Meth is hard, lets go shipping
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refusing to get outraged
I know that by saying this I must be tone policing and a concern troll and whatever other labels needed to disregard everything I say, but fuck this is a stupid thing to get mad about.
I'm sorry that I am capable of being rational and don't fly into a spitting fit every time someone somewhere is a prick. It happens quite a lot. where were you when people weren't being outraged about Ferguson? or is it just this one cause that you actually care about?
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Look, you got me all wrong, ok, I'm not a feminist; misogyny like that doesn't upset me. What I am, though, is a pedant, and if someone is going to try and say that something that clearly is misogynistic, isn't misogynistic, you can damn well expect me tell them exactly why they are wrong.
And if you're so damn rational, how can you not see what's wrong with someone taking one look at a person, deciding that they're ugly, and on that basis, assuming that they are guilty of a crime?
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not see what's wrong
refusing to get outraged
If you are so pedantic, how can you not see that these 2 phrases mean different things?
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That's true, that second phrase was a poor choice of words on my part. I'm not really a master pedant or anything—but boomzilla's already decided to sit this one out, and it didn't seem like any of the rest of the pendantry crew were gonna step up.
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Well to be honest I knew I didn't have anything useful to say, so I decided to show you a picture of my wooden table instead.
Now that I've had some time to think about it, I wonder if sending the couple an apology as soon as they became aware of the problem was trwtf? I thought that apologizing for stuff was a big no-no, as far as business was concerned, because it's basically an admission of wrongdoing, and opens a company up to litigation.
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where were you when people weren't being outraged about Ferguson?
I'm not sure who we should be most outraged about yet.
but boomzilla's already decided to sit this one out
Did I? Honestly, I don't find her as unattractive as @mott555 and @darkmatter appear to. I guess they have a thing about freckles. It's hard to tell from the mugshot if she isn't just a bit sunburned and stressed out for being arrested or is in the early stages of being a meth-head.
Now that I've had some time to think about it, I wonder if sending the couple an apology as soon as they became aware of the problem was trwtf? I thought that apologizing for stuff was a big no-no, as far as business was concerned, because it's basically an admission of wrongdoing, and opens a company up to litigation.
Legally, it probably hasn't helped them, though it might help when it's time to award damages. I don't think there's much to discuss there...it's just a wild confluence of...stuff.
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Well, you certainly weren't (from my point of view) helping.
If i had a nickel for every time someone on TDWTF could say that about me...
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Now, it could be argued that this was tongue-in-cheek, and that @mott555 realized how bad people always look in mug shots, and was making a funny about that. Still kind of shit, imo, but you, on the other hand, definitely took it too far by replying
I was being serious. I grew up in a rural area where meth was a huge problem, and because of that I know what meth-heads look like.
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What would it do? Attempt to detect a straw man argument, or scream "Ahhhh! I'm on fire!" when invoked?
The latter, please.
On the rare occasions I use that word, you may rest assured I used it correctly.
Yes, but the comment was originally directed toward @tufty , who seems to throw the word around like Halloween candy.
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Here's some halloween candy for you, then.
Yeah really... what a woofer
This is misogynistic. I really don't think there's any room for argument about it. The attitude it conveys is that a woman's place is to be attractive, and provide a warm moist place (or several) for men to stuff their cocks. It's very different to saying "I don't find her particularly attractive", or, indeed,
To be fair, you'd have to be on meth to look that old at age 23.
Now, @darkmatter responded by saying
It's misogynist to think a single girl is ugly and call her a name that means fugly?I assume it is also racist to think Obama is dumb and call him an inept fool?
The answer to this is that no, it's not misogynist to say you think someone is unattractive. However, calling someone names, particularly something like "woofer", is. It's the kind of behaviour that at best has a tendency to open one up to accusations of misogyny; at worst it might result in dental work.
Of course it's not racist to think Obama is dumb and call him an inept fool. It's a political viewpoint like any other - it might get you into an argument, but it's not racist, because it clearly doesn't reference Obama's race. Unfortunately, to be comparable to the level of rudeness of "woofer", you'd probably have to use phraseology like "fucking idiot coon". Which might well open one up to accusations of racism. And / or being beaten senseless.
It's really not rocket science, people. What surprises me the most is that people who, like 90% of the male population, don't meet the Ken & Barbie / deodorant commercial / gay icon levels of male bodily perfection (and certain of whom clearly fit the fat beardy geek stereotype), clearly don't understand that throwing insults around based on someone's looks is just fucking rude
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The attitude it conveys is that a woman's place is to be attractive, and provide a warm moist place (or several) for men to stuff their cocks.
Is there no place for simple poor taste or off color remarks? It's all hatredy and leaps of logic?
clearly don't understand that throwing insults around based on someone's looks is just fucking rude
I think we all probably agree on that. We disagree that being rude is some grand thing like you're claiming. Or that the word "misogynist" still has some meaning to us. Take your pick.
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clearly don't understand that throwing insults around based on someone's looks is just fucking rude
i don't disagree with that.but had the story been about a crazy looking man, I would have made the exact same comment. Is that then misandry??
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Homophobia?
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Or that the word "misogynist" still has some meaning to us. Take your pick.
Yes. Some of the people throwing that word around need to read a dictionary and find out what it actually means.
mi·sog·y·nist noun a person who dislikes, despises, or is strongly prejudiced against women.
mi·sog·y·ny noun dislike of, contempt for, or ingrained prejudice against women.
Does calling someone ugly imply a hatred or prejudice against their entire gender? Seriously? Because guess what, SOME PEOPLE ARE UGLY. GET OVER IT.
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The implication that her attractiveness is related to her moral standing or the ethics of taking police action against her is the misogynist part, because it's part and parcel of the misogynist idea that a woman's worth is entirely tied up in her ability to please men (by being pleasing to the eye among other things)
I tend to give this forum more of a pass, though, because often a reply has absolutely nothing to do with the post it's replying to, so the implication is weaker here.
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clearly don't understand that throwing insults around based on someone's looks is just fucking rude
It's no secret that i do not often agree with @tufty, but in this case... yeah i agree.
Because guess what, SOME PEOPLE ARE UGLY. GET OVER IT.
We would have a much easier time of it if it was not constantly rubbed in our face that if you don't look like barbie or ken (depending on which gender you externally represent as) then you are ugly.
we get that we do not fit in the "standard" image of beauty. We can come to terms with that, because we also can understand that beauty is in the eye of the beholder.
so yeah we can get over it just fine.
THAT DOES NOT MAKE IT NICE OR EVEN OKAY TO CALL ANYONE UGLY BECAUSE THAT IS EXTREMELY RUDE
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The implication that her attractiveness is related to her moral standing or the ethics of taking police action against her is the misogynist part.
I can agree with how my comment combined with @mott555 could be construed as implying her ugliness meant she deserved it.That wasn't what I intended though, for whatever that's worth. I was just agreeing with mott that she looked like a methhead in the photo, plus the other evidence in the article. So I must apologize for the straight literal implication of ugliness=guilt. Sorry for the confusion there.
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The implication that her attractiveness is related to her moral standing or the ethics of taking police action against her is the misogynist part,
I don't see that implication. Unless you are referring to @mott555 saying that her mugshot has the appearance of a meth user.
...because it's part and parcel of the misogynist idea that a woman's worth is entirely tied up in her ability to please men (by being pleasing to the eye among other things)
I would agree that that idea fits inside a reasonable definition of misogyny. I just wouldn't connect that dot with what happened here.
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"Bad things happened to this woman."
"Who cares, she's ugly anyway, she deserved it"That's a common enough exchange on the internet that responding to something only to comment that the person is ugly can be seen as shorthand for saying you shouldn't care what happens to someone because she's ugly.
Again, here we have a culture where making random observations about a small portion of a post is the norm, so contextually, I'd be surprised if it was meant that way, but it can come across that way.
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I would agree that that idea fits inside a reasonable definition of misogyny. I just wouldn't connect that dot with what happened here.
It's pretty simple.To be fair, you'd have to be on meth to look that old at age 23.
vs
what a woofer
One's a more-or-less reasonable observation, and the other is a direct insult based on appearance.
Filed Under: I don't necessarily think @darkmatter is really a misogynist.
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You're acting like the two statements weren't connected at all. Just stop trying to be offended for other people so hard.
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Yes, but the comment was originally directed toward @tufty , who seems to throw the word around like Halloween candy.
I have a rule. Well, it's more of a guideline. If someone offers me a suitable clue (for example, putting "that fucking cunt" in his description, to pick something totally at random) I will generally peg him as someone not to be taken seriously until he's proven he should be.
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well whatever.
the entire state is a bunch of dirty hillbillies.This topic needed more xenophobia.
Actually, what do you call xenophobia about people from other STATES rather than countries...?
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Slightly focused xenophobia.
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Unfortunately, to be comparable to the level of rudeness of "woofer", you'd probably have to use phraseology like "fucking idiot coon". Which might well open one up to accusations of racism. And / or being beaten senseless.
The only time you can use those words is in reference to a Procyon lotor that got into your garbage can. Any other usage should get you smacked upside the head, repeatedly, with a very dead Procyon lotor.The implication that her attractiveness is related to her moral standing or the ethics of taking police action against her is the misogynist part, because it's part and parcel of the misogynist idea that a woman's worth is entirely tied up in her ability to please men (by being pleasing to the eye among other things)
QFT as well.We would have a much easier time of it if it was not constantly rubbed in our face that if you don't look like barbie or ken (depending on which gender you externally represent as) then you are ugly.
we get that we do not fit in the "standard" image of beauty. We can come to terms with that, because we also can understand that beauty is in the eye of the beholder.
so yeah we can get over it just fine.
I have a better slogan: "Go Ugly Early". (This works especially well for folks who can get down-and-dirty.)"Bad things happened to this woman."
"Who cares, she's ugly anyway, she deserved it"That's a common enough exchange on the internet that responding to something only to comment that the person is ugly can be seen as shorthand for saying you shouldn't care what happens to someone because she's ugly.
Need I say more?
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I'm confused at what misandry has to do with a meth-head mugshot? Or is this argument just typical off-topic TDWTF thread leakage?
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I'm confused at what misandry has to do with a meth-head mugshot?
Shutup! they explained.
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Of course it's not racist to think Obama is dumb and call him an inept fool. It's a political viewpoint like any other - it might get you into an argument, but it's not racist, because it clearly doesn't reference Obama's race.
This may surprise you: I personally know people who will assume that any criticism of Obama is motivated by racism.
her attractiveness is related to her moral standing or the ethics of taking police action
the misogynist idea that a woman's worth is entirely tied up in her ability to please men (by being pleasing to the eye among other things)
Who here believes either of those things? Not a rhetorical question, I sincerely would like to know.
I don't necessarily think @darkmatter is really a misogynist.
Then maybe you shouldn't have called him one?
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I personally know people who will assume that any criticism of Obama is motivated by racism.
Yeah, I know morons as well. That's a global thing. Doesn't mean you have to attach any importance to the bollocks they spout, though, does it?Then maybe you shouldn't have called him one?
I don't think you're a literal cunt, either, but it wont stop me calling you a cunt if you come out with utter cuntery.
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Yeah, I know morons as well. That's a global thing. Doesn't mean you have to attach any importance to the bollocks they spout, though, does it?
You may want to be careful with that line of argument. Glass houses, stones, that sort of thing.
I don't think you're a literal cunt, either, but it wont stop me calling you a cunt if you come out with utter cuntery.
TDEMSYR. Either you think he's a misogynist or you don't. There is no figurative (as opposed to literal) sense of the word. Or is this more bollocks you're spouting because you don't really care about the truth but just want to have the last word?
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Either you think he's a misogynist or you don't.
<sigh>I don't think @darkmatter is a misogynist; nothing he's come out with before leads me to believe he is. However, the comment was misogynist, and I called him on it. I'd have done so IRL, too, and I don't think I'm the only one here who would.
Is that clear enough for you?
Filed under : I'll leave the last word for you
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last word smast word.
Had you merely said,
that was a rather mysoginistic thing to say, I probably would have simply agreed and this topic would have died.On second thought, I'm glad you hurled wild overreaching accusations, the topic was much more lively and fun that way.
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On second thought, I'm glad you hurled wild overreaching accusations, the topic was much more lively and fun that way.
FTFY
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<sigh>
I don't think @darkmatter is a misogynist; nothing he's come out with before leads me to believe he is. However, the comment was misogynist, and I called him on it. I'd have done so IRL, too, and I don't think I'm the only one here who would.
Is that clear enough for you?
<small>Filed under : I'll leave the last word for you
Well, here's what started this whole thread derail:
Oh, look! It's a misogynist! Can we keep it mum, please please please please please please I'll feed it and take it for walks and please please please...
Hands up, everyone who took the word "misogynist" here to refer to the comment itself as opposed to @darkmatter! I'm waiting.... No one? The defense rests.
You heard it here first: verbal precision matters, at least if you want people to understand what you're saying.
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verbal precision matters
it matters for my comment too, which was also way too ambiguous in meaning - I'd say we share an almost equal amount of responsibility for the
that ensued (but does anyone regret any of it?! well, except maybe the fool that tried to grammar nazi me and got bitchsmacked for his own grammar fail).
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You'll be shocked to hear this, but I think it's always good to argue back at the perpetually aggrieved who search for opportunities to make things more ominous and sinister than they are.
Sort of like a broken windows policing strategy of the bien pensant.
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it matters for my comment too, which was also way too ambiguous in meaning - I'd say we share an almost equal amount of responsibility for the
that ensued (but does anyone regret any of it?! well, except maybe the fool that tried to grammar nazi me and got bitchsmacked for his own grammar fail).Do you mean this comment?
It's misogynist to think a single girl is ugly and call her a name that means fugly?
I assume it is also racist to think Obama is dumb and call him an inept fool?I don't think that was ambiguous at all.
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Do you mean this comment?
It's misogynist to think a single girl is ugly and call her a name that means fugly?
I assume it is also racist to think Obama is dumb and call him an inept fool?
I meant my original insulting comment was ambiguous in implication.
Everything thereafter was just part of the ensuingstorm
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I meant my original insulting comment was ambiguous in implication.
That comment (quoted below for reference) doesn't imply anything except that you consider the woman in question to be ugly. Anything else is coming from someone's shoulder alien.
Yeah really... what a woofer.
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You'll be shocked to hear this, but I think it's always good to argue back at the perpetually aggrieved who search for opportunities to make things more ominous and sinister than they are.
Sort of like a broken windows policing strategy of the bien pensant.
So we're not just tilting at windmills?
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So we're not just tilting at windmills?
Man, I hope not. If nothing else speaking out against silliness and refusing to be shut up by the normal means encourages others to speak out and then the silly brigade doesn't get the entire field to themselves.
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The only time you can use those words is in reference to a Procyon lotor that got into your garbage can. Any other usage should get you smacked upside the head, repeatedly, with a very dead Procyon lotor.
I'd vote for smacking upside he head repeatedly with a Procyon lotor that isn't dead, yet, but soon will be — specifically, one in the "furious" phase of Lyssavirus infection.
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It's an indisputable fact that Barack Obama is the worst <substitute the word "best" here if you prefer> black president the USA has ever had.
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Also the best black president we have ever had. this too is an indisputable fact.
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There now follows a reading of the Tautology Society rulebook:
Rule 1: The first rule of the Tautology Society
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There now follows a reading of the Tautology Society rulebook:
Rule 1: The first rule of the Tautology Society
Rule 2: no pooftas?
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It's an indisputable fact that Barack Obama is the worst black president the USA has ever had.
Also the best black president we have ever had. this too is an indisputable fact.
Someone needs to tell Toni Morrison.
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Also the best black president we have ever had. this too is an indisputable fact.
I seem to recall a lot of people claiming Bill Clinton was the first black president. I never tried to hunt down the logic to that claim.
