WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else
-
@Rhywden said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
our school PCs all reset to the vendor image upon logout
Does that also include non-shared laptops? (If so, )
-
@Rhywden said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
And we make it pretty clear to everyone that
Desktop
is not a good place to save stuff.That's what the trash can is for.
-
@Zerosquare said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
@Rhywden said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
our school PCs all reset to the vendor image upon logout
Does that also include non-shared laptops? (If so, )
We don't have the budget for custom configurations. We simply could not sustain the additional tech support needed for that.
Plus, we don't have many non-shared laptops (again, budget) and the ones we do have are only loaners for about a month at a time.
-
@HardwareGeek said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
@Rhywden said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
And we make it pretty clear to everyone that
Desktop
is not a good place to save stuff.How many of them save stuff there anyway?
I've never understood saving things to the desktop, other than it is the one location guaranteed to always exist on all (Windows) computers.
I have this one program that always defaults to saving things to the Desktop. You can change the location, but you can't change the default, so every time I save something I have to change the location. Every. Fucking. Time.
-
@Rhywden said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
And we make it pretty clear to everyone that Desktop is not a good place to save stuff.
One of our clients recently migrated to a new server in Azure and they've asked us if we could redeploy our software to that server.
We said "sure, just make a copy of your existing data files in this and that directory and then we will take care of setting things up".
They copied their data to a drive named "Temporary Storage", which contained a file named "DATALOSS_WARNING_README.txt". Guess what happened next.
-
@Zecc said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
Guess what happened next.
They read the file and disaster was averted?
-
@El_Heffe said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
@HardwareGeek said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
@Rhywden said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
And we make it pretty clear to everyone that
Desktop
is not a good place to save stuff.How many of them save stuff there anyway?
I've never understood saving things to the desktop, other than it is the one location guaranteed to always exist on all (Windows) computers.
I have this one program that always defaults to saving things to the Desktop. You can change the location, but you can't change the default, so every time I save something I have to change the location. Every. Fucking. Time.
That takes "talent". Because Window's save dialog remembers the last directory you saved to by default.
-
@loopback0 said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
@Zecc said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
Guess what happened next.
They read the file
and disaster was avertedname?Has anyone in the history of computers ever read a file that says 'readme'?
-
@loopback0 said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
@Zecc said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
Guess what happened next.
They read the file and disaster was averted?
We read it to them. Because there was nothing else there to read.
Fortunately they hadn't gotten rid of the old server yet.
Or as @Luhmann would spell it:
We red it to them. Because there was nothing else there to reed.
Fortunately they hadn't gotten read of the old server yet.
-
Congratulations! You are reading the README file for a software package you downloaded! You are now officially an *advanced* software installer.
-
@Watson These two statements do not agree with each other:
- Under active development, last updated April 2020.
- Requires Python 2.6. Python 3 is not supported.
-
@TwelveBaud There's a hard core of application developers who don't see why the world should change and just insist on keeping on doing things the old way. When they get their world ripped out from under their feet (by, say, it no longer being possible to install their prerequisites as they're out of security support), they scream and shout about it.
These are the same sorts of people who write C functions like this (contents simplified):
foo(x, y) double y; { return x + y * 10; }
-
@El_Heffe said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
@HardwareGeek said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
@Rhywden said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
And we make it pretty clear to everyone that
Desktop
is not a good place to save stuff.How many of them save stuff there anyway?
I've never understood saving things to the desktop, other than it is the one location guaranteed to always exist on all (Windows) computers.
It's for convenience because it's right there on the screen instead of in some folder somewhere.
-
@dkf said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
@TwelveBaud There's a hard core of application developers who don't see why the world should change and just insist on keeping on doing things the old way. When they get their world ripped out from under their feet (by, say, it no longer being possible to install their prerequisites as they're out of security support), they scream and shout about it.
These are the same sorts of people who write C functions like this (contents simplified):
foo(x, y) double y; { return x + y * 10; }
Gody isrealdouble, unless declared integer.
No wait, it's the other way around here.
-
@dkf I bet they also write a jump-to-my-code instruction to
(void*)0x1C
because "can't be sure the OS-provided FPU emulator has the math right"... when every x86 CPU since 1993 has a hardware FPU that can't be disabled.
-
@boomzilla said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
it's right there on the screen instead of in some folder somewhere.
Only if you can actually see any of the desktop behind all the windows that are layered 20-deep.
-
@HardwareGeek said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
Only if you can actually see any of the desktop behind all the windows that are layered 20-deep.
I remember working with a guy like this.
And everytime I would watch him look at all the icons on his desktop trying to find the right shortcut/folder/file to open for like 5 minutes, I would be like
-
@TimeBandit said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
everytime I would watch him look at all the icons on his desktop trying to find the right shortcut/folder/file to open for like 5 minutes
I rarely use icons on the desktop, because they're always buried; if an installer offers an option to create a desktop icon or not, I'll usually choose not. The only taskbar icons that are usually a problem are Firefox on my machine, if I have to scroll the list of windows, or gvim on my work machine, because I tend to work on (either actually editing or just referring to) a lot of files at once. The other applications I have open are less of a problem, because I tend to have fewer instances open, so they don't stack on the taskbar (or whatever Gnome calls their equivalent).
-
@TimeBandit said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
everytime I would watch him look at all the icons on his desktop trying to find the right shortcut/folder/file to open for like 5 minutes
As someone with a lot of desktop icons as well, I can tell you it's possible the icons were neatly organized before the monitor resolution happened to change for some reason.
Filed under: fool me once, shame on you. But after the fifth time, kicks in.
-
@TwelveBaud said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
every x86 CPU since 1993 has a hardware FPU that can't be disabled.
I used the 386SX for a while, which was the last version of Intel machine without an FPU. One of the good features of the early Linux kernel was that it included the FPU emulator in the kernel instead of needing you to screw around with one in application space.
I'm glad those days are gone.
-
: The last Intel CPU without FPU was the 486SX, not 386SX.
-
@Zecc said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
As someone with a lot of desktop icons as well, I can tell you it's possible the icons were neatly organized before the monitor resolution happened to change for some reason.
Because my machine went to screen saving and turned off the monitors. And because the non-primary 100% window powers on faster than then 200% 4K monitor, everything resizes when things come back to life. But, of course, not every time. (Except for Firefox and Thunderbird always resizing themselves)
I need to replicate the 4K... (but and )
-
@Zerosquare I really thought that the 486SX was hobbled in some other way. Not that it matters; by that point, I didn't need to buy based on lowest price alone.
-
@dkf said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
@Zerosquare I really thought that the 486SX was hobbled in some other way. Not that it matters; by that point, I didn't need to buy based on lowest price alone.
Ditto. I went from a 386sx to a 486dx. (don't remember the speeds, that was too long ago) I also doubled my memory to 4M! (or did I quad it to 8? )
-
I had a dream that involved cannibalizing a dryer for a pair of 486 (no model specified) chips running at a whopping 25 MHz (I don't even know if that's a real thing). Something about going dual CPU.
Why there were 486 CPUs, let alone two of them, in a dryer to begin with, I'm not quite sure.
-
@dkf The 386 could come with the FPU in the same package (DX) or not (SX), and you could add a 387 to the SX to make a whole processor. The 486 always had an FPU on-die, which could be enabled (DX) or scrapped (SX). You could buy a 487, but that's just a rebadged 486DX that took over all processor operations entirely. The Pentium always came with a working on-die FPU, and I'm pretty sure Intel stopped selling SX's that same year.
@Benjamin-Hall Yes that's a valid speed. I'm not sure why, but TI was making 486's for industrial control up until earlier this decade, and there's no reason you couldn't write a cooperative-multiprocessed real-time OS for clothes driers on them.
-
@Benjamin-Hall said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
I had a dream
The "Don't interpret my dreams" thread is . And the MLK thread, if we had one, would probably be somewhere .
Filed under: MLK Day
-
@HardwareGeek said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
@Benjamin-Hall said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
I had a dream
The "Don't interpret my dreams" thread is . And the MLK thread, if we had one, would probably be somewhere .
Filed under: MLK Day
My dogs made me stop dreaming too early on MLK day. (Come on guys, 0530 is too early! Oh wait, my bladder says I'm not going back to sleep now anyways...)
-
@dcon said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
my bladder says I'm not going back to sleep
The oversharing thread is also .
-
@Benjamin-Hall said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
486 ... running at a whopping 25 MHz
It's been way too long, but I do believe in our household we had a 486 which ran at 25 MHz (or 16 MHz if you turned off Turbo).
-
@TwelveBaud said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
The Pentium always came with a working on-die FPU
For varying definitions of working.
-
@dcon said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
@Zecc said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
As someone with a lot of desktop icons as well, I can tell you it's possible the icons were neatly organized before the monitor resolution happened to change for some reason.
Because my machine went to screen saving and turned off the monitors. And because the non-primary 100% window powers on faster than then 200% 4K monitor, everything resizes when things come back to life. But, of course, not every time. (Except for Firefox and Thunderbird always resizing themselves)
I need to replicate the 4K... (but and )
Yeah, fucking Acer..
-
@Tsaukpaetra said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
@dcon said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
@Zecc said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
As someone with a lot of desktop icons as well, I can tell you it's possible the icons were neatly organized before the monitor resolution happened to change for some reason.
Because my machine went to screen saving and turned off the monitors. And because the non-primary 100% window powers on faster than then 200% 4K monitor, everything resizes when things come back to life. But, of course, not every time. (Except for Firefox and Thunderbird always resizing themselves)
I need to replicate the 4K... (but and )
Yeah, fucking Acer..
In my case, Asus.
-
I'm manually copying a folder from my computer to an external disk (yes, a poor man's backup if you want, there is a story behind it but it mostly involves ).
The directory already exists on the disk (since, again, poor man's backup), so I first rename it
foo -> foo_old
. Then I copy-pastefoo
. Nothing wrong with that, right?Well I still got the popup for " the files are already on the disk". Looking at the list of files, yes, it tells me that
file1
exists as<local_disk>\foo\file1
and also as<usb_disk>\foo_old\file1
. So they're not the same!foo_old != foo
!!!I told it to override everything (because anyway I was going to remove
foo_old
immediately after), it finished. The list of directories on the USB disk still only showsfoo_old
, notfoo
. That's... a bit weird, but I guess it didn't refresh the view? So refresh, and now I can seefoo
. Good. But no longerfoo_old
. Not good.Now I probably know the reason for that whole fuckery:
foo
is actuallyDocuments
which as we all know is a special folder because, well, Windows. So I'm pretty sure that when I renamed it, in fact I renamed i.e. not renamed it at all except in the explorer window that I had open, and that therefore when I copied another folder it knew deep down that it actually was the same.Still a Windows , if you ask me. If you don't actually want to let me rename the folder, don't let me do it. If you know that I'm copying something called
foo
but that it's actually going to overwrite something not calledfoo
, tell me so right away, not after having started the copy, and not with a cryptic "some files are similar to some other files" bullshit dialog.
-
@remi Robocopy is your friend. Robocopy is your protector. Don't allow Explorers to tell you otherwise. Trust Robocopy. Resiliency is mandatory.
(With apologies to @Schol_R_LEA)
-
@remi said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
Now I probably know the reason for that whole fuckery:
foo
is actuallyDocuments
...Best solution: don't use the Documents folder Windows assigns you for anything. Put your actual files elsewhere. If you are forced to use the Documents folder for something, always copy the files/folders inside it, never the folder itself. (Now you know one reason why.)
I screwed this up once when I was trying to recover files from a friend's messed-up machine, creating an infinite loop My Documents folder on my own computer's boot drive. Ended up wiping that machine to get things back to normal.
On this Windows 10 computer, the only things in my user profile's Documents folder were put there by various applications without asking me where to put them. Most of them are game saves and preferences, but a few non-games put stuff in there too. All of my own files are on a different drive.
If you don't actually want to let me rename the folder, don't let me do it.
I'd rather it "de-specialize" the folder when you copy it, so the copy on your USB drive would be a regular folder named "Documents" or whatever. I'm sure that'd cause people problems in some way, though.
If you know that I'm copying something called
foo
but that it's actually going to overwrite something not calledfoo
, tell me so right away, not after having started the copy, and not with a cryptic "some files are similar to some other files" bullshit dialog.It's the new prompt for same-name files/folders, where Explorer does everything it can and then asks you about overwriting things afterwards. I'm sure they could go back to asking you individually for each file in the middle of the copy process if you'd prefer.
-
@Parody said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
Best solution: don't use the Documents folder Windows assigns you for anything.
Yes, but . I started using it partly because I didn't notice, partly because I didn't really care, and now that I'm stuck with it... meh. It works most of time and the remaining failures are just enough to warrant a TD rant, not to actually do something about it.
If you don't actually want to let me rename the folder, don't let me do it.
I'd rather it "de-specialize" the folder when you copy it, so the copy on your USB drive would be a regular folder named "Documents" or whatever. I'm sure that'd cause people problems in some way, though.
I'm pretty sure it would cause weird effects, but that would indeed have been my preferred solution. "Documents" is special when it's in your profile folder (or in whatever location is defined by some hidden registry key), OK, I can live with it. But a folder named "Documents" anywhere else, or a copy of that folder anywhere else, should become, and behave like, a regular folder IMO. That's actually what I expected when I made the initial copy, and what it looked like on the USB disk (in particular it doesn't have the special "Documents" icon, it uses the regular folder one).
But barring that, if for some they have to keep it special, they should detect it from the start and act accordingly whenever I try to fiddle with it (i.e. forbid me from renaming it), rather than letting me do it but actually not do it properly.
If you know that I'm copying something called
foo
but that it's actually going to overwrite something not calledfoo
, tell me so right away, not after having started the copy, and not with a cryptic "some files are similar to some other files" bullshit dialog.It's the new prompt for same-name files/folders, where Explorer does everything it can and then asks you about overwriting things afterwards. I'm sure they could go back to asking you individually for each file in the middle of the copy process if you'd prefer.
<>It's usually better to try and read what people wrote before answering. </>
The dialog by itself is indeed better than the old one. But I'm not sure in which world "tell me so right away" means "asking you individually for each file in the middle of the copy process." They went to the effort of making a new dialog, so they actually did some work (shudder). They just missed the step where they think about it before doing it, and did a half-assed thing that doesn't properly detect/notify special cases.
Not that I'm really surprised about it all, but not that not being surprised is going to stop me from ranting about it either.
-
@Parody said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
Best solution: don't use the
Documents folder Windows assigns you for anything.the default dumping ground of applications, in particular those which think dot files in Windows are a thing
-
@Zecc said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
@Parody said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
Best solution: don't use the
Documents folder Windows assigns you for anything.the default dumping ground of applications, in particular those which think dot files in Windows are a thingThat's annoying on Linux too, even if less so. Please, dump your configuration garbage into
~/.config
instead of~
. TYVM.
-
@remi said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
But barring that, if for some they have to keep it special . . . . (i.e. forbid me from renaming it)
I feel like I'm missing something here. I guess I'm just dense. Why would you rename the Documents folder?
Create a folder called E:\Foo
Right click on Documents
Select Properties --> Location
Change location to E:\FooFor all intensive porpoises, the
Documents
folder no longer exists and has been replaced byFoo
.I did this years ago and it works perfectly fine. As an added bonus benefit, any retarded program which defaults to saving files in
Documents
(and there are a lot of those), now automagically saves toFoo
.I did the same thing with some of the other "special" folders, such as
Music
andVideo
. Never had a problem. iTunes, the ultimate weird retarded program, automagically saves everything toG:\Audio
which has now replacedMusic
.The only problem I ever encountered was when I changed the location of
Documents
to an external hard drive and then due to other fuckery, Windows took it upon itself to change the drive letter of the external drive, and E:\Foo no longer existed. This caused all manner of weird breakage in Explorer, including difficulty accessing the Start Menu. But that was on Windows 7.
-
@El_Heffe said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
I feel like I'm missing something here. I guess I'm just dense. Why would you rename the Documents folder?
He was trying to copy the contents of Documents to another drive for backup purposes. Not to move the folder itself.
As in:
Day 1: cp C:\Users\remi\Documents E:\DocumentsDay 2: mv E:\Documents E:\Documents_old ; cp C:\Users\remi\Documents E:\Documents
-
@Zecc said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
@Parody said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
Best solution: don't use the
Documents folder Windows assigns you for anything.the default dumping ground of applications, in particular those which think dot files in Windows are a thingI don't think I've seen any turn up in the Documents directory. Now
%USERPROFILE%
is an entirely different story...
-
@El_Heffe said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
I feel like I'm missing something here. I guess I'm just dense. Why would you rename the Documents folder?
I think that the bit you're missing is the first post of this discussion. Read my first post in that chain to see why I renamed a Documents folder.
(edit: or what @acrow said, but I started typing an typical TD answer based on about people not reading but then won yet again. Plus it's Friday 5pm here, so fuck you all, I'm off to
get a drinkpick up my grocery then get a drink)
-
@remi said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
they actually did some work (shudder). They just missed the step where they think
You want both working and thinking? I'm not sure even 's Earth-73 manages that.
-
@acrow said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
@El_Heffe said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
I feel like I'm missing something here. I guess I'm just dense. Why would you rename the Documents folder?
He was trying to copy the contents of Documents to another drive for backup purposes. Not to move the folder itself.
I do that literally every day. No problem. Oh well, whatever.
-
@remi said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
(edit: or what @acrow said, but I started typing an typical TD answer based on about people not reading but then won yet again.
Well, your orignal post was as clear as a glass of mud so maybe hold off on the
-
@remi said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
But I'm not sure in which world "tell me so right away" means "asking you individually for each file in the middle of the copy process."
It sounded to me like you want the copy process to stop on the first conflict to ask you what you want to do, which is exactly what Explorer used to do however many iterations of the conflict dialog ago. That version would ask for each conflicting file/folder unless you wanted to overwrite everything or Cancel in the middle of the process.
-
@boomzilla said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
Got an email back. Basically he's SOL, which I figured. They said he has to log into the school's network at least once every two weeks to prevent that from happening. I sent back a much politer email than I wanted to asking that means. He's attending school every day with it.
Fuckers.
Sooo... What is the "school network" then?
-
@Parody He wants it to stop immediately if there's a folder with the same underlying-filesystem name, before copying any children of that folder. Kind of like it used to do, before people said "I'm sick and tired of this darn golly dialog asking me to confirm I want to do what I told it to do! I'm not even going to bother reading it and just mash whatever button gets it out of my way. And cancel means my copy doesn't get done!"
He also wants it to prevent him from renaming any folder that's recognized as having a special name, or to have the rename apply to the underlying-filesystem name. Which will never happen because -- guess what! -- this is actually intended behavior so that apps that don't realize those special folders have been renamed can continue to shovel their crap into them. Which is why you should never use Explorer for anything if you're expecting specific results -- idiots are gonna idiot, always and forever, so Explorer has to compromise to protect them from themselves.
-
@TwelveBaud said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
idiots are gonna idiot, always and forever, so Explorer has to compromise to protect them from themselves.
Idiots should not be protected from the consequences of their idiocy. (Except on the rare occasions that I am .)