Idiot thinks you should use IRC instead of Slack
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But I'm also sick of these IRC
supportersopponents blatantly lying about what isn't part of IRC and what isn't.FTFY.
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I'm not sure what your point is in replying like that here.
I'm trying to say that keeping track of your messages if you accidentally go offline isn't a "fancy" feature, its an expected feature in any modern chat system. Again, Live Messenger has had offline messages for how many decades at this point?
Sorry I wasn't more explicit.
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But I'm also sick of these IRC supporters blatantly lying about what is part of IRC and what isn't
I thought you were the one lying about that stuff.
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I'm trying to say that keeping track of your messages if you accidentally go offline isn't a "fancy" feature, its an expected feature in any modern chat system.
Lync does not support this, but it's certainly "modern." And it's made by Micro$shit! Must be good!!!!11
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I don't see why that's such a difficult concept.
go to server whatever.com, type "/join #somechannel"
This. If you think that is an easy task I hope you don't have to work with end users a lot.
Not that it is and incredible difficult task but still not an easy one.
Think of it like configuring Outlook (pre-2013). As an IT drone I still wouldn't trust most to configure it right by just handing them the connection details. But hey look at that in 2013 I just have to enter my e-mail address and it figures everything else out. Not giving somebody a multi page setup instruction and hope they'll figure it out. This is why you killed your own argument by making it.
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yes it does.
So when you say "IRC" what you actually mean is "IRC plus a lot of stupid little server side bots you have to chat with to do basic fucking operations and also a GUI client that prints text in an awful font". Let's define our terms here.
See, when I say "IRC" I actually meant IRC. Stupid me.
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I'm trying to say that keeping track of your messages if you accidentally go offline isn't a "fancy" feature, its an expected feature in any modern chat system. Again, Live Messenger has had offline messages for how many decades at this point?
I dunno...I've really only used Quassel as a client and it remembers all of my history. You lying liar. I haven't used it for a couple of years probably, and I just fired it up and...there it all was.
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... you people are literally sticking your fingers in your ears...
Exaggerate much?
I'm a dick, okay? I get it.
And knowing is half the battle.
Half.
Mac
in enterpriseis
FTFY.
Source: My experience with Macs.
Enjoy your victim complex, you angry fuck.
Quoted for my amusement.
Right but that's not how he wrote the article; he wrote it as if he were making an argument that IRC was a better product...
I agree. It's bad writing.
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I was talking about how simple the protocol is. @dse said:
If only IRC had a nice CLI:
./irc -f cnx.json "@company behold #LOL #SongOfTheDay http://frking.tiny.url"That is what snowflakes like blakey look for.
And I said you could do it through almost literally any method imaginable. I am sorry that you are so stupid you can't even read posts in your own thread.
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That is literally IRC. They are developed as extensions of the ORIGINAL IRC protocol. I guess HTTPS isn't fucking HTTP because it's not in the original spec, ignoring the fact that a newer spec exists that defines the extension of the protocol. You're a complete fucking moron.
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Huh, oh well. Not sure how long that's been up. Guess I'll shut down my server.
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But hey look at that in 2013 I just have to enter my e-mail address and it figures everything else out.
If your Active Directory Domain is set up correctly you don't even do that.
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Lync does
notsupport thisIt has done so since the days it was called Communicator. If your instance doesn't feature it then your admins must have done something wrong.
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I dunno...I've really only used Quassel as a client and it remembers all of my history.
How?
Does it have like some third-party that logs channels it consults? Or by "history" do you mean "history of what was posted while my computer was online, but missing the stuff when I was offline?"
You lying liar. I haven't used it for a couple of years probably, and I just fired it up and...there it all was.
What was the timestamp on the most recent message it showed you?
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Okay, tell me what "Away - No IM" means? It means "not active on an IM device" meaning they can't get IMs unless they're on a device that can get them (unlike their desk phones).
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I was talking about how simple the protocol is.
Now explain how "the protocol is simple" is a software feature that I, or any end-user, should give a flying fuck about?
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I wasn't talking about users, you strawmanning idiot. I was responding to dse's post about CLI support.
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If your Active Directory Domain is set up correctly you don't even do that.
Even better! I guess being in the early upgrade group has it's down sides. Doesn't really matter. Getting Outlook to work has been getting better every time I had to use it since version 2010.
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Okay, tell me what "Away - No IM" means? It means "not active on an IM device" meaning they can't get IMs unless they're on a device that can get them (unlike their desk phones).
It means your admin turned off offline messages, probably due to some misguided advice from an auditor or lawyer.
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https://community.office365.com/en-us/f/166/t/293358
Nice lying, actually.
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Oh and BTW, don't fucking change the title of my threads without asking me first. Discourse may trust you with that ability, but I sure as fuck do not.
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Who said we needed your permission?
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If you think that is an easy task I hope you don't have to work with end users a lot.
Look, I work with clients that call in every week asking how to do a basic function of the application that's not hard given what's involved. But I'm also aware that 11 year olds can handle IRC. If I needed a person to use IRC regularly who was the kind who just can't remember how to connect, I'd write them a simple start script in mIRC that logs them in.
I'm still not saying that Slack's not better than IRC. I'm just saying that if you can't figure out how to use mIRC there's probably something wrong with you. Little kids can do it. Grandmas can do it. The kind of people who can't are dyslexic or afraid of computers, IMEE.
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It's been there a month. You don't need to close your server if you like to run it.
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But hey look at that in 2013 I just have to enter my e-mail address and it figures everything else out.
Oddly enough, however my company has email configured, the wizard cannot figure out how to connect.
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Obviously it's redundant though, so I guess there's really no point in keeping it up. Not really a lot of users anyway.
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Not giving somebody a multi page setup instruction and hope they'll figure it out.
Bah. I could probably give someone a single-page set of instructions including screenshots to set up mIRC and get to a particular channel on a particular server, and I only say "probably" because I haven't used IRC in 10 years, so I don't remember what the website looks like so I don't know how big the screenshots are.
Just because I make assumptions here that people are tech-savvy doesn't mean I do that with people IRL, just like supposedly the person behind @blakeyrat isn't an utter asshole IRL.
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By far the best IRC client on windows. I hope everyone here has a long hard think about what exactly that means.
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I dunno...I've really only used Quassel as a client and it remembers all of my history. You lying liar. I haven't used it for a couple of years probably, and I just fired it up and...there it all was.
I think he's saying that if you go offline, you won't get the messages that were sent while you were offline, when you go back online, unlike with IM, and that's certainly a valid complaint, and would require a server change.
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It means "not active on an IM device" meaning they can't get IMs
Uhu ...
I guess that button 'gemist' (missed) is a lie
Oh well doesn't matter because I receive message in my mailbox when I'm offline too.
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who was the kind who just can't remember how to connect, I'd write them a simple start script in mIRC that logs them in.
Yes so you as a IT specialist solve that issue for them. Great! Such great usability.
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That's kind of your job.
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The point isn't whether a person can/can't set it up. That is not the point. That is a tiny bit of the point, but only a very tiny bit.
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Does it have like some third-party that logs channels it consults? Or by "history" do you mean "history of what was posted while my computer was online, but missing the stuff when I was offline?"
Yes, that. One of the channels I was on has someone who maintains online logs of everything that happens there. Or used to. I haven't kept up.
What was the timestamp on the most recent message it showed you?
Aside from stuff this morning after I opened it up: November 16, 2014. 00:56:55
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I think he's saying that if you go offline, you won't get the messages that were sent while you were offline, when you go back online, unlike with IM, and that's certainly a valid complaint, and would require a server change.
Yeah, I get that now that he responded to my post. It wasn't clear to me what he was saying, though.
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At least I learned from this thread that Slack doesn't have an "on-premise" version, so now I can stop worrying because until it does have that, there's no way in hell we're using it. Which is good, because I'd rather avoid a conversation with my boss where I explain to him that no, I'm not installing some shitty app on my personal cell phone just because he asked me to, and I'm definitely not going to "be available on work chat just in case" when I'm not at work - which would probably become an expectation with Slack's push notifications and mobile support. Eff that. When I'm in the office I'm on IRC and available and once I log off, I cease to exist till I log back in as far as my employer is concerned.
Amen to that. The only guys worse than the messenger hipsters are the one who keep arguing in every meeting for for months on end that Google Docs and Google Calendar and whatnot are such superior products that we absolutely have to use them for business documents and that they're so much more productive since they've been forwarding all their company mail to their private gmail
@jmp said:
So shitty they built Slack on top of it? Wow. That's shitty.(IRC is a /protocol/, not a product)
Right, but the problem is: it's a really shitty one.
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since they've been forwarding all their company mail to their private gmail
Inb4 Hillary Clinton
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Look, I'm an end-user. I do not give a fuck if it's a protocol, if it's a dancing clam, or if it's Celine Dion. The point is, someone shows me a web interface and tells me, "hey, this is IRC." And I use it, and it's shit. Utter shit. Complete ass.
What would you say if I told you Twitch Chat is IRC?
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Amen to that. The only guys worse than the messenger hipsters are the one who keep arguing in every meeting for for months on end that Google Docs and Google Calendar and whatnot are such superior products that we absolutely have to use them for business documents and that they're so much more productive since they've been forwarding all their company mail to their private gmail
I'm so glad we're a HIPAA company. I worked for a company a year or two back that used Google Hangouts for almost everything, and that thing is awful. Not to mention having to figure out how to somehow make a Google+ account for my workplace without having it "magically" linked in any way to my home account. (Almost impossible; I ended up using a totally different browser solely for Google Hangouts.)
What would you say if I told you Twitch Chat is IRC?
I don't really use it, so I don't care?
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It has done so since the days it was called Communicator.
It still is called Communicator for us
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Is the onion company provided?
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As far as I'm concerned Slack is a direct copy of Hipchat, and when I already use Hipchat why would I ever switch to a differently branded version of exactly the same thing?
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It's called Skype for Business now. Go figure.
Fun fact: If you installed the new Skype for Business client and still hadn't migrated your servers from Lync, the client disguised itself UI-wise as a Lync client. You could force it to use the Skype branding with a registry key. :WTF:
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Fun fact: If you installed the new Skype for Business client and still hadn't migrated your servers from Lync, the client disguised itself UI-wise as a Lync client. You could force it to use the Skype branding with a registry key.
afaik, it can be forced to the old UI with AD, because companies are terrified of change, but it uses the new UI by default. Mine started in the new UI, then rebooted with the old. Then I installed 2016, and it stopped that.
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Yeah, you're probably right.
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But that's not part of IRC, that's a shitty awful "solution" someone built on top of IRC specifically because the IRC protocol is so fucking terrible that it didn't anticipate that need.
Oh and because it's built on top of IRC, natch is has a terrible user experience. Because the only way to send it directions is to "chat" with it. Standard login/pass dialog? Can't use it on IRC! Why would you be able to? That's ridiculous.
The vast majority of clients automate NickServ interaction because it's so common. You say what username and password to use when connecting to server X, it talks to NickServ for you.
It's part of the IRC ecosystem, even if it isn't part of IRC the protocol. Strictly speaking display for users is not part of the IRC protocol, the concept of a 'font' isn't part of the IRC protocol, graphical mechanisms for selecting a server or channel aren't part of the IRC protocol, etc. etc., but it'd be a strange or specialized IRC client that didn't do those.
If you think that's "easy to interface with" then you're disqualified from every judging the usability of software ever. Because you have no fucking clue.
If someone can't read text and follow simple instructions I would prefer to not chat with them; it's a useful filter.
(Also, as mentioned above, most clients automate it for you).
I have, but I didn't use the "nickserv" because I have no passwords I feel comfortable giving in plaintext (because you just chat to it like a person, it's all plaintext of course-- IRC also has shitty "security" if you can even call it security) and I wasn't going to make up and memorize a new password for a dumb chat client I'd already decided I wasn't going to use again.
IRC passwords should definitely go in the same class of throwaway doesn't-matter-if-this-leaks as passwords for little forums or the like, yes.
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IRC passwords should definitely go in the same class of throwaway doesn't-matter-if-this-leaks as passwords for little forums or the like, yes.
I agree, but that's no excuse for them to be sent plaintext.
I'm amazed all the geeky nerdy geek nerd dork geeks don't care about that.
