United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why
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@Polygeekery said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
But United should not?
They're the ones making the accusation. If you apply that standard, we'd never get anywhere.
She committed a crime!
No I didn't! That's a false accusation.
I'm innocent until proven guilty, therefore it's a true accusation!Carry on John Nestor.
Who is this guy and why do you keep using his name in connection with me?
The money you should have paid for that ticket.
I paid for the ticket. All I did was take a seat in a less crowded place. I didn't sneak onto the plane or something.
Seriously, have you been taking logic pills or something?!?
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@masonwheeler said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
They're the ones making the accusation.
And the couple are accusing UA. You consider UA to be guilty until proven innocent and the couple innocent until proven guilty. You are a hypocrite and an asshat.
And Elon Musk is a douche and vacuum trains are stupid ideas that will never work.
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@masonwheeler said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
Who is this guy and why do you keep using his name in connection with me?
I have told you before who he is and you seem just like him.
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@masonwheeler said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
I paid for the ticket. All I did was take a seat in a less crowded place. I didn't sneak onto the plane or something.
I paid for a Yugo, I just took a Mercedes. It's not like I did not buy a car from them...
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@Polygeekery said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
I paid for a Yugo, I just took a Mercedes. It's not like I did not buy a car from them...
First off, false analogy, as they couldn't sell the Mercedes after takeoff anyway; every unsold car on the lot was going to be destroyed, as it were, so there's no loss of revenue.
Second, where did you get this idea in your head that I moved to a more expensive class of seat in the first place?
Seriously, what's going on with this thread? You're being an even bigger derp than usual, and that's saying something!
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@masonwheeler said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
Second, where did you get this idea in your head that I moved to a more expensive class of seat in the first place?
Are you talking about a real situation that happened to you, or still discussing an analogy based on the couple that
actually tried to sit in an upgraded seat "repeatedly" and they "wouldn't follow crew instructions."
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@masonwheeler said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
they couldn't sell the Mercedes after takeoff anyway; every unsold car on the lot was going to be destroyed, as it were, so there's no loss of revenue.
It was last years model officer. Who wants a 2016 model?? So I took it.
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@hungrier Again, this is a baseless accusation that the airline is making to cover their own butts, with no evidence. According to the passengers, when the crew asked them to move, they immediately went back to their assigned seats and woke the sleeping guy up so they could sit there.
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@Polygeekery Your car analogy keeps getting worse and worse...
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sigh
It's reached the point that I think airlines need to put cameras in the passenger compartments of all their planes. Just so that they can back their flight attendants up when they say that passengers were being disruptive assholes.
Passenger-shot cellphone videos only tell part of the story, as we've seen here.
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@masonwheeler said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
@hungrier Again, this is a baseless accusation that the airline is making to cover their own butts, with no evidence. According to the passengers, when the crew asked them to move, they immediately went back to their assigned seats and woke the sleeping guy up so they could sit there.
But that's just what the passengers are saying to cover their own butts, with no evidence. According to the airline, they actually tried to sit in an upgraded seat "repeatedly" and they "wouldn't follow crew instructions."
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@anotherusername ...and then conveniently lose the footage, "accidentally" turn the cameras off, or "discover" that the cameras weren't on when it turns out the passengers weren't doing anything wrong afterall? (See also: police body cameras. A really great idea in theory, right up until you give them the ability to control the camera.)
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@masonwheeler said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
@hungrier Again, this is a baseless accusation that the airline is making to cover their own butts, with no evidence. According to the passengers, when the crew asked them to move, they immediately went back to their assigned seats and woke the sleeping guy up so they could sit there.
If that actually happened there would be no story. It seems infinitely more likely that they were entitled little shits about the whole situation, were being a pain in the ass, were like you and felt that they were entitled to do whatever they wish and then they got in trouble for making life hard on the flight attendants.
Flight attendants that usually love helping out newlyweds and such. Flight attendants that if they had not stolen the seats and instead said, "Excuse me, miss? We are on our way to our wedding, there is a guy asleep across our seats and we noticed that there are lots of empty seats in first-class. Would it be ok if we sat in some of those please?" they probably would have been able to and gotten glasses of champagne to boot.
I am convinced that more and more airline passengers turn in to petulant children once they reach the gate.
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@masonwheeler said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
@Polygeekery Your car analogy keeps getting worse and worse...
Improvise, adapt and overcome.
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@masonwheeler said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
...and then conveniently lose the footage, "accidentally" turn the cameras off, or "discover" that the cameras weren't on when it turns out the passengers weren't doing anything wrong afterall? (See also: police body cameras. A really great idea in theory, right up until you give them the ability to control the camera.)
At least then, the twitterverse will be right to convict them in the court of public opinion.
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This post is deleted!
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@masonwheeler said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
Again, this is a baseless accusation that the airline is making to cover their own butts, with no evidence. According to the passengers, when the crew asked them to move, they immediately went back to their assigned seats and woke the sleeping guy up so they could sit there.
Or it could be a baseless accusation that the couple is making to hop on the United hatewagon and/or to prepare for a future lawsuit. People lie just like corporations do. I couldn't tell either way from reading the article.
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@masonwheeler said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
They're the ones making the accusation. If you apply that standard, we'd never get anywhere.
Stop being retarded. You picked a side and now believe that whatever one side says is a lie. Which is particularly dumb.
I think it's a reasonable assumption to believe that the flight crew in Houston was aware of the Dr Dao brouhaha, and also likely that they'd like to avoid any sort of similar situation, so probably wouldn't involve government police forces without real cause.
Now, that's all speculation on my part, but I think it's how a reasonable person would behave in their situation and is plenty of cause to not automatically dismiss anyone wearing a United uniform as a liar from as thin a story as you linked.
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@boomzilla said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
Now, that's all speculation on my part, but I think it's how a reasonable person would behave in their situation and is plenty of cause to not automatically dismiss anyone wearing a United uniform as a liar from as thin a story as you linked.
Nonsense!! Everyone is innocent until proven guilty! Except United Airlines, those fuckers are guilty of everything and they also eat babies
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@masonwheeler said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
First off, false analogy, as they couldn't sell the Mercedes after takeoff anyway; every unsold car on the lot was going to be destroyed, as it were, so there's no loss of revenue.
Have you never been in first or business class on an airplane?
@masonwheeler said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
Second, where did you get this idea in your head that I moved to a more expensive class of seat in the first place?
Hey...remember that story you linked? We do!
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@boomzilla said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
Hey...remember that story you linked? We do!
citations, FTW!!
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@wharrgarbl said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
That was a very half-assed try if their offer was so low that not a single passenger took it
That's not valid reasoning.
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@Maciejasjmj said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
we have state of the art resource allocation systems designed to prevent this kind of situation in the first place.
Maybe.
The airline crew for the next flight could have gotten food poisoning and had symptoms only a few hours before, and the airline could be completely out of off-duty employees willing to come in for overtime.
But feel free to arrest someone and force them to work the airline so you don't have to bump customers. :P
But, seriously, if I can think of one way to fail the system, that argument isn't all that useful.
You could say, "reduce the likelihood", and maybe you meant that, but your attitude seems to imply that you think it's possible to make these situations impossible.
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@Maciejasjmj said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
It's not a bloody mom and pop shop that can be put out of business by two rainy days in a row. If they have no plan B that doesn't involve rush mode, it's on them.
Are you kidding me?
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@masonwheeler said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
police body cameras. A really great idea in theory, right up until you give them the ability to control the camera.
Those should only ever be treated as supplemental.
You can't expect to make a cop prove themselves innocent of camera tampering, because the next time a camera fails, a cop is sent home and the public says it's not enough until the cop hangs.
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@xaade said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
You could say, "reduce the likelihood", and maybe you meant that, but your attitude seems to imply that you think it's possible to make these situations impossible.
And unlike threads, those reductions probably aren't free.
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Did you see how much the CEO was paid. They could take his yearly salary and afford 50,000 tickets. Too bad they sale 140,000 daily seats in just the O'Hare airport.
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@xaade Math is hard. Let's go protest!
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@boomzilla said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
Have you never been in first or business class on an airplane?
Yes, actually, and TBH I don't see what the big deal is. You don't get to your destination any faster (a couple minutes at disembarcation time, I guess, but that's negligible) and the seating is still cramped, so why does anyone even bother paying extra for it?
@masonwheeler said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
Second, where did you get this idea in your head that I moved to a more expensive class of seat in the first place?
Hey...remember that story you linked? We do!
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@coldandtired said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
@abarker said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
Maybe they were all idiots travelling on too tight of a schedule
Why are they idiots?
It's not unknown that, in order to keep costs down, airlines oversell seats on flights. For some reason, passengers in the US have a higher rate of not showing up when they have purchased a ticket, so the rate of overselling is higher here. Of course, by the law of averages, there are going to be flights where more people show up than there are seats for, meaning people will get bumped from a flight. So what should you do? Never book the last possible flight before you need to be where you are going. Doing that would make you an idiot.*
* Of course there are going to be times where extenuating circumstances make this unavoidable, but it's a good general guideline.
@coldandtired said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
How many days in advance must one travel [...]?
It depends. On the airline, the route, the time of year, and all sorts of other factors. There isn't any one right answer. Maybe you just plan to travel the day before. Maybe you just schedule your flight in the morning instead of the evening. Maybe you just avoid a given airline because they only fly the route you want twice a week.
@coldandtired said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
because of questionable policies
Are they questionable policies? Without overbooking, airlines would need to increase their ticket prices, possibly double them. In some cases, flights would end up a lot emptier because they weren't oversold.
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@masonwheeler said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
so why does anyone even bother paying extra for it?
Because the seats are bigger, there is a little more legroom and, most importantly for the purposes of why you are wrong, there is better service. Usually they have their own dedicated flight attendants. Little to no waiting for drinks, etc.
@masonwheeler said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
Just admit that your very own link proves you wrong.
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@Polygeekery said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
I am convinced that more and more airline passengers turn in to petulant children once they reach the gate.
Have you ever been through airport security? It happens way before they reach the gate.
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@Maciejasjmj said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
It's not a bloody mom and pop shop that can be put out of business by two rainy days in a row. If they have no plan B that doesn't involve rush mode, it's on them.
Maybe they had a better Plan B in place, and this scenario was their Plan C. We don't know, and it's not like United is going to give us that much information.
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@masonwheeler said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
@boomzilla said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
Have you never been in first or business class on an airplane?
Yes, actually, and TBH I don't see what the big deal is. You don't get to your destination any faster (a couple minutes at disembarcation time, I guess, but that's negligible) and the seating is still cramped, so why does anyone even bother paying extra for it?
Cramped‽ There's also extra service, which includes much better food and (already paid for) drinks. On long flights this sort of thing can make a
hugeYUUUUUGE difference. I mean, I get that you don't think it's valuable enough for you to pay for, but do you really mean that you can't understand why someone would want it? Houston to Costa Rica appears to be about a 3.5 hour trip, so not huge, but not insignificant, either.I've never directly paid for this, but I've been upgraded either using miles or after getting rebooked due to a cancellation (in this case, got stuck for two days in Chicago after a blizzard).
@masonwheeler said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
Second, where did you get this idea in your head that I moved to a more expensive class of seat in the first place?
Hey...remember that story you linked? We do!
Perhaps you should stop rolling your eyes while reading.
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@masonwheeler said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
...and they did it again. At least there was no blood or broken bones involved this time, but still... wow.
http://www.wtsp.com/news/bride-groom-kicked-off-united-flight/431659972
The flight wasn't anywhere near close to full. They found some guy stretched out and sleeping across three seats: his own and their two. So they sat a few rows up, rather than waking the guy. When a flight attendant asked them why they weren't in their assigned seats, they explained, but moved back to their assigned seats as requested.
The crew sicced an Air Marshal on them anyway, and made up a bunch of accusations about them being disruptive and "repeatedly refusing" to take their seats, and the marshal kicked them off. On their way to their wedding. So not only does United break guitars and faces, but apparently hearts as well.
BRB. Shorting United...
Sounds like a they said, they said situation.
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@abarker said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
Sounds like a they said, they said situation.
But the people whom @masonwheeler decided he disliked a priori are obviously lying.
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@masonwheeler said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
First off, false analogy, as they couldn't sell the Mercedes after takeoff anyway; every unsold car on the lot was going to be destroyed, as it were, so there's no loss of revenue.
Second, where did you get this idea in your head that I moved to a more expensive class of seat in the first place?
Many airlines have different grades of seats in economy. You might pay less to sit in the very back, or pay more to have more legroom, for example.
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@abarker said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
Many airlines have different grades of seats in economy. You might pay less to sit in the very back, or pay more to have more legroom, for example.
@masonwheeler cares not for what people want. Don't you understand? United Airlines is bad!
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@boomzilla said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
@abarker said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
Many airlines have different grades of seats in economy. You might pay less to sit in the very back, or pay more to have more legroom, for example.
@masonwheeler cares not for what people want. Don't you understand? United Airlines is bad!
This reminds me, I need to buy a new pitchfork. I have to spread mulch soon.
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@Polygeekery said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
@boomzilla said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
@abarker said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
Many airlines have different grades of seats in economy. You might pay less to sit in the very back, or pay more to have more legroom, for example.
@masonwheeler cares not for what people want. Don't you understand? United Airlines is bad!
This reminds me, I need to buy a new pitchfork. I have to spread mulch soon.
What are you mulching? Protestors?
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@abarker nah, they are full of shit so they make good fertilizer. I make a slurry from protesters and spray it on the lawn.
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@abarker said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
Sounds like a they said, they said situation.
Indeed, and one we wouldn't have even heard about if not for the earlier event.
@masonwheeler said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
The crew sicced an Air Marshal on them anyway, and made up a bunch of accusations about them being disruptive and "repeatedly refusing" to take their seats, and the marshal kicked them off. On their way to their wedding. So not only does United break guitars and faces, but apparently hearts as well (ed.- emphasis added x2).
Does not compute.
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@boomzilla said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
United Airlines is bad!
Or at least worse than the airlines that don't drag people out of their planes.
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@wharrgarbl said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
@boomzilla said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
United Airlines is bad!
Or at least worse than the airlines that don't drag people out of their planes.
Get your facts right. United Airlines did not do that. You are the worst part of Twitter.
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@Polygeekery Oh, right, they asked someone else to remove the passengers.
Still worse than the airlines that don't do it.
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@wharrgarbl said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
Oh, right, they asked someone else to remove the passengers.
Yes, they asked airport authorities to remove a disruptive and belligerent passenger.
@wharrgarbl said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
Still worse than the airlines that don't do it.
Would you rather they leave disruptive and belligerent passengers on the plane to make life hell for everyone else? I wouldn't.
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@heterodox said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
@abarker said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
Sounds like a they said, they said situation.
Indeed, and one we wouldn't have even heard about if not for the earlier event.
@masonwheeler said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
The crew sicced an Air Marshal on them anyway, and made up a bunch of accusations about them being disruptive and "repeatedly refusing" to take their seats, and the marshal kicked them off. On their way to their wedding. So not only does United break guitars and faces, but apparently hearts as well (ed.- emphasis added x2).
Does not compute.
That's before we get to the point of, airlines don't typically know you're not in your seat, unless there is a contention for the seat.
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@xaade said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
That's before we get to the point of, airlines don't typically know you're not in your seat, unless there is a contention for the seat.
They have a count of how many people should be in first-class. You will see them take a headcount as soon as everyone is seated and buckled up.
But yeah, they don't even throw someone off the plane for sitting in the wrong seat. They throw them off for being assholes.
But @masonwheeler thinks that UA exclusively employs cartoon villains. He literally thinks that the very first thing they did was throw them off the plane, instead of first asking them to return to their assigned seat.
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@Polygeekery said in United Airlines: the airline we love to hate, but we can't agree on why:
They have a count of how many people should be in first-class. You will see them take a headcount as soon as everyone is seated and buckled up.
This was upgraded economy.
I doubt they went to every person seated in upgraded economy and asked them.
It's possible there wasn't anyone ticketed for those upgraded seats and that's how they knew.
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United has to protect the value of the upgraded seats.
Not making them cost more could end up with unwanted contests for those seats on an empty plane.
Putting a wall there to ensure equal legroom is compromising the emergency exit.
So they have to rely on customers to be mature enough to listen to directions.