The Star Wars VIIIIIII: The Force Awakens FRIDGE LOGIC THREAD **NOW DEFINITELY SPOILERS**
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I thought they found the kids early and began training them before they got bad habits.
The old Jedi did that. In the EU, which doesn't count any more, Luke spent years trying to rebuild the Jedi and he did things differently but I don't remember the details.
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The old Jedi did that.
Yeah, that was my point, which I thought contradicted what Lorne said.
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@Lorne_Kates said:
The establishing shots they showed of the planet and the cities implied it was heavily, heavily populated-- like, jammed packed full populated like whateverthefuck the city-planet was that Anakin moved to and had that jump-on-cars fight scene. I can't tell these fucking Star Wars planets apart.
boomzilla:
It would make sense for that one to have been Coruscant, as that was the seat of power for the Old Republic and then the Empire. You wouldn't just build up a new city that covered an entire planet in just the couple of decades or so between 6 and 7, especially if you already had one.
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But it didn't seem to encompass the entire galaxy, or at least, there were places that were probably Republic only in name (e.g., Tatooine). Likely that TFO grew up out there and coalesced as some sort of insurgency.
This seems to make sense--or it's a smaller, rump Empire. In the EU that's what happened--the Empire retreated to the Inner Rim and, while never technically ending the war against the Republic, reached somewhat of a detente that lasted out to approximately 40 years past the original movie and only ended with a galactic invasion. At that point the Republic and Empire essentially merged. Of course all that now has unhappened, but TFO could be similar.
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I recall the general dude talking about using the weapon for the purpose of getting rid of the Senate.
Right but without knowing the motive we don't know WHY he wanted to get rid of the Senate.
Saying "I can finally get rid of the Senate!" doesn't imply the Senate is some terrible threat to him. He might have been saying it like a person would say, "I can finally get rid of those little red ants in my garden!"
@Lorne_Kates said:
Sorry, next time I'll
I just thought it was funny. God knows I've been ass-pulling a lot of shit in this topic, too.
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Go fuck yourself.
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Right but without knowing the motive we don't know WHY he wanted to get rid of the Senate.
Saying "I can finally get rid of the Senate!" doesn't imply the Senate is some terrible threat to him. He might have been saying it like a person would say, "I can finally get rid of those little red ants in my garden!"
It obviously isn't some terrible threat, or the world wouldn't need the Rebellion. Nevertheless, it's an enemy that he feels the need to destroy. Presumably because the Republic's legitimacy stands in the way of TFO being in charge of everything.
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Maybe some dude in the Republic is the one who threw acid at Sloth from the Goonies' face.
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@FrostCat said:
The old Jedi did that.
Yeah, that was my point, which I thought contradicted what Lorne said.
That was Boomzilla's point. It contradicted what I said. I'll leave my weapon on the floor.
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It would make sense for that one to have been Coruscant, as that was the seat of power for the Old Republic and then the Empire.
Yeah, that one. In which case, you'd think Leia would be extra pissed at it being blowed up, since her mother moved to Coruscant. So she probably has a bunch of, I dunno-- family homes or some shit there?
Never mind, some googlecheating says it's the "Hosnian System", which is just another made up planet-thing. So fuck them.
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@Lorne_Kates said:
Never mind, some googlecheating says it's the "Hosnian System", which is just another made up planet-thing. So fuck them.
So upthread I mentioned that I'd read that Disney released some other materials with extra information other than the movie, and my stalker claimed that was bull because I couldn't instantly provide proof. Well, conveniently, Wookiepedia provides that.
From http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Lor_San_Tekka, we see that there were two children's books released on 12/18, Before the Awakening, and Finn & The First Order. Both of them at least mention Lor.
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Go fuck yourself.
Ah, trying to distract people from noticing you were wrong again? My, my, you're such a predictable stalker. Who's also a liar[1] who won't admit it.
[1] Ironically I am using your bullshit made-up and wrong definition of the word here.
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And, given the size and resources required to build it, the weapon is impossible to build in secret (it is literally visible when you look at the planet through a telescope).
That's silly, you know. Space is big. Really big. If the inhabited planets are usually 25 light years apart in that patch of space (not an unreasonable assumption; you build that sort of thing somewhere quiet) nobody with a telescope anywhere else has got the slightest chance to spot anything until 25 years after the fact. And they'll need an awesomely good telescope to do it; a planet is really rather difficult to see at all at that sort of distance. Much easier to send a probe by superluminal travel. But would you bother to do that to an ordinary barely-habitable world unless you suspected something was going on?
Nobody seeing anything ahead of time is actually obvious.
Nobody noticing the economic impact of a construction project that scale, now that is hard to believe. Or if that's ordinary enough to be not noticeable, then building a new planet-wide city in not much longer is also plausible. But then the economics of Star Wars has always been dodgy…
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nobody with a telescope anywhere else has got the slightest chance to spot anything until 25 years after the fact.
I want a new Star Trek series about a bunch of futureistic anoraks who spend all their time watching starships go into warp years after the starship arrived. They have timetables and hand-done astrophysics calculations and meet every other week at the local pond to trade spottings.
"Ooo, I saw the U.S.S. Fountains of Wayne leaving the Beetleguise system on Stardate 47714.6."
"Did I tell you this one time I tracked a Bird of Prey leaving Cronos, and timed it so I saw it depart the same time a Bajoran Freighter carrying Klingon Ale arrived?"
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At one point, a flight of X-Wings is attacking a ground facility. They strafe it, using whatever the X-Wing equivalent of 30mm cannon is I suppose, and then loop around for another pass. The Rebel's best pilot, Poe, then says: "come around for another bombing run." Uh, you didn't drop any bombs, idiot. The SFX guys forgot to read the script? And note, we know that X-Wings are capable of dropping at least one photon-torpedo-like explosive device as seen in Star Wars (1977).
Majorly
ed I'm sure, but they fired proton torps. The projectiles were blue, not red. And they were fired from the center of the fighter.Bombing run has been established by not-movie-canon (namely games) as including proton torpedo runs so... I guess that counts?
Why were there no Y-Wings though? Or A or B wings for that matter? K and E are EU so they don't exist any more, but this looks like a perfect mission for the old-as-sin Y-Wings
Also, +1 for not-Tattooine
Otherwise, yeah, pretty much agree with the review.
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EXACTLY! This fucking Abrams guy HAS NO CONCEPTION of how fucking huge interplanetary space is
That was my immediate thought too...
Those planets are so close together they might be able to see a structure on another planet like the Great Wall with the naked eye.
That's covered by my not wanting to talk about the mechanics of the weapon
It's simple.
Someone came in and said, Death Star but 20% cooler, and in case people go "huh?" we'll lampshade it in the same conversation.
(it is literally visible when you look at the planet through a telescope).
Naked eye even.
Verdict: Better than I, not as good as III, nowhere near IV-VI.
Agreed.
It felt more like the Hunger Games in space, as far as the acting, filmography, and dialogue.
BTW there's a rumor that Disney's casting for "Untitled Han Solo Film".
Marvel universe.... it would be a 52 episode TV series.
Can't fathom why
Because they played it safe.... real safe.
might be just there to earn his trust and then snatch the robot?
Whiny is not an empire's idea of double agent.
But.... I've been proven wrong before.
This was the best use of 3d I watched since Avatar.
The falcon backflip.
LOLOL... typical Disney 3d gimmickery.
When you watch a movie in 2d, and know when they put in an effect for 3d, you're doing it wrong.
I think it could have more lightsaber fighting and force power usage.
I felt that the force was stupidly weak.
Given, you couldn't have Kylo be too powerful in the force, but even that red horned guy could have batted Kylo around. Kylo, who was trained by a dark side master and luke.
I mean, if the point is that he's weak and whiney, why the hell is the master dude even caring about him. It's almost as if he's got a hard-on for the kid.
"Wah.... I'm too weak. She was powerful in the force... wah."
"He's right. CO guy, it's your fault."
"The hell. He left the droid because he wanted to flaunt his failure of a power. How can you stand this guy"
"He has beautiful hair?"
Rey might know more about how to use The Force than Luke did.
That goes out with the whole "The force isn't a myth" conversation.
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@Lorne_Kates said:
I want a new Star Trek series about a bunch of futureistic anoraks who spend all their time watc
... like... aliens who look like jackets?
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Majorly
ed I'm sure, but they fired proton torps. The projectiles were blue, not red. And they were fired from the center of the fighter.WELL THEY WERE RED IN THE OTHER MOVIE! SO THEREFORE SHUT UP!!!
Why were there no Y-Wings though? Or A or B wings for that matter?
Who knows.
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WELL THEY WERE RED IN THE OTHER MOVIE! SO THEREFORE SHUT UP!!!
Well uh...
Damn, yeah, you're right on that one.
Still though, they were something other than just plain blaster cannons. Maybe proton torpedos++ or concussion missiles?
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Also see: Luke put R2D2 in sleep mode before leaving. Ok. But... why/how did R2 decide to wake up at exactly that moment? Was he on a timer? Or was he reacting to events? But he was in a closet, so. Also why not give R2 the ENTIRE map instead of just like 85% of it? R2 was safe the entire film in the Rebel's main base, a hell of a lot safer than that old guy who inexplicably had it at the beginning of the film. (Were we supposed to recognize him? I mean as a character; obviously it was Max Von Sydow.)
Viable plot option:
Luke may have turned R2 on remotely. (Force powah or whatever)He sensed Han Solo's death/Rey's force sensitivity/"defeat " of Ren/something else and turned R2 on because "it's my time to return" or something. Seems feasible to me (and handwaves all the sensor stuff out, he just added in a force sensitive switch - hell or even a plain old remote button thing) and makes sense since the immediate result is "Luke gets found"
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They just happened to augment their uniform fleet with some random truck that's available to the general public?
Well according to extended (not EU) canon, there's precedent for that.
Hell, the Nebulon B Frigate (Made by KDY, the same guys that made Imperator Star Destroyers and the old Venator SDs) was an Imperial escort frigate that became basically a staple of the Rebellion in the GCW era.
Maybe ACME space freighters just does a really damn good job of making space freighters, so both the
EmpireFirst Order and Han bought a ship from them.Or hell, maybe Han just stole one. It's not like he's never done that before
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... like... aliens who look like jackets?
"anorak" is one of those weird britslang words. You're supposed to be thinking here of trainspotting nerds.
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WELL THEY WERE RED IN THE OTHER MOVIE! SO THEREFORE SHUT UP!!!
Shoulda watched the movie with closed captioning. There was a footnote to the effect that there was a manufacturing change that led to the other color.
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There was a footnote to the effect that there was a manufacturing change that led to the other color.
Talking about this stuff as if it's real.
"Hey let's do blue this time."
"How do we excuse that?"
"A footnote in closed captioning. So blakey won't see it. I love pranking that guy".
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Shoulda watched the movie with closed captioning. There was a footnote to the effect that there was a manufacturing change that led to the other color.
Wait wtf seriously?
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The falcon backflip.
LOLOL... typical Disney 3d gimmickery.
When you watch a movie in 2d, and know when they put in an effect for 3d, you're doing it wrong.
If you watched it only in 2d, I won't argue about it's use of 3d with you. Many 3d movies I watched had like 2min of 3d in the beginning of the movie, and the rest in 2d, that was doing it wrong. The backflip didn't feature much 3dness afaik.
Given, you couldn't have Kylo be too powerful in the force, but even that red horned guy could have batted Kylo around. Kylo, who was trained by a dark side master and luke.
I mean, if the point is that he's weak and whiney, why the hell is the master dude even caring about him. It's almost as if he's got a hard-on for the kid.
Kylo was weakened because of his encounter with Han. He was tempted by the light side of the force and hesitated, then he got hit by a blaster. He wasn't in his best shape.
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... like... aliens who look like jackets?
It's apparently British slang. Someone who wears an anorak, and spends all their time looking at train schedules. It's like identifying a hipster douchbag by their fedora, I guess.
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Re: upthread somewhere-- someone asked if the sun would go dark after sucking up the outer layer.
Yeah, I can see that happening. If the FuckyouStar is pulling off the outer layers-- which is basically just a whole bunch of output of a whole bunch of nuclear explosions-- then the inner layer would just be massively compressed matter. There wouldn't be anything asploding. No energy output == no light.
Once the weapon fired and released the sun, normal asplosions would resume. The sun would brighten again. Who knows how long it would actually take. Not sure what the timeline was between blowing up Not Courecant and the third act.
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If you watched it only in 2d, I won't argue about it's use of 3d with you. Many 3d movies I watched had like 2min of 3d in the beginning of the movie, and the rest in 2d, that was doing it wrong. The backflip didn't feature much 3dness afaik.
I thought the 3D was decent. I didn't see Avatar that way, though, so I can't compare to that. My only real complaint about it was that occasionally there'd be something like a bit of wall or tree or whatever that snuck in front of the intended foreground way on one side of the screen. I recall it happening a few times and it was really distracting.
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@Lorne_Kates said:
Yeah, I can see that happening. If the FuckyouStar is pulling off the outer layers-- which is basically just a whole bunch of output of a whole bunch of nuclear explosions-- then the inner layer would just be massively compressed matter. There wouldn't be anything asploding. No energy output == no light.
Hmmm....supposedly it takes 10,000 years or something for the energy release from fusion at the core of our sun to make it out as light.
@Lorne_Kates said:
Once the weapon fired and released the sun, normal asplosions would resume.
I guess it depends on how much mass you took out whether there was still enough to continue fusion. If you took enough away to stop it, I'd think there'd still be a delay from the time it stopped to the time it stopped giving off visible light. And maybe there'd be enough heat there to tear it apart altogether if you took out the mass quickly enough.
/NeilDeGrassJerkOff
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I guess it depends on how much mass you took out whether there was still enough to continue fusion. If you took enough away to stop it, I'd think there'd still be a delay from the time it stopped to the time it stopped giving off visible light. And maybe there'd be enough heat there to tear it apart altogether if you took out the mass quickly enough.
Unless you used The Force to hold it together and re-ignite it afterwards.
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@Lorne_Kates said:
Unless you used The Force to hold it together and re-ignite it afterwards.
Sounds dangerous. Better make sure you do it from the dark side of the sun.
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@Lorne_Kates said:
It's apparently British slang.
You're the one who typed it, and you don't know what it means? What hope did I have!
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Viable plot option:Luke may have turned R2 on remotely. (Force powah or whatever)
He sensed Han Solo's death/Rey's force sensitivity/"defeat " of Ren/something else and turned R2 on because "it's my time to return" or something. Seems feasible to me (and handwaves all the sensor stuff out, he just added in a force sensitive switch - hell or even a plain old remote button thing) and makes sense since the immediate result is "Luke gets found"
I'm still thinking one of:a) ding ding ding, timer expired, alarm goes off;
b) oops, battery low, better go find a power socket.. Hey what's going on?
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You're the one who typed it, and you don't know what it means? What hope did I have!
I knew exactly what it meant, I didn't realize how localized it was.
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Kylo was weakened because of his encounter with Han. He was tempted by the light side of the force and hesitated, then he got hit by a blaster. He wasn't in his best shape.
The Kylo character was for the most part, fine.
I just felt like there were three times his acting could have been worlds better.
The immediate moment after stabbing Han. Leading up to this moment, it was great. Immediately after, I just wasn't convinced.
The interrogation scene. I felt that the computer trashing, though immature, was perfectly fine for a dark-side villain, but the interrogation turned him into a crybaby. I was immediately annoyed. Like Jar Jar annoyed.
The end of the last fight. This guy is really good at building up tension, and then flopping. That's all. I don't know if it's him or the director.
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@Lorne_Kates said:
I knew exactly what it meant, I didn't realize how localized it was.
Oh; so you don't know what the word "apparently" means. Gotcha.
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@Lorne_Kates said:
I knew exactly what it meant, I didn't realize how localized it was.
Oh; so you don't know what the word "apparently" means. Gotcha.
What's wrong with the way he used it?
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Well maybe I'm wrong on this one, but I read "apparently" as "I'm guessing as to the meaning of this". Like you've determined the meaning based on usage and educated guesses. Not the literal, "it is apparent that it means...".
Whatever.
Just need people to stop speaking gibberish.
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Well maybe I'm wrong on this one, but I read "apparently" as "I'm guessing as to the meaning of this".
Yeah, in that formulation, he guess that it was a widely understood bit of slang, but it turned out to be more localized than he thought. You can tell how confused he is by how he used a 'z' in localized.
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he used a 'z' in localized.
Wait a second, yeah! He's mixing Brit with non-Brit! No wonder I was confused.
https://twitter.com/Niyx/status/681869027409555456
(Inscrutable British tweet from yesterday morning. Pretty sure they don't mean Chinook helicopters?)
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(Inscrutable British tweet from yesterday morning. Pretty sure they don't mean Chinook helicopters?)
Fuck knows. It might've been a reference to them, as some helicopters (of type I don't know) have been used to provide relief to some communities hit by recent flooding. It might have also been a snide reference to our Beloved Political Leadership™ and their tendency to focus on photoshoots over actually fixing anything.
But it's twitter so it isn't like it matters in the first place.
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Someone told me later that "wellies" are Wellington boots. So there's a tiny bit of the mystery solved.
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I guess it could also be the Dukes of Wellington, but that would be really quite unlikely. They've not really been very relevant since the early 19th century.
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2 Spoilers Below
[spoiler]Han Solo and Princess Leia have one child and they are failing at parenting.[/spoiler]
[spoiler]Uncle Luke also failing at recognizing child has Anakin's genes in him.[/spoiler]
[spoiler]Han Solo is dead in the movie's end.[/spoiler]
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Spoiler from Episode 8th
[spoiler]Rey is Luke's ILLEGITIMATE DAUGHTER![/spoiler]
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The guy who did Star Wars prequels fanfiction made a cool video with episode 8 predictions.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HHD9L_vcBy0
To summarize:
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Kylo Ren turns good, Ray turns evil
Cool, but no way in hell this will happen. Not to our perfect Marry Sue hero. -
Luke Skywalker is supreme leader Snoke
Even cooler, but not likely. After killing Han, I bet they'll be very careful in their treatment of Luke. -
Snoke is Palpetine's old master. Also the guy who "impregnated" Vader's mom, making him the grandfather of the entire Skywalker bloodline.
More likely than the other two, but they would have to bring in midichoriens back, which is the third rail of Star Wars at this point.
I personally think that all these are way too interesting for Disney's Star Wars. You can't have that sort of instability in a predictable, profit-churning franchise they are hoping to create. What we'll likely get is a traditional, safe space romp, with no major surprises, other than the new toys being introduced.
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tl;dw; but I'll comment on your comments...
Kylo Ren turns good, Ray turns evil
Cool, but no way in hell this will happen. Not to our perfect Marry Sue hero.Probably, but she has to be seriously tempted, with the outcome in doubt.
You can't have that sort of instability in a predictable, profit-churning franchise they are hoping to create.
Maybe. OTOH, if you look at what they've done with the Once Upon a Time TV franchise, they've seriously changed a lot of characters. Peter Pan and King Arthur as bad guys, Big Bad Wolf is Red Riding Hood, redemption for Captain Hook and Snow White's stepmother and Queen Ursula, Rumpelstiltskin redeemed multiple times but it never sticks. Very soap opera. So they might be able to do the same with space opera.
I think my favorite character portrayal was for Cruella de Vil while at the same time putting her character in there was really awful. Maleficent is the mirror image. They couldn't leave out the character but the actress was the absolute worst.
LMGTFY - Let Me Google That For You
