Technology has come a long way



  • @barfoo said:

    Uh.. When the operating system includes by default software that is only useful with a certain piece of hardware, and otherwise would just make the OS bigger for everyone else, we call that bloat.

    So every mouse manufacturer has to develop their own proprietary solution to use "advanced" features (like programmable buttons). Is this definitely the best way?

    What does that mouse even have that Windows doesn't already support by default anyways? I know it can do horizontal scrolling, and every version of windows has been touted as "touch-compatible" since forever, so surely it should handle a little touchpad fine?



  • @ubersoldat said:

    Wow... how much code do you need to fill 150MB? And just for a mouse?

    It's for every USB mouse, keyboard, and joystick they've ever released. Also, it's largely not code that's taking up the space, it's the images used in the Gestures training app if you have a Touch mouse. And the soundtrack.



  • By the way, the app is actually very nice and allows for macros and whatnots. I just had it install automatically when I plugged in my MS keyboard and I quite like it. It feels like it should be integrated with the OS though, not as a separate download, and should support any mouse and keyboard - though obviously they wouldn't do that as it's a "feature" of the MS mouse and keyboard brands.


  • Discourse touched me in a no-no place

    @configurator said:

    By the way, the app is actually very nice and allows for macros and whatnots. I just had it install automatically when I plugged in my MS keyboard and I quite like it. It feels like it should be integrated with the OS though, not as a separate download, and should support any mouse and keyboard - though obviously they wouldn't do that as it's a "feature" of the MS mouse and keyboard brands.
     

     And obviously the EU would threaten them with another antitrust lawsuit if they shipped the drivers with Windows.



  • @nonpartisan said:

    I plug a new USB drive into my laptop running Ubuntu and it "just works"; Windows says it is installing drivers.

    Assuming the driver is 'USB Mass Storage', both systems are doing the same thing; it's just Windows tells you instead of hiding it.

     



  • I guess I'm just weird, as long as the thing downloads the driver reasonably quickly, installs it quickly, and becomes usable without reboot, I'm happy. I couldn't give half a shit about 150 MB if I tried.



  • @RaceProUK said:

    @nonpartisan said:

    I plug a new USB drive into my laptop running Ubuntu and it "just works"; Windows says it is installing drivers.

    Assuming the driver is 'USB Mass Storage', both systems are doing the same thing; it's just Windows tells you instead of hiding it.

    Guess I didn't make it clear . . .

    As in, it says something like "Windows needs to install drivers to use this new hardware.  Choose a source:" as opposed to the balloon window "Windows is installing drivers, it'll be ready momentarily".  Been a long time since I've had to use a different USB drive, so the drivers are already installed; I don't have a way to replicate the exact message right now.  The most recent experience I had was with the USB-to-Serial adapter, which surprised the hell out of me -- I figured that's a pretty damn simple device, all things considered, so why does it need device/brand-specific drivers?  Adapter has the brand name "Plugable" on it.  DB9 on one side with a blue housing, USB on the other, about 18" to 2' cable in the middle.

     



  • @nonpartisan said:

    The most recent experience I had was with the USB-to-Serial adapter, which surprised the hell out of me -- I figured that's a pretty damn simple device, all things considered, so why does it need device/brand-specific drivers?

    1. Because RS232 and USB are different protocols, so the driver is for the translation chip.

    2. Because, at best, 0.0001% of Windows users will ever need such a cable.

     



  • The reason Windows requires drivers vs Ubuntu (and OSX) is simple: popularity.

    Microsoft doesn't want to write more code then it has to, and it knows that Windows is a popular enough OS that hardware vendors will write their own drivers. Less code means less work they have to do writing, testing, and documenting an already-complex system.

    Apple knows most driver vendors won't develop for it's OS, so it licenses the relevant technologies (such as PCL, PostScript, and JetDirect for a network printer), implements it's own driver, and bakes it into the OS.

    Linux kernel devs do the same thing, although in their case, it's less licensing and more straight out reverse engineering. That's way a lot of hardware doesn't work well under Linux-based OSes. (Add to that the fact that a lot of distros are allergic to non-open-source software; Ubuntu is not one of them though, and will happily let you use a nVidia-provided driver through it's repositories.)

    Obviously USB is TRWTF here for requiring even the simplest devices to have a driver. If I was the Holy Roman Emperor of PCs, I'd have specialized interconnects for each class of device (eSATA for drives, an improved IEEE 1284 for printers, an improved PS/2 for mice and keyboards, etc) and novel devices can use a serial interconnect based on an improved RS-232.



  • @MiffTheFox said:

    and novel devices can use a serial interconnect based on an improved RS-232

    Such a serial bus sounds like a great idea, especially if it would be universal. Why hasn't anyone thought of that before?!



  • @configurator said:

    @MiffTheFox said:
    and novel devices can use a serial interconnect based on an improved RS-232

    Such a serial bus sounds like a great idea, especially if it would be universal. Why hasn't anyone thought of that before?!

    Beats me. If only we could have USB-style hardware with RS-232-style software.



  • @nonpartisan said:

    The most recent experience I had was with the USB-to-Serial adapter, which surprised the hell out of me -- I figured that's a pretty damn simple device, all things considered, so why does it need device/brand-specific drivers?

    I always wondered about this, too - USB to parallel adapters don't need a specific driver - there's a generic one in the OS.



  • @flabdablet said:

    It is universally agreed among people who know their hardware, though, that the original Microsoft X800989-128 basic optical mouse - the grey and white one pictured in error here in place of the P58-00001 that superseded it - was the One True Mouse, and should have been left on the market indefinitely instead of being phased out in favour of Apple-wannabe shitcakes like these.

    I've gotta give props to the Intellimouse Explorer (2.0). It's comfortable, accurate, perfectly weighted and balanced, and lasts a decently long time on AAs. I myself have used the same green and black "Matrix" version for about 7 years now.

    Not a gamer (it's attached to my work computer) so I don't know how well it performs in that regards.



  • @Master Chief said:

    I guess I'm just weird, as long as the thing downloads the driver reasonably quickly, installs it quickly, and becomes usable without reboot, I'm happy. I couldn't give half a shit about 150 MB if I tried.

    The main WTF there is that the MAC install only takes 30mb, which I'd also argue is too much for a mouse driver, but can be explained with snazzy visuals and (Apparently) background music.

    We're installing background music for our installers now? Keygen creators are gonna be maaaaaad.



  • @flabdablet said:

     

    It is universally agreed among people who know their hardware, though, that the original Microsoft X800989-128 basic optical mouse - the grey and white one pictured in error here in place of the P58-00001 that superseded it - was the One True Mouse, and should have been left on the market indefinitely instead of being phased out in favour of Apple-wannabe shitcakes like these.

    I'm willing to bet a discussion about what model mouse should be known as the "One True Mouse" will spark more of an argument then an OS war.

     



  • One true mouse? BAH!

    Trackball forever! Its the perfect compramise between joystick and mouse, and you don't have to worry about surface conditions either. 



  • @Adanine said:

    I'm willing to bet a discussion about what model mouse should be known as the "One True Mouse" will spark more of an argument then an OS war.

    Only among those who don't know their hardware.



  • Yeah it's obviously the RAT 5.



  • @ubersoldat said:

    @Adanine said:

     I didn't see this before, but the software to run it is 150mb. It doesn't say wheather this is the "Mouse and Keyboard Center" software or not, but for Mac it's only 30mb (Which is still WTF-ish.)

    Microsoft, the home of the cheap $10 mouse that works fine...

    Wow... how much code do you need to fill 150MB? And just for a mouse?

    About the T&C maybe they don't want to be liable about someone getting hurt when your frustration over Win8 makes you throw your mouse in rage.

     

    The driver only takes a few hundred kilobytes; it's the T&C that consumes the rest. Don't tell me you didn't read it?!?

     



  • @MiffTheFox said:

    If I was the Holy Roman Emperor of PCs, I'd have specialized interconnects for each class of device (eSATA for drives, an improved IEEE 1284 for printers, an improved PS/2 for mice and keyboards, etc) and novel devices can use a serial interconnect based on an improved RS-232.

    If you were the Holy Roman Emperor of PCs, connectivity would be much like it is in reality.

    (The Holy Roman Empire was a big fragmented mess in which the emperor didn't have the authority most Holy Roman emperors would have liked to have, and where the electors and local rulers held much of the real power.)



  • @Gurth said:

    If you were the Holy Roman Emperor of PCs, connectivity would be much like it is in reality.

    (The Holy Roman Empire was a big fragmented mess in which the emperor didn't have the authority most Holy Roman emperors would have liked to have, and where the electors and local rulers held much of the real power.)

    This is a variety of pedantic dickweed I have not seen before.



  • @blakeyrat said:

    This is a variety of pedantic dickweed I have not seen before.
     

    I just had the image of an herbalist making this comment after examining some new plant out in the wilderness...



  • @blakeyrat said:

    This is a variety of pedantic dickweed I have not seen before.


    Thank you! This is high praise indeed!



  • @too_many_usernames said:

    @blakeyrat said:

    This is a variety of pedantic dickweed I have not seen before.
     

    I just had the image of an herbalist making this comment after examining some new plant out in the wilderness...

     

    No no.

    Sir David Attenborough.

    I should make a lolpic of it but instead I'm going to bed.

     


Log in to reply

Looks like your connection to What the Daily WTF? was lost, please wait while we try to reconnect.