Most fun I had in weeks
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@blakeyrat said:
... but seriously, stop watching those LPs. You're everything wrong with the LP fans right now.
Why, exactly? And how, respectively.
I've watched/read through dozens of LPs by now, and the absurdly difficult games have been far and away the most entertaining. I've learned a thing or three about some of my classic favorites (and a couple of times the LPer could have benefited from some of my retro game lore, but alas, most were years old by the time I found them).
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@blakeyrat said:
@Mason Wheeler said:
...which I already discussed. If your thumb is inside the concave part, then unless it's smaller than the finger of our hypothetical third grader, those hard bumps are going to be digging into it.
They aren't digging into it, because you're not putting pressure on it. Try to keep up.
@Mason Wheeler said:See above, re: hard bumps digging into your thumb if you do it that way.
The bumps aren't fucking MOTORIZED. They aren't digging into your thumb, you're digging your thumb into them. Just stop doing that. Idiot.
Eureka! It all makes sense now. You're telekinetic! That's the only theory that explains why you so consistently talk about how you can push something without putting physical pressure on it! Also, being telekinetic necessarily means that your brain is so advanced that I would be an idiot by comparison.
Why didn't I see this before?
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@blakeyrat said:
@Anonymouse said:
Wait, weren't you the one who (rightfully) complained about PC games doing things that make them look like obvious console ports not integrated with the rest of the system? Like not setting the default resolution to a proper one?Well, for me it's the only place I know to get good mods (SkyUI for converting that dumb consoleified interface into something that you can actually properly use on a "real" computer is awesome - I couldn't live without it).
Why people will take a game designed to be played with a controller and go to enormous lengths to make it work in a shitty fashion with a keyboard and mouse is simply beyond me. Because apparently if I plug a Xbox 360 controller into my computer it's no longer "real". I guess?
Hey here's a thought: maybe when PCs can move 1/10th the product as even the shittiest console, game companies will start developing for keyboards and mouses.
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@joe.edwards said:
@blakeyrat said:
... but seriously, stop watching those LPs. You're everything wrong with the LP fans right now.
Why, exactly?Because those "let's play a really hard game and then swear a lot" LPs are fucking terrible, and you're encouraging them.
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@Mason Wheeler said:
Eureka! It all makes sense now. You're telekinetic! That's the only theory that explains why you so consistently talk about how you can push something without putting physical pressure on it! Also, being telekinetic necessarily means that your brain is so advanced that I would be an idiot by comparison.
Why didn't I see this before?
If you need enough pressure so that the words "digging into" apply, you're using too much pressure.
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@spamcourt said:
Wait, weren't you the one who (rightfully) complained about PC games doing things that make them look like obvious console ports not integrated with the rest of the system? Like not setting the default resolution to a proper one?
Probably. What's your point?
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@blakeyrat said:
@Snooder said:
Every single other game on PC is better with a keyboard and mouse.
Skyrim isn't. What about Super Meat Boy? Rayman Origins?
There's shitloads of PC games that are better with a controller.
Skyrim can be argued either way. The mouse just lends it better to any sort of aiming with a bow/magic. It's only stuff like melee combos (power attack) where the controller has an edge. Then again, I play Skyrim on PS3 so I can't say for sure. I do remember Oblivion and Morrowind being mostly ok with mouse and keyboard though.
I sure as fuck wouldn't want to try to play Starcraft with a controller though. And even though you can technically play Dragon Age or Mass Effect with one, I'll stick to my mouse thanks.I think a lot of it, especially when it comes to Skyrim is that the mouse+keyboard is a better control scheme for RPGs because having more keys means you can switch between skills/spells much faster. And having games made objectively worse by simplifying the UI for consoles should make anyone sad.
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@blakeyrat said:
@Mason Wheeler said:
Eureka! It all makes sense now. You're telekinetic! That's the only theory that explains why you so consistently talk about how you can push something without putting physical pressure on it! Also, being telekinetic necessarily means that your brain is so advanced that I would be an idiot by comparison.
Why didn't I see this before?
If you need enough pressure so that the words "digging into" apply, you're using too much pressure.
Weren't you the one just talking about how "ordinary human beings" work? Because ordinary human beings, when they push on something that resists--such as the point where you've tilted the stick as far as it will go and it stops moving--tend to naturally push fairly hard without even noticing or thinking about it. It takes a concious act of will to push gently on something, which you don't have the time or concentration to focus on if you've got bullets and arrows and magic spells coming at you from three directions at once.
The people at Sony who built the Dual Shock understand this. That's why they created convex, padded thumbsticks that don't hurt your thumbs when you push hard (aka normally) against them. The folks at Microsoft... designed the Xbox 360 controller like a typical Microsoft product.
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@Snooder said:
sure as fuck wouldn't want to try to play Starcraft with a controller though. And even though you can technically play Dragon Age or Mass Effect with one, I'll stick to my mouse thanks.
I think a lot of it, especially when it comes to Skyrim is that the mouse+keyboard is a better control scheme for RPGs because having more keys means you can switch between skills/spells much faster. And having games made objectively worse by simplifying the UI for consoles should make anyone sad.
QFT.
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@Snooder said:
I sure as fuck wouldn't want to try to play Starcraft with a controller though. And even though you can technically play Dragon Age or Mass Effect with one, I'll stick to my mouse thanks.
You said "every single other game on PC". So keep moving those fucking goalposts.
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@Mason Wheeler said:
Weren't you the one just talking about how "ordinary human beings" work? Because ordinary human beings, when they push on something that resists--such as the point where you've tilted the stick as far as it will go and it stops moving--tend to naturally push fairly hard without even noticing or thinking about it.
So now you're admitting you push on the controller too hard and that's the source of all your problems.
Look, your argument "everybody does this" is demonstrably wrong. You're not even engaging your brain. Your debating technique here is weaker than a baby with rickets. Your lack of any kind of critical thinking and/or debating skill is making this curb-stomp battle so boring I think I'm about to fucking fall asleep.
Please either get your head in the game or fuck off and troll Slashdot or some other forum full of cretins.
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@Mason Wheeler said:
If your thumbs are getting all sweaty when you're playing video games, then you're obviously... umm... I don't even know what to say to that, actually.
Hands get sweaty. Are you sure you're human?
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@blakeyrat said:
@Mason Wheeler said:
Weren't you the one just talking about how "ordinary human beings" work? Because ordinary human beings, when they push on something that resists--such as the point where you've tilted the stick as far as it will go and it stops moving--tend to naturally push fairly hard without even noticing or thinking about it.
So now you're admitting you push on the controller too hard and that's the source of all your problems.
Again with the reading comprehension fail. The source of the problem is that pushing firmly ("too hard") is the normal human response, and the controller was not designed with this in mind.
Look, your argument "everybody does this" is demonstrably wrong.
Then could you please actually demonstrate what's wrong with it, instead of just contradicting what I say and declaring "therefore you're wrong because I said so." I feel like I'm talking with the Argument Clinic guy sometimes...
You're not even engaging your brain. Your debating technique here is weaker than a baby with rickets. Your lack of any kind of critical thinking and/or debating skill is making this curb-stomp battle so boring I think I'm about to fucking fall asleep.
You actually think you're making valid points and using good debating technique here? Hooray for the Dunning-Kruger effect, I guess...
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@dhromed said:
No. I'm a meat popsicle.@Mason Wheeler said:
If your thumbs are getting all sweaty when you're playing video games, then you're obviously... umm... I don't even know what to say to that, actually.
Hands get sweaty. Are you sure you're human?
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@blakeyrat said:
There's shitloads of PC games that are better with a controller.
I can never use controllers, though it's only very occasionally that I get to use one. I can't seem to grip them and press buttons at the same time, because of that dastardly fellow Newton. How do you push an analog stick forward in a relaxed manner without squeezing a trigger or shoulder button? I just don't know.
I suffer from poor PC ports, though. The merchant/crafting UI in AssCreed III takes the fucking cake, being pretty much unusable with M/K, but fortunately such Byzantian interaction schemes are rare, and it can't be called a problem.
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@dhromed said:
@Mason Wheeler said:
If your thumbs are getting all sweaty when you're playing video games, then you're obviously... umm... I don't even know what to say to that, actually.
Hands get sweaty. Are you sure you're human?
My hands get sweaty when I exert them, when I'm working with them. LIke last weekend when I went out to my grandparents' place to help harvest some fruit at their orchard.
When I'm playing video games and I get all tense or highly focused on something, I don't sweat. I do sometimes hold my breath without realizing it, and then suddenly my lungs are burning and I take a big gaspy breath, but I don't sweat.
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@Mason Wheeler said:
When I'm playing video games and I get all tense or highly focused on something, I don't sweat.
Well, then you should feel lucky! Sweaty palms under duress is rather annoying, and it's exacerbated when your hands are warm for whatever reason.
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@Mason Wheeler said:
When I'm playing video games and I get all tense or highly focused on something, I don't sweat. I do sometimes hold my breath without realizing it, and then suddenly my lungs are burning and I take a big gaspy breath, but I don't sweat.
That may be true, but if so you're pretty unique in that department. Believe me, most people get sweaty palms.
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@dhromed said:
@Mason Wheeler said:
When I'm playing video games and I get all tense or highly focused on something, I don't sweat.
Well, then you should feel lucky! Sweaty palms under duress is rather annoying, and it's exacerbated when your hands are warm for whatever reason.
Sometimes sweaty palms come in handy, though..
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Btw, something I've noticed about the 360 vs PS3 controller layout is that comfort depends a lot on how you prefer to hold the controller. Personally, I like the PS3 controller better. I cannot stand the asymmetrical analog sticks on the 360 controller, and it pisses me to no goddamn end that I have to install a 3rd-party hack to play any new games with my usb connected PS3 controller that windows recognizes just fine. Didn't use to be a problem until about 2009, when I could rely on most controllers from a reputable source like sony or logitech being compatible. But suddenly the only controller that triple-A devs will allow is the 360 controller. Meh.
Anyway, rant aside, I've noticed that people who like the 360 controller tend to hold their controllers with the balls of their thumbs resting in the center of the analog stick and their fingers on the outside of the controller. While people who like the PS3 controller put their fingers on the bottom of the controller and rest the ball of their thumb against the bottom slope of the analog stick. Which is why converting to the opposite controller format is so disconcerting.
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@Snooder said:
Btw, something I've noticed about the 360 vs PS3 controller layout is that comfort depends a lot on how you prefer to hold the controller. Personally, I like the PS3 controller better. I cannot stand the asymmetrical analog sticks on the 360 controller, and it pisses me to no goddamn end that I have to install a 3rd-party hack to play any new games with my usb connected PS3 controller that windows recognizes just fine. Didn't use to be a problem until about 2009, when I could rely on most controllers from a reputable source like sony or logitech being compatible. But suddenly the only controller that triple-A devs will allow is the 360 controller. Meh.
That's not a "meh," actually, that's Microsoft deliberately sabotaging the industry. A prime example of Fire and Motion in action.
Once upon a time, there used to be a standard method for controller input on Windows, called DirectInput. It worked really well, and plenty of hardware companies made devices that worked with it, and plenty of game companies made games that worked with DirectInput devices, and everyone was happy.
Then MIcrosoft got into the gaming hardware business, and built a controller that not only worked with the Xbox 360, but with the PC as well. And suddenly they realized that this was a problem for them. If anyone and everyone could produce DirectInput controllers that worked fine for everyone, how would they end up selling Xbox 360 controllers?
So they went and deprecated DirectInput and proclaimed a new API called XInput to be The New Standard. And you can guess exactly which devices support XInput. They've got a bunch of hurdles in the way of third-party controller compatibility for XInput, up to and including a non-standard USB protocol!
And of course game developers fell for it, because DirectInput was officially deprecated, and it was a little bit simpler to only have to code against one piece of hardware. (The arguments in favor based on that tend to sound suspiciously similar to the crap that Apple fanboys love to trot out about how Android device "fragmentation" makes Androids hard to code against and drives everyone away from Android, as if Android wasn't taking over the world right now and iOS hadn't been hemorrhaging market share for years now. Just saying.)
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Go back to Slashdot.
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@blakeyrat said:
Super Meat Boy
Isn't that the game where the developer embedded a connection string (including credentials of course) to a database where the game would upload your scores? And someone extracted said connection string from the binary, told the dev what an idiot he was and would he please fix it, and when the dev refused, said someone proceeded to fill the scores DB with garbage scores and levels?
Edit: Yep.
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@Arnavion said:
Edit: Yep.
@Team Meat said:
Trust me, it’s fine. I’ve done this stuff for a while now
Heh.
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@PJH said:
@Arnavion said:
@Team Meat said:Edit: Yep.
@Team Meat said:
Trust me, it’s fine. I’ve done this stuff for a while now
Heh.You're not showing me anything I don't already know.
. . . and we have nightly backups of the database.
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@El_Heffe said:
@PJH said:
@Arnavion said:
@Team Meat said:Edit: Yep.
@Team Meat said:
Trust me, it’s fine. I’ve done this stuff for a while now
Heh.You're not showing me anything I don't already know.
. . . and we have nightly backups of the database.
@Homestar Runner said:Hey, Strong Bad, I brought back your fondue pot.
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@CodeNinja said:
Right or wrong,
Fucking sexist gamers.
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I'm of the opinion that the almost 20-year-old (base) design of the Playstation controllers desparately needs an overhaul, and not just turning it into a boomerang.
The first PSX controller was awesome. I remember reading an article in Next Generation that briefly went over the design process of it. Making sure it was weight balanced - adding the wings to counter-balance the triggers, testing scenarios where you would be constantly putting down and picking up the controller (they used an RPG as example for that). Making sure the buttons had the right amount of give and responsiveness.
That being said, I'm glad Sony went back to concave sticks. Their first analog controller, the Dual Analog, had them, but they were hard plastic.
I guess it's a love it or hate it thing. Just like this thing:
(loved it, aside from the stick)
