WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else
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@Tsaukpaetra it's
\\wsl$\<insert distro here>\usr\Tsaukpaetra\
.
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In other news: Windows is still confused about what the Internet is.
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"That is to say, affected users are being alerted to a connection issue that does not actually exist, by way of an incorrect "No Internet Access" message within the 'Network and Internet' settings on Windows 10.
Eh...those are always untrustworthy and nothing new.
The larger problem is that some apps apparently will not work if Windows reports there is an issue with the internet connection
Meh.
On the bright side, Microsoft is aware of the issue and is currently looking into it. That being the case, this is likely to be resolved either with an out-of-band update, or with the next Patch Tuesday roll out (which will arrive on August 11, the second Tuesday of next month).
Hopefully by never reporting this message ever again.
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@pie_flavor said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
@Tsaukpaetra it's
\\wsl$\<insert distro here>\usr\Tsaukpaetra\
.Speaking of - why is it Windows Subsystem for Linux instead of Linux Subsystem for Windows?
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@Rhywden said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
@acrow I'm already sorry I asked.
((necro)) I'm sorry you asked, too.
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@Gąska said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
@pie_flavor said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
@Tsaukpaetra it's
\\wsl$\<insert distro here>\usr\Tsaukpaetra\
.Speaking of - why is it Windows Subsystem for Linux instead of Linux Subsystem for Windows?
I’ve had that same thought before, and I think as usual the answer is marketing.
It needs to be called “Windows something something”, not “Linux something something”.
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@Gąska Presumably because its predecessor was the Subsystem for Unix-Based Applications (SUA).
As to why that was SUA and not ASU, I have no idea.
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@Gąska It's a Windows Subsystem and it's for running Linux?
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Sorry, I'm in one of those moods, efficaciously fuelled by a big ol' glass of medium-good quality French wine that followed a rather tasty kir cassis made with entirely French ingredients.(1) I'm well buzzed.
On the other hand, my much-maligned main PC finally got its invitation to update to Windows 10 2004 this morning, and in the aftermath, it had a jolly BSOD, my absolute first on Windows 10.
(1) It's really easy to buy French wine(2) when you live in France. Duh.
(2) If you prefer beer (I don't), it's easy to buy aggressively strong (up to 12%) Belgian abbey beer around where I live, just on the edge of Lille. It is, apparently, top-tier stuff.
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@loopback0 said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
@Gąska It's a Windows Subsystem and it's for running Linux?
Right. I think I've once read somewhere that it was only one among several Windows Subsystems, like the subsystem for OS/2, for Windows 16-bit, maybe DOS.
Not that it helps answer the question. /shrug
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@Zecc said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
@loopback0 said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
@Gąska It's a Windows Subsystem and it's for running Linux?
Right. I think I've once read somewhere that it was only one among several Windows Subsystems, like the subsystem for OS/2, for Windows 16-bit, maybe DOS.
Not that it helps answer the question. /shrug
Not to mention the most-used Windows subsystem: Win32.
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@loopback0 said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
@Gąska It's a Windows Subsystem and it's for running Linux?
More accurately, the Windows Subsystem for running Linux applications, just as the Win32 subsystem is for running Win32 applications, and the OS/2 subsystems iswas for running OS/2 applications.
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@Steve_The_Cynic I dunno if I'd call that the most used subsystem. I'd say the most used subsystem is WOW64
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@Steve_The_Cynic said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
@loopback0 said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
@Gąska It's a Windows Subsystem and it's for running Linux?
More accurately, the Windows Subsystem for running Linux applications, just as the Win32 subsystem is for running Win32 applications, and the OS/2 subsystems iswas for running OS/2 applications.
But IIRC the official name for those subsystems are "Win32 subsystem" and "OS/2 subsystem" (also "Windows subsystem" for 16-bit and "console subsystem" for CLI applications). No matter how you look at it, WSL is the odd one out.
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@Gąska said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
@Steve_The_Cynic said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
@loopback0 said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
@Gąska It's a Windows Subsystem and it's for running Linux?
More accurately, the Windows Subsystem for running Linux applications, just as the Win32 subsystem is for running Win32 applications, and the OS/2 subsystems iswas for running OS/2 applications.
But IIRC the official name for those subsystem is "Win32 subsystem" and "OS/2 subsystem" (also "Windows subsystem" for 16-bit and "console subsystem" for CLI applications). No matter how you look at it, WSL is the odd one out.
For console applications, it's debatable, since they still have full access to all of the Win32 API, and can, indeed, create windows and even call FreeConsole to disconnect from their console.
But yeah, the naming is ... weird.
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@pie_flavor said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
@Steve_The_Cynic I dunno if I'd call that the most used subsystem. I'd say the most used subsystem is WOW64
Is that a separate subsystem in its own right? (Not to mention that it undoubtedly uses the 64-bit Win32 subsystem behind the scenes...)
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@Steve_The_Cynic said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
@pie_flavor said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
@Steve_The_Cynic I dunno if I'd call that the most used subsystem. I'd say the most used subsystem is WOW64
Is that a separate subsystem in its own right? (Not to mention that it undoubtedly uses the 64-bit Win32 subsystem behind the scenes...)
Ostensibly, the natively 64-bit Windows libraries that WOW64 uses behind the scenes is itself a subsystem.
Essentially, the Windows kernel is useless if you're not interfacing with at least one subsystem.
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@Steve_The_Cynic It needs kernel support for some thunking something or other, and the kernel side is implemented as a subsystem, though everything gets forwarded to the 64-bit Win32 subsystem.
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@loopback0 said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
@Gąska It's a Windows Subsystem and it's for running Linux?
It’s a subsystem of Windows. It’s the Linux subsystem for Windows. At least IMNSHO.
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@Steve_The_Cynic said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
It is, apparently, top-tier stuff.
It always is.
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@topspin said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
It’s a subsystem of Windows.
@loopback0 said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
It's a Windows Subsystem
Yes.
@topspin said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
Linux subsystem for Windows.
Also valid.
Windows System for Linux is still correct with the bonus of being in line with other Windows-branded things.
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@loopback0 said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
Windows System for Linux is still correct with the bonus of being in line with other Windows-branded things.
And being the complete opposite of what every single piece of software ever made in the entire history of making software meant by adding "for Linux" to its name. Don't forget that.
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@Gąska It's almost like words have different meanings.
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@loopback0 yeah, I hate this recent trend of changing what words mean too.
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@Gąska said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
@loopback0 yeah, I hate this recent trend of changing what words mean too.
Welcome to America!
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@Tsaukpaetra 4 days early but thanks!
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@Gąska said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
@Tsaukpaetra 4 days early but thanks!
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This post is deleted!
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@TwelveBaud said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
the 64-bit Win32 subsystem
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@loopback0 said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
Windows System for Linux is still correct
Only to the marketing department at Microsoft. It isn't a Windows Subsystem for Linux. That name implies that you're running something under Linux. You aren't. You are running Linux under Windows, so it is a Linux Subsystem for Windows.
with the bonus of being in line with other Windows-branded things.
And that's the problem. Microsoft insists that "Windows" must come first in the product name, even when it is wrong and doesn't make sense. They did the same exact thing in the 90s with Windows for OS/2. It's wrong and doesn't make sense, but it is consistent, so there's that.
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@dkf said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
@TwelveBaud said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
the 64-bit Win32 subsystem
The moral of the story: engineers gonna engineer, marketers gonna market.
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@Gąska said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
"It's the same old subsystem, just compiled for 64 bits. Let's keep the old name
for simplicitybecause there are too many stupidly hard-coded programs that will break if we change Win32 to Win64
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@El_Heffe said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
@Gąska said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
"It's the same old subsystem, just compiled for 64 bits. Let's keep the old name
for simplicitybecause there are too many stupidly hard-coded programs that will break if we change Win32 to Win64Regardless, it's actually named after the API, which remains Win32 even on 64-bit architectures. (In theory, someone with way far too much time on his hands could create an implementation of Win32 for x86-16.(1) I'd generally favour chastising such a person with a week-dead mackerel for engaging in such futility, but it could be done.)
(1) No, that's not the same thing as the 16-bit Windows API.
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@TwelveBaud said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
No. Win32s is an implementation of a 32-bit flavour of a subset of Win32.(1) What I meant was really an x86-16 version, perhaps with 16:32 data pointers.
(1) Win32c is the subset that Win9X implemented, with very little of the widechar API set (among other deficiencies). Win32s was a subset of that, notably lacking threading support.
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@Steve_The_Cynic said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
@TwelveBaud said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
No. Win32s is an implementation of a 32-bit flavour of a subset of Win32.(1) What I meant was really an x86-16 version, perhaps with 16:32 data pointers.
(1) Win32c is the subset that Win9X implemented, with very little of the widechar API set (among other deficiencies). Win32s was a subset of that, notably lacking threading support.
And access to the COM api. (I had to write a thunk layer so our 32bit program could talk to the modem. ***shudder***)
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It allowed some 32-bit applications to run on the 16-bit operating system using call thunks.
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I updated to 2004 by force but it broke a couple of odd things (I guess they were right about it being unavailable), so I rolled back to 1903 then updated to 1909.
Now I have "Suggestions" in the start menu.
Thankfully there's an off button for them.
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@loopback0 said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
Thankfully there's an off button for them.
One of the first things I do on a new machine!
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@loopback0 said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
I updated to 2004 by force but it broke a couple of odd things
Had that happen on an older thinkpad. It uninstalled (badly) a power monitor so I kept getting a dll not found message on login. Tried to reinstall, but that failed (not compatible!). Guess Lenovo finally updated that because I tried reinstalling that power monitor yesterday and it worked. Finally no more I-be-broken message!
On a different note, my new Dell desktop did finally offer the 2004 update - and it worked. Dell had just updated "SupportAssist" (I had just run SupportAssist and it downloaded/installed that update), so I'm guessing that must have been what was holding up the 2004 update.
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WTF is happening to my Start menu?
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@marczellm said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
WTF is happening to my Start menu?
Congratulations! It does the exact same thing as the Taskbar's Search button/text box search.
At one time you could disable the Internet part of that Search function, but they took the UI away. You might still be able to do something about it in the Registry. (At the time you would have had to turn off Cortana too, IIRC.)
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@Parody Registry and/or GPO, depending on which version you have.
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I think there are several versions of the Start Menu UX depending on OS version, language/region, privacy and search settings etc. For example, Cortana is not available in Hungarian, so if I set my region to Hungary I get the radically different looking Cortana-less search UI. This didn’t even include web results until recently. But the reason the screenshot surprised me is that I haven’t ever encountered the embedded webview style Bing search results before.
The three column layout looks unintentional. Restarting explorer.exe removed the middle column again. This was some sort of glitch.
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Fired up my customer supplied laptop. Been awhile. It was opening crap that I guess I'd had open before like Skype and Teams, so I told it to shut those down. Fired up Outlook and Firefox and then...I couldn't interact with any apps using the mouse.
The menu and taskbar worked fine, but anything I opened up wouldn't work when I tried to click on it. It was like there was something invisible preventing the mouse from touching anything.
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@boomzilla invisible top-most full-screen window? Sounds like something
badly coded crapwareSkype or Teams might do.
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@topspin yeah, they were my top suspects, but task manager said they were gone. I logged out and then back in and Windows started behaving.
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@boomzilla said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
I logged out and then back in and Windows started behaving.
MAGIC!!
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@boomzilla said in WTF is happening with Windows 10? And nothing else:
Fired up my customer supplied laptop. Been awhile. It was opening crap that I guess I'd had open before like Skype and Teams, so I told it to shut those down. Fired up Outlook and Firefox and then...I couldn't interact with any apps using the mouse.
The menu and taskbar worked fine, but anything I opened up wouldn't work when I tried to click on it. It was like there was something invisible preventing the mouse from touching anything.
I've had that happen occasionally. It's fixable by going to the ctrl+alt+del menu and exiting out of it.
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Oh! Forgot to mention:
My start menu was doing that weird "top half of the screen" thing again this morning so I tried the trick of restarting Explorer. Worked like a charm!
Thanks, @hungrier! (I think you were the one who suggested that last time.)