Where is Mexico?
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@boomzilla said in Where is Mexico?:
@admiral_p said in Where is Mexico?:
@remi Italian wiki states that the UN includes Mexico in Central America. I remember teachers telling me that Mexico was Central American (and after all Mesoamerica, which comprises large parts of Mexico, basically means Middle America - which, as a definition, goes from Mexico to Ecuador and maybe Colombia). Still it appears Mexicans are really sensitive about being classed as Central American, much more than Hungarians being classed as Eastern Europeans instead of Central Europeans.
Culturally, politically and ethnically that makes sense. Just not from a physical geography / plate tectonic POV.
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@Gąska said in Where is Mexico?:
@Gurth said in Where is Mexico?:
@Gąska Probably not by strict definition, but in common speech, a “foo bar” is a bar that’s distinguished from other bars by being foo. A “red car" is a car that’s red, a “Daily
” is a that’s Daily, a “dwarf planet” is a planet that’s dwarf(-like).A guinea pig is a pig from Guinea, a pineapple is an apple with pines, a firewall is a wall of fire...
That’s a straw man, but not a very good one because they still demonstrate the same principle as I was talking about. It’s just that you deliberately picked examples in which the name isn’t chosen well in the first place for the first two. The third, if you’re talking about a computer firewall, then it’s entirely metaphorical; however, a real firewall is a wall meant to keep out fire, but because “keeping-out-fire-wall” is cumbersome, it’s shortened to a word that still indicates it’s a wall to do with fire.
@da-Doctah said in Where is Mexico?:
However, an Attorney General is not a general who is attorney, but an attorney who is general.
And there's no martial that is court.
That’s because both of these are French loanwords, or constructed along French lines, where the adjective comes after the noun and not before it like in Germanic languages. Still the same principle, though.
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@ben_lubar said in Where is Mexico?:
After an argument with someone who uses the new definition of "continents", under which Cuba is part of North America instead of an offshore island (as it was when a continent was defined as "all the places you can walk to without your hat floating away"), I realized I'm not a native of North America.
See, I was born in southern California. West of the San Andreas fault. And lived there for the first ten years of my life. So I'm actually from the same continent as Obama.
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@da-Doctah said in Where is Mexico?:
a continent was defined as "all the places you can walk to without your hat floating away"
That’s the mindset that gave us Brexit.
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@da-Doctah said in Where is Mexico?:
See, I was born in southern California. West of the San Andreas fault. And lived there for the first ten years of my life.
Same here, except for almost 30 years, and I've lived most of the rest on crumbly bits along the east side that could, maybe, get stuck to the west side and get dragged north with it.
So I'm actually from the same continent as Obama.
Condolences.
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@Gąska said in Where is Mexico?:
@Gurth said in Where is Mexico?:
@Gąska Probably not by strict definition, but in common speech, a “foo bar” is a bar that’s distinguished from other bars by being foo. A “red car" is a car that’s red, a “Daily
” is a that’s Daily, a “dwarf planet” is a planet that’s dwarf(-like).A guinea pig is a pig from Guinea, a pineapple is an apple with pines, a firewall is a wall of fire...
I always sensed that "guinea pig" was an official name that was sort of a joke, and not to be taken strictly literally. In other words, a proper name rather a normal phrase. "Pineapples" was, firstly, a compound word and thus not the same thing, and also, like a "piny apple". Firewalls are also compound words, but don't fit the point you are trying to make at all, because they are, indeed, a kind of wall. A wall that blocks fire. So a "dwarf planet" should, logically speaking, be either a type of planet that is small or a planet inhabited by dwarves.
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@da-Doctah said in Where is Mexico?:
@Gąska said in Where is Mexico?:
@Gurth said in Where is Mexico?:
@Gąska Probably not by strict definition, but in common speech, a “foo bar” is a bar that’s distinguished from other bars by being foo. A “red car" is a car that’s red, a “Daily
” is a that’s Daily, a “dwarf planet” is a planet that’s dwarf(-like).However, an Attorney General is not a general who is attorney, but an attorney who is general.
And there's no martial that is court.
The word "general" in the proper name Attorney General comes from military terminology, which is utterly FUBAR'ed.
Compare: Master Sergeant (a type of Sergeant, as expected) and Sergeant Major (also a type of Sergeant, not as expected.)
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@jinpa said in Where is Mexico?:
@Gąska said in Where is Mexico?:
@Gurth said in Where is Mexico?:
@Gąska Probably not by strict definition, but in common speech, a “foo bar” is a bar that’s distinguished from other bars by being foo. A “red car" is a car that’s red, a “Daily
” is a that’s Daily, a “dwarf planet” is a planet that’s dwarf(-like).A guinea pig is a pig from Guinea, a pineapple is an apple with pines, a firewall is a wall of fire...
Firewalls are also compound words, but don't fit the point you are trying to make at all, because they are, indeed, a kind of wall.
It's just a figure of speech; it's not a literal wall. Just like a dwarf planet isn't a literal planet.
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@Gąska said in Where is Mexico?:
@jinpa said in Where is Mexico?:
@Gąska said in Where is Mexico?:
@Gurth said in Where is Mexico?:
@Gąska Probably not by strict definition, but in common speech, a “foo bar” is a bar that’s distinguished from other bars by being foo. A “red car" is a car that’s red, a “Daily
” is a that’s Daily, a “dwarf planet” is a planet that’s dwarf(-like).A guinea pig is a pig from Guinea, a pineapple is an apple with pines, a firewall is a wall of fire...
Firewalls are also compound words, but don't fit the point you are trying to make at all, because they are, indeed, a kind of wall.
It's just a figure of speech; it's not a literal wall. Just like a dwarf planet isn't a literal planet.
It is... in Diablo terms. https://diablo.fandom.com/wiki/Fire_Wall_(Diablo_I)
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@jinpa said in Where is Mexico?:
The word "general" in the proper name Attorney General comes from military terminology, which is utterly FUBAR'ed.
In regard to the etymology of the phrase Attorney General, Steven Pinker writes that the earliest citation in the Oxford English Dictionary is from 1292: "Tous attorneyz general purrount lever fins et cirrographer" (All general attorneys may levy fines and make legal documents). The phrase was borrowed from Anglo-Norman French when England was ruled by Normans after the conquest of England in the 11th-century. As a variety of French, which was spoken in the law courts, schools, universities and in sections of the gentry and the bourgeoisie, the term relating to government got introduced into English. The phrase attorney general is composed of a noun followed by the postpositive adjective general and as other French compounds its plural form also appears as "attorneys generals".[5][6] As compared to major generals, a term that also originates from French ("major-général") and also has a postpositive adjective, it also appears as "attorney generals". Steven Pinker writes: "So if you are ever challenged for saying attorney-generals, mother-in-laws, passerbys ... you can reply, 'They are the very model of the modern major general.'"
It's a French construct.
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@Gąska said in Where is Mexico?:
@jinpa said in Where is Mexico?:
@Gąska said in Where is Mexico?:
@Gurth said in Where is Mexico?:
@Gąska Probably not by strict definition, but in common speech, a “foo bar” is a bar that’s distinguished from other bars by being foo. A “red car" is a car that’s red, a “Daily
” is a that’s Daily, a “dwarf planet” is a planet that’s dwarf(-like).A guinea pig is a pig from Guinea, a pineapple is an apple with pines, a firewall is a wall of fire...
Firewalls are also compound words, but don't fit the point you are trying to make at all, because they are, indeed, a kind of wall.
It's just a figure of speech; it's not a literal wall. Just like a dwarf planet isn't a literal planet.
It is a literal wall in internal combustion -powered vehicle design parlance. It's the wall that separates the engine compartment from the people compartment, and which must be designed fireproof in (single-motor-on-nose-mount) airplanes (AFAIK).
Edit:
added plane type specifier
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@PleegWat said in Where is Mexico?:
@jinpa said in Where is Mexico?:
The word "general" in the proper name Attorney General comes from military terminology, which is utterly FUBAR'ed.
In regard to the etymology of the phrase Attorney General, Steven Pinker writes that the earliest citation in the Oxford English Dictionary is from 1292: "Tous attorneyz general purrount lever fins et cirrographer" (All general attorneys may levy fines and make legal documents). The phrase was borrowed from Anglo-Norman French when England was ruled by Normans after the conquest of England in the 11th-century. As a variety of French, which was spoken in the law courts, schools, universities and in sections of the gentry and the bourgeoisie, the term relating to government got introduced into English. The phrase attorney general is composed of a noun followed by the postpositive adjective general and as other French compounds its plural form also appears as "attorneys generals".[5][6] As compared to major generals, a term that also originates from French ("major-général") and also has a postpositive adjective, it also appears as "attorney generals". Steven Pinker writes: "So if you are ever challenged for saying attorney-generals, mother-in-laws, passerbys ... you can reply, 'They are the very model of the modern major general.'"
It's a French construct.
Great, the next time I'm challenged for mixing coding standards within five lines of code, I'll use a similar argument.
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@jinpa said in Where is Mexico?:
@PleegWat said in Where is Mexico?:
@jinpa said in Where is Mexico?:
The word "general" in the proper name Attorney General comes from military terminology, which is utterly FUBAR'ed.
In regard to the etymology of the phrase Attorney General, Steven Pinker writes that the earliest citation in the Oxford English Dictionary is from 1292: "Tous attorneyz general purrount lever fins et cirrographer" (All general attorneys may levy fines and make legal documents). The phrase was borrowed from Anglo-Norman French when England was ruled by Normans after the conquest of England in the 11th-century. As a variety of French, which was spoken in the law courts, schools, universities and in sections of the gentry and the bourgeoisie, the term relating to government got introduced into English. The phrase attorney general is composed of a noun followed by the postpositive adjective general and as other French compounds its plural form also appears as "attorneys generals".[5][6] As compared to major generals, a term that also originates from French ("major-général") and also has a postpositive adjective, it also appears as "attorney generals". Steven Pinker writes: "So if you are ever challenged for saying attorney-generals, mother-in-laws, passerbys ... you can reply, 'They are the very model of the modern major general.'"
It's a French construct.
Great, the next time I'm challenged for mixing coding standards within five lines of code, I'll use a similar argument.
From what I heard, most French programmers insist on writing all identifiers in French - making it mostly undecipherable for other developers. You might be onto something.
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@Gąska said in Where is Mexico?:
@jinpa said in Where is Mexico?:
@PleegWat said in Where is Mexico?:
@jinpa said in Where is Mexico?:
The word "general" in the proper name Attorney General comes from military terminology, which is utterly FUBAR'ed.
In regard to the etymology of the phrase Attorney General, Steven Pinker writes that the earliest citation in the Oxford English Dictionary is from 1292: "Tous attorneyz general purrount lever fins et cirrographer" (All general attorneys may levy fines and make legal documents). The phrase was borrowed from Anglo-Norman French when England was ruled by Normans after the conquest of England in the 11th-century. As a variety of French, which was spoken in the law courts, schools, universities and in sections of the gentry and the bourgeoisie, the term relating to government got introduced into English. The phrase attorney general is composed of a noun followed by the postpositive adjective general and as other French compounds its plural form also appears as "attorneys generals".[5][6] As compared to major generals, a term that also originates from French ("major-général") and also has a postpositive adjective, it also appears as "attorney generals". Steven Pinker writes: "So if you are ever challenged for saying attorney-generals, mother-in-laws, passerbys ... you can reply, 'They are the very model of the modern major general.'"
It's a French construct.
Great, the next time I'm challenged for mixing coding standards within five lines of code, I'll use a similar argument.
From what I heard, most French programmers insist on writing all identifiers in French - making it mostly undecipherable for other developers. You might be onto something.
It's only comparable to military ranking if they mix French and English. So if it's code that has programmers from multiple countries, then it's a valid comparison.
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@acrow said in Where is Mexico?:
@Gąska said in Where is Mexico?:
@jinpa said in Where is Mexico?:
@Gąska said in Where is Mexico?:
@Gurth said in Where is Mexico?:
@Gąska Probably not by strict definition, but in common speech, a “foo bar” is a bar that’s distinguished from other bars by being foo. A “red car" is a car that’s red, a “Daily
” is a that’s Daily, a “dwarf planet” is a planet that’s dwarf(-like).A guinea pig is a pig from Guinea, a pineapple is an apple with pines, a firewall is a wall of fire...
Firewalls are also compound words, but don't fit the point you are trying to make at all, because they are, indeed, a kind of wall.
It's just a figure of speech; it's not a literal wall. Just like a dwarf planet isn't a literal planet.
It is a literal wall in internal combustion -powered vehicle design parlance. It's the wall that separates the engine compartment from the people compartment, and which must be designed fireproof in (single-motor-on-nose-mount) airplanes (AFAIK).
Definition of WALL
a high thick masonry structure forming a long rampart or an enclosure chiefly for defense —often used in plural… See the full definition
wall noun
\ ˈwȯl
Definition of wall(Entry 1 of 3)
1a : a high thick masonry structure forming a long rampart or an enclosure chiefly for defense —often used in plural
1b : a masonry fence around a garden, park, or estate
1c : a structure that serves to hold back pressure (as of water or sliding earth)
2 : one of the sides of a room or building connecting floor and ceiling or foundation and roof
3 : the side of a footpath next to buildings
4 : an extreme or desperate position or a state of defeat, failure, or ruin // the surrounded troops had their backs against the wall
5 : a material layer enclosing space // the wall of a container // heart walls
6 : something resembling a wall (as in appearance, function, or effect) especially : something that acts as a barrier or defense a wall of reserve tariff wallNote that 4 and 6 are figurative walls (if something is described as resembling a wall, it's because it's not a wall.)
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@Gąska said in Where is Mexico?:
@acrow said in Where is Mexico?:
@Gąska said in Where is Mexico?:
@jinpa said in Where is Mexico?:
@Gąska said in Where is Mexico?:
@Gurth said in Where is Mexico?:
@Gąska Probably not by strict definition, but in common speech, a “foo bar” is a bar that’s distinguished from other bars by being foo. A “red car" is a car that’s red, a “Daily
” is a that’s Daily, a “dwarf planet” is a planet that’s dwarf(-like).A guinea pig is a pig from Guinea, a pineapple is an apple with pines, a firewall is a wall of fire...
Firewalls are also compound words, but don't fit the point you are trying to make at all, because they are, indeed, a kind of wall.
It's just a figure of speech; it's not a literal wall. Just like a dwarf planet isn't a literal planet.
It is a literal wall in internal combustion -powered vehicle design parlance. It's the wall that separates the engine compartment from the people compartment, and which must be designed fireproof in (single-motor-on-nose-mount) airplanes (AFAIK).
Definition of WALL
a high thick masonry structure forming a long rampart or an enclosure chiefly for defense —often used in plural… See the full definition
wall noun
\ ˈwȯl
Definition of wall(Entry 1 of 3)
1a : a high thick masonry structure forming a long rampart or an enclosure chiefly for defense —often used in plural
1b : a masonry fence around a garden, park, or estate
1c : a structure that serves to hold back pressure (as of water or sliding earth)
2 : one of the sides of a room or building connecting floor and ceiling or foundation and roof
3 : the side of a footpath next to buildings
4 : an extreme or desperate position or a state of defeat, failure, or ruin // the surrounded troops had their backs against the wall
5 : a material layer enclosing space // the wall of a container // heart walls
6 : something resembling a wall (as in appearance, function, or effect) especially : something that acts as a barrier or defense a wall of reserve tariff wallNote that 4 and 6 are figurative walls (if something is described as resembling a wall, it's because it's not a wall.)
I could argue that the networking term firewall comes from the engine-compartment firewall, but
dig up the etymology on that.
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@Gąska Not the ones I work with. Our code is entirely in English, though the occasional French-inspired mistake crops up.
@jinpa Funny fact about military ranks: in the French army, major is the highest non-commissioned rank (it's the highest of 3 ranks at OR-9), while the OF-3 rank (major in the US army) is called "commandant" (other officer ranks are pretty similar).
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@Khudzlin said in Where is Mexico?:
@jinpa Funny fact about military ranks: in the French army, major is the highest non-commissioned rank (it's the highest of 3 ranks at OR-9), while the OF-3 rank (major in the US army) is called "commandant" (other officer ranks are pretty similar).
To continue on the theme "American military ranks are FUBAR'd", a major is higher than a lieutenant, but a Lieutenant General is higher than a Major General.
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Speaking of Mexico, in French if someone says "Mexico" rather than "Mexique", they're taking about Mexico City.
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@Medinoc I'll remember that if I need to talk about Mexico's federal capital. No such distinction for New York (though we'll likely specify when talking about the state) or Québec (though the rest of the sentence will likely give a clue).
@jinpa Is there a difference in how you address them?
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@Khudzlin said in Where is Mexico?:
@Medinoc I'll remember that if I need to talk about Mexico's federal capital. No such distinction for New York (though we'll likely specify when talking about the state) or Québec (though the rest of the sentence will likely give a clue).
@jinpa Is there a difference in how you address them?
According to https://www.military.com/army/officer-ranks.html, all types of General are addressed as "General".
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@jinpa So we can just count the stars (or similar symbols) to sort out seniority.
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I just checked our military ranks and there are a fuckload of them.
– Ufficiali Generali
Generale
Generale di Corpo d’Armata
Generale di Divisione
Generale di Brigata
– Ufficiali superioriColonnello
Tenente Colonnello
Maggiore
– Ufficiali inferioriCapitano
Tenente
Sottotenente
– SottufficialiPrimo Maresciallo Luogotenente
Primo Maresciallo
Maresciallo Capo
Maresciallo Ordinario
Maresciallo
Sergente Maggiore Capo
Sergente Maggiore
Sergente
– GraduatiCaporal Maggiore Capo Scelto
Caporal Maggiore Capo
Caporal Maggiore Scelto
Primo Caporal Maggiore
– TruppaCaporal Maggiore
Caporale
SoldatoHere's the comparison between the various armed forces with NATO designations.
https://www.difesa.it/SMD_/Staff/Reparti/I/Impiego/Bandi/Documents/Modulistica/TabellaGradi_WEB.pdf
(Fun fact: we have a military police force, which is not the US-style military police, as it also has regular gendarmerie duties; but we also have a civilian police force, Polizia di Stato, and a "tax police" which is also responsible for smuggling and drug-related offences, Guardia di Finanza. Duties are often replicated across the three major police forces).
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@Gąska said in Where is Mexico?:
@Khudzlin said in Where is Mexico?:
Québec
There's a city of Quebec?
Yep, it's the capital of that province (the biggest city is Montréal, however).
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@admiral_p said in Where is Mexico?:
I just checked our military ranks and there are a fuckload of them.
You missed one: generale di corpo d'armata con incarichi speciali (OF-9, as opposed to regular generale di corpo d'armata which is OF-8).
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@Gąska it wasn't quoted in the Army's website (where I got the list from). That translates as "Army Corps General with Special Duties", which makes me think it is a designation for specific circumstances.
Edit: apparently it designates the Chief of Staff for the various forces.
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@Jaloopa said in Where is Mexico?:
@kazitor there wasn't really a firm definition until Eris was discovered. Then people got to thinking and realised that if Pluto was a planet there wasn't any logical reason not to define several bodies in the asteroid belt as planets too
So call them planets. Who cares?
When I was a kid, books on Astronomy said Jupiter had 9 moons and Saturn had 12. Now, thanks to better telescopes, we say that Jupiter has 79 and Saturn has 62.
Call Pluto a planet, call Eris a planet. WGAF if we have 8 planets or 98 planets.
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Or at least, don't make "dwarf planet" a disjoint set from "planet" in defiance of the conventions of most Western languages.
Something like "Small planetoid" would have been enough to carry the meaning that it looks like a planet yet is too small to be called one.PS: In French pine apples are definitely the fruit of the pine, you guys are the ones who got it wrong due to aesthetic similarities between ananas and pine apples. That said, is it really worse than calling handegg "football"?
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@El_Heffe said in Where is Mexico?:
WGAF if we have 8 planets or 98 planets.
People who make or take part in quizzes.
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@Medinoc said in Where is Mexico?:
Or at least, don't make "dwarf planet" a disjoint set from "planet" in defiance of the conventions of most Western languages.
That’s basically what I was saying, yes: if you name it “dwarf planet” then common language sense says it’s a planet with special properties compared to other planets.
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@Gurth Anybody who relies on 'common language sense' with respect to the English language is a fool. It's a hybrid of so many other languages that there is no common language rules. There are general cases, but they are all filled with so many caveats that relying on them is stupid.
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@jinpa said in Where is Mexico?:
@Gąska said in Where is Mexico?:
@jinpa said in Where is Mexico?:
The way I think of it (and this is not a view shared by the unwashed masses) is that anything north of the Panama canal is North America, and anything south of the Panama Canal is South America. Prior to the Panama canal, there was only one continent there.
This raises some questions about Asia and Africa.
Only historically. I would have regarded them as one continent prior to the Suez Canal.
... or prior to Moses splitting the red sea?
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@Gurth said in Where is Mexico?:
@da-Doctah said in Where is Mexico?:
a continent was defined as "all the places you can walk to without your hat floating away"
That’s the mindset that gave us Brexit.
Brexit still hasn't happened... just a lot of talk
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@bjolling
Is Mexico getting out of somewhere? I feel like the term 'Mexit' should really find some use.
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@bjolling said in Where is Mexico?:
@Gurth said in Where is Mexico?:
@da-Doctah said in Where is Mexico?:
a continent was defined as "all the places you can walk to without your hat floating away"
That’s the mindset that gave us Brexit.
Brexit still hasn't happened... just a lot of talk
That is Brexit, for now: a lot of talk about how the British want to have their cake and eat it, or have their cake and not eat it, or not have a cake and not eat it, or not have a cake yet eat it — depending on who you’re looking at.
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@Khudzlin said in Where is Mexico?:
while the OF-3 rank (major in the US army) is called "commandant" (other officer ranks are pretty similar).
American army / air force / marine majors are O-4s.
O-4s in the Navy are lieutenant commanders.
The Marine general who is their chief of staff is called the commandant.
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@Gurth said in Where is Mexico?:
@bjolling said in Where is Mexico?:
@Gurth said in Where is Mexico?:
@da-Doctah said in Where is Mexico?:
a continent was defined as "all the places you can walk to without your hat floating away"
That’s the mindset that gave us Brexit.
Brexit still hasn't happened... just a lot of talk
That is Brexit, for now: a lot of talk about how the British want to have their cake and eat it, or have their cake and not eat it, or not have a cake and not eat it, or not have a cake yet eat it — depending on who you’re looking at.
The thing I don't understand the most is why UK spends so much time on talks with EU and so little time on talks with everyone in the world outside EU.
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@Gąska said in Where is Mexico?:
The thing I don't understand the most is why UK spends so much time on talks with EU and so little time on talks with everyone in the world outside EU.
That's a different ministerial department, and a much more secretive one.
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@dkf one would think there would be some agreements negotiated by now.
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@Gąska said in Where is Mexico?:
one would think there would be some agreements negotiated by now
There have been a few, but when the details of the one with the US leaked (from members of the US Administration) it became rapidly clear that it was going to be desperately unpopular even with Tory party members. Something to do with not actually wanting lots of food poisoning or to be gouged for health costs (with the profile of people who vote Tory a lot more concerned over these things than average). What a totally unsurprising surprise that is!
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@Gąska said in Where is Mexico?:
The thing I don't understand the most is why UK spends so much time on talks with EU and so little time on talks with everyone in the world outside EU.
Because they probably don’t actually want out, but have painted themselves into a corner where they can’t not leave, is my guess.
In my newspaper this morning, I read an interesting interview with the author of a biography on Boris. She claims he’s just as likely to turn around 180° on his Brexit stance if he gets to be prime minister (and face it, he’s likely to be) and it then turns out he can’t deliver on his current promises because he has no fucking clue how to deal with the EU (or anyone else, for that matter).
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@Gurth said in Where is Mexico?:
how to deal with the EU
Oh, so you do want an organized relation with the EU beyond WTO rules? No problem. Just sign on the dotted line and we'll talk.
Attorney general - Wikipedia
