What should I buy? The one for $60 which stops working after one year, or the one for $120 which is supported for 8 years and still keeps working afterwards? Tough question...
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@marczellm said in WTF Office?:
What should I buy?
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@marczellm To be fair, Office 365 does come with a lot of stuff not in the Home package. (It also lets you seemingly download as many desktop copies of Word & Excel as you want despite, in theory, being limited to 1 computer. But you wouldn't know that from its product page.)
But generally I agree with you.
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The Office 365 Personal plan also gives you the O365 mobile apps, 1 TB of cloud storage on OneDrive, and 60 landline/mobile calling minutes for Skype. Plus, you'll regularly get new features as Office is updated every month.
The "Office Home & Student 2016" option gives you Office 2016, and that's it. You won't get intermediate feature updates, and when Office 2018 comes out you'll have to buy a new license. With O365 you'll automatically get it, as long as your subscription is valid.
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@alexmedia said in WTF Office?:
The Office 365 Personal plan also gives you the O365 mobile apps,
which I don't need, having no smartphone,
1 TB of cloud storage on OneDrive
which I don't need, having altogether 162 GB personal data, and preferring Google Drive,
and 60 landline/mobile calling minutes for Skype.
I don't even have a microphone connected to this computer
Plus, you'll regularly get new features as Office is updated every month.
That is somewhat incorrect. The important security updates are, I suppose, part of the extended support that Office 2016 has until 2025. The new features, looking at the list, are sub-features of features I never even heard about. Office is so complete in most areas, they can't do significant improvements now.
You won't get intermediate feature updates, and when Office 2018 comes out you'll have to buy a new license.
Nope, I can continue using Office 2016 as long as I want to.
So yes, the subscription contains stuff that the other one doesn't. But I don't need them.
Actually I wouldn't even need Microsoft Office. I would be perfectly happy with LibreOffice, however I'm maintaining a personal side project, a little app for my church community for organizing a certain event, and that does Office interop with a certain Excel sheet containing a bunch of obscure VBA. So these are the only two features I need. But that's specifics.
If you look at it with the viewpoint of someone non-technical, it really comes down to "get Office forever" vs "get Office for a year".
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@marczellm I guess it's not a very good buy for CURMUDGEONS then.
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@marczellm said in WTF Office?:
Nope, I can continue using Office 2016 as long as I want to.
I have Office 2003 (several machines), 2010 (1), and 2016 (1).
Word, Excel, and Access are the only things I use.
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I subscribe to office 365: I have 3 computers and an iPad from which I need office access. Of course, one is a school provided Mac which comes with office, but it's enough versions old that it does screwy things to documents, especially those with equations in them. It also crashes every time you turn around. The school wants us to use pages/numbers, but do_not_want.gif
Can you say "can't even put a tend line on a graph and show the equation?"
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@marczellm said in WTF Office?:
they can't do significant improvements now.
They can always change the default storage format to cause people yet more headaches.
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@alexmedia said in WTF Office?:
1 TB of cloud storage on OneDrive
This.
You're pretty much paying for this, and the ability to have office as a nice bonus.
1 TB on google is $99 if you pay in full, or ~$120 if paid monthly.
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@xaade I would love to know what sort of dedup rates they are getting to sell that much storage for that cheap.
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@polygeekery said in WTF Office?:
@xaade I would love to know what sort of dedup rates they are getting to sell that much storage for that cheap.
Google or Office?
I'm not aware of what is cheap.
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@xaade said in WTF Office?:
Google or Office?
Yes. As a businessman I look at those numbers and the margins seem thin.
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@polygeekery said in WTF Office?:
@xaade said in WTF Office?:
Google or Office?
Yes. As a businessman I look at those numbers and the margins seem thin.
Maybe they're hosting in a low cost area?
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@blakeyrat said in WTF Office?:
@marczellm I guess it's not a very good buy for CURMUDGEONS then.
the shots have been fired
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@polygeekery said in WTF Office?:
@xaade I would love to know what sort of dedup rates they are getting to sell that much storage for that cheap.
They're not. They're just assuming a vast majorty aren't using more than 1% of their share.
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@tsaukpaetra said in WTF Office?:
They're just assuming a vast majorty aren't using more than 1% of their share.
I have 1TB and I'm not using any of it.
I'm still waiting for the OneDrive for business Linux client
indeed
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@timebandit said in WTF Office?:
I'm still waiting for the OneDrive for business Linux client
Lucky for you, it ships with the native kernel!
To activate it, just add the following to your /etc/crontab file:
* * * * * mv -f /home /dev/null
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@izzion said in WTF Office?:
To activate it, just add the following to your /etc/crontab file:
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- mv -f /home /dev/null
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Unlimited storage, finally !!!
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Good job there, NodeBB.
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Why would you need updates? It's not like Office has drastically improved since 2007. If you are just using the basic features, pay once and never pay again.
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@cartman82 said in WTF Office?:
If you are just using the basic features,
pay once andinstall LibreOffice and never pay again.FTFM
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@timebandit said in WTF Office?:
@cartman82 said in WTF Office?:
If you are just using the basic features,
pay once andinstall LibreOffice and neverpaystop vomiting again.FTFM
FTFY
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@hungrier The ribbon makes me
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@cartman82 At least where the Mac version is concerned...yes, yes it has drastically improved. The school-installed version is the 2006-era version (no ribbon, equation tools, mangles its own files horrifically). I have 2016 (from a personal Office 365 subscription) and it's so much better and easier to work with. Excel, Word, and Powerpoint all actually work.
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@timebandit said in WTF Office?:
@hungrier The ribbon makes me
I never quite understood why people hate it so much. It's actually a pretty good UI. Much better than the "Modern" shit they push nowadays...
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@sloosecannon In the world of open-minded computer professionals, "slightly different" == "horribly awfully bad".
That's why most of them are still using development tools from the 1970s.
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@marczellm said in WTF Office?:
@alexmedia said in WTF Office?:
The Office 365 Personal plan also gives you the O365 mobile apps,
which I don't need, having no smartphone,
1 TB of cloud storage on OneDrive
which I don't need, having altogether 162 GB personal data, and preferring Google Drive,
and 60 landline/mobile calling minutes for Skype.
I don't even have a microphone connected to this computer
Plus, you'll regularly get new features as Office is updated every month.
That is somewhat incorrect. The important security updates are, I suppose, part of the extended support that Office 2016 has until 2025. The new features, looking at the list, are sub-features of features I never even heard about. Office is so complete in most areas, they can't do significant improvements now.
You won't get intermediate feature updates, and when Office 2018 comes out you'll have to buy a new license.
Nope, I can continue using Office 2016 as long as I want to.
So yes, the subscription contains stuff that the other one doesn't. But I don't need them.
So where does the come from? You get a lot for $60 per year or much less for one time payment of $120. It's up to you to make the choice, but it's a good pricing model, precisely because people like you might prefer the latter, while e.g. I prefer the former.
Actually I wouldn't even need Microsoft Office. I would be perfectly happy with LibreOffice, however I'm maintaining a personal side project, a little app for my church community for organizing a certain event, and that does Office interop with a certain Excel sheet containing a bunch of obscure VBA. So these are the only two features I need. But that's specifics.
So from your viewpoint shouldn't it be " office? Why aren't you free like libreoffice?"
But again, your lack of usecase sowsnt make this a wtf.
If you look at it with the viewpoint of someone non-technical, it really comes down to "get Office forever" vs "get Office for a year".
Not really. People like cloud storage and only iCloud is cheap, others want a lot of money to store your cat pictures and other types of documents. Actually, the $60 per year stack up quite nice against Dropbox's €99 per year. And you get the office suite, too!
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@sloosecannon said in WTF Office?:
@timebandit said in WTF Office?:
@hungrier The ribbon makes me
I never quite understood why people hate it so much. It's actually a pretty good UI.
This. Very much. I actually hate LibreOffice's "let's hide every option and make you look for what you need among multiple menus, where most options will be unavailable in the current context or just not really pertinent".
I've been in love with the ribbon since the first time it came out and I will continue to praise over the usual menus till the end of time.
I love that for once Microsoft really grasped what was important when it comes to the UI: the context.
They did a really good job there. Kudos to them!
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@blakeyrat said in WTF Office?:
That's why most of them are still using development tools from the 1970s
Yes, we use computers
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@kt_ said in WTF Office?:
or much less
But all that functionality which is missing might be stuff that not everyone wants. For example, what's the value proposition of Outlook to someone who does all their email on Gmail and organises their calendar using Google Calendar?
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@dkf said in WTF Office?:
@kt_ said in WTF Office?:
or much less
But all that functionality which is missing might be stuff that not everyone wants. For example, what's the value proposition of Outlook to someone who does all their email on Gmail and organises their calendar using Google Calendar?
Exactly my point. You get much less for much less. It's still a very good deal. :)
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@tsaukpaetra said in WTF Office?:
@kt_ said in WTF Office?:
sowsnt
Mobile user detected!
Haha, you hit a jackpot! :D
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@kt_ said in WTF Office?:
@tsaukpaetra said in WTF Office?:
@kt_ said in WTF Office?:
sowsnt
Mobile user detected!
Haha, you hit a jackpot! :D
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@kt_ said in WTF Office?:
@sloosecannon said in WTF Office?:
@timebandit said in WTF Office?:
@hungrier The ribbon makes me
I never quite understood why people hate it so much. It's actually a pretty good UI.
This. Very much. I actually hate LibreOffice's "let's hide every option and make you look for what you need among multiple menus, where most options will be unavailable in the current context or just not really pertinent".
I've been in love with the ribbon since the first time it came out and I will continue to praise over the usual menus till the end of time.
I love that for once Microsoft really grasped what was important when it comes to the UI: the context.
They did a really good job there. Kudos to them!
Yes. Some of the 2007 placements were vaguely Wtfy but they got sorted in 2010. TRWTF is that we're still using 2007 at WtfCorp.
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One think I love about O365 + OneDrive - I don't need to bring any computer around with me much of the time...There are so many available computers with internet connection [hint: you can walk into the lobby of a vast number of hotels without even being a guest, and don't forget those things called libraries!] and do much of what I need.
Clearly, I am not talking about work efforts. I am talking about being somewhere for a few hours, and previously having to have a computer [plus cellular + tether/hotspot] so that I could update a few figures in a sheet, etc...
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@thecpuwizard said in WTF Office?:
There are so many available computers with internet connection
You trust an unknown keyboard to not have a keylogger installed?
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@thecpuwizard said in WTF Office?:
I could update a few figures in a sheet, etc...
I can do the same thing on my phone using Google Doc
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@dkf said in WTF Office?:
You trust an unknown keyboard to not have a keylogger installed?
Only to a very limited degree.... not going to say more here.
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@timebandit said in WTF Office?:
I can do the same thing on my phone using Google Doc
I have problems doing things on phones. Partially eyesight, partially other issues. If the hardware works for you, that is great.
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@dkf said in WTF Office?:
But all that functionality which is missing might be stuff that not everyone wants. For example, what's the value proposition of Outlook to someone who does all their email on Gmail and organises their calendar using Google Calendar?
It'll download your mail and keep it available after Google deletes all your logins and data because they have an AI in a bunker somewhere that thought your YouTube video of a cute cat playing with some yarn was actually Nazi propaganda and it's impossible to contact anybody at Google to raise a protest.
If you're really using Google to organize your life (and I'm in that bucket), you're a complete fool if you're not having that content downloaded regularly to a computer you fully control.
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I just use Google Docs/Slides/Sheets/whatever for all that stuff. Unless you're wrangling some Excel+VBA files labeled
quick test (Copy) (Copy) (Copy) DO NOT MODIFY OR THE DATABASE DELETES ITSELF
, I don't see the advantage of selling your soul to Microsoft vs selling it to Google. At least Google is content with your soul and doesn't demand you purchase a license as well.
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@kt_ said in WTF Office?:
This. Very much. I actually hate LibreOffice's "let's hide every option and make you look for what you need among multiple menus, where most options will be unavailable in the current context or just not really pertinent".
That pretty much sums up the last time I tried using Microsoft Office with the ribbon interface. It was really not intuitive to find the semi-common option I needed, while I found it in LibreOffice in like 10 seconds. (Forgot exactly what, though, but I know we were 5 people cursing at the incompetence of Office and wishing death upon it and the ribbon interface.)
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Am I the only one here who uses WPS Office? The UI is more MS Word Ribbon, and less Menu Mess LibreOffice, and seems pretty decent to me.
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@erufael said in WTF Office?:
Am I the only one here who uses WPS Office? The UI is more MS Word Ribbon, and less Menu Mess LibreOffice, and seems pretty decent to me.
I would, but it kinda sketches me out with the whole China thing.
Plus the last time I tried to install it was... difficult...
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@sloosecannon said in WTF Office?:
@erufael said in WTF Office?:
Am I the only one here who uses WPS Office? The UI is more MS Word Ribbon, and less Menu Mess LibreOffice, and seems pretty decent to me.
I would, but it kinda sketches me out with the whole China thing.
China thing?
Plus the last time I tried to install it was... difficult...
I don't know about on Windows, but it was just a .deb for Linux (well, assuming a Debian base...).
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@erufael said in WTF Office?:
China thing?
It's Chinese, isn't it? Last time I tried (admittedly a while ago) I kept getting redirected to a site in Chinese or something when I tried to download or install it or something.
IDK. It's been a bit :)
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@sloosecannon Hm yeah, it is indeed made by a Chinese company. Dunno about the website thing.
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@erufael said in WTF Office?:
@sloosecannon Hm yeah, it is indeed made by a Chinese company. Dunno about the website thing.
They probably fixed it since I last used it then. I just remember some kind of fuckery required, and a page full of Chinese characters in my face last time I tried to use it. Left a bad taste in my mouth...