The Return of Windows RT?
-
@anonymous234 said in The Return of Windows RT?:
I can't figure out what the hell is going on with Microsoft.
There are three really big things going on at MS.
- Windows (I guess you can count the consoles as part of this).
- Office (and supporting corporate software, so Exchange, SQL Server, etc.)
- Azure.
These are the things that move serious amounts of money. #2 is what's making the most right now, though #3 is rising (and has lock-in that people vote for with their feet and wallets, so that's really nice). #1 is entirely disconnected from #2 though, and if push comes to shove then they'll drop #1 to concentrate on the other too. (Ballmer wouldn't make that choice, but Nadella most definitely would.)
Developer tools are either feeding one of the behemoths above, or things that are also-rans that sneak out but aren't part of anyone's core business at all.
-
@Magus Nobody. Which is the point. :p
-
@dkf I was gonna ask about VS, but that's being connected to Azure more and more with every update. I wouldn't be surprised if, eventually, it gets renamed Azure Studio.
-
@RaceProUK said in The Return of Windows RT?:
@dkf I was gonna ask about VS, but that's being connected to Azure more and more with every update. I wouldn't be surprised if, eventually, it gets renamed Azure Studio.
And, with Code being used as a test platform, completely moved to the cloud?
#Conspiracy!
Actually, the more I think about it, the more it's actually plausible... And if not, Microsoft, you're free to contact me if you're interested in paying for my brillant ideas!
-
@RaceProUK said in The Return of Windows RT?:
I was gonna ask about VS
Well, I was just repeating what I've heard from people I know who work there. The finances are dominated by the big three products, and MS ain't stupid.
-
@dkf And with VS Community Edition giving you about 90% of VS Professional at 0% of the cost, I agree.
-
@Sumireko said in The Return of Windows RT?:
I'm gonna re-bring up my idea of OSaaS. Always online, and every restart entails a 5 GB download.
Wait while I'm patenting BSODaaS.
-
@Hanzo said in The Return of Windows RT?:
@Sumireko said in The Return of Windows RT?:
I'm gonna re-bring up my idea of OSaaS. Always online, and every restart entails a 5 GB download.
Wait while I'm patenting BSODaaS.
"Error: unknown error: the error CDN could not be reached"
-
@Sumireko said in The Return of Windows RT?:
Always online, and every restart entails a 5 GB download.
You realise that networks are starting to get fast enough that doing that is almost sensible?
-
@Lorne-Kates said in The Return of Windows RT?:
:(
"Error: unknown error: the error CDN could not be reached"FTFW8+
-
-
@dkf said in The Return of Windows RT?:
@Sumireko said in The Return of Windows RT?:
Always online, and every restart entails a 5 GB download.
You realise that networks are starting to get fast enough that doing that is almost sensible?
No.
No they're not.
-
- a simplifed version of the OS
- which will only run Unified Windows Platform apps
- installed from the Windows Store.
The phrase "3 strikes and you're out" comes to mind.
But that's just me.
-
@pydsigner said in The Return of Windows RT?:
No they're not.
Maybe we're unusual in rolling out gigabit-to-the-desktop? That really can sustain those sorts of transfer rates, and there's other hardware that can keep up. (We're looking to go to FTTDesktop with the next big tranche of buildings, but they're still quite a few years out of completion.)
And yes, we've got applications that will really use that. (I've got colleagues who are running a data processing and distribution centre for the LHC, and others who are working on the SKA.) Gigabytes of OS really counts as small beans.
-
@El_Heffe said in The Return of Windows RT?:
The phrase "3 strikes and you're out" comes to mind.
But that's just me.Two-bee-fayre, it's conceptually no different from a Chromebook.
-
@Magus said in The Return of Windows RT?:
The bad: I'd rather have an x86 or QUALCOMM edition and be able to install things.
That's always going to be a problem with the UWP-only ones.UWP is already x86, isn't it?
-
@coldandtired said in The Return of Windows RT?:
UWP is already x86, isn't it?
It runs on anything Windows 10 runs on, which is ARM, x86, and x64.
-
@RaceProUK That's what I thought. This new one sounds like Win10 locked in tablet mode.
-
@coldandtired Why do you think I titled the thread as such? :P
-
@RaceProUK I never actually used WIndows RT. My only experience with it comes from the woefully-underpowered API.
-
@RaceProUK said in The Return of Windows RT?:
@boomzilla said in The Return of Windows RT?:
How will they fuck up the start menu this time?
Ads.
The start menu already has
adssuggested apps.
-
@Deadfast said in The Return of Windows RT?:
@RaceProUK said in The Return of Windows RT?:
@boomzilla said in The Return of Windows RT?:
How will they fuck up the start menu this time?
Ads.
The start menu already has
adssuggested apps.Oh right. The ads are pre-installed. (GetOffice)
-
@Captain said in The Return of Windows RT?:
@Polygeekery A way to measure social capital isn't a terrible idea. Black Mirror did an episode about a scheme like this.
At the end of the day, it's not really much different than what we do here, where private parties (that we don't elect, and are unaccountable to us) compile and publish numbers/"scores" about each of us that determine how much we pay for stuff.
At least we can elect to not play that game. The Chinese are not so lucky.
-
@dkf said in The Return of Windows RT?:
SKA
How had I never heard of that before?!
The amount of sensory information collected pose a huge storage problem and require real-time signal processing to reduce the information to relevant data. In mid 2011 it was estimated the array could generate an exabyte a day of raw data, which could be compressed to around 10 petabytes
I like to imagine that they'll build a system of rails and little carts carrying piles of hard drives up and down. They probably won't but it would be so cool.
-
Can we really?
Everybody has a credit score, and having no credit by the time you're middle aged will severely hurt your ability to do things. (They're taking your freedoms and you can't opt out...)
-
@anonymous234 said in The Return of Windows RT?:
I like to imagine that they'll build a system of rails and little carts carrying piles of hard drives up and down.
I'd guess that it'll be fiber optic links, at least to a convenient place for a shipping container full of flash memory.
-
@coldandtired It's probably not locked to tablet mode, since they even put the desktop mode in the phone version.
RT had a kind of bare-bones API, which is now pretty decent - and it's fundamentally disconnected from the processor architecture, which is something I find really compelling - I'd be fine with it killing win32, but that's understandably difficult.
At this point, they're moving the other way too: They're doing a "Windows for Qualcomm" with x86 emulation. As much as I hate the idea though, that approach may actually help.
-
@Magus said in The Return of Windows RT?:
It's probably not locked to tablet mode, since they even put the desktop mode in the phone version.
Only on the Lumia 950 and 950XL, IIRC (the only ones with Continuum)
-
@RaceProUK yeah, I don't know why they bothered locking that. I admit it'd probably be slow on my Icon, and I doubt I'd use it, but I don't see the harm in allowing it.
I will bother upgrading next time they release a new high-end device. But I'm one of the very strange people who is quite satisfied with their platform (And as a platform, it's awesome. I can't imagine anyone disagreeing with that at this point. But network effect blah blah blah...)
-
@anonymous234 said in The Return of Windows RT?:
You could make a social network that was better than Facebook, but what's the point when everyone is on Facebook. Etc.
Yes, because MySpace was so much better....
People do drop heavily used products for better versions even with the network effect in place.
But you're only complaining about the cases where it is visible.
Consider what milk goes into your yogurt. The only time people have ever cared, is because of the introduction of terms they network with like "organic". So, it's actually the network effect that's perpetuating "organic".
Otherwise, if the milk was functionally equivalent, without a social narrative, you wouldn't care.
-
@xaade But you need to build up that critical mass to do so first. Facebook managed it, but I can't think of any other examples right now.
-
@RaceProUK said in The Return of Windows RT?:
@xaade But you need to build up that critical mass to do so first. Facebook managed it, but I can't think of any other examples right now.
Preference for Windows XP over Vista?
The problem isn't "network effect", but consumer laziness.
I'm willing to bet that the majority of people wouldn't have cared otherwise about Vista.
-
@anonymous234 said in The Return of Windows RT?:
I like to imagine that they'll build a system of rails and little carts carrying piles of hard drives up and down. They probably won't but it would be so cool.
I sense a Factorio addict...
-
@xaade said in The Return of Windows RT?:
Consider what milk goes into your yogurt. The only time people have ever cared, is because of the introduction of terms they network with like "organic". So, it's actually the network effect that's perpetuating "organic".
I'm quite certain I've never seen yogurt made from inorganic milk.
-
Given there is Win10M for mobile device already, what good does it bring to make such OS?
I think those targets are more likely a new "thin client" version that runs everything on the cloud, such as the RemoteApp that Microsoft has advertised before.
-
@RaceProUK said in The Return of Windows RT?:
Sources at Microsoft told ZDNet's Mary Jo-Foley that Windows 10 Cloud will be a simplifed version of the OS, which will only run Unified Windows Platform apps installed from the Windows Store.
Kinda like their Windows Server Nano, but with a GUI?
(lol jk, but not far off probably)
-
@boomzilla said in The Return of Windows RT?:
Yeah, this discussion is interesting and all, but let's get down to the important stuff:
How will they fuck up the start menu this time?
My bet: returning it back into a Win32 application.
-
@Sumireko said in The Return of Windows RT?:
@hungrier said in The Return of Windows RT?:
@boomzilla said in The Return of Windows RT?:
How will they fuck up the start menu this time?
Apps in the start menu will be loaded from a CDN
I'm gonna re-bring up my idea of OSaaS. Always online, and every restart entails a 5 GB download.
I once had an online OS that was essentially a disk image served up by httpdisk, and a fbwf to persist certain changes to local disk. Slow as balls though.
-
@Jaloopa said in The Return of Windows RT?:
@boomzilla said in The Return of Windows RT?:
How will they fuck up the start menu this time?
It will be an @end menu instead. When you click it, you'll just get a "sorry, no longer welcome here" message, and have to use the command prompt to open your programs instead
Windows Server Core ftw!
-
@dkf said:
@Sumireko said in The Return of Windows RT?:
Always online, and every restart entails a 5 GB download.
You realise that networks are starting to get fast enough that doing that is almost sensible?
Yeah, I have "minimum" of 200 Mbps fibre - in practice, if the server is "near" enough, I can get up to 320 Mbps on downloads. That's 40 MB/sec, around half the rate my hard disks can sustain. It's a bit scary sometimes, telling something to download and realising I blinked or looked away for a moment and missed the download.
-
@Captain said in The Return of Windows RT?:
Can we really?
Everybody has a credit score, and having no credit by the time you're middle aged will severely hurt your ability to do things. (They're taking your freedoms and you can't opt out...)
While there are some similarities to the Chinese thing it's still pretty different and much more terrifying.
-
@Steve_The_Cynic said in The Return of Windows RT?:
@dkf said:
@Sumireko said in The Return of Windows RT?:
Always online, and every restart entails a 5 GB download.
You realise that networks are starting to get fast enough that doing that is almost sensible?
Yeah, I have "minimum" of 200 Mbps fibre - in practice, if the server is "near" enough, I can get up to 320 Mbps on downloads. That's 40 MB/sec, around half the rate my hard disks can sustain. It's a bit scary sometimes, telling something to download and realising I blinked or looked away for a moment and missed the download.
Lucky you. Us USians would have to mortgage the house to get service like that. Assuming it was even available. I'm in Silicon Valley and I don't have access to that.
-
@Deadfast said in The Return of Windows RT?:
@RaceProUK said in The Return of Windows RT?:
@boomzilla said in The Return of Windows RT?:
How will they fuck up the start menu this time?
Ads.
The start menu already has
adssuggested apps.Oh, and speaking of ads...
Note the utter lack of a "NEVER AGAIN" button.
-
@RaceProUK said in The Return of Windows RT?:
@El_Heffe said in The Return of Windows RT?:
The phrase "3 strikes and you're out" comes to mind.
But that's just me.Two-bee-fayre, it's conceptually no different from a Chromebook.
That's based on the assumption that a Chromebook, or being like a Chromebook, is a good thing.
-
@Deadfast said in The Return of Windows RT?:
Note the utter lack of a "NEVER AGAIN" button.
Note that there is an X in the top-right corner.
But with Micro-Soft, clicking on it may do the same thing as clicking on "Sign in"
-
@dcon said in The Return of Windows RT?:
Lucky you. Us USians would have to mortgage the house to get service like that. Assuming it was even available. I'm in Silicon Valley and I don't have access to that.
Don't worry. Der Trumpenfuhrer's new head of the FCC says he's going to remove all the "regulatory barriers" that are preventing everyone from having petabit internet speeds. And a pony. Or maybe a unicorn.
-
@TimeBandit said in The Return of Windows RT?:
@Deadfast said in The Return of Windows RT?:
Note the utter lack of a "NEVER AGAIN" button.
Note that there is an X in the top-right corner.
But with Micro-Soft, clicking on it may do the same thing as clicking on "Sign in"Yeah, there's no way that thing dismisses this forever.
-
@Deadfast said in The Return of Windows RT?:
Yeah, there's no way that thing dismisses this forever.
This
addssuggested apps needs a big button labeled "FUCK OFF"
-
@TimeBandit said in The Return of Windows RT?:
@Deadfast said in The Return of Windows RT?:
Note the utter lack of a "NEVER AGAIN" button.
Note that there is an X in the top-right corner.
But with Micro-Soft, clicking on it may do the same thing as clicking on "Sign in"Didn't they get sued over doing that with the Upgrade to Windows 10 thing?
I wonder how that lawsuit is doing...
Edit: Apparently they lost one such lawsuit already, but it was only for $10k.
-
@El_Heffe said in The Return of Windows RT?:
he's going to remove all the "regulatory barriers"
Right. Second mortgage too. And selling your first-born. Hmm - Problem, I'm single.