WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else
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@Benjamin-Hall the only time my MacBook ever screwed anything up was when I literally poured a glass of water over it. Besides the occasional update (definitely rarer than Windows’s monthly “let’s see what breaks this time”), it’s got an uptime that would make Windows 95 crash.
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@Arantor said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
Change for change's sake irks me, and desktop Linux is doing a pretty good of emulating that from what I can see, and I have neither the time nor patience to squirrel away how to undo it. Like... yes I can install this desktop environment and I can install those packages... but I just want to use the fucking thing. I'm not 18 any more, I don't have the spare time or patience to experiment and tweak every little thing because I can.
I'm sure this is highly desktop environment dependent. The KDE 4 5 upgrade was pretty painful (and took a few versions to get all the functionality back) but since then it's been pretty stable from my perspective.
I do choose a theme (been using Plastik for pretty much ever) and disable crap like weird windows actions when you move them to some edge / corner (also turn that off in Windows). Plus I like to have taskbars on the sides. But it's been fine between Kubuntu LTS versions the last few upgrades.
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@Benjamin-Hall said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
@topspin said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
@Benjamin-Hall better is subjective, apparently some people like their ads, but Windows 10 being more stable than macOS or Linux?
I can't remember the last time my windows machine (a frankenputer that has been upgraded from 7 to 10 to 11 without full reinstall) crashed or had to be restarted (other than updates). The personal Linux server I administer... Not so much. And don't even get me started about my work MacBook pro. Which wedges something sideways every week or when and a half. And needs constant maintenance, as every little point update breaks almost everything.
I'd have to go look in the Win10 thread (where I document these events), but at least my old work machine (which went away last November) used to BSOD on me every other month or so, IIRC.
Can't remember the last time my personal machine (Kubuntu 22.04) crashed anything close to like that.
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@boomzilla this machine has been in near daily use (including for gaming) since mid 2021 and a total of 2 BSODs, both video driver related. The machine I had before that ran from 2016 to 2021, again as a daily driver, I don't think I ever had a BSOD on it.
Before that, 2012-2016 was a MacBook Pro running Windows via Boot Camp, no BSODs I can remember on that either, though it did have to go back to the shop at one point because of a fault on the entire Late 2011 MBP range where the discrete GPU would eventually fail hard and need a motherboard/daughterboard replacement.
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@Zerosquare said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
Yeah! I'm back down to the minutes!
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@Benjamin-Hall said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
The personal Linux server I administer... Not so much.
Maybe you suck at server administration
The multiple Linux servers I administer never crash or need to get restarted (unless there is a kernel update).
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@topspin said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
would make Windows 95 crash.
:really-low-barrier.png:
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@Zerosquare said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
Ain’t none of my Windows systems got great uptimes. No BSODs but I still get the update pain train because I’m not on LTSB or whatever.
Ain’t none of my Mac systems got great uptimes either. Longest the current work Mac has lived without a reboot is about a month before services just start randomly failing because something no longer authenticates me as the currently logged in user to the system itself, I get a bajillion login prompts as all the services start to lose cohesion and the only way out of it is to power off because it spawns login prompts faster than I can login to any of them.
iPhone routinely gets powered off because I forget to keep it plugged in (it’s not my daily mobile device, my iPad is)
iPad on the other hand is getting on a bit and occasionally just decides overnight when it’s happily on charge that it’ll just reboot for no reason. Probably the weight of the 118 tabs I have in Safari.
I have no Linux systems of my own right now.
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@TimeBandit said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
@topspin said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
would make Windows 95 crash.
:really-low-barrier.png:
Maximum uptime of Win95/98 is 49 days.
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What are these "forced reboots" that Windows 10 is supposed to do? Mine's never done that.
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@Watson those of us not on big expensive plans (or have fudged the internet connection) get rebooted once a month or thereabouts, to have the latest “greatest” Windows Update applied automatically.
Home edition does this when it feels like it. Pro edition lets you hold out for a week but if you haven’t done it, it’s going to do it for you.
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@Arantor Really? I'm not on a "big expensive plan". It's a machine sitting on my desk at home. Pro edition upgraded from the original 8.1 (which dates it as being too old to support Windows 11 anyway). Nothing fancy about that. It updates on a roughly monthly basis, sure, but it doesn't force any rebooting to do it.
Edit: Actually I might have figured it out myself from this talk of "uptimes": I actually turn my computer off. And then later turn it back on again.
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@Arantor said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
@TimeBandit said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
@topspin said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
would make Windows 95 crash.
:really-low-barrier.png:
Maximum uptime of Win95/98 is 49 days.
Which is higher than you’d get on Windows 1x including Patch Tuesday.
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@Watson said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
Edit: Actually I might have figured it out myself from this talk of "uptimes": I actually turn my computer off. And then later turn it back on again.
My computer (W10) has a few times turned itself on after hours to do updates (and didn't even kindly turn itself back off afterwards), until I changed whatever configuration it was to stop that.
Edit to clarify: by this I mean waking up from hibernation, not booting from a complete shutdown.
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@Watson that would explain it - I’m too lazy to shut down/start when I can just close the lid and (normally) come back to my files Where I Left Them.
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@Arantor said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
@Watson those of us not on big expensive plans (or have fudged the internet connection) get rebooted once a month or thereabouts, to have the latest “greatest” Windows Update applied automatically.
No "big expensive plan" needed. Just a registry setting.
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@Gern_Blaanston that’s a thing? I thought that was an urban legend.
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@Gern_Blaanston said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
Microsoft has essentially turned Windows into Linux.
And I thought of installing Linux on my machine.
While I could simply install Windows 11 ...
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@TimeBandit said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
The multiple Linux servers I administer never crash
because they are frozen over all time.
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@Gern_Blaanston said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
Day #2 of trying to move from Windows 10 to Windows 11 on my main desktop computer. Finally got things wrangled into a usable state (for certain values of "usable").
-- There are a lot of things that are the same as Windows 10.
-- There are a lot of things that are worse.
-- There is nothing that is better.Microsoft has essentially turned Windows into Linux.
Windows 11 drove me to Linux.
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@loopback0 said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
@Arantor said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
@HardwareGeek no, what's happened is that Windows is now - from the outside - functionally indistinguishable from many modern Linux distributions.
Linux finally caught up? Year of the Linux desktop soon?
In typical linux fashion, they’re arguing over whether chromebooks or steamdecks should be included so its an arguement over 3% or 7%.
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@Arantor gah! Ubuntu and their horseshit have probably driven off more users than its brought. Worse than MS in a lot of ways. Their community is terrible too. Almost worse than wine/proton.
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@Zecc said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
@Watson said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
Edit: Actually I might have figured it out myself from this talk of "uptimes": I actually turn my computer off. And then later turn it back on again.
My computer (W10) has a few times turned itself on after hours to do updates (and didn't even kindly turn itself back off afterwards), until I changed whatever configuration it was to stop that.
Edit to clarify: by this I mean waking up from hibernation, not booting from a complete shutdown.
I've had that happen too, a couple of times it started playing sounds as well making me wake up and go
Windows computers have several times a year just decided to do an update on the middle of working despite having configured them to never do it during business hours and other shit like that.
Linux merely pops up a notification saying that there are updates I might want to do. And then it shuts up and lets me do them whenever. It also most of the time won't even need a reboot.
The short time I had a Mac, that thing also didn't force reboots in the middle of work. I hated it for other reasons.
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@Arantor said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
the latest “greatest” Windows Update applied automatically.
I call them cum updates!
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@Tsaukpaetra do they come with pineapple?
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@topspin said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
@Tsaukpaetra do they come with pineapple?
Checking recent KB articles, it seems you're going to have to take it raw.
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@Tsaukpaetra I’ll stay on my Mac, I guess.
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@topspin said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
@Tsaukpaetra I’ll stay on my Mac, I guess.
Apple or pineapple, it all boils down to taste.
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@Arantor said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
@Gern_Blaanston that’s a thing? I thought that was an urban legend.
It's real. I've been using it on Windows 10, and it works on Windows 11 too. You can still update manually any time you want, or click on the "Resume Updats" button to go back to automatic updates.
Adjust the dates and Windows version to whatever you want. Here's mine for Windows 10:
Windows Registry Editor Version 5.00
[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\WindowsUpdate\UX\Settings]
"PauseFeatureUpdatesStartTime"="2022-12-12T12:12:59Z"
"PauseQualityUpdatesStartTime"="2022-12-12T12:12:59Z"
"PauseUpdatesExpiryTime"="2039-12-12T12:12:59Z"
"PauseFeatureUpdatesEndTime"="2039-12-12T12:12:12Z"
"PauseQualityUpdatesEndTime"="2039-12-12T12:12:12Z"[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Policies\Microsoft\Windows\WindowsUpdate]
"TargetReleaseVersion"=dword:00000001
"TargetReleaseVersionInfo"="1809"
Which results in:
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@DogsB said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
@Gern_Blaanston said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
Day #2 of trying to move from Windows 10 to Windows 11 on my main desktop computer. Finally got things wrangled into a usable state (for certain values of "usable").
-- There are a lot of things that are the same as Windows 10.
-- There are a lot of things that are worse.
-- There is nothing that is better.Microsoft has essentially turned Windows into Linux.
Windows 11 drove me to Linux.
Routing error in Bing Maps?
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@BernieTheBernie said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
@DogsB said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
@Gern_Blaanston said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
Day #2 of trying to move from Windows 10 to Windows 11 on my main desktop computer. Finally got things wrangled into a usable state (for certain values of "usable").
-- There are a lot of things that are the same as Windows 10.
-- There are a lot of things that are worse.
-- There is nothing that is better.Microsoft has essentially turned Windows into Linux.
Windows 11 drove me to Linux.
Routing error in Bing Maps?
No, apple maps. At least they don’t deny that they listen to your conversations.
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@Tsaukpaetra said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
@topspin said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
@Tsaukpaetra I’ll stay on my Mac, I guess.
Apple or pineapple, it all boils down to taste.
And neither belong on a pizza. Could work in a curry though.
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@Luhmann said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
@Tsaukpaetra said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
pineapple
have a pen
Ungh! Pen pineapple apple pen.
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@TimeBandit said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
Microsoft has confirmed that third-party applications that let users customize the user interface (UI) are once again breaking the Start menu.
No, it is not third-party applications that are breaking the Start menu. It is Microsoft, who keeps making stupid pointless changes that break third-party applications that are trying to fix the things that Microsoft keeps breaking.
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@Gern_Blaanston said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
@TimeBandit said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
Microsoft has confirmed that third-party applications that let users customize the user interface (UI) are once again breaking the Start menu.
No, it is not third-party applications that are breaking the Start menu. It is Microsoft, who keeps making stupid pointless changes that break third-party applications that are trying to fix the things that Microsoft keeps breaking.
You remember a time when Microsoft went out of its way to avoid breaking things?
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@Gern_Blaanston said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
No, it is not third-party applications that are breaking the Start menu. It is Microsoft, who keeps making stupid pointless changes that break third-party applications that are trying to fix the things that Microsoft keeps breaking.
Sure but it's also unreasonable to expect them to care about testing third party stuff like Explorer Patcher.
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@loopback0 said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
@Gern_Blaanston said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
No, it is not third-party applications that are breaking the Start menu. It is Microsoft, who keeps making stupid pointless changes that break third-party applications that are trying to fix the things that Microsoft keeps breaking.
Sure but it's also unreasonable to expect them to care about testing third party stuff like Explorer Patcher.
They could start with testing if the start menu opens / closes when you click it, preferably without measurable delay that allows me to click the same entry 4 times before the fucking thing disappears.
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@topspin said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
@loopback0 said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
@Gern_Blaanston said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
No, it is not third-party applications that are breaking the Start menu. It is Microsoft, who keeps making stupid pointless changes that break third-party applications that are trying to fix the things that Microsoft keeps breaking.
Sure but it's also unreasonable to expect them to care about testing third party stuff like Explorer Patcher.
They could start with testing if the start menu opens / closes when you click it, preferably without measurable delay that allows me to click the same entry 4 times before the fucking thing disappears.
But even if it didn't that's nothing to do with what I said.They deserve shit for not testing their own stuff as they ship it, but not because they didn't test something that a random third party created.
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@loopback0 said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
They deserve shit for not testing their own stuff
asbefore they ship it
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@HardwareGeek yes, but I meant their own stuff in the state they ship it.
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@Tsaukpaetra said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
You remember a time when Microsoft went out of its way to avoid breaking things?
Yes.
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@loopback0 said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
Sure but it's also unreasonable to expect them to care about testing third party stuff like Explorer Patcher.
I don't expect them to test Explorer Patcher. That would be unreasonable, I agree.
I would like them to stop fucking things up, so that Explorer Patcher isn't needed in the first place.
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@Gern_Blaanston said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
I would like them to stop fucking things up
I would like a flying car, a few billion dollars, and to be God-Emperor of Earth. Whose wish is more likely to come true?
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@HardwareGeek Best I can offer is Cybertruck,
Twitter✘ stock and Technoking of Mars
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@Applied-Mediocrity said in WTF is happening with Windows 11? And nothing else:
@HardwareGeek Best I can offer is Cybertruck,
Twitter𝕏 stock and Technoking of Mars
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