+10MB
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@dhromed said:
@davedavenotdavemaybedave said:
As I'm sure many people would agree, wide-screen may be good for video and gaming, but they're completely the wrong shape to read from.
While you lose points for the "argument from popularity" fallacy, I would like to say +100 to the second part. I had to test a wide site for layout issues, meaning I had to rotate my monitor back to landscape.
How do people work like this?! On even wider monitors?!
We actually use the windowing OS the way it's intended, instead of maximizing everything.
Unless your wide screen is super low-res, you don't lose anything from switching to widescreen. On the contrary, you gain a nice little strip of pixels perfect for your IM friend list, or your Windows widgets, or whatever you want to use it for.
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@dhromed said:
@Master Chief said:
Which is why it has a white glow around the black text, so it will be readable regardless of what color is underneath.
Yes.
So you can't put white text on a black background, because it will not be readable.
Most of Aero's aspects don't respond to the Advanced window settings.
Microsoft forgot to compensate for the users who want the entire world to be DOS all the time!
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@blakeyrat said:
We actually use the windowing OS the way it's intended, instead of maximizing everything.
Oh, great, so I'll lose nothing except the middle option from 'maximise'/'window'/'minimise'. If windows could remember a number of intermediate sizes, it would be fine to do as you suggest. I want to have non-maximised windows that don't take up the full screen vertically, and that's not compatible with having ones that do. Not to mention that there is no way to line them up neatly, so it's annoying in an OCD sort of way, and that if you overshoot the scroll-bar at the side slightly, you click on a different window and lose focus.Unless your wide screen is super low-res, you don't lose anything from switching to widescreen. On the contrary, you gain a nice little strip of pixels perfect for your IM friend list, or your Windows widgets, or whatever you want to use it for.
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@davedavenotdavemaybedave said:
Oh, great, so I'll lose nothing except the middle option from 'maximise'/'window'/'minimise'.
What are you talking about?
@davedavenotdavemaybedave said:
I want to have non-maximised windows that don't take up the full screen vertically,
So... a normal window?
@davedavenotdavemaybedave said:
and that's not compatible with having ones that do.
How do you figure? My copy of Windows doesn't have any problems with it.
Maybe your solution is to not maximize *any* windows.
@davedavenotdavemaybedave said:
Not to mention that there is no way to line them up neatly, so it's annoying in an OCD sort of way,
Stop being OCD. Computers can't help you with psychological problems.
@davedavenotdavemaybedave said:
and that if you overshoot the scroll-bar at the side slightly, you click on a different window and lose focus.
That's a slightly valid complaint, but is this really something that happens so often that it's a concern?
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@blakeyrat said:
@davedavenotdavemaybedave said:
I want to have non-maximised windows that don't take up the full screen vertically,
So... a normal window?
@davedavenotdavemaybedave said:
and that's not compatible with having ones that do.
How do you figure? My copy of Windows doesn't have any problems with it.
You're telling me that your copy of Windows will remember the sizes of windows that you set at one time, even after you subsequently set them as something different? Don't be daft. It's not telepathic.
I have a use for non-maximised windows which don't take up nearly the whole screen. If I set non-maximised windows to take up nearly the whole screen, then I am no longer able to switch between having maximised windows and windowed ones, because the windowed ones will be almost exactly the same size as the maximised ones. If I could choose from a number of different stored sizes, it would be fine, but that functionality doesn't exist in any GUI that I know of.@blakeyrat said:
@davedavenotdavemaybedave said:
and that if you overshoot the scroll-bar at the side slightly, you click on a different window and lose focus.
That's a slightly valid complaint, but is this really something that happens so often that it's a concern?
It was just an example, really. Your contention is basically that there are no benefits to maximising windows, but in fact there are, which is why the maximise functionality exists.
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In some window managers like KDE's KWin, right-clicking the maximize button will maximize the window vertically, which is very handy. Likewise, middle-clicking maximizes it horizontally.
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@Xyro said:
In some window managers like KDE's KWin, right-clicking the maximize button will maximize the window vertically, which is very handy. Likewise, middle-clicking maximizes it horizontally.
That sounds genuinely useful. If you go from (1) windowed, to (2) vertically maximised, to fully maximised, and then return to windowed, will it go back to state (1) or (2)? I suppose there's no reason why, instead of the window/maximise buttons replacing each other as you toggle the state, you couldn't retain the windowing button and be able to go back through previous window sizes and positions with repeated clicking.
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I'm not on a Linux machine at the moment, but as I recall, it does indeed remember all the states of the window, but I don't remember in what order you can access them. So in regular windowed mode (A), you can vertically maximize (B). If you right-click maximize again, you return to A. If you were at B and fully maximize (C), and then hit maximize again, I'm pretty sure it takes you to A. But if it takes you to B, you can use the same vertically maximize step to get back to A.
It's pretty useful, but these days I find myself alt+right-clicking to quickly resize windows rather than moving my mouse to the little window buttons, which is slightly slower. Yep, those milliseconds are important.
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@davedavenotdavemaybedave said:
You're telling me that your copy of Windows will remember the sizes of windows that you set at one time, even after you subsequently set them as something different? Don't be daft. It's not telepathic.
I'm sorry, is that what I was supposed to be getting from your word soup? I'm not being "daft" I just genuinely had absolutely no idea what the gibberish in your post meant. I'm not telepathic either.
No, Windows does not store the position of windows. It leaves that functionality up to the application itself; good applications do it, shitty applications don't. Note: this is the same in every other OS I've used, even the famously spatial Mac Classic relied on applications to implement window position saving.
Now some more gibberish:
@davedavenotdavemaybedave said:
I have a use for non-maximised windows which don't take up nearly the whole screen.
Ok...
@davedavenotdavemaybedave said:
If I set non-maximised windows to take up nearly the whole screen, then I am no longer able to switch between having maximised windows and windowed ones, because the windowed ones will be almost exactly the same size as the maximised ones.
Then don't do that.
Either don't maximize them, or don't set the non-maximized version to "take up nearly the whole screen". I mean, what do you want from us? Some kind of magic wand?
@davedavenotdavemaybedave said:
If I could choose from a number of different stored sizes, it would be fine, but that functionality doesn't exist in any GUI that I know of.
You should write it! Now's your time to shine!
@davedavenotdavemaybedave said:
It was just an example, really. Your contention is basically that there are no benefits to maximising windows, but in fact there are, which is why the maximise functionality exists.
I think it's more likely that maximize functionality exists due to the rampaging horde of IT people who are deathly afraid of change. After all, if you set your text to white-on-black and maximize all your apps, it's just like that DOS computer you had in 1990! OH THE JOYS OF ANCIENT SHIT OSES!
A lot of things that exist don't have any good reason to exist, BTW.
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@blakeyrat said:
After all, if you set your text to white-on-black and maximize all your apps, it's just like that DOS computer you had in 1990! OH THE JOYS OF ANCIENT SHIT OSES!
... and also because it's easier on the eyes?Just because you don't understand the reason for it, doesn't mean there isn't one...
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@Faxmachinen said:
The arguments for the modern look so far amount to "for most people the modern look is not much worse than the classic look if they buy a new monitor for $200. But c'mon, that should it be worth to you". Okay, I'll go change back to the modern look right away.
Updated to reflect the new developments in this thread.
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@Xyro said:
@blakeyrat said:
After all, if you set your text to white-on-black and maximize all your apps, it's just like that DOS computer you had in 1990! OH THE JOYS OF ANCIENT SHIT OSES!
... and also because it's easier on the eyes?If you really cared about reducing eye-strain, you'd use black on white, which is pretty much universally considered superior to white-on-black. There have been many, many studies on this. Here's a link about programming in particular: http://www.codinghorror.com/blog/2005/07/code-colorizing-and-readability.html
I've also seen a study that cited dark blue on a very light yellow as the best combination, but I can't seem to dig it out at the moment.
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Huh! I'll certainly check out those studies. Maybe I should just turn down the brightness of my monitor...
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@davedavenotdavemaybedave said:
You're telling me that your copy of Windows will remember the sizes of windows that you set at one time, even after you subsequently set them as something different? Don't be daft. It's not telepathic.
I wrote a little program to do this for my most common use cases. I often need a VM window running at exactly 1280x1024, so I click a button and I have it.
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@Master Chief said:
You can quite literally pick any color out of a rainbow.
Where did I mention a rainbow? You can't do this with Aero (if you somehow manage to do this, I want to know how).
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@blakeyrat said:
@Xyro said:
@blakeyrat said:
After all, if you set your text to white-on-black and maximize all your apps, it's just like that DOS computer you had in 1990! OH THE JOYS OF ANCIENT SHIT OSES!
... and also because it's easier on the eyes?If you really cared about reducing eye-strain, you'd use black on white, which is pretty much universally considered superior to white-on-black. There have been many, many studies on this. Here's a link about programming in particular: http://www.codinghorror.com/blog/2005/07/code-colorizing-and-readability.html
I've also seen a study that cited dark blue on a very light yellow as the best combination, but I can't seem to dig it out at the moment.
"I don't care if you have headache, the studies say that you can't possibly have headache from this, so shut up" - that sounds like a compelling argument indeed.
80/20 is an awesome rule for difficult computation problems, but people seem to transfer it to almost every other aspect of life. Where exactly in the thought process did "Some studies over certain parts of the population tell that a vague majority of their participiants did not use that option" become "no one uses that option ever, so we can savely remove it"?
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@PSWorx said:
"I don't care if you have headache, the studies say that you can't possibly have headache from this, so shut up" - that sounds like a compelling argument indeed.
If you have a headache, it's because your monitor's brightness is set to high, not because the color of your fonts.
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@blakeyrat said:
Then don't do that.
Either don't maximize them, or don't set the non-maximized version to "take up nearly the whole screen". I mean, what do you want from us?
As I said, I'm pretty happy with my solution. Why the blithering fuck are you telling me I should do something else and then a few posts later ridiculing me for the stupidities in what you said? Have I killed a few too many braincells last night and lost the ability to read and write English?
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@davedavenotdavemaybedave said:
Have I killed a few too many braincells last night
Oh shit, fuck horsecocks buggery shit. Make that 'did I kill'. Let's just pretend I didn't post anything at all today, ok? Move along, nothing to see here.
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@blakeyrat said:
If you really cared about reducing eye-strain, you'd use black on white
Regardless of studies and common cases, Ender's situation appears to be one of accessbility, and I strongly feel Aero should support a far greater range of preferences than just "pick a mild colour and then mildly adjust it a little"
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@Jaime said:
I wrote a little program to do this for my most common use cases.
I sense an open source project!
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@blakeyrat said:
No, Windows does not store the position of windows. It leaves that functionality up to the application itself; good applications do it, shitty applications don't
Actually, Windows does that for the main app window. It also stores other things behind your back, such as common file open dialog settings.
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Windows isn't the only OS that mis-calculates file sizes!
This bug only started in Snow Leopard; Leopard reported the "on disk" size correctly. It does this to all files: any file less than 1MB gets reported as 1MB and bigger files get more added to them.
TRWTF is probably Apple's samba in this case.
