Feature Request: Users Can Propose Jeffing
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@barisu, @julianlam, @ben_lubar
From my idea here:
Allow users to propose moving a conversation to another thread, subject to the approval of all other involved users and/or a moderator.
The way I envision this working is that standard users can queue up a series of actions that normally are reserved to moderators, and then let a moderator approve, modify, or reject the proposed actions.
Specifically, it would allow users to pick the posts that they think ought to be moved and to set a target thread into which to move the posts. Then a moderator can add or remove posts to the set and actually make the move.
The all-involved-users approach would send a notification to all the users who have authored a post that is in the set of picked posts for them to approve or reject the suggested move, and if they all sign off on it, then the move is automatically performed without a mod needing to get involved directly.
This would save a lot of work for the mods (who we all know love
), and it would save a lot of stress on the part of users who don't want to see flame-y topics in non-flame-y threads.To limit abuse of this feature, maybe there could be a time limit on it, so a user can only make one such proposal per day/3 days/week, or a user must be in a certain group, or some combination, or maybe something else.
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@djls45 What would you expect to happen if one of those involved doesn't respond? Some sort of window to respond, say 1 day? If you don't respond it's assumed to be a response of "I don't care" (not agreement).
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If the moderators need to review it all anyway, then they're not really saving much effort over doing it themselves IMO.
It's basically
TL4 with a moderator action needed.
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@mikehurley First, a mod could simply provide the approval.
But that's a good question. So the possible responses could be:
Approve No response/don't care (default) Reject I suppose it could require approval from at least one other involved user, or perhaps a simple majority, for the proposed move to be accepted.
Edit: And I suppose a single rejection could veto it. Or maybe at least one other, or maybe a majority, so as to prevent abuse from the other direction.
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@loopback0 said in Feature Request: Users Can Propose Jeffing:
If the moderators need to review it all anyway, then they're not really saving much effort over doing it themselves IMO.
It's basically TL4 with a moderator action needed.I seem to recall @boomzilla saying that it's a pain to go through and pick all the posts to jeff out of a thread for a jeffing request. This would take away that pain point for the @mods. If all they need to do is click a button to approve or reject the request, then it becomes a lot easier, and people could be happier with the forum.
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@djls45 said in Feature Request: Users Can Propose Jeffing:
This would take away that pain point for the @mods. If all they need to do is click a button to approve or reject the request, then it becomes a lot easier
The whole point of them reviewing it is to actually review it though? They'd still need to go through every post that's been selected.
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@loopback0 I was about to type a reply saying basically that, when yours appeared on my screen just now.
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@loopback0 said in Feature Request: Users Can Propose Jeffing:
@djls45 said in Feature Request: Users Can Propose Jeffing:
This would take away that pain point for the @mods. If all they need to do is click a button to approve or reject the request, then it becomes a lot easier
The whole point of them reviewing it is to actually review it though? They'd still need to go through every post that's been selected.
Looking to see if they all should be moved is often a lot easier than picking them out of the original thread when they're intertwined with other sub-threads. This happens a lot in the News thread.
And if some are missed then someone else can pick the next batch to go!
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Or you guys could, I don't know, not make lives difficult for people and voluntarily evict yourselves to the proper thread. Especially relating to the sort of discussion that prompted this suggestion, this is the second time in not so long ago, and right from the start it was "proposed" by at least two users.
I know, I know. All threads on WTDWTF must be derailed unless explicitly stated otherwise... do what you will.
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@loopback0 said in Feature Request: Users Can Propose Jeffing:
If the moderators need to review it all anyway, then they're not really saving much effort over doing it themselves IMO
From what the mods have said, it sounds like there's a lot of work in selecting posts, choosing the new thread for them etc.
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I thought the standard procedure for this was to flag the first post
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@Applied-Mediocrity said in Feature Request: Users Can Propose Jeffing:
Or you guys could, I don't know, not make lives difficult for people and voluntarily evict yourselves to the proper thread.
What would you expect that to look like, though? Someone posts something that may be inflammatory in a non-flame thread, and someone else wants to reply to it. Would you want to see them make a new thread (or a post in an existing thread) with their reply:
something that may be inflammatory
And then back in the original thread, they make a new post that says
something that may be inflammatory
see further discussion here
?What if the original post itself also deserves being jeffed?
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@hungrier said in Feature Request: Users Can Propose Jeffing:
I thought the standard procedure for this was to flag the first post
The mods have to select every single post to move. Flagging the first one only provides a starting point.
The system doesn't auto-select all the posts in that post's reply chain.^^This could perhaps be an alternate method.
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@djls45 said in Feature Request: Users Can Propose Jeffing:
The system doesn't auto-select all the posts in that post's reply chain.
^^This could perhaps be an alternate method.Discourse did this, it is useful. It might have only gone 1 level of reply though, I can't remember for sure.
This is the better solution, then no-one has to piss about individually selecting posts.
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@djls45 said in Feature Request: Users Can Propose Jeffing:
@Applied-Mediocrity said in Feature Request: Users Can Propose Jeffing:
Or you guys could, I don't know, not make lives difficult for people and voluntarily evict yourselves to the proper thread.
What would you expect that to look like, though? Someone posts something that may be inflammatory in a non-flame thread, and someone else wants to reply to it. Would you want to see them make a new thread (or a post in an existing thread) with their reply:
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@loopback0 said in Feature Request: Users Can Propose Jeffing:
@djls45 said in Feature Request: Users Can Propose Jeffing:
The system doesn't auto-select all the posts in that post's reply chain.
^^This could perhaps be an alternate method.Discourse did this, it is useful. It might have only gone 1 level of reply though, I can't remember for sure.
This is the better solution, then no-one has to piss about individually selecting posts.
Yes, Discourse only went to one level.
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@TimeBandit said in Feature Request: Users Can Propose Jeffing:
@djls45 said in Feature Request: Users Can Propose Jeffing:
@Applied-Mediocrity said in Feature Request: Users Can Propose Jeffing:
Or you guys could, I don't know, not make lives difficult for people and voluntarily evict yourselves to the proper thread.
What would you expect that to look like, though? Someone posts something that may be inflammatory in a non-flame thread, and someone else wants to reply to it. Would you want to see them make a new thread (or a post in an existing thread) with their reply:
That's the first step, but it doesn't make a reply-link attachment to the original post in the original thread.
For someone who wants other people to see their reply, should they post a reply in the original thread calling attention to their new topic?
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@loopback0 said in Feature Request: Users Can Propose Jeffing:
@djls45 said in Feature Request: Users Can Propose Jeffing:
The system doesn't auto-select all the posts in that post's reply chain.
^^This could perhaps be an alternate method.Discourse did this, it is useful. It might have only gone 1 level of reply though, I can't remember for sure.
This is the better solution, then no-one has to piss about individually selecting posts.
But then what about when the reply-connection gets broken somehow, as with this post?
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@djls45 said in Feature Request: Users Can Propose Jeffing:
For someone who wants other people to see their reply, should they post a reply in the original thread calling attention to their new topic?
Yes.
Maybe
should do it for you, but doing it manually for now is ok. 
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@TimeBandit said in Feature Request: Users Can Propose Jeffing:
@djls45 said in Feature Request: Users Can Propose Jeffing:
For someone who wants other people to see their reply, should they post a reply in the original thread calling attention to their new topic?
Yes.
Maybe should do it for you, but doing it manually for now is ok. And what should be done if the discussion gradually becomes Garage-worthy, or people have different ideas about when/where it should be split?
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@djls45 said in Feature Request: Users Can Propose Jeffing:
But then what about when the reply-connection gets broken somehow, as with this post?
The moderators spot it while reviewing the posts that have been selected, or it gets missed and flagged later.
Same applies to the original proposal.
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@djls45 said in Feature Request: Users Can Propose Jeffing:
people could be happier with the forum.
Don't count on it.
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@djls45 said in Feature Request: Users Can Propose Jeffing:
What would you expect that to look like, though?
Don't be discouraged and all, but I have a feeling that this particular problem is where more technology is only a workaround.
It's not like a couple of potshots or flammable stuff are going to harm anyone (<cpt_obvious>if it does, I'd strongly suggest reconsidering hanging around here</cpt_obvious>). Happens all the time, it's some of what makes the place lively, and it's just fine. But for contrast, you guys went and typed a whole volume of the life and work of St. Aquinas, which is not.
Same could be said about the Bosque thread which went and became a Cacophony For Very Small Violins in F# Minor, but okay, the original topic was shit anyway.
Move to the proper thread (preferably very soon), make one, post links to and from. It has the upside of allowing the keyboard cool down a little, too. The bigger man gets the
.
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@Applied-Mediocrity said in Feature Request: Users Can Propose Jeffing:
Cacophony For Very Small Violins in F# Minor
I would not at all object to the jeffing of the music discussion into a thread of its own. But only if the new thread is given this title. It would be a great name for a piece for very young beginning students.
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@djls45 said in Feature Request: Users Can Propose Jeffing:
@barisu, @julianlam, @ben_lubar
From my idea here:
Allow users to propose moving a conversation to another thread, subject to the approval of all other involved users and/or a moderator.
The way I envision this working is that standard users can queue up a series of actions that normally are reserved to moderators, and then let a moderator approve, modify, or reject the proposed actions.
Specifically, it would allow users to pick the posts that they think ought to be moved and to set a target thread into which to move the posts. Then a moderator can add or remove posts to the set and actually make the move.
The all-involved-users approach would send a notification to all the users who have authored a post that is in the set of picked posts for them to approve or reject the suggested move, and if they all sign off on it, then the move is automatically performed without a mod needing to get involved directly.
This would save a lot of work for the mods (who we all know love
), and it would save a lot of stress on the part of users who don't want to see flame-y topics in non-flame-y threads.To limit abuse of this feature, maybe there could be a time limit on it, so a user can only make one such proposal per day/3 days/week, or a user must be in a certain group, or some combination, or maybe something else.
Can we get a new topic for this?
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@Gribnit said in Feature Request: Users Can Propose Jeffing:
Can we get a new topic for this?
Sure. What name do you propose for this new topic?
But hurry: I have only about 3 days, I think.
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@Applied-Mediocrity said in Feature Request: Users Can Propose Jeffing:
Or you guys could, I don't know, not make lives difficult for people and voluntarily evict yourselves to the proper thread. Especially relating to the sort of discussion that prompted this suggestion, this is the second time in not so long ago, and right from the start it was "proposed" by at least two users.
I know, I know. All threads on WTDWTF must be derailed unless explicitly stated otherwise... do what you will.
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Instead of having a whole new feature like this, I would think it would be simpler to just extend the existing moderator forking tool to have the option to take all the replies with the selected post. That would eliminate the main complaint, right?
EDIT: There's also still the problem of posts that are on the de-railed topic, but may not be a direct reply to another post. How do either of these solutions overcome that?
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@Erufael said in Feature Request: Users Can Propose Jeffing:
EDIT: There's also still the problem of posts that are on the de-railed topic, but may not be a direct reply to another post. How do either of these solutions overcome that?
Once you've cleared out nearly everything, cherry-picking the rest becomes trivially easy since there's only two or three of them. Just make sure they remain in chronological order and you're good.
