Review/validate my work PC build
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I've been allowed to purchase the parts to build a new work PC with a maximum budget of about AU$2,000 (ideally less than that) and the requirement that the parts ship to Sydney fairly quickly (within the next week). I'm planning to buy the parts from Mwave, since I've used them before and they've been recommended by someone who buys a lot of computers.
I'm currently using a decent but slightly old Dell laptop (don't know the exact model, but I think it has some sort of i7 CPU) hooked up to a 24" (I think) monitor.
I've built my own PC at home, but this is the first time I've picked the full parts list myself so I want to validate that the parts I've picked are compatible and suitable.
I usually run one or two instances of Visual Studio, one or two instances of VS Code, an SQL Server instance + SQL Server Management Studio and a bunch of Chrome tabs. Occasionally I need to run an Android emulator.
This is the Mwave shopping cart with the parts I've selected, and this is a PCPartPicker list of the same parts (though the M.2 SSD, optical drive and monitor appear to be slightly different models to what Mwave is selling).
I originally wanted a 9th-gen Intel CPU, but Mwave only has unlocked models without a stock cooler and I don't really want to deal with a third-party cooler.
Are these parts compatible? Are they suitable for my needs? Does the PSU have enough wattage?
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@Choonster said in Review/validate my work PC build:
I don't really want to deal with a third-party cooler.
There's nothing wrong at all with a third-party cooler. It's just another component, nothing more (and pretty easy to fit once you figure where on the instruction sheet you start). But whether you use a stock or a third-party one, you need one even if just while you install the OS…
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I haven't built a PC in ages so I hope I'm not talking out of my ass.
If I were you I'd pay extra for another 16 gigs of RAM, it's cheap and the list of software you're usually running seems like it can chew through memory in no time. Then again you could just upgrade at any point, you have 2 free slots on the MB.
You may need to update the motherboard's firmware, but I think that's pretty common when buying a motherboard with a chipset originally made for a previous generation of CPUs.
The PSU is perfectly fine. By the way, you can safely ignore any recommendations from other component manufacturers (e.g. the GPU manufacturer will recommend "at least 500W PSU" or something like that) - they have no way of knowing what the rest of your build is and whether you're using a decent PSU or some chinesium garbage that doesn't match its own spec, so they highball it to stop people from bitching. Your CPU has a TDP of 65 W and the GPU will do about 130 W, and the rest of the components will need maybe 25 W max altogether, probably even less.
Do you really need a GTX 1660 Ti for development? The CPU has integrated graphics. And a DVD burner?
What about storage, are you going to be fine with a half terabyte SSD? I'd consider a spinning hard drive for stuff that doesn't need fast access. Of course, like the RAM, it's easy to add later.
I'd vouch for a third party cooler, the stock ones aren't usually great, you can get a much quieter one for cheap and the installation is just as easy as with the stock one. OTOH the case has two fans that probably won't be very quiet themselves, so buying a different CPU cooler probably won't help with noise too much.
The mesh on the front of the case is going to catch dust and it's a bitch to clean - I have a similar one. I'm also not a fan (heh) of top-mounted case fans - they're great for cooling, but when the fan is off, dust just falls straight in.
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@blek said in Review/validate my work PC build:
Do you really need a GTX 1660 Ti for development?
Have you seen what Slack can do?
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@pie_flavor I haven't really had the displeasure yet, we use IRC and every time someone starts with "hey guys it's
date +%Y, we should swi-" they're obliterated by a rampaging horde of screaming autists. Is it actually GPU intensive? I thought it just devoured memory.
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@blek No, that's mostly a joke. Also, it's 2019, which is why I use Discord, because IRC blows.
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@Choonster said in Review/validate my work PC build:
I originally wanted a 9th-gen Intel CPU, but Mwave only has unlocked models without a stock cooler and I don't really want to deal with a third-party cooler.
That's not nearly a reason enough, I'd say.- Take a look at the prices. 8th gen is $100 more expensive with less megahertzzzss.
- 9th gen have hardware fixes for Spectre. Less performance hit than with a software fix, I'd think.
@blek said in Review/validate my work PC build:
If I were you I'd pay extra for another 16 gigs of RAM
I second this. With a note that very often people think they'll just buy more later and they usually won't. Budgets change, compatibility issues arise, wild kneeling warthogs appear.
It depends on your habits (open all the programs, tabs, etc.) and your SQL data, but it can't really hurt. Consider 2x16 before the Illuminati devise another insane DRAM price hike.
(which is, of course, just what they want you to do -buy, buy, buy-
)You may need to update the motherboard's firmware, but I think that's pretty common when buying a motherboard with a chipset originally made for a previous generation of CPUs.
Don't think that's an issue with 8th gen anymore. It's been a long time.
With 9th gen, however, it very well might be, so that's a considerable problem.
Take a look at this bundle, however. According to support list that one's guaranteed to work.And a DVD burner?
Well, some of us burn houses down, some burn DVDs. Probably for training purposes :>
What about storage, are you going to be fine with a half terabyte SSD? I'd consider a spinning hard drive for stuff that doesn't need fast access. Of course, like the RAM, it's easy to add later.
Whereas I'd offer to consider 256GB for OS and programs and another, 2.5" for data.
I'd vouch for a third party cooler
Yes, perhaps something like the timeless CM 212. They all are somewhat tricky to install (with 212 somewhere in the middle, BeQuiet being bitches and Scythe being pox-ridden trans hookers).
But if you really really don't want to, there's a couple of cheap ones available with 4 pushpins pretty much like the Intel one.
The mesh on the front of the case is going to catch dust and it's a bitch to clean - I have a similar one. I'm also not a fan (heh) of top-mounted case fans - they're great for cooling, but when the fan is off, dust just falls straight in.
Goddamn I hate Antec. My first build was Antec 300. Do you want to know how I got these scars?
Anyway, yes, I'd look for something without dust trapping meshes and the top hole. Not just dust. Spilled coffee, perhaps? Say, Corsair 100R Silent, that's a decent one... once you remove those plastic rattling drive cages and use actual screws to fix all the drives, that is. The 3-state fan switch is unwieldy, but hell, leave it on 5V and forget about it.
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Thanks for all the feedback so far.
Is the i5-9600K (9th-gen) really better than the i7-8700 (8th-gen) I currently have selected? The i5 a higher base frequency, but the same turbo frequency and no hyperthreading. Does the software fix for Spectre make that much of a difference? The 9th-gen i7 is out of my price range, unfortunately.
I'll look at getting a third-party cooler.
The DVD burner is just so I have an optical drive in case I end up needing it for something.
I've got an Antec 300 at home which I like, but it does build up a lot of dust. I'll consider switching it out. The Corsair 100R Silent looks nice and it's steel, which I like.
I don't actually need much storage, I've only got 256 GB at the moment and it's not completely full. I only have a few databases on my machine at any point in time and they're usually no larger than a few GB each. I've got a lot of storage at home, but a lot of that's occupied by games and videos (which I obviously won't have at work).
I'll probably upgrade to 32 GB of RAM.
I got the graphics card mainly because I'm used to the integrated graphics being considered crap, though I suppose it doesn't matter as much for development. I got the Ti over the regular GTX 1660 because it has two HDMI ports and I'd rather use HDMI cables for both monitors than HDMI for one and DVI for the other (though it doesn't really matter that much).
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@Choonster said in Review/validate my work PC build:
I'll probably upgrade to 32 GB of RAM.
Good call. IME very few people who say "I can always add more RAM later" ever do. By the time you get to that point we will be on DDR17 and you will look at the price of what you need and think about how for a little bit more money you can upgrade the whole machine (even though it is a fair chunk more money and not just a little more) and you end up upgrading the whole machine.
When I build machines for our work I just max them out on RAM. RAM is cheap in comparison to how much it can bottleneck performance if you don't have enough.
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Get Ryzen. And terabyte SSD.
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@Choonster
Ultimately the decision of i5 vs i7 comes down to whether or not what you're doing is parallel enough to really make use of the hyper-threading (and/or extra cores) of the i7. If not, the i5 is better because it's at least $100 cheaper for any given generation.In my experience, for really CPU intensive stuff, hyper-threading kind of falls off, since there's only one underlying CPU core to actually do stuff, regardless of the two threads. And for really CPU un-intensive stuff, you don't need the hyper-threading anyway. So I've become an i5 believer, even for my gaming rigs now. But I'm kind of a heretic in the eyes of true Master Racers
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@Gąska said in Review/validate my work PC build:
And terabyte SSD.
I've got a half-TB SSD for my home PC and no regrets. Games (the only large media I consume) install to spinning rust, and everything else sits nicely on the fast media.
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@Gąska said in Review/validate my work PC build:
Get Ryzen. And terabyte SSD.
nVME if your motherboard supports it.
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@Choonster said in Review/validate my work PC build:
M.2 SSD,
Get the Western Digital NVMe Black SSDs. They're way faster than those Intels.
https://www.mwave.com.au/product/wd-500gb-m2-2280-nvme-pcie-3x4-3d-nand-ssd-wds500g2x0c-ac13211
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@Choonster Fractal cases are awesome, too, if a bit on the expensive side.
Regarding graphics, I think modern integrated Intel GPUs are perfectly fine if you don't want to play games, use GPGPU or render high quality 3D models. Buying a mid-range GeForce seems really unnecessary.
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@dkf said in Review/validate my work PC build:
Games (the only large media I consume) install to spinning rust,
SSDs are explicitly for game installation, so that you can lord your master racedness over the lowly console players with super long load times.
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@dkf said in Review/validate my work PC build:
@Gąska said in Review/validate my work PC build:
And terabyte SSD.
I've got a half-TB SSD for my home PC and no regrets. Games (the only large media I consume) install to spinning rust, and everything else sits nicely on the fast media.
Terabyte SSD > half-terabyte SSD + additional HDD for what doesn't fit in that half-terabyte. Unless you need a lot more than just one terabyte, then it's not as clear-cut - but most people, even professionals like us, don't.
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How much does RAM speed matter? I've switched to a Z390 motherboard that supports RAM speeds of up to DDR4 4300, but there's a pretty big price difference between this DDR4 3600 kit (AU$700) and this DDR4 2666 kit (AU$329). Should I stick with the DDR4 2666 kit, or get something slightly better? I don't think the DDR4 3600 kit is within my budget.
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@Choonster
Ryzen - quite, Intel - pretty much no. If you want to squeeze the last drop from your dollar, I think the sweet spot is currently hovering around DDR4-3000/3200 CL16 currently (provided they're without blingity-bling).@dkf said in Review/validate my work PC build:
Games (the only large media I consume) install to spinning rust
I had a colleague like that.
: Why the hell do you keep games on that rusty old drive? It takes almost a minute to load! And then there's the annoying 7...6...5... on top of that.
(we were talking about Dirt Rally at the time)
: But just enough for me to crack a bottle and take a good swig.
: I see. Drive carefully.
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@Applied-Mediocrity said in Review/validate my work PC build:
Goddamn I hate Antec. My first build was Antec 300. Do you want to know how I got these scars?
Anyway, yes, I'd look for something without dust trapping meshes and the top hole. Not just dust. Spilled coffee, perhaps? Say, Corsair 100R Silent, that's a decent one... once you remove those plastic rattling drive cages and use actual screws to fix all the drives, that is. The 3-state fan switch is unwieldy, but hell, leave it on 5V and forget about it.It looks like the Corsair 100R Silent (max CPU cooler height 150mm) doesn't have enough space for the CM 212 (height 163mm). Is there any other case you (or anybody else) would recommend?
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@Choonster The 100R would fit the Corsair AIO 120mm liquid coolers like the H60 or H80i.
I've got the H100i (which is just the 240mm version of the same) and it's superb.
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I've made most of the changes suggested by everyone, so here's version 2: Mwave cart, PCPartPicker parts list
How does this look?
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@Choonster
Well, you've certainly come a long way, from not wanting anything to do with aftermarket coolers to having a badass AIO on your list :>You're right about 212's height, almost, but its side panels will provide the extra allowance. The heatpipes might push into the soundproofing layer, but it will fit. That's why I find it a decent one. It permits proper tower coolers on one side and
carelesseasier cable routing on the other while still being very cheap. However, if "I've done it" does not convince, Pure Base 600 might be a good pick. That one I haven't done, seems to be new, but it does look very solid, wide, spacy.Any particular reason why you've chosen that specific mainboard, though?
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@Applied-Mediocrity said in Review/validate my work PC build:
Any particular reason why you've chosen that specific mainboard, though?
I think it was the cheapest Z390 one with a HDMI and a DVI port on the back, which I need for my two monitors. Most of the more expensive ones only had a single HDMI port.
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@Choonster
It's just that it may have an older firmware, so while the chance of that is small, it's not 100% guaranteed 9th gen will run right out of the box.
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@Applied-Mediocrity said in Review/validate my work PC build:
@Choonster
It's just that it may have an older firmware, so while the chance of that is small, it's not 100% guaranteed 9th gen will run right out of the box.I think I checked for that on the manufacturer's website, but I'll check again. PCPartPicker also isn't showing a warning about the firmware like it did for the previous motherboard when I switched to the 9th-gen i5.
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@pie_flavor said in Review/validate my work PC build:
@blek said in Review/validate my work PC build:
Do you really need a GTX 1660 Ti for development?
Have you seen what Slack can do?
What does that do with GPU? I really wanna know...
@pie_flavor said in Review/validate my work PC build:
No, that's mostly a joke.
Oh, darn...
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@Applied-Mediocrity said in Review/validate my work PC build:
@Choonster
It's just that it may have an older firmware, so while the chance of that is small, it's not 100% guaranteed 9th gen will run right out of the box.I'm 99% sure that it supports 9th-gen out of the box, since the CPU Support List says that the i5-9600k is supported since BIOS version P1.30 and the BIOS tab shows P1.30 as the first release.
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@Choonster
You're right. I was wrong.
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I'm probably going to be buying this today. Any last-minute feedback before I do?
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I see Mwave and think of the soundcard/modem in my first PC.
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I ordered the parts last week and they arrived today.
I got about halfway through the build before I left for the day; but when I went to put the side panels of the case back on, the screws for the rear fan/radiator block were in the way.
Is there anything I can do to fix this? I'd rather not reinstall the radiator, it was quite annoying to install in the first place.
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Bend the side panel lip slightly using needle tip pliers so that those fan screw heads fit.
Jury rigged solutions is the best part of PC building, eh? Right?
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@Choonster said in Review/validate my work PC build:
when I went to put the side panels of the case back on, the screws for the rear fan/radiator block were in the way.
Either your computer case has been stupidly designed or you're
.
Are you sure you're not flipping the panels around?
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@Choonster
I suspect the problem is less the fan screw and more that you installed the side panel from "too far back" - modern ATX cases are trending toward having the point where the side panel needs to start being very close to the front of the case, and if you start it further back, it doesn't sit all the way down in the track, resulting in the picture.
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@Zecc said in Review/validate my work PC build:
@Choonster said in Review/validate my work PC build:
when I went to put the side panels of the case back on, the screws for the rear fan/radiator block were in the way.
Either your computer case has been stupidly designed or you're
.
Are you sure you're not flipping the panels around?They're supposedly identical to each other, I think I tried both on that side.
This is a Corsair case that's explicitly compatible with the Corsair cooler, so I'm not sure why it wouldn't work.
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@izzion said in Review/validate my work PC build:
@Choonster
I suspect the problem is less the fan screw and more that you installed the side panel from "too far back" - modern ATX cases are trending toward having the point where the side panel needs to start being very close to the front of the case, and if you start it further back, it doesn't sit all the way down in the track, resulting in the picture.That could be it, the side panels were a bit fiddly to install. I'll have to see if starting closer to the front works.
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Sorry that I'm late to this but if you a budget left over consider aftermarket cooling with the emphasis on silent. A noisy work machine can be very distracting.
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@DogsB said in Review/validate my work PC build:
Sorry that I'm late to this but if you a budget left over consider aftermarket cooling with the emphasis on silent. A noisy work machine can be very distracting.
That's what he got - the Corsair H80i.
I've got the 2 fan version of the same (H100i) and it goes silent until the CPU gets very hot, and you can customise it.@Choonster said in Review/validate my work PC build:
@izzion said in Review/validate my work PC build:
@Choonster
I suspect the problem is less the fan screw and more that you installed the side panel from "too far back" - modern ATX cases are trending toward having the point where the side panel needs to start being very close to the front of the case, and if you start it further back, it doesn't sit all the way down in the track, resulting in the picture.That could be it, the side panels were a bit fiddly to install. I'll have to see if starting closer to the front works.
I've got the Corsair 330R and and the side panels are like that.
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@izzion Unfortunately, I don't think installing the side panels from too far back was the issue; I tried again today and wasn't able to get it working even when installing the side panels from near the front.
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To me, it looks like they sent you the wrong panel part. If you look at the picture, you can see a screwhead-shaped bump on the panel, between the two screws. That's obviously supposed to go over a screw, like it does on the other side (where you can see one at the bottom). Give the manufacturer a call, it doesn't look right.
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@Captain I thought that but looked at a photo on the Corsair site and that's how it is.
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@Choonster It seems that the issue is with your cooler screws. Looking at a picture from Corsair, the screws are meant to be countersunk. Were there are any other screws that came with the cooler?
Also, it kinda looks like you have washers underneath the screws (unless that's just what the screw head looks like). If so, can you remove them?
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@Deadfast Right, I found the cooler manual and they are washers which Corsair explicitly tell you to put in, and there don't seem to be any alternative screws. So good job there Corsair. I like their other products but their cheap cases are pretty crap from my experience (but I guess that is true for any cheap case in general).
So yeah, just ignore what they say and try it without the washers. If that doesn't work, you can:
- Contact Corsair and demand a resolution. The cooler is even listed as compatible on their website so at the very least you'll be able to return either the case or the cooler through Mwave (if they give you any grief like demanding a "restocking fee", feel free to drop a mention of the Australian Consumer Law guarantees).
- Remove one of the four screws. As long as the radiator doesn't vibrate (I don't think it will), she'll be right.
- See if you can mount the radiator at the front instead, put the included fan at the back. Since you don't have a graphics card it shouldn't be an issue.
- The screws look pretty standard. You could drop by Bunnings and see if you can find a replacement that would fit better.
- Deal with the case panel not seating properly.
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@Deadfast said in Review/validate my work PC build:
@Deadfast Right, I found the cooler manual and they are washers which Corsair explicitly tell you to put in, and there don't seem to be any alternative screws. So good job there Corsair. I like their other products but their cheap cases are pretty crap from my experience (but I guess that is true for any cheap case in general).
So yeah, just ignore what they say and try it without the washers. If that doesn't work, you can:
- Contact Corsair and demand a resolution. The cooler is even listed as compatible on their website so at the very least you'll be able to return either the case or the cooler through Mwave (if they give you any grief like demanding a "restocking fee", feel free to drop a mention of the Australian Consumer Law guarantees).
- Remove one of the four screws. As long as the radiator doesn't vibrate (I don't think it will), she'll be right.
- See if you can mount the radiator at the front instead, put the included fan at the back. Since you don't have a graphics card it shouldn't be an issue.
- The screws look pretty standard. You could drop by Bunnings and see if you can find a replacement that would fit better.
- Deal with the case panel not seating properly.
Thanks for the detailed response.
Yes, the screws and washers were the only ones provided with the cooler. I'll try without the washers, but I don't think removing one of the screws would help since they both seem to be blocking the side panel.
If that doesn't work, I'll probably contact Corsair.
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I decided to submit a ticket to Corsair anyway, but their support website is broken and won't load the ticket I've submitted; hopefully they get that working at some point.
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@Choonster said in Review/validate my work PC build:
I decided to submit a ticket to Corsair anyway, but their support website is broken
You should file a ticket about that.
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