Just Souls Things
-
@Groaner said in Just Souls Things:
There seems to be a bug or feature where if you can instigate monster infighting, that you still get runes from every kill.
That's how it works in all soulsborneringtwice games. Every soulsborneringtwice game has an easy grinding exploit related to that. Dragon bridge in DS1 comes to mind (a semi-scripted event and you still get souls).
I also don't like games where "dodge" means anything other than "move the character out of the way of danger using normal movement controls," because otherwise it implies iframes. Iframes as a mechanic are awful design because they boil down to "push this button to not die."
Why are you buying From Software games again?
-
-
@Arantor said in Just Souls Things:
Fake news, anybody can concoct the existence of a major motion picture these days.
-
@Gribnit ah but was it fake news in 1986?
-
@Arantor I'll check.
-
-
@PleegWat said in Just Souls Things:
@Groaner said in Just Souls Things:
If I wanted roleplay, I'd go on a WoW RP server and hang with my good pal MacSpitterton, who only communicates using /spit emotes*.
Didn't they remove that emote? Or was that just the player-targeted version?
Most of what I say pertaining to WoW is probably based on 15-year-old data, since I have not yet seen a compelling reason to go back since.
The most fun I had in that game was abusing the sentry totem floating glitch in Arathi Basin next to cliffs and baiting rogues and warriors into charging me and falling to their deaths.
-
@Gąska said in Just Souls Things:
@Groaner said in Just Souls Things:
There seems to be a bug or feature where if you can instigate monster infighting, that you still get runes from every kill.
That's how it works in all soulsborneringtwice games. Every soulsborneringtwice game has an easy grinding exploit related to that. Dragon bridge in DS1 comes to mind (a semi-scripted event and you still get souls).
Good to know. For all that people complain about dying and losing a ton of runes, the game seems to provide a lot of ways to make collecting them relatively easy.
I also don't like games where "dodge" means anything other than "move the character out of the way of danger using normal movement controls," because otherwise it implies iframes. Iframes as a mechanic are awful design because they boil down to "push this button to not die."
Why are you buying From Software games again?
Because several friends started playing the game and convinced me to get it as well, and I forgot to post in this thread beforehand to gain your blessing to acquire it.
Irregardless, I reserve the right to critique and complain about what I perceive as crappy design as informed by my three decades of gaming experience. If in a game like Counter-Strike, players had a spammable dodge-roll button that made them briefly invincible to all bullets, an angry mob with pitchforks and torches would descend on Valve's HQ and not leave until they had GabeN's head on a pike.
This is actually a good test in general for a lot of other stupid game mechanics. What if in Counter-Strike, you had a Headshot skill, and pressed TAB to cycle through potential targets so that when you activated the skill, it would result in a guaranteed kill? What if there was an AoE Fear skill that would cause all afflicted players to immediately lose control of their characters and run around aimlessly (with only a 3 minute cooldown skill available to cancel the status effect) so that you and your teammates could
freely stack DoTsshoot them like fish in a barrel?And now you know some of the beefs I have with WoW!
-
@Groaner Не путай кислого с длинным.
I don't like Souls mechanics as much as the next pathetic scrub, but your WoW vs CS comparison is not even wrong.
-
@Applied-Mediocrity said in Just Souls Things:
@Groaner Не путай кислого с длинным.
I don't like Souls mechanics as much as the next pathetic scrub, but your WoW vs CS comparison is not even wrong.
Would you play a first-person shooter where you could only attack or shoot every ~2 seconds, and your knife slashes/gunshots would always hit, if and only if you had selected a target beforehand? How about if all the "good" skills were behind 30 second/3 minute/5 minute/30 minute cooldowns?
Or does that sound like a pretty crappy gaming experience?
-
@Groaner said in Just Souls Things:
Would you play a first-person shooter where you could only attack or shoot every ~2 seconds, and your knife slashes/gunshots would always hit, if and only if you had selected a target beforehand?
as long as it's rap-battle themed
-
@Groaner different genres need different mechanics. MMORPGs are not 1st person shooters. News at 11.
-
@Groaner said in Just Souls Things:
Would you play a first-person shooter where you could only attack or shoot every ~2 seconds, and your knife slashes/gunshots would always hit, if and only if you had selected a target beforehand? How about if all the "good" skills were behind 30 second/3 minute/5 minute/30 minute cooldowns?
Would you play a first-person shooter where you launch the ball with a spring and then twiddle the flippers as it falls down, in hopes that it will hit the enemy?
They are different games requiring different sets of skills -- that a sizeable number of people evidently already have or can acquire.
informed by my three decades of gaming experience
Put it on your Tinder profile, for all the good you think it might add to any discussion.
I almost want to hear your decades of experience based opinion about Pathfinder videogames, on no less than the Core difficulty. Except I've heard it too many times already that the design is shit, because it's stacked against you with impossible, bloated stats, rigged RNG, minmaxer builds, cheesing, metagaming and so on.
And if your friends insist on Elden Ring being some kind of epitome of gaming... well, you seem like a strongly opinioned kind of fellow. Change your friends. Tell them to stuff their bloody ring up their shitholes, so that the next time they receive anal, they can really feel it rubbing because the ring will get stuck on the dick that's giving - but if there's two or more, it's going to cause the Shattering.
-
@Applied-Mediocrity said in Just Souls Things:
Tell them to stuff their bloody ring up their shitholes, so that the next time they receive anal, they can really feel it rubbing because the ring will get stuck on the dick that's giving - but if there's two or more, it's going to cause the Shattering.
Try fingers
but hole
-
-
@Benjamin-Hall said in Just Souls Things:
@Groaner different genres need different mechanics. MMORPGs are not 1st person shooters. News at 11.
That's fine. But that different genres exist does not mean that we cannot compare user experience or can't be critical of differences or shortcomings therein. I don't want, for example, "because it's a MOBA" to be the decisive rebuttal to anyone who objects to RTS controls and their associated roundtrip latency to control a single character, when pretty much every other genre out there with multiplayer has much better methods of controlling a single character.
-
@Groaner said in Just Souls Things:
If in a game like Counter-Strike, players had a spammable dodge-roll button that made them briefly invincible to all bullets, an angry mob with pitchforks and torches would descend on Valve's HQ and not leave until they had GabeN's head on a pike.
The technical term is "CSGO'd"
-
@Applied-Mediocrity said in Just Souls Things:
@Groaner said in Just Souls Things:
Would you play a first-person shooter where you could only attack or shoot every ~2 seconds, and your knife slashes/gunshots would always hit, if and only if you had selected a target beforehand? How about if all the "good" skills were behind 30 second/3 minute/5 minute/30 minute cooldowns?
Would you play a first-person shooter where you launch the ball with a spring and then twiddle the flippers as it falls down, in hopes that it will hit the enemy?
First person meaning that the camera is fixed to the ball? Sure, sounds like an interesting twist, and it sounds like it requires a decent amount of player skill.
They are different games requiring different sets of skills -- that a sizeable number of people evidently already have or can acquire.
And some games require more player skill than others.
informed by my three decades of gaming experience
Put it on your Tinder profile, for all the good you think it might add to any discussion.
I disagree. Someone who's put in thousands of hours over a wide variety of genres and titles has a far more valuable opinion than someone who's sitting behind a controller for the first time, particularly when it comes to game design and its implications.
I almost want to hear your decades of experience based opinion about Pathfinder videogames, on no less than the Core difficulty. Except I've heard it too many times already that the design is shit, because it's stacked against you with impossible, bloated stats, rigged RNG, minmaxer builds, cheesing, metagaming and so on.
I haven't even played that and my experience has informed me that those complaints are relatively common and applicable to a wide variety of games. Sometimes, those complaints are even valid. If, for example, a game is so heavily-influenced by RNG that the impact of player actions has been rendered insignificant, that's probably a design problem. Players, in general, should be rewarded for performing correct actions, and punished for incorrect actions.
And if your friends insist on Elden Ring being some kind of epitome of gaming... well, you seem like a strongly opinioned kind of fellow. Change your friends. Tell them to stuff their bloody ring up their shitholes, so that the next time they receive anal, they can really feel it rubbing because the ring will get stuck on the dick that's giving - but if there's two or more, it's going to cause the Shattering.
This sounds like a great way to end up with fewer friends than one started. But, I am more diplomatic than that. See, another thing about those thousands of hours logged is that you develop very fussy and refined appetites that are rarely sated, and learn to manage your expectations accordingly. I know, for example, that the Mount & Blade series has had far better horseback fighting controls than Elden Ring for years, but I still put up with them.
-
@Groaner said in Just Souls Things:
Mount & Blade series has had far better horseback fighting controls
I haven't played that at all, but, well, the name suggests that's something they might have put quite a bit of thought into getting right, as it appears to be a rather important aspect of the game.
-
@HardwareGeek said in Just Souls Things:
@Groaner said in Just Souls Things:
Mount & Blade series has had far better horseback fighting controls
I haven't played that at all, but, well, the name suggests that's something they might have put quite a bit of thought into getting right, as it appears to be a rather important aspect of the game.
Kinda...
M&B is, at later game stages, a real-time tactical simulator, more than anything else. In fact, in the new Bannerlord, I've mostly been shying away from personal combat, focusing on making the best of my troops instead.
-
@Groaner said in Just Souls Things:
we cannot compare user experience or can't be critical of differences or shortcomings therein
A mechanic does not become a shortcoming solely because you don't like it.
Elden Ring has stupid shit going on, starting with the fact that it's once again a shitty console port.
I recently mentioned the artbook and soundtrack. Both are Unity engine executables, and fuck all do they, but show Start (the slideshow or the muzak player), Language and Exit. Unless some intern was tasked to make them for training purposes, it's a patently stupid way to do it. I made some presentations this way (that didn't have to be handed in) in college, because I was flexing my leet coder brain muscles and showing off. It was also patently stupid.
I disagree. Someone who's put in thousands of hours over a wide variety of genres and titles has a far more valuable opinion than someone who's sitting behind a controller for the first time, particularly when it comes to game design and its implications.
And I have ranted around here myself that developers should be forced to play games at work, certain amount of time per day, so that they know what kind of shit everybody's making. I hoped that would be a learning experience, but @Tsaukpaetra graciously explained - and I had to agree - that there's certain amount of cargo cult in the industry, and these little things (that make the whole) that piss me off aren't even considered. It's just how things are done, and that's how it is. Nobody gives a shit about your wisdom of ancients. Nor mine.
But assuming somebody did:
If they want to cater to their existing customer base, your opinion might be valid. Or it might be biased. I think it's 50/50.
If they want to sell it to the new guy, your experienced opinion will most likely be worth bupkis. In fact that is why many tutorials suck a flaccid one. It's very difficult for someone experienced to get the mindset of a new player. Worse, someone new to videogames as a thing.
My favorite pony Pathfinder had and keeps having issues with it. Ain't nobody who hasn't already done so is going to read the 600-page Core Rulebook (which isn't even implemented right anyway), not to mention the rest of the tomes, to understand all the "spooky action at a distance" (said @Benjamin-Hall). And yet you must teach your new players somehow, coupled with the ways how videogame differs from tabletop.a game is so heavily-influenced by RNG
I would guess the d20 is probably the most recognizable tabletop element next to the standard deck of cards and the d6.
Usually effective strategies exist to mitigate the element of chance. They may not be obvious or even intuitive.Players, in general, should be rewarded for performing correct actions, and punished for incorrect actions.
Said correct actions are perfect dodgerolling for iframes and exploiting various kinds of grind. Your reward is being able to continue playing the game. Tough bloody bastards, them japs. Damn thing is they made such good cameras.
The same way you exploit
in Original SIn. It sounds and looks kind of stupid that you can win battles by being able to not die while being on fire for longer than your enemies, but that's what it is.@Groaner said in Just Souls Things:
Mount & Blade series has had far better horseback fighting
Ass. Creed, MGS V, Twitchers and Red LED Redemption also have mounted combat. Which one sucks horsecock more than either Elden Souls or
Mercedes BenzMen & Blacks
-
@Applied-Mediocrity said in Just Souls Things:
Nobody gives a shit about your wisdom of ancients.
Of course not. CADT.
-
@HardwareGeek And now that that's out of the way, I eagerly await the QooC about my favorite pony (and the issues with it).
-
@HardwareGeek said in Just Souls Things:
@Groaner said in Just Souls Things:
Mount & Blade series has had far better horseback fighting controls
I haven't played that at all, but, well, the name suggests that's something they might have put quite a bit of thought into getting right, as it appears to be a rather important aspect of the game.
The first one was a labor of love* made by a Turkish husband-wife team, and Warband has enough depth to it that old as it is, you might still sink a lot of hours into it, as there's a lot to do from jousting tournaments to field battles to besieging castles to partaking in politics to building your kingdom.
You might call it a multi-genre game as it's a FPS first and foremost, but you command and fight alongside your army, and as @GOG says, later on you're more hands-off. This is especially important as if you're KO'ed it can result in your army taking heavy losses they otherwise would not.
*inb4
-
@GOG said in Just Souls Things:
@HardwareGeek said in Just Souls Things:
@Groaner said in Just Souls Things:
Mount & Blade series has had far better horseback fighting controls
I haven't played that at all, but, well, the name suggests that's something they might have put quite a bit of thought into getting right, as it appears to be a rather important aspect of the game.
Kinda...
M&B is, at later game stages, a real-time tactical simulator, more than anything else. In fact, in the new Bannerlord, I've mostly been shying away from personal combat, focusing on making the best of my troops instead.
At the same time, there's something thoroughly satisfying about getting the 50+ damage two-handed cleaver that can oneshot most enemy soldiers and then going near the frontlines and taking down the enemy one by one.
I got Bannerlord when it was new, and maybe I'll give it another checkup once I'm done with games relevant to this thread.
-
@Applied-Mediocrity I have been summoned, and so I appear.
-
@Applied-Mediocrity said in Just Souls Things:
@Groaner said in Just Souls Things:
we cannot compare user experience or can't be critical of differences or shortcomings therein
A mechanic does not become a shortcoming solely because you don't like it.
Yes it does. We're talking opinions here, and in the realm of opinion, anything can be a boon or shortcoming. I have justified my position, anyone who disagrees is free to respond to my arguments or advance their own.
Elden Ring has stupid shit going on, starting with the fact that it's once again a shitty console port.
I think we're all on the same page with respect to that.
I recently mentioned the artbook and soundtrack. Both are Unity engine executables, and fuck all do they, but show Start (the slideshow or the muzak player), Language and Exit. Unless some intern was tasked to make them for training purposes, it's a patently stupid way to do it. I made some presentations this way (that didn't have to be handed in) in college, because I was flexing my leet coder brain muscles and showing off. It was also patently stupid.
Maybe Unity was all they knew? This intern theory probably makes the most sense, since you don't want to overload the valuable guys with low-risk stuff.I disagree. Someone who's put in thousands of hours over a wide variety of genres and titles has a far more valuable opinion than someone who's sitting behind a controller for the first time, particularly when it comes to game design and its implications.
And I have ranted around here myself that developers should be forced to play games at work, certain amount of time per day, so that they know what kind of shit everybody's making.
I agree. As someone with a gamedev side gig, I feel market research is important, which is another reason why I elected to jump into this game.
I hoped that would be a learning experience, but @Tsaukpaetra graciously explained - and I had to agree - that there's certain amount of cargo cult in the industry, and these little things (that make the whole) that piss me off aren't even considered. It's just how things are done, and that's how it is. Nobody gives a shit about your wisdom of ancients. Nor mine.
Such a status quo might be depressing... BUT:
It means that if you are a freelance game developer, you have a huge opportunity, since the big boys are too busy constructing airstrips from coconut husks to innovate. Punish them for their complacence.
But assuming somebody did:
If they want to cater to their existing customer base, your opinion might be valid. Or it might be biased. I think it's 50/50.Something something opinion something asshole something.
I don't expect FromSoft to read this thread, nor do I expect them to make any business decisions from here. They have what they believe to be a winning recipe, and they probably don't want to touch it. I'm here only to register my disapproval of certain aspects of their product(s).
If they want to sell it to the new guy, your experienced opinion will most likely be worth bupkis. In fact that is why many tutorials suck a flaccid one. It's very difficult for someone experienced to get the mindset of a new player. Worse, someone new to videogames as a thing.
This is why I have procrastinated on making a tutorial for my game. The thought of having to explain how to press WASD is horrifying. At least, horrifying without a UI/UX team to handle those horrors.
My favorite pony Pathfinder had and keeps having issues with it. Ain't nobody who hasn't already done so is going to read the 600-page Core Rulebook (which isn't even implemented right anyway), not to mention the rest of the tomes, to understand all the "spooky action at a distance" (said @Benjamin-Hall). And yet you must teach your new players somehow, coupled with the ways how videogame differs from tabletop.
Some games really only work with a "fit in or fuck off" model. And that's not necessarily a bad thing.
a game is so heavily-influenced by RNG
I would guess the d20 is probably the most recognizable tabletop element next to the standard deck of cards and the d6.
Usually effective strategies exist to mitigate the element of chance. They may not be obvious or even intuitive.Right, I have no problem with RNG driving certain processes in games. There's a hell of a lot of randomness in a Diablolike, but if you play your character prudently and are wise with your equipment, stats, and skills, you will usually do very well.
Contrast this to Darkest Dungeon, where you can have a well-equipped party of excellent composition, and then through RNG the boss makes your entire party afflicted and your party wipes soon after through no obvious fault of the player (especially since the player more or less loses control of afflicted characters, and afflicted characters generally cause snowballing affliction in the rest of the party).
Players, in general, should be rewarded for performing correct actions, and punished for incorrect actions.
Said correct actions are perfect dodgerolling for iframes and exploiting various kinds of grind. Your reward is being able to continue playing the game. Tough bloody bastards, them japs. Damn thing is they made such good cameras.
Yes, and that's dumb for reasons I mentioned earlier. There are better ways to make a game hard, and victories more satisfying.
@Groaner said in Just Souls Things:
Mount & Blade series has had far better horseback fighting
Ass. Creed, MGS V, Twitchers and Red LED Redemption also have mounted combat. Which one sucks horsecock more than either Elden Souls or
Mercedes BenzMen & BlacksThat's a good question, but outside the scope of this discussion. We're talking specifically about Darkborne Ring against the TaleWorlds guys (who, incidentally, know how to make good controls for a PC game. Which really isn't all that hard if you've played say a half dozen FPSes with mouse and keyboard).
-
@Groaner said in Just Souls Things:
We're talking opinions here, and in the realm of opinion, anything can be a boon or shortcoming.
De gustibas non est disputandum.
Or in colloquial: Opinions are like a@#holes. Everyone's got them and they stink.
-
@Groaner said in Just Souls Things:
I'm here only to register my disapproval of certain aspects of their product(s).
There's several schools of thought. FromSoft seem to be members of the school that says that great satisfaction comes from mastering difficult challenges. Others prefer things that are more like rollercoaster rides: they feel thrilling, but typically aren't actually all that challenging and are much more easily forgotten experiences.
Also, the Dark Moon Greatsword is really nice. Yes, you have to do a long and difficult quest to get it, including beating some pretty tough bosses. That's good.
-
-
@Groaner said in Just Souls Things:
We're talking opinions here, and in the realm of opinion, anything can be a boon or shortcoming. I have justified my position, anyone who disagrees is free to respond to my arguments or advance their own.
Well, my opinion is that your opinion is wrong.
you don't want to overload the valuable guys with low-risk stuff.
Or there could have been two folders, one with a bunch of jpegs or pngs, and another with flacs or oggs.
I agree. As someone with a gamedev side gig, I feel market research is important, which is another reason why I elected to jump into this game.
Ah, finally I get it. Science must be done.
It means that if you are a freelance game developer, you have a huge opportunity, since the big boys are too busy constructing airstrips from coconut husks to innovate. Punish them for their complacence.
I'm not so sure about that. I've been trying out, for the last couple times Steam's been doing the demo week or whatever it's called.
In the beginning I thought, ok, when you're rushing to make a demo, don't bother with all the fluff like working options and, in fact, a working game. But no, that kind of demo you may show the publisher, perhaps. So that they see that you've got a bit more than the grand idea on paper that's worth putting up the money for.
But then demos themselves were sometimes such pieces of shit... I mean, technically. There was one where, it seems, the first thing was to put a bunch of cool logo videos, but then they didn't play, because of unsupported resolution.They have what they believe to be a winning recipe, and they probably don't want to touch it.
Well, Sekiro Dies In Darkness, for one, relies on iframes less...
Some games really only work with a "fit in or fuck off" model. And that's not necessarily a bad thing.
Which one is Elden Souls? It doesn't sound like you're entirely committed about the fitting in thing.
if you play your character prudently and are wise with your equipment, stats, and skills, you will usually do very well.
I'm always reminded of this by "rolling a character". And why modern CRPGs did away with it in favor of the point buy.
Yes, and that's dumb for reasons I mentioned earlier. There are better ways to make a game hard.
Are there? I don't know. Most of this stuff is immediately stupid to me, personally, but at the same time I don't know any better way.
The combat is heavily asymmetric. That's why you're given this kind of a superpower. For the same reason that Press F to Call Duty shooters have regenerating helth. You're not obliged to get shot and rely on it, but the training wheels are there.
-
@dkf said in Just Souls Things:
@Applied-Mediocrity That won't usually help you in this game. You can typically see what's going to happen, but it doesn't help if your character's been staggered slightly by the last hit.
The Fire Giant is pretty neat when you get there.
Especially when he starts rolling around or swiping at you with his shield. Seeing that coming does not help at all; you just gotta be somewhere else.He's not even close to the hardest boss in the game. Malenia's much trickier.Not playing Elden Ring, but just come across this awesome footage of someone who insist defeating Malenia in solo, using 30+ hours of practice to analyze and recite the boss's move patterns.
-
@Applied-Mediocrity that's dubious alright.
-
I finally found someone to kill Radahn for me. I considered it an accomplishment that I survived.
-
@error said in Just Souls Things:
I finally found someone to kill Radahn for me. I considered it an accomplishment that I survived.
That means you're not too far off getting the Mimic Tear. That's worth it; it's one of the very best summons, and health-powered so it's useful for martial types.
-
@dkf said in Just Souls Things:
@Groaner said in Just Souls Things:
I'm here only to register my disapproval of certain aspects of their product(s).
There's several schools of thought. FromSoft seem to be members of the school that says that great satisfaction comes from mastering difficult challenges. Others prefer things that are more like rollercoaster rides: they feel thrilling, but typically aren't actually all that challenging and are much more easily forgotten experiences.
Thing is, in the grand scheme of things, the bosses aren't all that hard. Starsiege Radahn's been the high water mark for me, but once I realized that there's a reason you're allowed to bring Torrent in and run circles while repeatedly summoning helpers to whittle down his HP, it became much easier than trying to directly engage a a lawnmower with sword hitboxes the size of a schoolbus. In most games, if something seems impossibly difficult, it means the player is doing something wrong. And that's a very helpful insight.
I could make the argument that games like Cuphead and Celeste are harder, because you can't grind your way out of a difficult battle and have to have perfect execution. There are bosses in other games that took me literal years to down. Like this lovely duo at the end of Stage 7:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ia5eRa2Epto
So there exist harder bosses than what Elden Ring offers, and pressing a button to get some invincibility frames is still a dumb mechanic. Arguably, a game like Mount & Blade is even harder (and at the hardest difficulties, it probably is) because the player doesn't have such a button.
Also, the Dark Moon Greatsword is really nice. Yes, you have to do a long and difficult quest to get it, including beating some pretty tough bosses. That's good.
Got it and the INT requirements make it unwieldy for a Confessor. The trickiest boss on that questchain was the Blaidd lookalike but everything else died pretty quickly.
But I am considering my options now (at level 120ish), between whether 40 vigor is not enough, or whether I want to invest a few points into Arcane to get into Dragon things, or bite the bullet and invest in Faith to use incantations I might find useful once in a blue moon, or Strength to use colossal weapons that have so far seemed inferior to the quickness and agility of a Crystal Sword and shield (or morningstar with bleed for those pesky dragons/wyrms).
-
@Applied-Mediocrity said in Just Souls Things:
@Groaner said in Just Souls Things:
We're talking opinions here, and in the realm of opinion, anything can be a boon or shortcoming. I have justified my position, anyone who disagrees is free to respond to my arguments or advance their own.
Well, my opinion is that your opinion is wrong.
Aren't opinions great?
you don't want to overload the valuable guys with low-risk stuff.
Or there could have been two folders, one with a bunch of jpegs or pngs, and another with flacs or oggs.
That makes too much sense.
I agree. As someone with a gamedev side gig, I feel market research is important, which is another reason why I elected to jump into this game.
Ah, finally I get it. Science must be done.
I can also say with reasonable confidence that if I had their art team (and resources in general) and George R. R. Tolkien to help with worldbuilding, my game would probably blow it out of the water.
It means that if you are a freelance game developer, you have a huge opportunity, since the big boys are too busy constructing airstrips from coconut husks to innovate. Punish them for their complacence.
I'm not so sure about that. I've been trying out, for the last couple times Steam's been doing the demo week or whatever it's called.
In the beginning I thought, ok, when you're rushing to make a demo, don't bother with all the fluff like working options and, in fact, a working game. But no, that kind of demo you may show the publisher, perhaps. So that they see that you've got a bit more than the grand idea on paper that's worth putting up the money for.
But then demos themselves were sometimes such pieces of shit... I mean, technically. There was one where, it seems, the first thing was to put a bunch of cool logo videos, but then they didn't play, because of unsupported resolution.There are plenty of people who are in over their head, and grifters out to make a quick buck, and they make it worse for everyone. And there's also Sturgeon's Law. I'm under no illusions of how difficult it can be - I've put in many more years than I would have liked on my own project. But that the big boys have lost their will to innovate and take risks should still be encouraging for those willing to make the effort.
They have what they believe to be a winning recipe, and they probably don't want to touch it.
Well, Sekiro Dies In Darkness, for one, relies on iframes less...
Maybe I'll check that out when I have time.
Some games really only work with a "fit in or fuck off" model. And that's not necessarily a bad thing.
Which one is Elden Souls? It doesn't sound like you're entirely committed about the fitting in thing.
I was talking about the game you mentioned. An example of the "fit in or fuck off" model in action might be this game, where players are expected to invest thousands of dollars (and/or thousands of hours) into creating or acquiring serviceable equipment to even be competitive with people who have been playing for over ten years. I don't consider FromSoft's works to be of that nature as they're far too accessible in comparison.
As far as my commitment or non-commitment to the concept, I understand that it takes a Lot of Money to keep a studio afloat and understand why some studios might design such awful systems. Whether I choose to patronize such games is on a case-by-case basis.
if you play your character prudently and are wise with your equipment, stats, and skills, you will usually do very well.
I'm always reminded of this by "rolling a character". And why modern CRPGs did away with it in favor of the point buy.
If your character has an equal chance of having all stats start at 10, or all stats start at 20, that is pretty dumb, yes.
Yes, and that's dumb for reasons I mentioned earlier. There are better ways to make a game hard.
Are there? I don't know. Most of this stuff is immediately stupid to me, personally, but at the same time I don't know any better way.
The combat is heavily asymmetric. That's why you're given this kind of a superpower. For the same reason that Press F to Call Duty shooters have regenerating helth. You're not obliged to get shot and rely on it, but the training wheels are there.In DOOM and the Serious Sams, you don't get such a button, and those games can be incredibly difficult at higher difficulty levels. Combat is also asymmetric in those games as you're taking on dozens of enemies at once, but you make do.
So iframes are completely unnecessary, until developers make them so. And that game of walls and ladders escalates into schoolbus sized hitboxes, and oneshot map-wide AoE skills.
-
-
@Groaner said in Just Souls Things:
Aren't opinions great?
I think @Benjamin-Hall weighted in his opinion on that
I can also say with reasonable confidence that if I had their art team (and resources in general) and George R. R. Tolkien to help with worldbuilding, my game would probably blow it out of the water.
Pride goeth before the autumn.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Curt_Schilling#Gaming.
Some games really only work with a "fit in or fuck off" model. And that's not necessarily a bad thing.
I was talking about the game you mentioned.
Ah, that's why I brought it up.
Exhibit A: difficulty options of Elden Souls
Exhibit B: difficulty options of the game I mentioned
And yet people keep having Blakey-Gąska rants (pages upon pages with endless
and quote chains) about how difficult it is. Anyone who even suggests adjusting the difficulty is summarily ignored at best.
I can explain everything. Badly, incorrectly, gribnitly. This I cannot explain. Perhaps you can, then?
In DOOM and the Serious Sams, you don't get such a button, and those games can be incredibly difficult at higher difficulty levels. Combat is also asymmetric in those games as you're taking on dozens of enemies at once, but you make do.
Are you serious? Those games have difficulty levels. Select Tourist, scout out the map where what kinds of enemies will spawn and where the secret rocket launchers are, then work your way up.
And SS3+ have headshots and melee kills. I might be misremembering, but during the melee kill animation Sam can't be hurt. Oldfags frequently complain that the series has gone down the drain.
-
@Applied-Mediocrity said in Just Souls Things:
scout out the map where what kinds of enemies will spawn and where the secret rocket launchers are,
Two common ways to adjust difficulty are to adjust the numbers of both monsters and helpful spawns.
-
@PleegWat said in Just Souls Things:
@Applied-Mediocrity said in Just Souls Things:
scout out the map where what kinds of enemies will spawn and where the secret rocket launchers are,
Two common ways to adjust difficulty are to adjust the numbers of both monsters and helpful spawns.
Best way for SS is to play only with the knife for awhile. Then stop. So much easier once you stop.
-
@Applied-Mediocrity said in Just Souls Things:
I can also say with reasonable confidence that if I had their art team (and resources in general) and George R. R. Tolkien to help with worldbuilding, my game would probably blow it out of the water.
Pride goeth before the autumn.
.What's the point here, that no one should ever be proud of anything one does, or that one should never attempt anything ever because one might fail?
Only a masochist or fool would invest their blood, sweat, and tears into a project if they didn't think it was something worthwhile.
Some games really only work with a "fit in or fuck off" model. And that's not necessarily a bad thing.
I was talking about the game you mentioned.
Ah, that's why I brought it up.
Exhibit A: difficulty options of Elden Souls
Exhibit B: difficulty options of the game I mentioned
And yet people keep having Blakey-Gąska rants (pages upon pages with endless
and quote chains) about how difficult it is. Anyone who even suggests adjusting the difficulty is summarily ignored at best.
I can explain everything. Badly, incorrectly, gribnitly. This I cannot explain. Perhaps you can, then?
That difficulty selection screen seems pretty reasonable and reminds me a bit of the difficulty selection UI for M&B. But I do like how there are at least four different difficulty levels for "hard." As far as how that translates into actual difficulty... I couldn't say unless I played the game. And I have played some pretty hard games.
In DOOM and the Serious Sams, you don't get such a button, and those games can be incredibly difficult at higher difficulty levels. Combat is also asymmetric in those games as you're taking on dozens of enemies at once, but you make do.
Are you serious? Those games have difficulty levels. Select Tourist, scout out the map where what kinds of enemies will spawn and where the secret rocket launchers are, then work your way up.
There not being a difficulty slider in Darkborne Ring is a fair complaint, but I'm not sure what relevance it has in the context of the highest difficulty levels offered by other games. I always play on Serious mode for my first playthrough as historically that's always been the most fun for me. Anything less feels tame and boring.
And SS3+ have headshots and melee kills. I might be misremembering, but during the melee kill animation Sam can't be hurt. Oldfags frequently complain that the series has gone down the drain.
That's right, there are glory kills. Unfortunate. But there aren't in TFE and TSE, which are quite possibly the best games in the series. We don't talk about 2. The first half of 3 feels like a generic tactical shooter, and the second half actually feels like a Serious Sam game, and 4 comes pretty close to the level of TFE/TSE. I'll take it as the rest of the shooter genre has gone down the tubes and it's a flawed remnant of the good ol' days.
-
@Groaner said in Just Souls Things:
But I am considering my options now (at level 120ish), between whether 40 vigor is not enough, or whether I want to invest a few points into Arcane to get into Dragon things, or bite the bullet and invest in Faith to use incantations I might find useful once in a blue moon, or Strength to use colossal weapons that have so far seemed inferior to the quickness and agility of a Crystal Sword and shield (or morningstar with bleed for those pesky dragons/wyrms).
The late stage bosses are mostly very tricky with STR-based builds. They went a lot easier on the second run (which was INT-based). Next up will be FAI+DEX, and that should be enough to net the final achievements. (One of the main classes of ending remains to be done.)
-
This post is deleted!
-
@Groaner said in Just Souls Things:
But there aren't in TFE and TSE, which are quite possibly the best games in the series.
I picked up TSE a few times and every time I get bored after one level and don't come back for months because of how boring it is. You're saying the later games are even worse?
-
@Gąska said in Just Souls Things:
@Groaner said in Just Souls Things:
But there aren't in TFE and TSE, which are quite possibly the best games in the series.
I picked up TSE a few times and every time I get bored after one level and don't come back for months because of how boring it is. You're saying the later games are even worse?
Naturally, that depends on what "boring" means and how better and worse are defined. I can't really answer that as it's all subjective. But what I can say is:
- 2 feels cringy in the same way that Final Fantasy X is about a solemn death march to save the world, but X-2 is about world-traveling divas and fashion
- 3 is decent if you're able to skip literally the first half of the game
- 4 is definitely better than 3, it builds on the character-driven nature of 3 while sticking to the recipe of the earlier games, and has some interesting elements like the motorcycle sequence and the homing chainsaw launcher
And apparently there's an expansion for 4 released this year. Might need to pick that up.
-
@Groaner said in Just Souls Things:
@Gąska said in Just Souls Things:
@Groaner said in Just Souls Things:
But there aren't in TFE and TSE, which are quite possibly the best games in the series.
I picked up TSE a few times and every time I get bored after one level and don't come back for months because of how boring it is. You're saying the later games are even worse?
Naturally, that depends on what "boring" means
The gameplay and the level design was just so uninspired that after finishing one level I didn't have a desire to play more. I think I last played the level where you spawn in a pond. It's a fun little game and probably felt much better 25 years ago when it was released, but for me today I just can't play it for more than 15 minutes at a time.
-
@Groaner said in Just Souls Things:
Might need to pick that up.
Do. Oldfags are saying there's finally a worthy successor to the classics. I wouldn't say that, but then I was not Serious. It's certainly the best of the modern Sams. Drumjan doesn't disappoint, too.
I'll address some of the points in our nice little quotechain later. If you want to.
@Gąska said:
The gameplay and the level design was just so uninspired that after finishing one level I didn't have a desire to play more. I think I last played the level where you spawn in a pond. It's a fun little game and probably felt much better 25 years ago when it was released, but for me today I just can't play it for more than 15 minutes at a time.
You can't be Serious.
-
@Applied-Mediocrity don't call me Shirley!
-
@Gąska To reply or not to reply? That is a serious question.
For the uninitiated: https://youtu.be/-jRQRbg-qug?t=3195
?
Curt Schilling - Wikipedia
