Razer just hired a bunch of MBAs



  • http://www.overclock.net

    TL;DR: Razer thought that for using your mouse it would be a good idea to require an Internet connection.



  • Wow. I was gonna make yet another joke about "the cloud", but this is just sad.

     

    It's gonna be fun trying to run some software and games from 2012 in 2025, when half the companies are dead and all their servers gone.



  • I never install the software bundled with computer mice anyway. That would be like voluntarily installing OEM crapware.
    My Logitech 5 button mouse works flawlessly with the windows drivers.

    Of course if you want a billion programmable buttons or what not, you might have to use the included software.


  • Discourse touched me in a no-no place

    @topspin said:

    Of course if you want a billion programmable buttons or what not, you might have to use the included software.

    From reading the thread, I gather that's exactly what they're trying to do/complaining about.



    As they say in the first post:

    Yes, you can use the mouse as plug and play with basic functionality if you choose not to make an account and activate your computer, but who pays $80 for a basic plug and play mouse? The reason people buy the Naga 2012 is the configurable buttons and to change the DPI, polling rate, set up macros and profiles along with everything else


  • @PJH said:

    change the DPI, polling rate


    At the risk of making a fool of myself: the rest is reasonable, but why would you want to change this? I'm sure what you actually want to change are the pointer speed and acceleration.



  • @topspin said:

    At the risk of making a fool of myself: the rest is reasonable, but why would you want to change this? I'm sure what you actually want to change are the pointer speed and acceleration.
     

    Same difference.



  • Interesting. While my Logitech G9x doesn't have as many programmable buttons as the Naga, it does have the nice ability to store several 'profiles' on the mouse. So I can download and install the Logitech software on a machine, create a profile and tell it what the buttons do, what color to make it glow, etc etc, save it to the mouse, then never worry about the software again. Hell, it lets me toggle which profile I want right on the mouse, and I can change the DPI and such all on it as well.

    The only annoying thing about it is the fact that the button to enable its 'super scrolling' mode, where the scroll free wheels, is on the bottom of the mouse.



  • @topspin said:

    @PJH said:

    change the DPI, polling rate

    At the risk of making a fool of myself: the rest is reasonable, but why would you want to change this? I'm sure what you actually want to change are the pointer speed and acceleration.

    Simple, for games.
    High DPI allow more precision. And You can save time because You move your mouse on smaller distnace.

    High pooling rate also give more precision. If You do fast move, for example drawing path for units, it will make smooth curve, instead of chain of straight lines.



  • @topspin said:

    Of course if you want a billion programmable buttons or what not, you might have to use the included software.

    If your high-DPS mouse isn't an even multiple of the Windows DPI settings, you need the software or your mouse motion will be weird and jerky.



  • @spamcourt said:

    High DPI allow more precision.
     

    Yes, of course. But why would anyone want to use anything less than the maximum DPI the hardware support? (Thus, why would anyone ever want to change the DPI?)  The same applies to pooling rate.



  • I have one of the Tron mice they make, no Synapse or logins or anything like that. Note to self: If I ever need the config utility reinstalled, use my disk...



  • @Mcoder said:

    @spamcourt said:
    High DPI allow more precision.
    Yes, of course. But why would anyone want to use anything less than the maximum DPI the hardware support? (Thus, why would anyone ever want to change the DPI?) The same applies to pooling rate.

    Because games don't have an option to change the mouse DPI on-the-fly, and you can hardly alt-tab in the middle of Modern Warfare 3 to use the control panel. So if you want slower-but-more-precise tracking you need to do it in the hardware. My RAT5 has 4 DPI settings you can pick from on-the-fly. (Thankfully it doesn't require any driver to use.)



  • @blakeyrat said:

    @Mcoder said:
    @spamcourt said:
    High DPI allow more precision.
    Yes, of course. But why would anyone want to use anything less than the maximum DPI the hardware support? (Thus, why would anyone ever want to change the DPI?) The same applies to pooling rate.

    Because games don't have an option to change the mouse DPI on-the-fly, and you can hardly alt-tab in the middle of Modern Warfare 3 to use the control panel. So if you want slower-but-more-precise tracking you need to do it in the hardware. My RAT5 has 4 DPI settings you can pick from on-the-fly. (Thankfully it doesn't require any driver to use.)


    My Tron mouse has the buttons on the right side that simply shift the sensitivity up and down between a dozen or so settings. Useful as hell when you need to toggle between firefight scenarios and sniping in Fallout. Assuming Fallout works today.



  • @Master Chief said:

    Assuming Fallout works today.

    Not on Windows 7, it doesn't.



  • @Jeremy D. Pavleck said:

    @Master Chief said:
    Assuming Fallout works today.

    Not on Windows 7, it doesn't.

    It does if you limit it to one CPU. Also I understand that if you only have a dual-core it's ok, it just barfs if you have more than 3. (The Xbox 360 has 3 and it runs fine there, but... not sure how relevant that is.)



  • @blakeyrat said:

    @Jeremy D. Pavleck said:
    @Master Chief said:
    Assuming Fallout works today.

    Not on Windows 7, it doesn't.

    It does if you limit it to one CPU. Also I understand that if you only have a dual-core it's ok, it just barfs if you have more than 3. (The Xbox 360 has 3 and it runs fine there, but... not sure how relevant that is.)

     

    I hypothesize that Master Chief is referring to Fallout 3, since I believe there's no sniping in the isometric predecessors.

    Talk of making Fallout 1 run on 7 is still useful (to fans). Proceed.



  • @blakeyrat said:

    It does if you limit it to one CPU. Also I understand that if you only have a dual-core it's ok, it just barfs if you have more than 3. (The Xbox 360 has 3 and it runs fine there, but... not sure how relevant that is.)

    Thank you for the tip! I only knew it didn't work because I have a friend who went off about trying to get it to work a week or 2 ago, I'll have to pass this along to him and see if it helps.



  • Well ask him HOW it fails. If it's the "too many CPU cores" issue it'll run perfectly fine for about 10 minutes, then lock-up hard. (No doubt a race condition in the AI processing code.) If it's failing in some other way, then it could be another problem.

    But I'm pretty sure the "too many CPU cores" issue happens on every Windows 7 64-bit computer with more than 2 CPU cores.



  • @Jeremy D. Pavleck said:

    @Master Chief said:
    Assuming Fallout works today.

    Not on Windows 7, it doesn't.

    It works fine on Windows 7. Why wouldn't it? Vista and 64-bit multi-core CPUs were already commonplace when it was released.



  • @blakeyrat said:

    But I'm pretty sure the "too many CPU cores" issue happens on every Windows 7 64-bit computer with more than 2 CPU cores.

    It does. Iirc New Vegas contained an explicit engine hack to sort of, kind of, maybe work around the issue. (Some people still experience issues with it.) It wasn't until Skyrim that the engine was well and truly fixed, or atleast; so we are led to believe. One can never be quite sure when the topic is Bethesda software. (Also; contrary to what their PR guys may state, Skyrim does not run on a completely new engine: it still holds unused references to the VATS system from Fallout...)

    Also, even with the CPU-affinity fixed, you'll need to patch the Fallout 3 main executable to be large address-space aware (LAA). The 2GB RAM limit you are otherwise stuck with is very easy to hit, even with only the official DLC packs installed, and it will eventually cause logic bugs or hard crashes of the game. This seems to be tied to data in the actual game state that is persisted to save data, which means that long-lived save data will eventually also become unplayable.



  • @Zylon said:

    It works fine on Windows 7. Why wouldn't it? Vista and 64-bit multi-core CPUs were already commonplace when it was released.

    Oh I guess I was hallucinating the bug. Thanks for setting me straight.



  • @Ragnax said:

    (Also; contrary to what their PR guys may state, Skyrim does not run on a completely new engine: it still holds unused references to the VATS system from Fallout...)

    The "burned book" item is identical to the one in Fallout 3 and Fallout New Vegas. You hardly need to dig into the database to find signs of Fallout in Skyrim. (A couple other items are the same, but the burned book one stood out because it's so common in both games.) If you really dig, you'll see there's still Morrowind references in the engine as well.

    Skyrim uses the VATS code to play the finishing move cinematics.



  • @Ragnax said:

    It wasn't until Skyrim that the engine was well and truly fixed, or atleast; so we are led to believe.
     

    For that particular issue, maybe.  In general, no.  Being unable to handle task switching correctly (and not responding at all to ALT-F4) in this day and age is beyond ridiculous.

     



  • @blakeyrat said:

    @Ragnax said:
    (Also; contrary to what their PR guys may state, Skyrim does not run on a completely new engine: it still holds unused references to the VATS system from Fallout...)

    The "burned book" item is identical to the one in Fallout 3 and Fallout New Vegas. You hardly need to dig into the database to find signs of Fallout in Skyrim. (A couple other items are the same, but the burned book one stood out because it's so common in both games.) If you really dig, you'll see there's still Morrowind references in the engine as well.

    Skyrim uses the VATS code to play the finishing move cinematics.

    Going to look for the Combat Shotgun in Skyrim then. Should bring new life to the game, IMO!

    With the old Razer Naga Mice, without any special software/drivers, you can still use the 1-= buttons (Or numpad versions) on Windows 7/8. Most games allow you to change those bindings to do what actions you need, and third party programs are available as well. Better to go that route, IMO.

    I wonder if there's any third party programs that can bind a keypress to change DPI?

     



  • @ubersoldat said:

    TL;DR: Razer thought that for using your mouse it would be a good idea to require an Internet connection.
     

    Eh. My wife installed this software a couple weeks back when she got her Naga back from warranty service. She was a bad girl, did something stupid. And Razer replaced it anyway.

    It only requires an internet connection once, when you install it. Some MBA just got excited and insisted the new drivers 'do the cloud', and in the rush to get the software out the door with an entirely new and useless feature someone forgot to include a 'No, thanks. Install without creating an account' option. 

    They'll put one in for the next release, I imagine. And it isn't like you can't download their old ones anyway. 



  • @dhromed said:

    @blakeyrat said:

    @Jeremy D. Pavleck said:
    @Master Chief said:
    Assuming Fallout works today.

    Not on Windows 7, it doesn't.

    It does if you limit it to one CPU. Also I understand that if you only have a dual-core it's ok, it just barfs if you have more than 3. (The Xbox 360 has 3 and it runs fine there, but... not sure how relevant that is.)

     

    I hypothesize that Master Chief is referring to Fallout 3, since I believe there's no sniping in the isometric predecessors.

    Talk of making Fallout 1 run on 7 is still useful (to fans). Proceed.

    There's a Fallout before Fallout 3? Next you'll be telling me there's a Call of Duty not-Modern Warfare.



  • @MiffTheFox said:

    There's a Fallout before Fallout 3? Next you'll be telling me there's a Call of Duty not-Modern Warfare.
     

    Or a Half-Life 2 Episode 3 .



  • My goodness, the drama one can conjure by omitting a version number.



  • @Master Chief said:

    My goodness, the drama one can conjure by omitting a version number.
     

    That's Drama 2.0, you fuck asser.



  •  I bought a Razor mouse once, reviews seemed good, liked the look and feel of the mouse and bought it. As soon as I plugged it in, it decided to flash a stupid logo on the mouse itself and light up the mouse wheel, and you have to download and install the razor dedicated software to turn the features off. It was pulled apart that night and the LEDs surgically removed.



  • @Master Chief said:

    My goodness, the drama one can conjure by omitting a version number.

    You think the 3 in Fallout 3 is a version number? Like Fallout 3.0?



  • @blakeyrat said:

    @Master Chief said:
    My goodness, the drama one can conjure by omitting a version number.

    You think the 3 in Fallout 3 is a version number? Like Fallout 3.0?

    Release notes:

    + Added a third dimension
    - Removed existing world, replaced with new one
    * Changed development company to different one
    ...


  • @blakeyrat said:

    @Master Chief said:
    My goodness, the drama one can conjure by omitting a version number.

    You think the 3 in Fallout 3 is a version number? Like Fallout 3.0?


    I assumed anyone with an IQ above room temperature would realize that the joke in "Assuming Fallout works today." was a jab at the seemingly endless stream of WTF that regularly comes out of Gamebryo powered games, and not at the very stable and simplistic old school Fallout. Obviously my assumption was incorrect.



  • @Master Chief said:

    I assumed anyone with an IQ above room temperature would realize that the joke in "Assuming Fallout works today." was a jab at the seemingly endless stream of WTF that regularly comes out of Gamebryo powered games, and not at the very stable and simplistic old school Fallout. Obviously my assumption was incorrect.

    Yes. No doubt most people with that sort of IQ have no clue what a "Gamebryo" is. And everyone knows that Old School Fallout is best when salted with cobalt.



  • @boomzilla said:

    @Master Chief said:
    I assumed anyone with an IQ above room temperature would realize that the joke in "Assuming Fallout works today." was a jab at the seemingly endless stream of WTF that regularly comes out of Gamebryo powered games, and not at the very stable and simplistic old school Fallout. Obviously my assumption was incorrect.

    Yes. No doubt most people with that sort of IQ have no clue what a "Gamebryo" is. And everyone knows that Old School Fallout is best when salted with cobalt.


    Granted, but blakey definitely does, which makes me think he's just being a pedantic dickweed because he can. Why I have no idea, I was agreeing with him, but whatever.



  • @Lorne Kates said:

    That's Drama 2.0, you fuck asser.
     

    TRWTF is that it's confusingly versioned as Drama1.2 - Drama1.4



  • @boomzilla said:

    Yes. No doubt most people with that sort of IQ have no clue what a "Gamebryo" is.

    Pretty sure it's a fictional magazine from Homestuck.



  • @MiffTheFox said:

    Pretty sure it's a fictional magazine from Homestuck.
     

    Like, I went to deviantart's homepage, clicked on one category page, and saw a Homestuck fanart. This suggests that HS fanart is now a significant portion of all fanart.



  • @dhromed said:

    @MiffTheFox said:

    Pretty sure it's a fictional magazine from Homestuck.
     

    Like, I went to deviantart's homepage, clicked on one category page, and saw a Homestuck fanart. This suggests that HS fanart is now a significant portion of all fanart.

    Dude I was at an anime convention last weekend and there were more Homestuck cosplayers then actual anime cosplayers.

    Take that as you will.



  • @MiffTheFox said:

    Dude I was at an anime convention last weekend and there were more Homestuck cosplayers then actual anime cosplayers.

    Take that as you will.

    But it's incomprehensible trash! Not to say most other anime isn't, but. Jesus.



  • @blakeyrat said:

    But it's incomprehensible trash!
     

    It's loads of fun!



  • @Mole said:

    It was pulled apart that night and the LEDs surgically removed.

    Wh... why would you do that? You presumably had to install the software at some point anyway to set up DPI stages, and those settings (including the light settings) are stored to memory internal to the mouse – unless you intentionally used the same software to turn the LEDs back on again, they would've stayed dim indefinitely. Instead, you opted to blow the warranty on (what was presumably) an $80 mouse – an $80 mouse made by a company imfamous for shoddy manufacturing and short-lived products.


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