Cartman sucks at hardware
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@owatson said in Cartman sucks at hardware:
but the creatures' actions would have tons of race conditions forcing it to do things one at a time.
You fail at simulations forever. If your simulation steps depend on the order in which you update the entities, and not in the state of the previous state, your simulation is not deterministic.
Simulations are a perfect example of perfectly parallelizable calculations. Pro tip: use a buffer instead of updating in place, and your race conditions disappear. If it's still 32 bit, the most memory it could have been using anyway is 4 GB, which is in the low end for a current pc so doubling that wouldn't be an issue.
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@blakeyrat Dwarves being telepathic wasn't part of the original design, it is tongue in cheek rationalization of the behavior of the implementation. Functionally, there is no difference if the dwarf's telepathy were limited to the state of play at the start of the tick, rather than everything every other actor has done on the same tick. Stupid behaviors might be delayed up to 1 whole tick!
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@Kian The bit you're missing is that here's absolutely no evidence that the developers of Dwarf Fortress know what the hell they're doing at all.
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@blakeyrat said in Cartman sucks at hardware:
the developers of Dwarf Fortress know what the hell they're doing at all.
That was an assumption made on your part, not theirs....
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@owatson said in Cartman sucks at hardware:
Anything you can see, you're dwarfs also know of.
Why?
why does Dwarf X know that i've seen an ore piece 387 kilometers away?
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@blakeyrat
I thought it's just one developer, Tarn Adams?
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@owatson it is. I followed it for awhile. Clearly the actual programming has been a learning process, and his core interests are in the worldbuilding, not the development.
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@owatson that may be how the game works, but it isn't required to work like this.
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@blakeyrat said in Cartman sucks at hardware:
Does a monster in Seattle need to know what a monster in Boston is doing?
if they are kanji monsters like the one in your avatar, maybe they can see each other?
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@fbmac
ITYM "kaijuu" not "kanji"
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@owatson what they are doing in seattle and boston anyway? we know all a kaiju wants is to destroy Tokio
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@fbmac said in Cartman sucks at hardware:
we know all a kaiju wants is to destroy Tokio
where do they go to destroy a city after Tokyo is rubble?
I some how doubt they'd go for numi numiburi, Seatale or New Yourk City would be a much more satisfying crunch underfoot.
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@accalia I think they would just sleep a few years until the japanese rebuild it, to attack it again.
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@owatson said in Cartman sucks at hardware:
I thought it's just one developer, Tarn Adams?
How is that relevant to anything I've said?
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@fbmac why sleep? you can just keep circumnavigating the world destroying as you go. they're bound to have finished rebuilding by the time you get back to them and this way you destroy more things than those lazy Kai-juice that sleep all the time
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@owatson said in Cartman sucks at hardware:
shiny that was dropped by another dwarf four floors up and across the map. So the dwarf's actions are affected instantly.
But it was dropped. The dropping happened in the previous game tick. The act of dropping will have to be pulled from main memory somewhere, regardless of which CPU contemplates going to pick it up, so it doesn't impede multithreading.
You may need to set aside a journal where updates to mostly static data are logged to be applied in a (possibly also multithreaded) world update phase. That dropped shiny is new this tick, but it may be static for hundreds or thousands of ticks, and you don't want to copy it each tick.
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@blakeyrat
Well, one man can only do so much, and there are bugs to be fixed before undertaking some crazy multithreading rewrite...
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@owatson So the answer is: it has NOTHING to do with what I said.
A competent developer wouldn't have written an AI-intensive game without threading in the first place.
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@accalia said in Cartman sucks at hardware:
where do they go to destroy a city after Tokyo is rubble?
Kyoto?
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@RaceProUK nah. if they do that they'll stop putting on those nice kabuki theatre productions, and even kaiju appreciate a good kabuki theatre.
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@blakeyrat
I don't know who is claiming that the game is written competently. I'm just claiming that it is fun, but requires intensive cpu. That's all.
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Back to hardware sucking, does anyone know if there are products that can put a fan across the 5.25" bay covers in a case? Asking for the lulz.
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@Tsaukpaetra nothing that duct tape, super glue and a small hacksaw couldn't do...
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Hold on, I jsut had a crazy idea. Since the fans are pulling air into the computer and then the cpu and etc are warming it up, could we use a turbine on the outlet to drive an extra fan?
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It must be getting late in the day. I've seen this thread a dozen different times and only just now the engine chimes in with a snide remark.
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@Tsaukpaetra said in Cartman sucks at hardware:
anyone know if there are products that can put a fan across the 5.25" bay covers in a case?
a TIG welder will do that no problem.
so will a MIG but the TIG gives you a better finished product
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@accalia said in Cartman sucks at hardware:
a TIG welder will do that no problem.
so will a MIG but the TIG gives you a better finished productI'm not that big on case mods, but maybe I'll see what kind of welder my dad has (totally forgot, but IIRC it has gas tanks or something).
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@Tsaukpaetra said in Cartman sucks at hardware:
otally forgot, but IIRC it has gas tanks or something
oxyacetalyne welding? that's a bit overkill for the thin mild steel you find on computer cases these days. very much overkill for those crap aluminium cases.
oxy's good for heavy guage steel where you want to weld and/or cut holes in it.
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@accalia said in Cartman sucks at hardware:
@Tsaukpaetra said in Cartman sucks at hardware:
otally forgot, but IIRC it has gas tanks or something
oxyacetalyne welding? that's a bit overkill for the thin mild steel you find on computer cases these days. very much overkill for those crap aluminium cases.
oxy's good for heavy guage steel where you want to weld and/or cut holes in it.
A TIG need some inert gas (Argon or Helium) to remove the oxygen around the part you are welding.
As do a MIG, unless you use fluxcore wire.
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@Tsaukpaetra said in Cartman sucks at hardware:
Back to hardware sucking, does anyone know if there are products that can put a fan across the 5.25" bay covers in a case? Asking for the lulz.
Lazyweb strikes again.
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@loopback0 said in Cartman sucks at hardware:
Lazyweb strikes again.
5.25" Bay Fans | Page 1 | Sort By: Product Title A-Z - FrozenCPU.com
I actually got one of the single-slot ones, but found it too noisy for my purposes (seriously, tiny fans are almost synonymous with wonderful high-pitched noise).
Rather, looking for one that would fit a normal fan, of the size to span the full width (and probably height) of three bays. It doesn't appear that that variant exists...@TimeBandit said in Cartman sucks at hardware:
Argon
Yeah, I think that's what one of the tanks was. Never used the welder myself. ;)
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@Tsaukpaetra
They exist too, I just linked the first result.I looked at them, but just bought a case with space for enough fans instead.
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@Tsaukpaetra said in Cartman sucks at hardware:
Yeah, I think that's what one of the tanks was. Never used the welder myself. ;)
You are missing on a lot of fun
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@loopback0 said in Cartman sucks at hardware:
a case with space for enough fans instead.
The space that the "server" sits in wouldn't allow such a case, so I deal. I eventually hope to expand a second set of hard drives up in the empty bays (gonna need a raid card though, the MB only had so many SATA ports).
Money permitting I would rebuild with something else in an area that's not right next to my bed, but I think the soft white noise generated by the machine is somewhat soothing...
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@Tsaukpaetra said in Cartman sucks at hardware:
I actually got one of the single-slot ones, but found it too noisy for my purposes (seriously, tiny fans are almost synonymous with wonderful high-pitched noise).
Rather, looking for one that would fit a normal fan, of the size to span the full width (and probably height) of three bays. It doesn't appear that that variant exists...My case (Antec 900-2) includes two enclosures the size of three 5¼" bays which contain a filter and intake fan in the front, room behind that for three 3½" drives in anti-vibration suspension, or an optional second fan at the back. I'm expecting to replace that case next build though - the dust filter is a bugger to get at.
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@PleegWat said in Cartman sucks at hardware:
My case (Antec 900-2)
I'll have to wait until I get home to check what I have, but this is probably technically true for my case as well.
If I remember, I might even post a pic....
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@PleegWat said in Cartman sucks at hardware:
includes two enclosures the size of three 5¼" bays which contain a filter and intake fan in the front, room behind that for three 3½" drives in anti-vibration suspension, or an optional second fan at the back
Mine has that too. And space for 2 x 120/140mm fans (or a 240/280mm radiator) at the top.
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@loopback0 said in Cartman sucks at hardware:
@PleegWat said in Cartman sucks at hardware:
includes two enclosures the size of three 5¼" bays which contain a filter and intake fan in the front, room behind that for three 3½" drives in anti-vibration suspension, or an optional second fan at the back
Mine has that too. And space for 2 x 120/140mm fans (or a 240/280mm radiator) at the top.
Mine came with the large radiator on top, a smaller one at the back, and space for an extra one in the side panel, though I never put one in. Plus the two intakes on front. Problem is I have to remove both side plates and unscrew the drive enclosures to get at the dust filters - 20 screws in total.
I'm still considering my next build, including when I'll be doing it. My current i5-750 is aging well, currently on its 3rd video card and had its ram doubled to 8gb. Back when I built it I was still running a RAID array in the desktop - one of the reasons the anti-vibrating drive bays appealed. However I got a NAS and later an SSD years ago so nowadays the fans are the only moving parts.
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@PleegWat Mine had 1 fan (and an empty space) at the front and 1 fan at the rear. I added the radiator at the top as it's part of the closed-loop CPU cooler. I don't need a 2nd fan at the front so that space is still empty.
The dust filter is on the outside of the fans (inside the door) and can be removed in seconds.
Has noise reducing stuff on the door and the sides too.
(the panel on the top is removed when the radiator/fans are installed)
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@Tsaukpaetra said in Cartman sucks at hardware:
@loopback0 said in Cartman sucks at hardware:
Lazyweb strikes again.
5.25" Bay Fans | Page 1 | Sort By: Product Title A-Z - FrozenCPU.com
I actually got one of the single-slot ones, but found it too noisy for my purposes (seriously, tiny fans are almost synonymous with wonderful high-pitched noise).
Rather, looking for one that would fit a normal fan, of the size to span the full width (and probably height) of three bays. It doesn't appear that that variant exists...@TimeBandit said in Cartman sucks at hardware:
Argon
Yeah, I think that's what one of the tanks was. Never used the welder myself. ;)
Theese may be cheaper, and get you 4x 3.5" bays for 'free', if they fit.
http://www.coolermaster.com/case/case-accessories/4-in-3-device-module/
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@swayde said in Cartman sucks at hardware:
Theese may be cheaper, and get you 4x 3.5" bays for 'free', if they fit.
That almost looks precisely ideal. Cable management's going to be a ■■■■■■ though... Then again, it already is for the case I'm using. sigh.
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@Tsaukpaetra I've used them for years, while they're not perfect, they're good for the price. I ended up Buying some norco 5 in 3 hotswap instead, clause it's a bitch getting to the drives in the Cooler Master module. You have to recove the entire module to get at one drive, plus i wanted some individual drive leds.
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@TimeBandit said in Cartman sucks at hardware:
You are missing on a lot of fun
Wrong.
EDIT: Oh, sorry, posted from the wrong account.
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@accalia said in Cartman sucks at hardware:
where do they go to destroy a city after Tokyo is rubble?
San Fransisco. Especially in western made movies because Hollywood hates San Fransisco...
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@loopback0 My case came with room for 2 140mm fans and a Russian bride.
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@accalia said in Cartman sucks at hardware:
in less than a single game tick?
One game tick is 72 seconds. What's your reaction time?
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@ben_lubar said in Cartman sucks at hardware:
@accalia said in Cartman sucks at hardware:
in less than a single game tick?
One game tick is 72 seconds. What's your reaction time?
over a distance of two stories? rather longer than that unless someone text messages me about the shiny. and why would they do that before stealing my undefended shiney for themselves?.
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@accalia what if you're standing at the top of 3 flights of stairs?
Anyway, if the game also had to track the set of objects each dwarf could see or think about separately, that'd take exponentially more RAM and CPU time.
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@ben_lubar said in Cartman sucks at hardware:
@accalia what if you're standing at the top of 3 flights of stairs?
Anyway, if the game also had to track the set of objects each dwarf could see or think about separately, that'd take exponentially more RAM and CPU time.
then it would either be suicide (or at least very dangerous) for me to traverse that distance in that time frame or it would still be out of my field of vision due to the turns in the stairwell.