Windoze 10 Fall 2018 Flopdate, now with even more nothingness
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There's this one too...
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@Gribnit said in Windoze 10 Fall 2018 Flopdate, now with even more nothingness:
@TimeBandit said in Windoze 10 Fall 2018 Flopdate, now with even more nothingness:
@hungrier said in Windoze 10 Fall 2018 Flopdate, now with even more nothingness:
Now I don't know what to believe
Believe what you want
But more importantly: Want what you believe.
what?
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So I updated to 1809 and the dark themed explorer looks easy on the eyes as I dark theme everything!!!
Anyways, I was wondering why did it take them so long to implement this. I'm imagining this would be like flipping two fields basically the background to black and the color to white and colors for maybe a few other things. I know I sound naive as fuck. What would have actually happened? Is this more complicated? I'm curious about the mechanics behind this.
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@stillwater It's less 'we did a big thing that's difficult' and more 'we did a small thing that you want'. They're milking approval.
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@pie_flavor A thing that I want?
Cool, bring back the Win 7 DWM and shelf the 3.11 look.Also, just recently realized that they removed jump lists from the task bar / start menu. Must have been too useful.
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@topspin What's a jump list, and how does the current look look anything like the 3.11 look?
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@pie_flavor said in Windoze 10 Fall 2018 Flopdate, now with even more nothingness:
how does the current look look anything like the 3.11 look?
They're both flat, square and ugly.
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@stillwater said in Windoze 10 Fall 2018 Flopdate, now with even more nothingness:
So I updated to 1809 and the dark themed explorer looks easy on the eyes as I dark theme everything!!!
Anyways, I was wondering why did it take them so long to implement this.
The dark theme is nice. The "night light" feature is nice. There are several things that I like about Win 10.
Unfortunately, the bugs, glitches, inconsistencies, removal of useful features while adding useless crap, and overall shitty UI, far outweighs the good features.
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@pie_flavor said in Windoze 10 Fall 2018 Flopdate, now with even more nothingness:
@topspin What's a jump list, ...?
Jump lists are the extra items in the right-click menu of an item on the Taskbar or in the Start Menu, like the recently opened items for many applications, pinned folders in Explorer, common tasks, etc.
@topspin said in Windoze 10 Fall 2018 Flopdate, now with even more nothingness:
Also, just recently realized that they removed jump lists from the task bar / start menu. Must have been too useful.
They're working for me, FWIW.
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@stillwater said in Windoze 10 Fall 2018 Flopdate, now with even more nothingness:
So I updated to 1809 and the dark themed explorer looks easy on the eyes as I dark theme everything!!!
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@Parody said in Windoze 10 Fall 2018 Flopdate, now with even more nothingness:
@pie_flavor said in Windoze 10 Fall 2018 Flopdate, now with even more nothingness:
@topspin What's a jump list, ...?
Jump lists are the extra items in the right-click menu of an item on the Taskbar or in the Start Menu, like the recently opened items for many applications, pinned folders in Explorer, common tasks, etc.
I'm on latest, and still have those.
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@stillwater said in Windoze 10 Fall 2018 Flopdate, now with even more nothingness:
Anyways, I was wondering why did it take them so long to implement this. I'm imagining this would be like flipping two fields basically the background to black and the color to white and colors for maybe a few other things. I know I sound naive as fuck. What would have actually happened? Is this more complicated? I'm curious about the mechanics behind this.
Technically yes, if you managed to get the legacy Appearance Options control panel you could do this, but you'd be (un)surprised how few programs actually use the system colors properly...
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@topspin Should have looked this up first, but make sure they're still turned on in Settings, Personalization, Start, Show recently opened items in Jump Lists....
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@El_Heffe said in Windoze 10 Fall 2018 Flopdate, now with even more nothingness:
They're both flat, square and ugly.
That's unfair to 3.1. Imperfect as it was, its design was still more polished and more readable than 10's.
https://i.imgur.com/l6ujgfn.png
vs
https://i.imgur.com/VSw0cwd.png
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@Parody said in Windoze 10 Fall 2018 Flopdate, now with even more nothingness:
@topspin Should have looked this up first, but make sure they're still turned on in Settings, Personalization, Start, Show recently opened items in Jump Lists....
Well, I didn’t turn them off, so how would I know that’s there?
Also, not sure that’s the exact same name (basically the same feature though): does it also do that in the start menu (not the task bar)?
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@topspin said in Windoze 10 Fall 2018 Flopdate, now with even more nothingness:
Well, I didn’t turn them off, so how would I know that’s there?
Sorry, I was saying I should have looked up where the setting went in Windows 10; it used to be in the Taskbar settings dialog before Windows 10 (or 8). Normally I would have just edited it in but people had already responded.
Also, not sure that’s the exact same name (basically the same feature though): does it also do that in the start menu (not the task bar)?
Yup, it should work for both pinned items and ones in the list.
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@Zerosquare said in Windoze 10 Fall 2018 Flopdate, now with even more nothingness:
@El_Heffe said in Windoze 10 Fall 2018 Flopdate, now with even more nothingness:
They're both flat, square and ugly.
That's unfair to 3.1. Imperfect as it was, its design was still more polished and more readable than 10's.
https://i.imgur.com/l6ujgfn.png
vs
https://i.imgur.com/VSw0cwd.pngYes, that's totally a fair comparison, opening windows for stuff that's deprecated and also completely irrelevant. If we're doing that, this is a screen that more accurately represents Windows 3.11:
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@pie_flavor said in Windoze 10 Fall 2018 Flopdate, now with even more nothingness:
@Gribnit said in Windoze 10 Fall 2018 Flopdate, now with even more nothingness:
@TimeBandit said in Windoze 10 Fall 2018 Flopdate, now with even more nothingness:
@hungrier said in Windoze 10 Fall 2018 Flopdate, now with even more nothingness:
Now I don't know what to believe
Believe what you want
But more importantly: Want what you believe.
what?
You believe want what.
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@pie_flavor said in Windoze 10 Fall 2018 Flopdate, now with even more nothingness:
If we're doing that, this is a screen that more accurately represents Windows 3.11
Yeah, 10 is way more polished, it would just show:
:(
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@topspin It shows it a hell of a lot less, though.
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@pie_flavor said in Windoze 10 Fall 2018 Flopdate, now with even more nothingness:
@topspin It shows it a hell of a lot less, though.
Can you suggest an experimental rubric by which this can be validated independently, perhaps under a slightly different set of circumstances and physical laws?
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@pie_flavor said in Windoze 10 Fall 2018 Flopdate, now with even more nothingness:
@topspin It shows it a hell of a lot less, though.
Still reboots all the time. Same difference...
More seriously, I wasn't complaining about the kernel improvements from 7 to 10, just about the user interface. And the "UX" of forced updates / forced telemetry / forced everything...
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@topspin The updates aren't forced, the telemetry isn't forced, and most of the other stuff isn't forced either. Also, the user interface is much better.
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@pie_flavor said in Windoze 10 Fall 2018 Flopdate, now with even more nothingness:
@topspin The updates aren't forced, the telemetry isn't forced, and most of the other stuff isn't forced either. Also, the user interface is much better.
Your lies are making me like IntelliJ less.
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@Gribnit Good thing there aren't any of those, then.
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@pie_flavor said in Windoze 10 Fall 2018 Flopdate, now with even more nothingness:
the user interface is much better.
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@topspin Boy, that's constructive.
What in particular do you dislike about Win10 UI?
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@pie_flavor said in Windoze 10 Fall 2018 Flopdate, now with even more nothingness:
@topspin Boy, that's constructive.
It was a joke, there's no need to be constructive.
What in particular do you dislike about Win10 UI?
What I don't dislike would be a shorter list. Things only working for some people (see above, defaults are rand()?) would be one, the eye-
candycancer another.
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@topspin That's not really a list of what you don't like about the UI. It's a list with two elements: <specific thing that is not actually UI> and <all the stuff I don't like about Win10 UI>. Rather recursive, isn't it.
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@pie_flavor That the UI doesn't show something it used to show, unless I dig somewhere in one of the 8 different settings systems, is not UI?
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@topspin The UI shows exactly what it used to show. There is also additional UI which shows the same data with the chaff taken out.
Have any specific examples?
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@pie_flavor said in Windoze 10 Fall 2018 Flopdate, now with even more nothingness:
@topspin The updates aren't forced, the telemetry isn't forced, and most of the other stuff isn't forced either. Also, the user interface is much better.
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@pie_flavor said in Windoze 10 Fall 2018 Flopdate, now with even more nothingness:
The UI shows exactly what it used to show.
I was talking about the task bar not showing the more useful menus they had in Win 7, as I said above. Well, except when it does, because apparently the whole world is an A/B test or something.
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@topspin My taskbar does that. What apps on your taskbar don't do that? Got screenshots?
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@pie_flavor said in Windoze 10 Fall 2018 Flopdate, now with even more nothingness:
@topspin My taskbar does that. What apps on your taskbar don't do that? Got screenshots?
None of them do. Office in particular. And no, not right now.
But as @parody said, apparently you can turn itoffon.
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@topspin
https://i.imgur.com/rCoJCpS.png
https://i.imgur.com/QSnBa1m.png
https://i.imgur.com/cNUUHRy.png
Bam, all three places. What were you saying again?
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@pie_flavor I see them as well, and I've changed no settings.
Honestly, I'm in @pie_flavor's camp on this. Win 10 has been more stable and better performing than Win 7, has features I use frequently, and has exhibited none of the things that haters love to hate on. Never had Windows Update problems either.
And this is on an older (~3+ years old) frankenputer I built out of parts.
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These "Jump lists" were there as far as I can remember. It was even a pain in the ass sometimes clusterfucking the screen. But nonetheless, it is a pretty useful feature.
Also if I wanted to see Windows bashing without raisins I'd go to hackernews. Win 10 comes with annoying af candy cunt and all sorts of nonsense that I have to uninstall every damn time I install it. And the untimely updates but other than that I have not seen other PITAs. Never had a Win10 crash even with lots of CPU and RAM hungry apps.
For my personal work, I have a touchscreen 2 in 1 laptop that folds into a tab andd to do some linuxy shenanigans I had to install Linux and oh God was it a pain to get the touchscreen and the touchpad working. Driver install uninstall trial and error galore. Gave up and went back to Win 10 with WSL. I don't know if this is a Linux issue or the hardware supports windows better but right now, I use Win 10 daily and have a smooth experience. What am I missing? Are y'all using parts of Win 10 I'm not?
Oh also VS 2017. Fuckin A.
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@pie_flavor toastastic.docx has piqued my curiosity more than it should.
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@Zerosquare That 3.1 UI looks like recent Windows' accessibility mode which looks ugly af. Also comparing that to three windows with errors. Really?
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@Benjamin-Hall said in Windoze 10 Fall 2018 Flopdate, now with even more nothingness:
Win 10 has been more stable and better performing than Win 7, has features I use frequently, and has exhibited none of the things that haters love to hate on. Never had Windows Update problems either.
I've had pretty good luck on my main desktop as well; it's been very stable on both Windows 7 and 10. I don't remember having any strange problems on 7, but I have had a couple on 10. (For example, in 1703 my Type 1 fonts disappeared; they fixed it in 1709.)
Look-wise I preferred Windows 7 on the desktop. Aero Glass looked better to me than what they've done with Fluent Acrylic, the thicker window borders were easier to work with than the 1 pixel line of Windows 8+, and I prefer 3D controls to the flat ones.
For tablets, though, I thought the look and feel of Windows 8 was actually pretty decent. The customizable Start Screen with tiles giving you updates and touch-based design (larger targets, feedback animations, use of edges and swiping) made for a good experience there and (presumably) on phones. Sadly they forced it on non-touch devices at the time, which was one of many backfires in that era.
Windows 10, at least on my tablet, isn't as good. The removal/changing of the system's touch features and deemphasis of a move to applications designed with touch in mind have made it less friendly to use without a mouse or touchpad. Tablet Mode has long been buggy/quirky and Microsoft hasn't been in a hurry to fix anything in that area. They have added some things back over the years, but there are times I wish I'd left it on 8.1.
On Monday I'm going to do some hardware upgrades on my desktop so I'll get to see the exciting world of reinstalling Windows 10 from scratch, Microsoft Account-based licensing and all. Hopefully that'll go OK and it'll only be a week or two before I get everything back up and running to my liking.
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@Parody what win 10 tablet is this?
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@stillwater An ASUS Transformer Book T100. Mine is the Z3775/64 GB/No HD variant.
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@Parody it says win 8 though :/
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@stillwater said in Windoze 10 Fall 2018 Flopdate, now with even more nothingness:
@Parody it says win 8 though :/
It came with 8.1; I updated it to Windows 10 during the free update period. Later on I completely wiped it to free up the space from the old recovery partition; every MB counts at that size!
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@stillwater Good.
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@pie_flavor said in Windoze 10 Fall 2018 Flopdate, now with even more nothingness:
@topspin
What were you saying again?Reading is hard?
Try again and you might notice that I was saying that apparently they can be turned on/off and they’re not there on my machine. And I didn’t change them.Edit: although from your screenshot it seems that in the start menu they’re only in the right click menu, whereas windows 7 showed an arrow next to it indicating you could open such a menu right there.
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@pie_flavor said in Windoze 10 Fall 2018 Flopdate, now with even more nothingness:
If we're doing that, this is a screen that more accurately represents Windows 3.11:
If I remember right, the BSOD was uncommon in before 95 because Windows was just an application running on top of MS-DOS. The sorts of crashes you got were a bit more varied than plain old BSODs, and would typically put the system into weirdly unstable states because of the lack of memory protection…
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@Parody said in Windoze 10 Fall 2018 Flopdate, now with even more nothingness:
every MB counts at that size!
Every MB counts on Win10. They count a bit less on Win8.1. But I wouldn't know, 'cos I didn't need to count on either Debian or Ubuntu. The Debian installation never grew beyond 12GB (out of a 32GB eMMC).
If you're trying to free up space, note that the most commonly offered Powershell commands for uninstalling the value-deducted clutter, like Xbox accessories and Zune, only remove the UI components. To get rid of the bulk of their binaries, you'll need another set of commands. AFAIK. I haven't tried it at work, as removing the adverts was enough for me there, and the only Windows I have at home is 7.
EDIT:
Size of Debian installation figure includes Qt development environment, Firefox and Inkscape. Measured in early 2017, before I got a new laptop. For great
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@pie_flavor said in Windoze 10 Fall 2018 Flopdate, now with even more nothingness:
It shows it a hell of a lot less, though.
I remember a time, somewhere in the mid-to-late naughties, when kernel panics seemed to have become a thing of the past. In recent years I've had several unsolicited kernel panics on both Mac OS and Windows. So if you still feel that these are showing up "a hell of a lot less" just give it anther decade of the current "release early, release
crapoften, let our users be our testers" software development methodology.