YAWTC (Yet Another Windows Ten Complaint)
-
@Tsaukpaetra said in YAWTC (Yet Another Windows Ten Complaint):
@marczellm said in YAWTC (Yet Another Windows Ten Complaint):
@TimeBandit said in YAWTC (Yet Another Windows Ten Complaint):
@marczellm said in YAWTC (Yet Another Windows Ten Complaint):
I simply don't believe that it has installed on anyone's machine without consent.
Think again
- Why does that site reload itself every minute?
- That's still consent. "Won't read this dialog, I want it to go away, click"
Something something rape culture?
I'm scheduled to have sex with you at 11PM this night.
Fine or whatevs I didn't really hear it but I'm working right now so could you leave me alone pls
-
@marczellm
The real question is: did she accept the meeting invite?
-
@Tsaukpaetra said in YAWTC (Yet Another Windows Ten Complaint):
Apparently there is a 32-bit version that does include 16-bit support though.
Yeah, Windows XP Mode, which is really just Windows XP in a VM.
I fail to see how that applies. Also, Windows 10 32-bit (actually, Windows 8.1-and-up 32-bit) requires PAE and NX-Bit for who-knows why.
Ah, rereading that I think you meant "16-bit support is called XP Mode", not "the 32-bit version is called XP Mode", which I assumed you meant because XP is (commonly) 32-bit.
Are you sure XP Mode exists on W10? Everybody tells me it doesn't and googling around for it seems to confirm that. The only answer from MS I found saysWindows 8/8.1 32-bit comes with a built-in option to turn on or off 16-bit application support. You may try using 16 bit application if you have 32 bit operating system version of Windows 10.
If that was based on a true VM instead of NTVDM, why would they disable that on 64-bit W10?
OK, I'm on thin ice here trying to apply everyday logic to Windows, but still …
-
@Atazhaia said in YAWTC (Yet Another Windows Ten Complaint):
Wait... 32-bit Windows requires PAE now? And they STILL haven't sorted addressing more than 4GB of memory?
Sure they have. Upgrade to 64-bits.
-
@boomzilla And fixed for :
Wait... 32-bit Windows requires PAE now? And they STILL haven't sorted addressing more than 4GB of memory in the 32-bit non-server editions?
Not that it really matters anymore as pretty much everyone should be on 64-bit by now anyway.
-
@boomzilla said in YAWTC (Yet Another Windows Ten Complaint):
@Atazhaia said in YAWTC (Yet Another Windows Ten Complaint):
Wait... 32-bit Windows requires PAE now? And they STILL haven't sorted addressing more than 4GB of memory?
Sure they have. Upgrade to 64-bits.
I'll just install 32-bits twice. Bam! 64-bits without paying extra.
-
@Atazhaia said in YAWTC (Yet Another Windows Ten Complaint):
@Tsaukpaetra said in YAWTC (Yet Another Windows Ten Complaint):
I fail to see how that applies. Also, Windows 10 32-bit (actually, Windows 8.1-and-up 32-bit) requires PAE and NX-Bit for who-knows why.
Wait... 32-bit Windows requires PAE now? And they STILL haven't sorted addressing more than 4GB of memory?
Microsoft Technical Fellow Mark Russinovich says that some drivers were found to be unstable when encountering physical addresses above 4 GB.
Ah, so it's because of shitty drivers. And instead of enforcing the use of non-shitty drivers they limit Windows so driver makers can keep on making shitty drivers. Got it.
Yeah. I believe it's Intel's integrated graphics drivers IIRC.
-
@LaoC said in YAWTC (Yet Another Windows Ten Complaint):
OK, I'm on thin ice here trying to apply everyday logic to Windows, but still …
Yeah, the ice has become a really interesting share of purple.
I thought they got rid of NTVDM in 7, which is why you can't full-screen console apps anymore. I could be misremembering things, it's in the Trivia category so totally 💩 🔫.
-
@Luhmann said in YAWTC (Yet Another Windows Ten Complaint):
The real question is: did she accept the meeting invite?
If you think that matters, you haven't been paying attention (but that's properly a topic for the garage).
-
@TimeBandit said in [YAWTC (Yet Another Windows Ten Complaint)](/post
Micro-Soft
-
@Yamikuronue said in YAWTC (Yet Another Windows Ten Complaint):
the death of IDEs
Wait, what? When did that happen?
-
@Atazhaia said in YAWTC (Yet Another Windows Ten Complaint):
Not that it really matters anymore as pretty much everyone should be on 64-bit by now anyway.
Most of my computers at home are on the 32-bit edition specifically so that they can continue to run 16-bit applications (viz. old games). None of the machines have more than 3GB anyway and it's easier than setting up a VM.
Actually it's possible that some of the kids' computers don't even have 64-bit processors, particularly the oldest one (which is still running XP because there are no drivers for its hardware in the post-XP world), possibly also the next oldest one.
-
@Scarlet_Manuka Well, that's a specific use case that's an exception to normal use. Even if I would look at alternate solutions, like DOSBox, for running old 16-bit games nowadays unless I'd being going for the authentic experience, but then I would use old hardware too.
As for RAM; 4GB is too little for general use for me nowadays so running anything less than 8GB ends up not an option, which also means I have to look at alternate means for running 16-bit applications unless I want to keep old hardware around. (Which I do, but it's not in my home atm due to space constraints.)
-
@Atazhaia Well, I obviously use DOSBox for the DOS games, but it's a lot more effort to get enough of a stack on top of it to successfully run a wide variety of 16-bit Windows games, which is more of our usage. It's a lot easier to run 32-bit Windows and let the Windows games run (more or less) natively.
What general use are you doing that requires 8GB of memory? The only reason I upgraded our office machine to 3GB was that I started playing an online game that turned out to be a memory-hogging Flash thing*. It was perfectly happy doing general web browsing, Office apps, etc. with 2GB.
Sure, if you're into a lot of video rendering or compiling big VS projects or whatever, you'll need more memory, but I wouldn't personally call that general use. I don't really do video watching on ours, so I don't know what that's like in terms of requirements, but I'd have thought it would be much more a storage than memory issue there.
It could be worse though. It would have been roughly mid to late 1990s when I found out that a friend of ours was running Windows 2.0 and didn't want to upgrade because, he said, it did what he needed it to do. I never actually saw it in action, but that was the closest I've been to experiencing a pre-3.0 version of Windows.
* TRWTF is that I still play it don't judge me OK I probably deserve it
-
@Scarlet_Manuka said in YAWTC (Yet Another Windows Ten Complaint):
memory-hogging Flash thing*
You know they're getting rid of Club Penguin, right?
-
@Tsaukpaetra My kids had actually pretty much stopped playing that when they found out about the impending shutdown. There was a full-on Club Penguin frenzy in the kids' computing area the last night it was active (punctuated by arguments about who got to go on the faster computer, because of course there were).
And no, I never joined it myself :P
-
@Scarlet_Manuka Considering Windows 10 uses ~2GB on its own it doesn't really leave a lot of room for other programs. Maybe 4GB is enough for general use, but I also like a bit of headroom so it wont start swapping to drive, therefore I go for the next typical size, which is 8GB, as a recommendation for general use. Especially if using the built-in GPU. And if not using the built-in GPU you're probably doing gaming, and for modern gaming I'd say at least 8GB. Even more if running the demanding titles.
As at the time of this writing, my computer is using 7.4GB of RAM and I'm just browsing the web and listening to music. Although that's probably a sign I should start cleaning up among the tabs in my browser. Or just swap over to Linux, which is a lot better at not using large amounts of RAM to just run the OS.
-
Our household is a fabulous museum. In order from newest to oldest:
Windows 10 era
My brother's laptop.
Windows 8 era
My sister's laptop, but that was so cheap it's generally unusable.
My desktop, bought for semi-serious gaming in ~2014.
Both running 10 now.Vista era
My laptop is a 10 year old Toshiba. I used for a long time with 7 then managed to upgrade it to 10. The Windows key doesn't work and the hard drive behaves weird sometimes, but all of my stuff is in Google Drive anyway. Only for web browsing and Office editing when away from home.
My mother's laptop is a 10 year old HP. It ran Vista (it was unbearably slow recently) until this week I installed Linux Mint Xfce on it. It's not slow anymore and my mother is very happy with it.XP era
My old desktop, now running 7 with some added RAM and still used by my father.
My father's Compaq laptop and small netbook, the latter used for web browsing on business trips, the former kept solely for its RS-232 port to communicate with even older cinema processors.98 era
My father's main desktop, still running Win98. There are some webpages and PDFs it can't open which is when he goes to the other room to my old desktop PC.
3.1 era
My father's other desktop which he still does company finance related Excel work on.
Other
A functional Enterprise 128 in the closet, with a custom modified floppy drive.
-
@marczellm said in YAWTC (Yet Another Windows Ten Complaint):
Excel
Did you know Excel 2003 works on Windows 10? It should be easy to whittle him over, since 10 looks remarkably similar to 3.1 (actually, I think someone probably has a 3.1 theme for it, TBH), and the familiar will happen! :D :D :P
(Yes, I know you've probably explained in detail elsewhere why he won't migrate, but heh)
-
@Atazhaia said in YAWTC (Yet Another Windows Ten Complaint):
@Scarlet_Manuka Considering Windows 10 uses ~2GB on its own it doesn't really leave a lot of room for other programs. Maybe 4GB is enough for general use, but I also like a bit of headroom so it wont start swapping to drive, therefore I go for the next typical size, which is 8GB, as a recommendation for general use. Especially if using the built-in GPU. And if not using the built-in GPU you're probably doing gaming, and for modern gaming I'd say at least 8GB. Even more if running the demanding titles.
As at the time of this writing, my computer is using 7.4GB of RAM and I'm just browsing the web and listening to music. Although that's probably a sign I should start cleaning up among the tabs in my browser. Or just swap over to Linux, which is a lot better at not using large amounts of RAM to just run the OS.
Mostly a chrome tabfest I assume? I'm using 5.5GB, of which 2gb is taken by wow and 200mb by firefox.
-
@PleegWat Firefox tabfest. Although the Windows side of my computer got more programs running in the background too. Think a problem for me is that I can run more programs in the background without any noticeable effect due to having plenty of CPU cores and RAM, so I feel no need to limit them yet. (6-core i7 + 24GB RAM)
-
@RaceProUK said in YAWTC (Yet Another Windows Ten Complaint):
@Yamikuronue said in YAWTC (Yet Another Windows Ten Complaint):
@RaceProUK said in YAWTC (Yet Another Windows Ten Complaint):
reinstall the broken software
Assuming it works on 10. I was figuring it's some monstrosity that's no longer supported and won't be getting updates.
I've yet to see anything work on 7 and not on 10
My sister's laptop BSODed several times a day on 7. Not a single BSOD on 10 since I installed it half a year ago (or maybe a full year, can't remember).
-
@Gąska said in YAWTC (Yet Another Windows Ten Complaint):
@RaceProUK said in YAWTC (Yet Another Windows Ten Complaint):
@Yamikuronue said in YAWTC (Yet Another Windows Ten Complaint):
@RaceProUK said in YAWTC (Yet Another Windows Ten Complaint):
reinstall the broken software
Assuming it works on 10. I was figuring it's some monstrosity that's no longer supported and won't be getting updates.
I've yet to see anything work on 7 and not on 10
My sister's laptop BSODed several times a day on 7. Not a single BSOD on 10 since I installed it half a year ago (or maybe a full year, can't remember).
QED. Obs the things that were working on said computer continued to work once 10 came along...
-
@Gąska said in YAWTC (Yet Another Windows Ten Complaint):
My sister's laptop BSODed several times a day on 7. Not a single BSOD on 10 since I installed it half a year ago (or maybe a full year, can't remember).
Either the update mended the file that was broken (there's lots of things that can go wrong) or you've now got a better driver for some bit of hardware. Hard to tell which.
-
@dkf both were clean installs from unmodified ISOs. The manufacturer's site doesn't even mention Windows 7 drivers, so it's possible no stable drivers exist.
-
@Gąska weird. I'm getting way more bsods on my desktop after switching to 10. 🙆
-
@Gąska said in YAWTC (Yet Another Windows Ten Complaint):
My sister's laptop BSODed several times a day on 7. Not a single BSOD on 10 since I installed it half a year ago (or maybe a full year, can't remember).
Which means there wasn't a hardware problem (a common cause of BSOD), just something in Windows 7 got borked, so you could have fixed the problem just as well by doing a clean install of Windows 7. And you get the added extra bonus of not using Windows 10.
-
@El_Heffe a better theory is that her laptop is just not compatible with W7. A theory supported by the fact there are no W7 drivers listed at manufacturer's site.
-
@Zecc said in YAWTC (Yet Another Windows Ten Complaint):
@El_Heffe said in YAWTC (Yet Another Windows Ten Complaint):
A few years ago, a friend of mine asked if I could take a look at his son's computer that wasn't working properly. (His son is an adult). I figured, worst case scenario, I wipe the hard drive and re-install Windows 7 (the newest version of Windows, at that time) along with the latest versions of whatever other programs I had.
The computer was running Windows 98.
I don't understand the point of this story.
Posted from my Windows 7 machine.
A Win98 machine probably can't run Win7.
-
@djls45 said in YAWTC (Yet Another Windows Ten Complaint):
@Zecc said in YAWTC (Yet Another Windows Ten Complaint):
@El_Heffe said in YAWTC (Yet Another Windows Ten Complaint):
A few years ago, a friend of mine asked if I could take a look at his son's computer that wasn't working properly. (His son is an adult). I figured, worst case scenario, I wipe the hard drive and re-install Windows 7 (the newest version of Windows, at that time) along with the latest versions of whatever other programs I had.
The computer was running Windows 98.
I don't understand the point of this story.
Posted from my Windows 7 machine.
A Win98 machine probably can't run Win7.
Maybe not. But a Windows XP machine can!
Also, "usefully" is quite relative. I was able to get an install of XP on a machine with 40 Mb of RAM and a Pentium Processor working which displayed IRC and BBS streams just fine (back in the day)!
-
@Gąska said in YAWTC (Yet Another Windows Ten Complaint):
@El_Heffe a better theory is that her laptop is just not compatible with W7. A theory supported by the fact there are no W7 drivers listed at manufacturer's site.
That would certainly make sense -- but how did the laptop get Win 7 on it?
-
@WernerCD said in YAWTC (Yet Another Windows Ten Complaint):
Users. Are. Stupid.
Users Are Cunts.
It all makes sense now!
Filed under: INB4: 'd somewhere downstream from quoted post
-
@Onyx said in YAWTC (Yet Another Windows Ten Complaint):
@WernerCD said in YAWTC (Yet Another Windows Ten Complaint):
Users. Are. Stupid.
Users Are Cunts.
It all makes sense now!
Filed under: INB4: 'd somewhere downstream from quoted post
U Are Correct Sir