Tales from Coronavee-rooss Italy, mamma mia!
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The context of the answer, for anyone wondering.
https://www.reddit.com/r/AskMen/comments/jwecpn/my_husband_says_he_doesnt_need_to_change_his/
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@loopback0 said in Tales from Coronavee-rooss Italy, mamma mia!:
The context of the answer, for anyone wondering.
https://www.reddit.com/r/AskMen/comments/jwecpn/my_husband_says_he_doesnt_need_to_change_his/
Nope thread is ...
Sorry, didn’t make it that far.
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@topspin You're welcome
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The Nope thread is
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@Gąska Disappointed they didn't "accidentally" have to remove the second one.
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@Gąska enough internet for today. (And it just started)
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@Zerosquare said in Tales from Coronavee-rooss Italy, mamma mia!:
So a bunch of vaccines with unusually strong effectiveness is slightly less effective in Asian and African populations? Seems it'll probably be good enough for herdish immunity anyway then.
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If all goes well, probably. But it's not the first time I've heard that such a thing happens in pharmaceuticals development.
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@Zerosquare It's been said many times the demographics in the tests tend to be skewed and then of course the medication might work worse for some without it being noticed. What would be interesting is an honest analysis for why the demographic tends to be skewed.
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@Bulb said in Tales from Coronavee-rooss Italy, mamma mia!:
What would be interesting is an honest analysis for why the demographic tends to be skewed.
ISTM the most likely answer is that it probably tends to represent the demographic of the region in which the test is conducted and/or the people willing to participate in the test, because those are the people available, rather than the population of the world as a whole. If there are few people of a particular ethnicity in the region (say, not many Africans in China), they are going to be underrepresented in the study.
This isn't the Garage, so I won't discuss how racism and/or anti-racism might affect the choice of study participants.
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@HardwareGeek said in Tales from Coronavee-rooss Italy, mamma mia!:
ISTM the most likely answer is that it probably tends to represent the demographic of the region in which the test is conducted and/or the people willing to participate in the test, because those are the people available, rather than the population of the world as a whole. If there are few people of a particular ethnicity in the region (say, not many Africans in China), they are going to be underrepresented in the study.
Pretty much this, combined with the fact that a lot of drug development likes to work with university students, specifically medics and pharmacists, as adverse reactions there are less likely to kill them and their professors can effectively order them to take part. I guess that's a bit less of an issue with Stage 3 trials (the ones used to design the standard treatment plans) as those have to be pretty large to start picking up on rare effects. That's also why they're expensive (and the reason they've gone fast this time is that there's plenty of patients in a pandemic).
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@dkf said in Tales from Coronavee-rooss Italy, mamma mia!:
and the reason they've gone fast this time is that there's plenty of patients in a pandemic
We are talking about vaccines, so patients don't help. But with the general panic there are many people scared of the disease and therefore willing to try an experimental vaccine.
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@Bulb said in Tales from Coronavee-rooss Italy, mamma mia!:
@dkf said in Tales from Coronavee-rooss Italy, mamma mia!:
and the reason they've gone fast this time is that there's plenty of patients in a pandemic
We are talking about vaccines, so patients don't help. But with the general panic there are many people scared of the disease and therefore willing to try an experimental vaccine.
And the fact that plenty of governments have thrown a lot of money at the whole development process up front, instead of the researchers to grind for it over years.
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@dkf said in Tales from Coronavee-rooss Italy, mamma mia!:
their professors can effectively order them to take part.
Wait. Isn't that a massive ethics violation?
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@Zerosquare Eh, it's academia. Students exist for the purpose of being mistreated and abused.
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@HardwareGeek said in Tales from Coronavee-rooss Italy, mamma mia!:
@Zerosquare Eh, it academia. Students exist for the purpose of being mistreated and abused.
Over here, we need to go through a metric ton of bureaucracy to even put a VR headset onto somebody in a study (and after doing that, we got called out by outside reviewers for not documenting that we did the ethics paperwork).
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@HardwareGeek said in Tales from Coronavee-rooss Italy, mamma mia!:
@Zerosquare Eh, it academia. Students exist for the purpose of being mistreated and abused.
I know an assistant professor at a big university. His comments about students have caused me to remark to him to the effect that he would fit in nicely at Unseen University.
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@Bulb said in Tales from Coronavee-rooss Italy, mamma mia!:
We are talking about vaccines, so patients don't help.
Not that already have the disease, of course, but the incidence of exposure needs to be high enough that you can be sure that the protective effect is present from the fact that they're not getting sick when the control group is getting sick. Or you can use biomarkers in the blood if you know exactly what to look for. You also want to have many different groups as you get deeper into Stage 3 trials that you can work out treatment strategies: what size of dose should be actually given, and exactly how?
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@Gurth said in Tales from Coronavee-rooss Italy, mamma mia!:
he would fit in nicely at Unseen University
… which always was a thinly veiled parody of universities in this world, so duh, yes. And we pretend to not be wiz(z)ards.
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@Zerosquare said in Tales from Coronavee-rooss Italy, mamma mia!:
@dkf said in Tales from Coronavee-rooss Italy, mamma mia!:
their professors can effectively order them to take part.
Wait. Isn't that a massive ethics violation?
Back when I took psych courses in college, I had to participate in a certain number of studies to pass the class. But these were rather bland psych studies, not "let's mix this substance in with your biochemistry and see what happens!"
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It still consider it unethical. The fact that it's for psychology classes is even worse - they can't claim ignorance of psychology and ethics as an excuse.
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@Zerosquare I'm assuming that the mandatory studies weren't the Stanford Prison Experiment
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I hope so!
But it's pretty hypocritical to teach students that coercing people into participating is both unethical and a cause of results bias, while doing that exact same thing to them.
(I know the usual reply is "but if we didn't use psych students, we wouldn't have enough people for studies!". I don't consider that a valid excuse.)
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@PotatoEngineer you're supposed to give an alternative to participating in studies, like writing a short paper or something, to earn that credit. But, "supposed to"
!=
"actually do"...
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Meanwhile, in Italy...
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@boomzilla said in Tales from Coronavee-rooss Italy, mamma mia!:
Meanwhile, in Italy...
That's crazy.
I live in a pretend 3-BR with 5 other people and a dog. I've gone out and just sat on the benches in the median of Broadway.
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@Zerosquare said in Tales from Coronavee-rooss Italy, mamma mia!:
Can't read all of it, but Sweden has had a "ban" on large gatherings with variations in the size restrictions since April or so. With distance restrictions in restaurants between different groups of guests.
Not much has changed. People still do pretty much what they've been doing all year. Apart from the winter rains having started so people for the most part stay indoors.Looks like we've peaked the new infections as well, so we should probably be back to slow burn in February, even without vaccines.
Nothing that has been done had had much of an effect on the infection rates.
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@Carnage said in Tales from Coronavee-rooss Italy, mamma mia!:
@Zerosquare said in Tales from Coronavee-rooss Italy, mamma mia!:
Can't read all of it, but Sweden has had a "ban" on large gatherings with variations in the size restrictions since April or so. With distance restrictions in restaurants between different groups of guests.
Not much has changed. People still do pretty much what they've been doing all year. Apart from the winter rains having started so people for the most part stay indoors.Looks like we've peaked the new infections as well, so we should probably be back to slow burn in February, even without vaccines.
Nothing that has been done had had much of an effect on the infection rates.
Looks to be the full article:
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@Carnage said in Tales from Coronavee-rooss Italy, mamma mia!:
Not much has changed. People still do pretty much what they've been doing all year. Apart from the winter rains having started so people for the most part stay indoors.
Looks like we've peaked the new infections as well, so we should probably be back to slow burn in February, even without vaccines.If people are staying indoors, what matters is which indoors they are staying in. If they're mostly staying at home, infection numbers should decrease. If they're staying in but in places like work and shops… it depends a lot on how well they mask up. And (at least round here) a lot of people just can't seen to figure out how to wear a mask or why wearing one actually is something that they should do. Not even as patients in a doctor's surgery…
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@dkf said in Tales from Coronavee-rooss Italy, mamma mia!:
@Carnage said in Tales from Coronavee-rooss Italy, mamma mia!:
Not much has changed. People still do pretty much what they've been doing all year. Apart from the winter rains having started so people for the most part stay indoors.
Looks like we've peaked the new infections as well, so we should probably be back to slow burn in February, even without vaccines.If people are staying indoors, what matters is which indoors they are staying in. If they're mostly staying at home, infection numbers should decrease. If they're staying in but in places like work and shops… it depends a lot on how well they mask up. And (at least round here) a lot of people just can't seen to figure out how to wear a mask or why wearing one actually is something that they should do. Not even as patients in a doctor's surgery…
I see perhaps one or two people with masks on per week.
And people are still going to restaurants, bars, gyms, shops and pretty much everything else that normal life entails.
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@dkf said in Tales from Coronavee-rooss Italy, mamma mia!:
a lot of people just can't seen to figure out how to wear a mask
I remember a government spokesperson who got roasted back in March when she said to justify not recommending mask-wearing that wearing one properly was hard. I always agreed with her (on that specific point), and now everyone else does, but at the time she was made into a symbol of stupidity and treating people as children because "how hard is it to wear a mask?"
(though to be fair, she was stupid because of many other things she said, and because she tried to mask the lack of masks with this argument, which no-one was buying, and it would have been far more honest at the time to admit that there was a lack of mask, but that doesn't mean that her other argument wasn't valid)
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@dkf said in Tales from Coronavee-rooss Italy, mamma mia!:
If they're staying in but in places like work and shops… it depends a lot on how well they mask up.
Does it? Evidence for masks making any difference at all is conspicuously completely missing.
@dkf said in Tales from Coronavee-rooss Italy, mamma mia!:
And (at least round here) a lot of people just can't seen to figure out how to wear a mask or why wearing one actually is something that they should do.
The answer to the second part is easy here: because it is mandatory inside, and outside where there many people around. And most people do. Did not seem to have much effect when it was ordered.
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Sweden has put out new, harsh regulations (more like sternly worded recommendations since there is no policing of it) now that the hospitals are all "overwhelmed" all over the nation. In short; "Don't snuggle strangers." and "Don't socialize if you have symptoms!"
Some harsh rules there.
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This post is deleted!
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@lolwhat Hm, quick search reveals a clinical trial, but while it should be complete, it does not have any results posted.
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157 year old restaurant closes permanently due, in part, to COVID dining restrictions. I haven't actually read TFA to determine the proportion of blame for the closure.
Edit: I read TFA. It and other sources give varying details, but it seems the contract issue is the biggest factor; bleeding money from the forced COVID closure just exacerbated the problem.
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@HardwareGeek Bummer. I really liked that place (when we could get in since visiting SF was always a 'where do we want to go now?' kind of day). A bit expensive, but really good food.
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@HardwareGeek said in Tales from Coronavee-rooss Italy, mamma mia!:
@dcon said in Tales from Coronavee-rooss Italy, mamma mia!:
@HardwareGeek Bummer.
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@Gąska Different article, in case you're actually confused
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@hungrier I know, it just looks funny.
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Again at my ENT's office, my temperature measured too low for 5 or so times.
Finally 96.7 was accepted.If it reads that low, how many actual fevers do they miss?
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@Karla in moments like this, I start wondering who was doing calibration and what was their real goal.
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@Gąska said in Tales from Coronavee-rooss Italy, mamma mia!:
@Karla in moments like this, I start wondering who was doing calibration and what was their real goal.
Well, it does probably reduce false-positives.
My temp does run low. But I've never had a doctor be concerned.