Shorting Gamestop
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@LaoC yes, true. I meant the time where they stopped being an option at all as the banks stopped providing the facility to process them. They hadn't been in regular use for quite a while already, so it was not considered a big loss in service really.
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lmao
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@blek said in Shorting Gamestop:
The guy who started it turned something like 40k dollars into 50 million already.
Pump-and-Dump: Definition, How the Scheme is Illegal, and Types
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Pump-and-dump is a manipulative scheme to boost the price of a security through fake recommendations based on false, misleading, or exaggerated statements.
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@acrow That doesn't fit. Nobody is spreading false information, everyone knows the stock is shit.
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@blek Spreading false information is only one way to get people to buy a certain stock. You can also order your personal cult to buy stocks. Or incite a mob to buy stocks. Either way, there's a killing to be made when you know (or are reasonably certain) that a stock will go up in the near future.
Now, I'd expect this kind of activity to fall under insider trading laws, since you're basing your trading on information not publicly available. But IANAL.
Also, I'm not saying that this is definitely a scheme. I'm just extremely cynical. Check the money and the women first, and all that.
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@acrow said in Shorting Gamestop:
@blek Spreading false information is only one way to get people to buy a certain stock. You can also order your personal cult to buy stocks. Or incite a mob to buy stocks. Either way, there's a killing to be made when you know (or are reasonably certain) that a stock will go up in the near future.
Now, I'd expect this kind of activity to fall under insider trading laws, since you're basing your trading on information not publicly available. But IANAL.
Also, I'm not saying that this is definitely a scheme. I'm just extremely cynical. Check the money and the women first, and all that.
You can tell people to buy stock you invested in, nothing illegal about that. If you get a lot of people to listen, then good for you.
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@acrow said in Shorting Gamestop:
@blek Spreading false information is only one way to get people to buy a certain stock. You can also order your personal cult to buy stocks. Or incite a mob to buy stocks. Either way, there's a killing to be made when you know (or are reasonably certain) that a stock will go up in the near future.
Now, I'd expect this kind of activity to fall under insider trading laws, since you're basing your trading on information not publicly available. But IANAL.
Also, I'm not saying that this is definitely a scheme. I'm just extremely cynical. Check the money and the women first, and all that.
How is information posted publicly on Reddit "not publicly available"?
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It looks like in this case the hedgies were unusually vulnerable due to having short-sold over 100% of the stock by volume. Which is major danger territory because it means that the position cannot be unwound easily, giving time for other people to make bank off them. Apparently, this was the only significant stock that they'd done this to. (There was a tweet listing other stocks that were significantly short-sold at the moment, but they were no more than around 60% shorted by volume.)
It's got the same level of
as a good old train crash.
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@Mason_Wheeler said in Shorting Gamestop:
@acrow said in Shorting Gamestop:
@blek Spreading false information is only one way to get people to buy a certain stock. You can also order your personal cult to buy stocks. Or incite a mob to buy stocks. Either way, there's a killing to be made when you know (or are reasonably certain) that a stock will go up in the near future.
Now, I'd expect this kind of activity to fall under insider trading laws, since you're basing your trading on information not publicly available. But IANAL.
Also, I'm not saying that this is definitely a scheme. I'm just extremely cynical. Check the money and the women first, and all that.
How is information posted publicly on Reddit "not publicly available"?
Because you haven't published your intention to inflate the stock in a newspaper.
The definition of "publically available" is one of those funny peculiarities in law that may be very... localized. For example, some legal actions in Finland require that they be announced in a newspaper. So there is a special newspaper published by the government, that has a paper print run, but is read by absolutely no-one except lawyers. Full of very specifically formatted announcements by lawyers.
But I don't know how U.S. law law on stocks defines "public information", so that may or may not be applicable here.
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@acrow said in Shorting Gamestop:
But I don't know how U.S. law law on stocks defines "public information", so that may or may not be applicable here.
That generally applies to information from within the company (about future plans, current operations, etc), not about what rando traders are up to. There is definitely a lot of talk right now about this being manipulation, and I think there's some truth to that, because that's exactly what the people doing it are saying: "Let's manipulate this stock to hurt the shorts."
It probably shouldn't fall afoul of current securities laws or regulations, but who the hell knows?
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@boomzilla said in Shorting Gamestop:
There is definitely a lot of talk right now about this being manipulation, and I think there's some truth to that, because that's exactly what the people doing it are saying: "Let's manipulate this stock to hurt the shorts."
It is definitely, and explicitly stated as, trying to manipulate the stock. But without any insider information or any power that not everybody else has. It is very much detailed in public.
If this is illegal, then every single finance professional or anybody publishing articles about stocks should be in jail.
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@topspin said in Shorting Gamestop:
If this is illegal, then every single finance professional or anybody publishing articles about stocks should be in jail.
I mean...if you're talking about the health, prospects, etc, of a company...that seems qualitatively different than an explicit attempt to manipulate the value. But I'm not convinced that this should be illegal, so much as an object lesson about taking large and risky positions in a security.
Of course, now the Redditors get to play the Greater Fool game with each other, and hopefully they haven't taken as monumental a risk relative to their financial position as Melvin capital did. It will be interesting to see how this all shakes out in a few months (which is still pretty short term for stocks), assuming anyone has the attention span to follow it.
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So... now that it's bound to go down, is it time to short it?
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@dangeRuss said in Shorting Gamestop:
So... now that it's bound to go down, is it time to short it?
The market can remain irrational longer than you can remain solvent.
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@dangeRuss said in Shorting Gamestop:
So... now that it's bound to go down, is it time to short it?
If you have enough trading knowledge that you know how to do it so you need to buy back only six months from now, yes. If you're asking the question, probably no.
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Wow, they're up to $450 this morning. And I still can't reach the storefront to shop. Are they running these trades from their data center or what?
Full Disclosure: I wish they'd pulled this stunt with JCP!
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@Zenith said in Shorting Gamestop:
Wow, they're up to $450 this morning.
And then some profits were taken:
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edit: Just went to yahoo - I don't think I've ever seen a stock price change on every refresh cycle before. Oh - it just missed one!
editedit: Huh. And they just completely stopped updating...
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According to some of my cow-orkers who've been paying attention to this, Robin Hood has blocked buying these stocks and is holding up sales of them.
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Currently in free fall.
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@abarker Would now be a good time to sell options on this?
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@dangeRuss said in Shorting Gamestop:
@abarker Would now be a good time to sell options on this?
I think the best use of your money here is buying some
and watching it from the sideline.
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@dangeRuss said in Shorting Gamestop:
@abarker Would now be a good time to sell options on this?
Since everyone is probably now expecting it to freefall, you'd need to set that price pretty low. Maybe $1.50?
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@robo2 said in Shorting Gamestop:
@SlackerD said in Shorting Gamestop:
Kind reminder that it is usually boomers that do that.
Kind reminder that in saner countries kids born when cheques were abandoned are now allowed to vote, drink and get married.
Kind reminder that some of those "saner countries" refuse classification for films and such and ban the sale of them in said "saner country."
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@remi said in Shorting Gamestop:
When GameStop truly crashes, you're suddenly going to see thousands of Redditors whining that their nice stocks that are valued 10x what they bought them, well, are not worth more than the paper they're written on.
I'm a bit late to this whole story, but I think the idea for most of the people buying the stock wasn't an expectation of massive profits, but rather to stick it to The Man. Each investor puts in a couple hundred bucks or something that they're willing to part with, and the hedge funds shorting the stock get massively f'd. I've seen reports that Melvin Capital was going bankrupt, but apparently they "only" suffered a multi billion $ loss and had to be bailed out by a couple other hedge fund companies.
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@abarker said in Shorting Gamestop:
According to some of my cow-orkers who've been paying attention to this, Robin Hood has blocked buying these stocks and is holding up sales of them.
I had heard they blocked buying but not selling
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@boomzilla said in Shorting Gamestop:
@dangeRuss said in Shorting Gamestop:
So... now that it's bound to go down, is it time to short it?
Yes, bet the farm.
Filed under: As long as it's your farm, not mine.
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I love all the sites that say, "here's some advice (DISCLAIMER: this is not advice)" to avoid liability.
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@error said in Shorting Gamestop:
I buy stock through the Employee Stock Purchase Program, which lets me buy company stock at a 15% discount. And I hold.
I've been doing it for nearly a decade now, and the stock has more-than-doubled since I started. I'm sitting on about $300k of it right now.
Filed under: When the company does well, I do well. Our interests are aligned.
Filed under: If you can doxx me from that line, good job, and please don't.
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@error said in Shorting Gamestop:
Filed under: If you can doxx me from that line, good job, and please don't.
I had that idea before I read this sentence. I'm sure it's possible, but I don't get paid for that.
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@error said in Shorting Gamestop:
@error said in Shorting Gamestop:
I buy stock through the Employee Stock Purchase Program, which lets me buy company stock at a 15% discount. And I hold.
I've been doing it for nearly a decade now, and the stock has more-than-doubled since I started. I'm sitting on about $300k of it right now.
Filed under: When the company does well, I do well. Our interests are aligned.
Filed under: If you can doxx me from that line, good job, and please don't.
My company's stock did the tripling thing before I started doing the EPP. Now it's been mostly flat.
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Relevant memes:
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@dangeRuss said in Shorting Gamestop:
@abarker Would now be a good time to sell options on this?
I'm going to repeat what you were told the last time you asked that question:
@topspin said in Shorting Gamestop:
If you have enough trading knowledge that you know how to do it so you need to buy back only six months from now, yes. If you're asking the question, probably no.
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@hungrier said in Shorting Gamestop:
@abarker said in Shorting Gamestop:
According to some of my cow-orkers who've been paying attention to this, Robin Hood has blocked buying these stocks and is holding up sales of them.
I had heard they blocked buying but not selling
Last I checked, my boss had a sale that was being held up. He'd initiated the sale forty minutes prior to our conversation, and it still hadn't gone through on Robin Hood..
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@abarker said in Shorting Gamestop:
@hungrier said in Shorting Gamestop:
@abarker said in Shorting Gamestop:
According to some of my cow-orkers who've been paying attention to this, Robin Hood has blocked buying these stocks and is holding up sales of them.
I had heard they blocked buying but not selling
Last I checked, my boss had a sale that was being held up. He'd initiated the sale forty minutes prior to our conversation, and it still hadn't gone through on Robin Hood..
Gamestop or unrelated stocks?
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@abarker said in Shorting Gamestop:
@dangeRuss said in Shorting Gamestop:
@abarker Would now be a good time to sell options on this?
I'm going to repeat what you were told the last time you asked that question:
@topspin said in Shorting Gamestop:
If you have enough trading knowledge that you know how to do it so you need to buy back only six months from now, yes. If you're asking the question, probably no.
Tastyworks - the platform where I was tried and failed to learn how to do some option trading a while back just sent this
Apex Clearing, who acts as the custodian of all tastyworks accounts, has informed us that the following symbols (AMC, GME, & KOSS) will be set to closing only order status immediately. You will only be able to submit orders to close out any open positions that you have in these symbols.
New opening orders will not be accepted at this time. We will update our clients should the clearing firm lift the Closing Only status in the near future.
Best,
The tastyworks Team
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lollercoaster:
Wonder if the new uptick was people moving from Robinhood to something else.
Robinhood backlash: What you should know about the GameStop stock controversy
Lawmakers, regulators and Reddit aren't happy with the popular investing app.
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@hungrier said in Shorting Gamestop:
@abarker said in Shorting Gamestop:
According to some of my cow-orkers who've been paying attention to this, Robin Hood has blocked buying these stocks and is holding up sales of them.
I had heard they blocked buying but not selling
That sounds much more like the illegal kind of market manipulation than what the redditors did.
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@hungrier said in Shorting Gamestop:
I think the idea for most of the people buying the stock wasn't an expectation of massive profits, but rather to stick it to The Man. Each investor puts in a couple hundred bucks or something that they're willing to part with
I guess that was the idea, but as always with
sheephumans, some of them are bound to make bad choices (I mean, they follow advice from randos on the web, that's already a pretty good sign that they make bad choices...). So I'm almost certain that some of them will have invested more than is safe, some will have not taken the easy option of selling a few high-priced shares to cover their potential losses, some will become greedy when they see the huge rise etc.On the whole, a train crash isn't nice for anyone involved, even if they're (supposedly) in the last carriage of the train.
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I'm not sure I've seen so many videos from Louis Rossman in a short period of time for a while...
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@blek said in Shorting Gamestop:
@remi Those naive redditors can easily avoid any losses right now unless they bought at the absolute peak. Buy in, wait for the stock to go up even more, sell a part of it to recoup your initial investment, and hold the rest. Worst case scenario you're back where you started and you have a funny story to tell. Anyone sane will do that, and anyone not sane enough to do that deserves to lose his money.
I mean the price doubled yesterday, and WSB have been memeing it for a while, people started buying in at 20 and now it's at 320 pre-market. The guy who started it turned something like 40k dollars into 50 million already.
'Tis foolishness! If all were so easy, why, none would suffer in this world!
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@dangeRuss said in Shorting Gamestop:
@abarker said in Shorting Gamestop:
@hungrier said in Shorting Gamestop:
@abarker said in Shorting Gamestop:
According to some of my cow-orkers who've been paying attention to this, Robin Hood has blocked buying these stocks and is holding up sales of them.
I had heard they blocked buying but not selling
Last I checked, my boss had a sale that was being held up. He'd initiated the sale forty minutes prior to our conversation, and it still hadn't gone through on Robin Hood..
Gamestop or unrelated stocks?
Gamestop.
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This is one 'investment' I'm staying the hell away from - nothing about this stock's current valuation has anything to do with the company's actual value, it's a pure emotional bubble, and that's almost impossible to predict.
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@abarker said in Shorting Gamestop:
@hungrier said in Shorting Gamestop:
@abarker said in Shorting Gamestop:
According to some of my cow-orkers who've been paying attention to this, Robin Hood has blocked buying these stocks and is holding up sales of them.
I had heard they blocked buying but not selling
Last I checked, my boss had a sale that was being held up. He'd initiated the sale forty minutes prior to our conversation, and it still hadn't gone through on Robin Hood..
If nowhere is letting people buy then presumably it makes it very tricky to find a buyer
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@boomzilla said in Shorting Gamestop:
The ride continues:
I have a very vague recollection (probably from the tons of articles about financial markets back in 2008?) that there was some sort of investment strategy where you bet on the volatility of a stock (not a specific raise or fall). I have no idea whether it was just a way to summarise some sequence of simple operations or a specific operation, but if that's really a thing (it maybe isn't...), there probably are a few traders who are keeping mum but raking in a fortune due to the those swings...
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@loopback0 great rant.
