I hate printers, with a passion
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@BernieTheBernie said in I hate printers, with a passion:
potentially breaking printing.
Again?!?
How π hard π can π it π fucking π be?!?
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@Tsaukpaetra said in I hate printers, with a passion:
@BernieTheBernie said in I hate printers, with a passion:
potentially breaking printing.
Again?!?
How π hard π can π it π fucking π be?!?
Quite easy, especially as it seems deliberate.
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@loopback0 said in I hate printers, with a passion:
@Tsaukpaetra said in I hate printers, with a passion:
@BernieTheBernie said in I hate printers, with a passion:
potentially breaking printing.
Again?!?
How π hard π can π it π fucking π be?!?
Quite easy, especially as it seems deliberate.
Well, they released the original patch a GDMF year ago, then applied a temporary mitigation, giving us a year to get our shit together, ducks in a row, etc.
And now, after that year is up, they are turning off the mitigation. If stuff breaks, it's our fault.
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@BernieTheBernie said in I hate printers, with a passion:
Welcome to the world of Windows Printing!
https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/news/microsoft/microsoft-warns-that-new-windows-updates-may-break-printing/
No, that's a current article:July 22, 2022 10:30 AM
That's going to be fun when it tangles with something nasty in the real world, like the docket printer for a major warehouse. That's the sort of thing where if it fails, the trucks start to queue onto the street quite quickly and the police get real antsy about the blocked roads. If corporate IT (probably in a far-distant timezone) hasn't been smart enough to make sure that keeps working, things are going to get really horrible, especially if they dig their heels in.
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@dkf Almost certainly the docket printer won't have one of those smart card authentication tokens anyway.
Assuming it even supports running its software on something more recent than XP.
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@Steve_The_Cynic said in I hate printers, with a passion:
Almost certainly the docket printer won't have one of those smart card authentication tokens anyway.
Assuming it even supports running its software on something more recent than XP.Who knows what's deployed out there in the wild? That's the point. The stuff that's put into service in reality is often not what you'd expect.
The docket printer is a real story from quite a few years ago BTW, but didn't (AFAIK) involve Windows Update. I don't know where the warehouse was, but I suspect, knowing who told me it (the guy doing first level support and who said this was an "emergency escalation" case) that it was somewhere in Brazil or Argentina.
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@Tsaukpaetra
The issue here is that:- The original authentication method on remote printing connections (e.g. print servers) was inadequate
- There are working PoCs for how to impersonate the print server in a way that can lead to evil actions on clients
- Microsoft released upgrades to how print clients & servers authenticate to each other, but it was by technological requirement a breaking change
- Administrators are
physicallymorally incapable of updating clients and servers all at one time on short order - Microsoft provided a workaround to opt out of the new authentication method
- Everyone just applied the workaround everywhere and have gone forward with not bothering to make sure everything got updated
- Now Microsoft has said "time's up, workaround is gonna go poof", so if there are still print servers that haven't been updated, clients are gonna break again when they apply their next updates.
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@izzion said in I hate printers, with a passion:
@Tsaukpaetra
The issue here is that:- The original authentication method on remote printing connections (e.g. print servers) was inadequate
- There are working PoCs for how to impersonate the print server in a way that can lead to evil actions on clients
- Microsoft released upgrades to how print clients & servers authenticate to each other, but it was by technological requirement a breaking change
- Administrators are
physicallymorally incapable of updating clients and servers all at one time on short order - Microsoft provided a workaround to opt out of the new authentication method
- Everyone just applied the workaround everywhere and have gone forward with not bothering to make sure everything got updated
- Now Microsoft has said "time's up, workaround is gonna go poof", so if there are still print servers that haven't been updated, clients are gonna break again when they apply their next updates.
All of which means that I was correct. It is our (for a rather loose definition of "our") fault.
And of course this bit:
Administrators are
physicallymorally incapable of updating clients and servers all at one time on short orderIs, more or less, equivalent to "Administrators are blatant refuseniks."
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@Steve_The_Cynic said in I hate printers, with a passion:
XP
Zebra's and compatible run on windows 1
21Filed under: don't ask how I know
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@Steve_The_Cynic said in I hate printers, with a passion:
And of course this bit:
Administrators are
physicallymorally incapable of updating clients and servers all at one time on short orderIs, more or less, equivalent to "Administrators are blatant refuseniks."
Administrators know the power of in their very bones.
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And also the golden rule: "if it ain't broke, don't fix it".
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@Tsaukpaetra said in I hate printers, with a passion:
How π hard π can π it π fucking π be?!?
CUPS.
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@Zerosquare said in I hate printers, with a passion:
And also the golden rule: "if it ain't broke, don't fix it".
But even when it is, still don't fix it
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@loopback0 said in I hate printers, with a passion:
@Zerosquare said in I hate printers, with a passion:
And also the golden rule: "if it ain't broke, don't fix it".
But even when it is, still don't fix it
The only possible fix would be to not have printers.
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@topspin said in I hate printers, with a passion:
@loopback0 said in I hate printers, with a passion:
@Zerosquare said in I hate printers, with a passion:
And also the golden rule: "if it ain't broke, don't fix it".
But even when it is, still don't fix it
The only possible fix would be to not have printers.
I would be Ok with this atopian future.
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Did the melon printer run out of ink?
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@topspin said in I hate printers, with a passion:
Did the melon printer run out of ink?
Probably dried up since We As A Society print fewer melons and look at them on screens more these days than we did a generation ago.
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new Windows update
TLDR, am I going to be able to print with my decade old laser printer through wifi or not?
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@hungrier said in I hate printers, with a passion:
new Windows update
TLDR, am I going to be able to print with my decade old laser printer through wifi or not?
Shirley that's a question you ask each time you need to print, irregardless of Windows updates?
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@loopback0 It's been working fine so far. I was actually impressed that I didn't have to jump through any stupid hoops to get it set up, although something that was even more surprising was that it Just Workedβ’ in Linux
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@loopback0 Hopefully not ο Ί ο―
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@hungrier said in I hate printers, with a passion:
I was actually impressed
This is a pun which doesn't work in English.
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@Zecc It kind of does, but not so much that I realized when I posted it
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@topspin Radicalized? Because he stopped getting a service he stopped paying for? I suppose he'd keep going to work if his employer stopped paying him, right?
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@SirTwist The service was (probably) automatic ordering of ink cartridges when the existing ones ran out. Not paying for that does not justify remotely bricking hardware they (probably) paid for.
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@jakjawagon It depends. If they're using what I think they're using then it's a subscription service where you're not paying for the ink cartridge itself but rather for every page (e.g. 4β¬ for 50 pages per month with rollover into the next month).
I'm using that service myself - it automatically ships new cartridges to me when the old ones run low and it does not matter what I print (so it can also be 50 pages of full-page colour photos). And you can change your contract every month - so you could run 20 pages per month in June and then 200 pages per month in Juli and back to 20 afterwards.
Of course, with it being a subscription service, it makes perfect sense for them to disable printing with those cartridges when your subscription fails to be renewed - that happened to my mother as well recently (she got a new credit card to replace an old one and forgot to update the payment details). However, in her case the error message was very clear as was the email from HP about this which she had ignored up till that moment.
There's nothing hindering you from going into any shop and buying a non-subscription cartridge for that printer there.
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You guys seem to be missing the part where you're supposed to laugh.
(Although printer manufactures being scum is no laughing matter)But also:
@Rhywden said in I hate printers, with a passion:
There's nothing hindering you from going into any shop and buying a non-subscription cartridge for that printer there.
Yet. Nothing hindering you, yet.
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@jakjawagon said in I hate printers, with a passion:
@SirTwist The service was (probably) automatic ordering of ink cartridges when the existing ones ran out. Not paying for that does not justify remotely bricking hardware they (probably) paid for.
Sure, but, like, maybe they could have sent an email or something to their customer suggesting they update the card on file? It would have been better for everyone since they'd have continued to make money from him printing stuff and he could have kept printing stuff and not have wasted all that time troubleshooting.
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@boomzilla said in I hate printers, with a passion:
@jakjawagon said in I hate printers, with a passion:
@SirTwist The service was (probably) automatic ordering of ink cartridges when the existing ones ran out. Not paying for that does not justify remotely bricking hardware they (probably) paid for.
Sure, but, like, maybe they could have sent an email or something to their customer suggesting they update the card on file? It would have been better for everyone since they'd have continued to make money from him printing stuff and he could have kept printing stuff and not have wasted all that time troubleshooting.
For my mother, they did. I'm not convinced that we're not actually dealing with a case of PEBKAC here, considering that they clearly signed up for HP InstantInk.
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@Rhywden said in I hate printers, with a passion:
they clearly signed up for HP InstantInk.
Or at least, the printer thinks so. And we know printers never malfunction, don't we?
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@Zerosquare said in I hate printers, with a passion:
@Rhywden said in I hate printers, with a passion:
they clearly signed up for HP InstantInk.
Or at least, the printer thinks so. And we know printers never malfunction, don't we?
Given the fact that you have to actively connect your printer to ActiveInk using both a username and a password, then choose a subscription type and then enter your credit card number, I highly doubt that it was an accident.
The default is: Print using a normal cartridge.
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Look, whose side are you on? Humans or printers?
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@Zerosquare said in I hate printers, with a passion:
Look, whose side are you on? Humans or printers?
Yes.No
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@topspin said in I hate printers, with a passion:
@Zerosquare said in I hate printers, with a passion:
Look, whose side are you on? Humans or printers?
Yes.No
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Bad Ideaβ’. Fucking with printers is always painful.
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@Zerosquare said in I hate printers, with a passion:
Bad Ideaβ’. Fucking with printers is always painful.
It's possible(1) that @Tsaukpaetra was advocating fucking both tropical drinks and grumpy cats, both of which are pretty weird things for people to want to fuck.
(1) No, I don't think it's remotely likely...
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@Steve_The_Cynic said in I hate printers, with a passion:
I don't think it's remotely likely
Remember the source. It's possible β disturbingly possible.
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@HardwareGeek said in I hate printers, with a passion:
@Steve_The_Cynic said in I hate printers, with a passion:
I don't think it's remotely likely
Remember the source. It's possible β disturbingly possible.
In the, most caring aroused voice imaginable. π
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@izzion said in I hate printers, with a passion:
Pfft. As if an inkjet printer could live long enough to trigger the time limit in the first place.
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@Zerosquare said in I hate printers, with a passion:
@izzion said in I hate printers, with a passion:
Pfft. As if an inkjet printer could live long enough to trigger the time limit in the first place.
Clearly some of them do live long enough, because it has happened to printers in actual use. I guess the ones that manage to trigger it have been (relatively) heavily used.
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@Zerosquare said in I hate printers, with a passion:
And also the golden rule: "if it ain't broke, don't fix it".
Unless you're a company that sells printers. Then the rule is:
"If it ain't broke, break it."
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@Gern_Blaanston said in I hate printers, with a passion:
@Zerosquare said in I hate printers, with a passion:
And also the golden rule: "if it ain't broke, don't fix it".
Unless you're a company that sells
printersappliances. Then the rule is:"If it ain't broke, break it."
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@Luhmann said in I hate printers, with a passion:
@Gern_Blaanston said in I hate printers, with a passion:
@Zerosquare said in I hate printers, with a passion:
And also the golden rule: "if it ain't broke, don't fix it".
Unless you're a company that sells
printersΒappliancesjust about anything. Then the rule is:"If it ain't broke, break it."
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The never ending story of Windows updates fucking Printers just received another chapter: