I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games
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@anonymous234 said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
I for one am sick of seeing so many people throw thousands of euros on virtual hats. I don't care if "it's their money", it's entirely irrational spending on their part and entirely undeserved money for the seller. And the market affects everyone.
I hate seeing people get angry about how people choose to spend their money. I laugh at you losers spending money on expensive graphics cards to play video games. GROW UP ALREADY! Spend your money on beer and vehicles with internal combustion engines like you're supposed to.
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@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
you cannot lunge directly for the cosmetic you want
Which keeps me from playing it further, since if there's cosmetics I want but that I don't get via their lootboxes, it discourages me from continuing to play.
@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
(b) there is no unfairness between those who buy and those who earn.
In Overwatch's case, there wouldn't be anyway. There's no gameplay difference to wearing any of the skins, just maybe a couple changed voicelines or poses.
Lootboxes are a blight upon modern gaming and the trend needs to die. If a developer wants to put in cosmetics, make them either directly purchasable or tie them to something specific in the game (like achievement rewards).
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@boomzilla said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
Spend your money on beer and vehicles with internal combustion engines like you're supposed to.
I'm sick of seeing people spend money on vehicles with internal combustion engines like Ford Fusion. Buy an old Alfa Romeo and then spend most of your time trying to keep it running like you're supposed to!
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Gambling should be legal. If half the modern world weren't retarded authoritarian pieces of shit that ban random stuff because "it's bad", we wouldn't have these problems.
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@magus said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
Now everyone can buy the single cosmetic they want, and 99% of the cosmetics that Blizzard painstakingly sunk time and effort into get completely unused.
Which is 100% benefit for the playerbase.
Only in the sense that a 'click here to win the game' button would be 100% benefit.
@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
Now it goes back to "just buy it", and for those who don't, it's a goddamn grind.
It's cosmetic, so there isn't really room to complain there.
Why not?
@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
(a) you cannot lunge directly for the cosmetic you want and never pay attention to drops instead
Which is only a negative thing.
To you, because you want the cool shit in your hands as fast as possible. Video games don't work like that. Imagine what BOTW would be like if you could just grab the Master Sword right off the bat.
@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
(b) there is no unfairness between those who buy and those who earn.
"Fairness" does not come in here. It's cosmetic. For users who pay money, the difference is between paying money for what you want, and paying 8x as much and maybe getting something you want. I would be totally fine if free players couldn't get the cosmetics at all. The fact that they can grind for them means they have to think about it more, and are given more chances to see the "refill premium currency" screens, and the low, low numbers on premium currency prices.
They actually never see the 'refill premium currency' screens. There is no link to buy more anywhere in the game. Games that let you click 'buy' and then go 'aww, looks like you don't have enough money! Buy more?' can go fuck themselves. There are plenty of people who don't know you can buy loot boxes, simply because the option is only present in the Blizzard store, which most people never visit. And the inability to get what you want right off the bat is the point of the system. Loot boxes are for players who want to unlock everything faster, not for players who want to unlock one particular thing faster.
You have this model in your mind of how a game should work, and it's clearly showing - 'fix feature X so it fits with feature Y!' 'actually feature Y works this way instead.' 'oh you should fix feature Y so it fits with feature Z' 'actually feature Z works this way instead' 'oh you should fix feature Z so it fits with feature Σ' etc. The game doesn't fit your model, and instead breaks the mold, and you're mad because you can't do the thing that worked in other games, and focus on how difficult it is to keep doing that thing instead of embracing the way you're supposed to be doing it instead. Like if you were transitioning from Lunix to Windows, and were complaining about how annoying it is to copy fonts to the folder in C:\Windows\Fonts when you used to have a folder right in ~/ for fonts, and nobody could convince you that the font manager was how you were supposed to do it.
@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
It's good game design is what it is.
Not in a million years. Lootboxes are done 100% because it makes more money. It will always make more money than not having them, because having them means people can pay money to get nothing they wanted, except maybe one slightly intriguing thing. Which entices them to keep on spending.
You can say that that's their motivation, and for all I know that's why they're doing it, but their reasons make sense and are reasons I could have come up with myself. I don't care why Initrode is giving everyone free Internet, because why they do it doesn't affect whether I have it.
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@pitaj It's like drugs. Technically, everyone should be able to make their own decisions. But the only thing that teaches people how to make the correct decision is firsthand experience, and once you've gotten that you're already down the rabbit hole.
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@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
Only in the sense that a 'click here to win the game' button would be 100% benefit.
Paying money to a company should never be gamified. The fact that you think it should is why you're so completely wrong.
@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
Why not?
Because it doesn't benefit you to buy it. Unless they go with the way they actually patented, where the game matches you against people with expensive skins, and shows them to you in a glittering display when they kill you, with Buy buttons. Because that is the same company, you'll remember.
@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
To you, because you want the cool shit in your hands as fast as possible. Video games don't work like that. Imagine what BOTW would be like if you could just grab the Master Sword right off the bat.
Money is not a game. Tying money into a game mechanic at all is horrible and manipulative.
@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
They actually never see the 'refill premium currency' screens. There is no link to buy more anywhere in the game. Games that let you click 'buy' and then go 'aww, looks like you don't have enough money! Buy more?' can go fuck themselves. There are plenty of people who don't know you can buy loot boxes, simply because the option is only present in the Blizzard store, which most people never visit.
Yeah, and the store totally doesn't list everything in, say, Heroes of the Storm as "1000g, 150c"
@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
And the inability to get what you want right off the bat is the point of the system. Loot boxes are for players who want to unlock everything faster, not for players who want to unlock one particular thing faster.
Because they want to gamify their payment system to encourage you to spend more money.
@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
You have this model in your mind of how a game should work, and it's clearly showing - 'fix feature X so it fits with feature Y!' 'actually feature Y works this way instead.' 'oh you should fix feature Y so it fits with feature Z' 'actually feature Z works this way instead' 'oh you should fix feature Z so it fits with feature Σ' etc. The game doesn't fit your model, and instead breaks the mold, and you're mad because you can't do the thing that worked in other games, and focus on how difficult it is to keep doing that thing instead of embracing the way you're supposed to be doing it instead. Like if you were transitioning from Lunix to Windows, and were complaining about how annoying it is to copy fonts to the folder in C:\Windows\Fonts when you used to have a folder right in ~/ for fonts, and nobody could convince you that the font manager was how you were supposed to do it.
next time you go to the grocery store to buy some food, I hope they've replaced it with a machine that dispenses ingredients at random for $2 each.@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
You can say that that's their motivation, and for all I know that's why they're doing it, but their reasons make sense and are reasons I could have come up with myself. I don't care why Initrode is giving everyone free Internet, because why they do it doesn't affect whether I have it.
A benefit for them is a monetary loss for consumers in this regard. It does not make the game more fun to have to spend more money on things to get what you want.
@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
t's like drugs.
He finally noticed!
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@magus said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
Only in the sense that a 'click here to win the game' button would be 100% benefit.
Paying money to a company should never be gamified. The fact that you think it should is why you're so completely wrong.
Paying money is not being gamified. The collection of drops is.
@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
Why not?
Because it doesn't benefit you to buy it. Unless they go with the way they actually patented, where the game matches you against people with expensive skins, and shows them to you in a glittering display when they kill you, with Buy buttons. Because that is the same company, you'll remember.
I don't remember. Enlighten me. My first experience with Blizzard has been Overwatch.
@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
To you, because you want the cool shit in your hands as fast as possible. Video games don't work like that. Imagine what BOTW would be like if you could just grab the Master Sword right off the bat.
Money is not a game. Tying money into a game mechanic at all is horrible and manipulative.
You're coming at this wrong. Buying loot boxes is not the intended solution. The intended solution is to earn them, buying them is the workaround.
@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
They actually never see the 'refill premium currency' screens. There is no link to buy more anywhere in the game. Games that let you click 'buy' and then go 'aww, looks like you don't have enough money! Buy more?' can go fuck themselves. There are plenty of people who don't know you can buy loot boxes, simply because the option is only present in the Blizzard store, which most people never visit.
Yeah, and the store totally doesn't list everything in, say, Heroes of the Storm as "1000g, 150c"
???
And HOTS is free to play. All bets are off in F2P games.@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
And the inability to get what you want right off the bat is the point of the system. Loot boxes are for players who want to unlock everything faster, not for players who want to unlock one particular thing faster.
Because they want to gamify their payment system to encourage you to spend more money.
I don't know why it is that you never listen to me when I say that buying loot boxes is very uncommon. You talk as if buying loot boxes was the unchanging constant, and the system needs to be reworked so that it can cooperate with that constant as much as possible. That's simply not the case. All these things you're talking about that make buying loot boxes worthless instead have discouraged people from buying loot boxes, and they just earn them the regular way instead.
@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
You have this model in your mind of how a game should work, and it's clearly showing - 'fix feature X so it fits with feature Y!' 'actually feature Y works this way instead.' 'oh you should fix feature Y so it fits with feature Z' 'actually feature Z works this way instead' 'oh you should fix feature Z so it fits with feature Σ' etc. The game doesn't fit your model, and instead breaks the mold, and you're mad because you can't do the thing that worked in other games, and focus on how difficult it is to keep doing that thing instead of embracing the way you're supposed to be doing it instead. Like if you were transitioning from Lunix to Windows, and were complaining about how annoying it is to copy fonts to the folder in C:\Windows\Fonts when you used to have a folder right in ~/ for fonts, and nobody could convince you that the font manager was how you were supposed to do it.
next time you go to the grocery store to buy some food, I hope they've replaced it with a machine that dispenses ingredients at random for $2 each.I see you have neglected to attempt to comprehend what I said.
@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
You can say that that's their motivation, and for all I know that's why they're doing it, but their reasons make sense and are reasons I could have come up with myself. I don't care why Initrode is giving everyone free Internet, because why they do it doesn't affect whether I have it.
A benefit for them is a monetary loss for consumers in this regard. It does not make the game more fun to have to spend more money on things to get what you want.
I'm not spending money on things. I just don't buy loot boxes. Most players agree. Loot box sales really only spike up from 'obscenely low' to 'very low' around events, because each box is guaranteed to have an event specific item in it.
@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
it's like drugs.
He finally noticed!
?? I'm saying gambling is. I'm also saying this isn't like gambling.
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@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
@pitaj It's like drugs. Technically, everyone should be able to make their own decisions. But the only thing that teaches people how to make the correct decision is firsthand experience, and once you've gotten that you're already down the rabbit hole.
Making things illegal causes people to keep doing them, but less safely.
That's why illegal things should always be things with absolutely no merit in any circumstance. Otherwise, you're just making that thing unsafe.
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@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
You're coming at this wrong. Buying loot boxes is not the intended solution. The intended solution is to earn them, buying them is the workaround.
FOR YOU
Not for Activison.
@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
???
And HOTS is free to play. All bets are off in F2P games.Even in the case where you can spend ingame gold or their crystals, the numbers are manipulated to make crystals look cheaper.
@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
I don't know why it is that you never listen to me when I say that buying loot boxes is very uncommon.
And I'm going to continue to do that, because you're still wrong. Maybe Overwatch is a rare special case. I would not take Activision at their word.
@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
?? I'm saying gambling is. I'm also saying this isn't like gambling.
Which is why you're wrong.
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@ben_lubar said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
@pitaj It's like drugs. Technically, everyone should be able to make their own decisions. But the only thing that teaches people how to make the correct decision is firsthand experience, and once you've gotten that you're already down the rabbit hole.
Making things illegal causes people to keep doing them, but less safely.
That's why illegal things should always be things with absolutely no merit in any circumstance. Otherwise, you're just making that thing unsafe.
People keep doing them, but only the very determined people. I'm talking about the average joes who try it once, and can't stop.
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@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
@ben_lubar said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
@pitaj It's like drugs. Technically, everyone should be able to make their own decisions. But the only thing that teaches people how to make the correct decision is firsthand experience, and once you've gotten that you're already down the rabbit hole.
Making things illegal causes people to keep doing them, but less safely.
That's why illegal things should always be things with absolutely no merit in any circumstance. Otherwise, you're just making that thing unsafe.
People keep doing them, but only the very determined people. I'm talking about the average joes who try it once, and can't stop.
If you make ____ illegal, people will still do ____, but unsafely.
- drugs
- medical procedures
- gambling
- violent video games
- memory accesses
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@boomzilla said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
@anonymous234 said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
I for one am sick of seeing so many people throw thousands of euros on virtual hats. I don't care if "it's their money", it's entirely irrational spending on their part and entirely undeserved money for the seller. And the market affects everyone.
I hate seeing people get angry about how people choose to spend their money. I laugh at you losers spending money on expensive graphics cards to play video games. GROW UP ALREADY! Spend your money on beer and vehicles with internal combustion engines like you're supposed to.
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@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
Gambling is when you sink money in with the hope of getting more money out.
Which would be true, except the actual problems with addiction-coupled behaviour patterns are observed in children playing these games (and you'd better believe that children, more particularly teens, play them). OK, so there isn't so much of a possibility of using the games to launder money for organised crime, a common issue with traditional gambling, but it's hardly the only concern out there. Encouraging it as a habit in pre-adults is definitely storing up trouble for the future.
Gambling is a multifaceted thing.
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@magus said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
You're coming at this wrong. Buying loot boxes is not the intended solution. The intended solution is to earn them, buying them is the workaround.
FOR YOU
Not for Activison.
You keep talking about the motivation. I don't care about the motivation. I care about the effects. I thought I had made that clear.
@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
???
And HOTS is free to play. All bets are off in F2P games.Even in the case where you can spend ingame gold or their crystals, the numbers are manipulated to make crystals look cheaper.
I assume that this is a case where crystals are worth more? In which case only someone who didn't play the game would fall for that. Also, and this is a biggun, Overwatch has no shop screen or encouragement to buy. You could become the best player in the world without ever knowing that loot boxes are purchasable.
@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
I don't know why it is that you never listen to me when I say that buying loot boxes is very uncommon.
And I'm going to continue to do that, because you're still wrong. Maybe Overwatch is a rare special case. I would not take Activision at their word.
It is a rare special case for a lot of things.
@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
?? I'm saying gambling is. I'm also saying this isn't like gambling.
Which is why you're wrong.
It's not gambling if you win every time. It's not gambling if you can't get money out of it.
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@ben_lubar said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
If you make ____ illegal, people will still do ____, but unsafely.
Which is why you use an approach that lies between complete prohibition and complete permission, and why you set the regulation to limit as many of the harms of the action as possible without encouraging the harms associated with people doing illegal activities. It's effectively a classic optimisation problem, except with non-standard input values.
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@e4tmyl33t said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
Lootboxes are a blight upon modern gaming and the trend needs to die. If a developer wants to put in cosmetics, make them either directly purchasable or tie them to something specific in the game (like achievement rewards).
QFT.
In addition, make the achievements actual achievements. That way getting the special magic unicorn hat or whatever would mean something (and seeing somebody having it would do so too).
Now, the moronic skins or whatever in Overwatch et al. just mean that you've either been very lucky, spent a metric shitton of time in game (put potentially still sucking at it) or that you've ponied up $$$.
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@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
It's good game design is what it is. Let's take Overwatch for example.
Oh, boy. Here we go again.
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@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
It's not gambling if you win every time.
Which you don't.
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@boomzilla I don't mind graphics cards. They actually provide something for your money.
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@anonymous234 Yeah, bitcoins.
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@magus said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
It's not gambling if you win every time.
Which you don't.
Yes, you do. You get four cosmetics every time a loot box gets opened.
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@pie_flavor Which, if they are not the ones you wanted, are not a win.
"Woo hoo! I got shards! I love shards! I want all the shards!"
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@magus said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
@pie_flavor Which, if they are not the ones you wanted, are not a win.
"Woo hoo! I got shards! I love shards! I want all the shards!"
Random drops from games that you may or may not have wanted are nothing new.
Again, buying loot boxes is not the constant. If loot boxes aren't worth the investment, then don't fuckin' buy 'em.
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@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
Random drops from games that you may or may not have wanted are nothing new.
Right.
@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
Again, buying loot boxes is not the constant. If loot boxes aren't worth the investment, then don't fuckin' buy 'em.
You really don't get it, do you?
I don't buy loot boxes. But I know why they're a problem. You don't seem to. They - for obvious reasons that are clear to everyone but you - cause exactly the same impulses that make gambling dangerous, and cannot result in a reward. If real money could not enter the equation, there would be no problem here. Your personal supposed immunity to manipulation does not mean anything at all.
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@magus It's not whether real money goes into the equation. It's whether real money comes out of the equation. Gambling involves you potentially profiting. Loot boxes (in games where content is not tradable for real money) do not cause you to feel the urge of gambling.
I can tell you don't play Overwatch.
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@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
It's not whether real money goes into the equation. It's whether real money comes out of the equation.
No. We're talking about how this harms people. Getting nothing real makes it no less harmful.
@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
Loot boxes (in games where content is not tradable for real money) do not cause you to feel the urge of gambling.
Wrong. I say you do. Except apparently you personally are totally immune to being manipulated. Which is why you're still defending a company that literally patented a strategy for manipulating people in rather extreme ways for monetary gain.
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@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
It's not whether real money goes into the equation. It's whether real money comes out of the equation.
It's the induced behaviour pattern, you thick-skulled fool, with the fact that real money goes in as a secondary concern. (If money also came out, it'd also be a worry in relation to organised crime, but if you think that's the only problem with gambling then you're an even-bigger idiot.)
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@magus said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
It's not whether real money goes into the equation. It's whether real money comes out of the equation.
No. We're talking about how this harms people. Getting nothing real makes it no less harmful.
Well, that coupled with getting a reward every single time means that it's not really going to evoke the same feelings as gambling.
@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
Loot boxes (in games where content is not tradable for real money) do not cause you to feel the urge of gambling.
Wrong. I say you do. Except apparently you personally are totally immune to being manipulated. Which is why you're still defending a company that literally patented a strategy for manipulating people in rather extreme ways for monetary gain.
I don't give a damn what the company does. How many times am I going to say this? I don't care about the motivations. I care about the results.
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@ben_lubar said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
If loot boxes can lead to profit according to this law, then literally any gameplay mechanic that involves random chance is gambling.
Loot boxes is/was something you buy with real and immediately give you a random prize that you can easily sell for money. It can't get any more similar to a slot machine. Fuck anyone that think it's ok.
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I would be satisfied with a large "this game contains gambling" sticker on these games. Also a large warning on the screen when you're going to get as a download. So I don't buy it by accident to my kids.
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@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
You could become the best player in the world without ever knowing that loot boxes are purchasable.
It seems unlikely that you'd become the best player in the world without ever opening a loot box; the Shop button is the obviously highlighted button on that screen once you open any loot boxes you have, placed right by the area where you open loot boxes.
@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
Well, that coupled with getting a reward every single time means that it's not really going to evoke the same feelings as gambling.
For purchased loot boxes it'd feel about the same to me. A losing lottery ticket leaves you with a piece of paper, which I find more useful than two sprays, an account icon, and a voice line for a character I don't play.
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@parody said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
You could become the best player in the world without ever knowing that loot boxes are purchasable.
It seems unlikely that you'd become the best player in the world without ever opening a loot box; the Shop button is the obviously highlighted button on that screen once you open any loot boxes you have, placed right by the area where you open loot boxes.
Hmm. That must have changed.
@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
Well, that coupled with getting a reward every single time means that it's not really going to evoke the same feelings as gambling.
For purchased loot boxes it'd feel about the same to me. A losing lottery ticket leaves you with a piece of paper, which I find more useful than two sprays, an account icon, and a voice line for a character I don't play.
Then don't purchase loot boxes.
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@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
@magus Loot boxes (in games where content is not tradable for real money) do not cause you to feel the urge of gambling.
On what scientific psychological basis do you assume this?
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@rhywden said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
@magus Loot boxes (in games where content is not tradable for real money) do not cause you to feel the urge of gambling.
On what scientific psychological basis do you assume this?
On the basis that he says so and knows in his gut that this must be true because he knows he doesn't do gambling and yet likes loot boxes.
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@rhywden said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
@magus Loot boxes (in games where content is not tradable for real money) do not cause you to feel the urge of gambling.
On what scientific psychological basis do you assume this?
Because you win every time and can't get real money out of it.
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@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
@anonymous234 said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
I for one am sick of seeing so many people throw thousands of euros on virtual hats. I don't care if "it's their money", it's entirely irrational spending on their part and entirely undeserved money for the seller. And the market affects everyone.
I for one am sick of seeing so many people throw
thousands of dollars on cable television. I don't care if "it's their money", it's entirely irrational spending on their part and entirely undeserved money for the seller. And the market affects everyone.Just popping in to say that this is true as written.
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@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
@rhywden said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
@magus Loot boxes (in games where content is not tradable for real money) do not cause you to feel the urge of gambling.
On what scientific psychological basis do you assume this?
Because you win every time and can't get real money out of it.
If you get rubbish you don't need then I don't define that as "winning". Also, I don't think you know how gambling works psychologically. Real money actually plays a minor role - it's merely the hook to get you started. After that your lizard brain takes over and it's not really about the money anymore.
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@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
Because you win every time and can't get real money out of it.
Please stop rolling out that meretricious argument. It's been refuted a bunch of times.
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@pie_flavor said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
Gambling involves you potentially profiting. Loot boxes (in games where content is not tradable for real money) do not cause you to feel the urge of gambling.
You heard it here first, folks. The only way to get an addictive seratonin hit is to win real money. Probably only USD as well
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@pie_flavor Do you seriously think that the only way to "feel the urge for gambling" is to be able to win real money, or is this another "things don't 'affect' people by my made up definition of affect" thing?
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@magus said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
@pie_flavor Which, if they are not the ones you wanted, are not a win.
"Woo hoo! I got shards! I love shards! I want all the shards!"
Are those machines where you put in a quarter and get a random toy in a capsule gambling? Are Kinder Surprise eggs?
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@hungrier Probably sometimes. Though I wouldn't think Kinder eggs are, since those are chocolate, and the toy is a bonus. But all such things where there's a specific set of related items someone might want to get all of is that way specifically because someone knows that that will happen, and will result in them getting more money.
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@hungrier said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
Are those machines where you put in a quarter and get a random toy in a capsule gambling?
They're not considered gambling in the US, but then again neither is loot boxes.
Are they considered gambling in Belgium? That's the country we're talking about.
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@blakeyrat said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
Video game loot boxes declared illegal under Belgium gambling laws
The Belgium Gaming Commission finds video game loot boxes violate its gambling legislation.
Because their idiot moron government has just made a decision that practically guarantees no game company will sell in their region. And it's enforceable by prison time for the game's producers.
Strangely their anti-loot-box law makes Overwatch, FIFA 2018, and Counterstrike: Global Offensive all illegal, but not Star Wars Battlefront II-- the game that started the whole brouhaha in the first place.
@rhywden said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
However, I dare say that Hearthstone has a bit of a problem now.
Raises the question, what will they do about physical trading card games.
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@hungrier said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
@magus said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
@pie_flavor Which, if they are not the ones you wanted, are not a win.
"Woo hoo! I got shards! I love shards! I want all the shards!"
Are those machines where you put in a quarter and get a random toy in a capsule gambling? Are Kinder Surprise eggs?
Pretty sure this was already discussed in this thread, but the answer is no, assuming all of the toys are of approximately equal value (and, by extension, rarity).
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@Polygeekery said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
But if they are instituting gambling then they can follow the laws that regard to that.
Including age checks to ensure that the gambler is of legal age for their jurisdiction...
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@polygeekery said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
@bjolling said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
@polygeekery said in I hope Belgiumites don't like playing video games:
@magus lots of shit gets abused. But you cannot outlaw stupidity. If someone finds out a way to do so I will throw all my weight behind the initiative.
But if they are instituting gambling then they can follow the laws that regard to that.
It's not only protection against stupidity but also against inexperience. I have children playing games. As an experienced gamer myself, I can guide and protect them against gambling abuse but many parents know a lot less about gaming than their own children. I don't mind the law, I don't mind that games with gambling will not be available here. One less thing to worry about when my kids play.
I doubt that the Belgian law will make a dent, but someone has got to go first. Hopefully enough countries will follow so that game developers will have no choice but to remove gambling from their games.Watch your kids. Problem solved.
Probably he just should tie them up and keep them in his basement. Or consider (extremely) late term abortion.
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EA: We don't care about European regulations
EA Still Believes in Loot Boxes, Will ‘Push Forward’ With Their Use
Despite the decision by some regulatory authorities that "loot boxes" are an illegal form of gambling, EA Arts remains committed.
