IOS 6 Maps



  • Borrowing a line from blakey, who looked at this product and thought "it's ready.  ship it"?

    http://www.tickld.com/t/25514





  • On an unrelated note, i'm really impressed that the the 'terrain/building-generator' got SO much right... It's accuracy is amazing, frankly... If they'd used the auto generator, and then just touched it up manually, the results could have been fantastic (why haven't google attempted this yet?).
    And no, i'm not suggesting that apple converts the entire world to 3D in one go, but they could have done the biggest cities in each country...



  •  Yah, I think the 3D view goofs are unfair. It's kind of difficult to generate a 3D view of the underside of an object. (see chicago bean)

    All the reduced detail and accuracy on maps is amazing, though.



  • @dhromed said:

    Yah, I think the 3D view goofs are unfair. It's kind of difficult to generate a 3D view of the underside of an object. (see chicago bean)
     

    If your product is literally incapable of producing results that your users will not ridicule, you should possibly consider building a different product instead.

     



  • Were the old 3D views far better?



  • @Iago said:

    @dhromed said:

    Yah, I think the 3D view goofs are unfair. It's kind of difficult to generate a 3D view of the underside of an object. (see chicago bean)
     

    If your product is literally incapable of producing results that your users will not ridicule, you should possibly consider building a different product instead.

     



  • @swayde said:

    http://theamazingios6maps.tumblr.com/
     

     I had posted this link earlier on my FB feed. I had a friend respond with something along the lines of "yeah, well how was that BlackBerry outage?" It reminded me of the Blakeyrat rants. What the hell does one have to do with the other? Because there was an outage on another mobile platform, that means it's OK that Apple released shitty software?



  • @JoeCool said:

    @swayde said:

    http://theamazingios6maps.tumblr.com/
     

     I had posted this link earlier on my FB feed. I had a friend respond with something along the lines of "yeah, well how was that BlackBerry outage?" It reminded me of the Blakeyrat rants. What the hell does one have to do with the other? Because there was an outage on another mobile platform, that means it's OK that Apple released shitty software?


    That's called an "emotional response".



  • @JoeCool said:

    I had posted this link earlier on my FB feed. I had a friend respond with something along the lines of "yeah, well how was that BlackBerry outage?"

    "I use Windows Phone so... good point? Dumbshit?" Can you say "dumbshit" on Facebook? I don't use Facebook. Probably because you can't say "dumbshit".

    @JoeCool said:

    It reminded me of the Blakeyrat rants.

    Have you ever read anything I've ever written?\

    @JoeCool said:

    Because there was an outage on another mobile platform, that means it's OK that Apple released shitty software?

    Pro-tip: I spent like 68% of my posts on this board calling out people on doing exactly that.



  • @blakeyrat said:

    @JoeCool said:
    It reminded me of the Blakeyrat rants.

    Have you ever read anything I've ever written?</blockquote>

    I've read plenty of what you've written. Re-reading what I wrote, I can see how you might misinterpret what I meant. To clarify, I didn't mean that what he wrote reminded me of what you write, I meant that what he wrote made me think of your rants : as in how you would respond to him.

    @blakeyrat said:

    @JoeCool said:
    Because there was an outage on another mobile platform, that means it's OK that Apple released shitty software?

    Pro-tip: I spent like 68% of my posts on this board calling out people on doing exactly that.

    Yeah, that's what I was getting at.



  • It's funny too how people focus on the bad. Yes the new maps are a little sparse (which will get better over time.. how were Google's maps when they first launched?), but wait... Did old maps do Turn by Turn directions? Nope.

    Besides.. even throughout the beta's Apple made huge strides to improve their data. The first beta wanted me to take a 50 foot plunge off an overpass into my neighbourhood (cause it didn't recognize a tunnel). 3 weeks later in Beta 2.. that's magically fixed. If my memory serves me correctly, Google Maps had that same bug for 5 YEARS until it got fixed.

    It's ultimately an improvement for Maps, maybe not in the short term.. but the long term it'll be great. Another thing that people don't realize is that Apple had their hand forced to create their own system as Google refused to renew their contract. Hence why Youtube was also removed from iOS.



  • @gu3st said:

    3 weeks later in Beta 2.. that's magically fixed. If my memory serves me correctly, Google Maps had that same bug for 5 YEARS until it got fixed.
     

    Bugfixing is random.



  • @gu3st said:

    but wait... Did old maps do Turn by Turn directions? Nope.

    Wait, they didn't? Google Maps on my Android phone had turn-by-turn. My Windows Phone 7 has turn-by-turn.

    You mean iPhones this whole time didn't have turn-by-turn directions when every other smartphone did? Shit.



  • @gu3st said:


    It's ultimately an improvement for Maps, maybe not in the short term.. but the long term it'll be great. Another thing that people don't realize is that Apple had their hand forced to create their own system as Google refused to renew their contract. Hence why Youtube was also removed from iOS

    Apples Map app may be better in the future, but replacing a working app(Google map) with a much worse alternative in an upgrade with the hope that "in the future our app might be good" is not a good thing.

    And google does release their youtube player for IOS6, so I wonder if they will do the same with google map. Or would that conflict with the "You are not allowed to submit apps ment to replacement a part of the os" claues?  

     



  • @JoeCool said:

    I didn't mean that what he wrote reminded me of what you write, I meant that what he wrote made me think of your rants : as in how you would respond to him.
     

    Sort of like Hofstadter's "Why does this sentence remind me of Agatha Christie?"

    It's not a quote from any of her books, it's not written in her style, it says nothing characteristic about her, and yet it's almost impossible to read it without thinking of Agatha Christie; why is that?



  • @da Doctah said:

    @JoeCool said:

    I didn't mean that what he wrote reminded me of what you write, I meant that what he wrote made me think of your rants : as in how you would respond to him.
     

    Sort of like Hofstadter's "Why does this sentence remind me of Agatha Christie?"

    It's not a quote from any of her books, it's not written in her style, it says nothing characteristic about her, and yet it's almost impossible to read it without thinking of Agatha Christie; why is that?

    Because it goddamn says Agatha Christie in the goddamn sentence. If I said potato, you'd be thinking about potato even though the sentence has nothing to do with them.



  • @Ben L. said:

    @da Doctah said:

    @JoeCool said:

    I didn't mean that what he wrote reminded me of what you write, I meant that what he wrote made me think of your rants : as in how you would respond to him.
     

    Sort of like Hofstadter's "Why does this sentence remind me of Agatha Christie?"

    It's not a quote from any of her books, it's not written in her style, it says nothing characteristic about her, and yet it's almost impossible to read it without thinking of Agatha Christie; why is that?

    Because it goddamn says Agatha Christie in the goddamn sentence. If I said potato, you'd be thinking about potato even though the sentence has nothing to do with them.
     

     

    Does this sentence remind you of Kreutzfeldt Madrigal?

     



  • @blakeyrat said:

    @gu3st said:
    but wait... Did old maps do Turn by Turn directions? Nope.

    Wait, they didn't? Google Maps on my Android phone had turn-by-turn. My Windows Phone 7 has turn-by-turn.

    You mean iPhones this whole time didn't have turn-by-turn directions when every other smartphone did? Shit.

    That wasn't Apple's fault. Google wouldn't give them the API or permission to use turn-by-turn. They'd allow you to route stuff, but not do live turn-by-turn. It's about the only way Android could make their Maps experience better.. was to handcuff iOS. Now iOS is free from those handcuffs and is better off for it.

    Windows phone is unique in that Microsoft has always had its own maps solution. Which ironically enough iOS maps shares data sources with Bing maps (go compare satellite imagery between the 2.. the seams are in identical spots.)



  • @mt@ilovefactory.com said:

    @gu3st said:


    It's ultimately an improvement for Maps, maybe not in the short term.. but the long term it'll be great. Another thing that people don't realize is that Apple had their hand forced to create their own system as Google refused to renew their contract. Hence why Youtube was also removed from iOS

    Apples Map app may be better in the future, but replacing a working app(Google map) with a much worse alternative in an upgrade with the hope that "in the future our app might be good" is not a good thing.

    And google does release their youtube player for IOS6, so I wonder if they will do the same with google map. Or would that conflict with the "You are not allowed to submit apps ment to replacement a part of the os" claues?  

     

    Google is fortunate that Apple can't reject their apps without bringing up a huge anti-trust lawsuit. They can drag their feet to release it and release updates, but if they flat out rejected it without concrete reasoning.. they'd be in for a world of hurt.


    Hence why the piss poor GMail app made it through the first time.. Any other dev and that would be rejected for being just a total trainwreck (a fancified webview)... but because they're Google.. they had to.

    It is still really funny to me though.. Every other smartphone developer makes apps for iOS so they can compete (Google Maps, Gmail Youtube, Xbox Live).. but Apple doesn't feel the need to think about building apps on Android.

    Oh yeah, it's cause Google and Microsoft have more to gain by building stuff for the top of the pyramid. Even with their own OS's, they'd rather invest resources in building for iOS.



  • @gu3st said:

    Now iOS is free from those handcuffs and is better off for it.

    By "better off" you mean of course "universally reviled and mocked", yes?

    Because I've seen the maps in the linked blogs and that don't scream "better off" to me somehow.



  • @blakeyrat said:

    Because I've seen the maps in the linked blogs and that don't scream "better off" to me somehow.
    To an Apple fanperson, anything made by Apple is clearly better than everything else, even when it's obviously worse than everything else and universally hated by everyone.



  • @blakeyrat said:

    @gu3st said:
    Now iOS is free from those handcuffs and is better off for it.

    By "better off" you mean of course "universally reviled and mocked", yes?

    Because I've seen the maps in the linked blogs and that don't scream "better off" to me somehow.

    Well... They are better off. Without transitioning away from Google (which their hand was forced. Google refused to renew their contract for Youtube and Maps), they could never have implemented Turn-by-Turn (as Google wouldn't let them either.)

    I know for your small brain it seems like a step backwards.. but when Google restricted their ability to add a really key feature that every other OS had implemented, along with Google not allowing them to continue using Google as a data source.. they weren't left with much choices.

    Why is it "Apple's maps are awful." The real story should be how Google is anti-competitive and was so scared of iOS, that their only way to compete was to literally restrict them. That doesn't seem like Google has a lot of faith in competing on their own merits.



  • @gu3st said:

    Why is it "Apple's maps are awful." The real story should be how Google is anti-competitive and was so scared of iOS, that their only way to compete was to literally restrict them. That doesn't seem like Google has a lot of faith in competing on their own merits.
    Oh, sweetie. I think you're confused.

    Considering Apple have just won a lawsuit against Samsung that boils down to "they have curved corners and flat fronts just like us and we think people are too stupid to tell the difference between their products and ours even though theirs says Samsung everywhere and ours don't", I'd hazard a guess and say that Apple is scared of Android.



  • @Douglasac said:

    To an $VENDOR fanperson, anything made by $VENDOR is clearly better than everything else, even when it's obviously worse than everything else and universally hated by everyone.
     

    Refactored that for you.

    @blakeyrat said:

    Because I've seen the maps in the linked blogs and that don't scream "better off" to me somehow.

    @gu3st said:

    Well... They are better off.
     

    Talking two different viewpoints - you're talking about the developers and whole ecosystem being better off, Blakey's talking about the end effect: the deliverable products that users consume.

    As yet, this change hasn't bought about significant benefits for the end-user, and that's what they're currently being judged upon (at least by the vociferous majority on the interwebz, including industry pundits). 

     



  • @Douglasac said:

    @gu3st said:
    Why is it "Apple's maps are awful." The real story should be how Google is anti-competitive and was so scared of iOS, that their only way to compete was to literally restrict them. That doesn't seem like Google has a lot of faith in competing on their own merits.
    Oh, sweetie. I think you're confused.

    Considering Apple have just won a lawsuit against Samsung that boils down to "they have curved corners and flat fronts just like us and we think people are too stupid to tell the difference between their products and ours even though theirs says Samsung everywhere and ours don't", I'd hazard a guess and say that Apple is scared of Android.

    I'm sorry, but if I had my work and trade dress stolen, I'd be suing them too. Why should manufacturers get a free pass just becuase they were second. Plus a lot of the lawsut wasn't just on shape, but it was underlying OS stuff.. and even dialogue from Samsungs designers on how they were basically "See iOS, look at us, now make us like iOS".

    If you went and built a jetpack, figured out all the design to make it safe for everyone else to use.. but spent 1 billion dollars figuring it out and actually developing processes and R&D.. wouldn't you be pissed that some random company came along, spent 1/50th of your investment and came out with something comparable? Wouldn't you want to protect your billion dollar investment?



  • @Cassidy said:

    @Douglasac said:

    To an $VENDOR fanperson, anything made by $VENDOR is clearly better than everything else, even when it's obviously worse than everything else and universally hated by everyone.
     

    Refactored that for you.

    @blakeyrat said:

    Because I've seen the maps in the linked blogs and that don't scream "better off" to me somehow.

    @gu3st said:

    Well... They are better off.
     

    Talking two different viewpoints - you're talking about the developers and whole ecosystem being better off, Blakey's talking about the end effect: the deliverable products that users consume.

    As yet, this change hasn't bought about significant benefits for the end-user, and that's what they're currently being judged upon (at least by the vociferous majority on the interwebz, including industry pundits). 

     

    At the current time.. it's a minor downgrade. But in the longterm.. Apple being independent from Google for any service will be better in the long run. As the expression goes. Things get worse before they get better. This is one of those times, but of any point to do that kind of transition.. better now than in 3 years.



  • @gu3st said:

    Google wouldn't give them the API or permission to use turn-by-turn.

    @gu3st said:
    Oh yeah, it's cause Google and Microsoft have more to gain by building stuff for the top of the pyramid.

    Careful, you might sprain something there. I hear the pretty iCrutches really hurt your armpits.

    Really, though, this sort of thing is to be expected when you run such a draconian ecosystem that includes lots of breaking changes.



  • @gu3st said:

    At the current time.. it's a minor downgrade. But in the longterm.. Apple being independent from Google for any service will be better in the long run. As the expression goes. Things get worse before they get better. This is one of those times, but of any point to do that kind of transition.. better now than in 3 years.

    Then why didn't they sign a 3-year deal with Tom-Tom? Or Yahoo? Or any of the half-dozen other companies that already have functional turn-by-turn direction software? It's not like Apple's poor; fuck they've been doing nothing but hoarding cash for 5 years. They're the Smaug of tech companies.

    I don't want to be that guy, but fuck man: if Steve Jobs were alive, he'd NEVER have signed off on this map app.



  • @blakeyrat said:

    @gu3st said:
    At the current time.. it's a minor downgrade. But in the longterm.. Apple being independent from Google for any service will be better in the long run. As the expression goes. Things get worse before they get better. This is one of those times, but of any point to do that kind of transition.. better now than in 3 years.

    Then why didn't they sign a 3-year deal with Tom-Tom? Or Yahoo? Or any of the half-dozen other companies that already have functional turn-by-turn direction software? It's not like Apple's poor; fuck they've been doing nothing but hoarding cash for 5 years. They're the Smaug of tech companies.

    I don't want to be that guy, but fuck man: if Steve Jobs were alive, he'd NEVER have signed off on this map app.

    Actually... Tom-Tom (or one of those large GPS companies. Garmin maybe?) is a data source for Apple's Maps. Bing Maps is 1 provider of satellite imagery as well. They do have some pretty large data sources for their stuff.



  • @gu3st said:

    If you went and built a jetpack, figured out all the design to make it safe for everyone else to use.. but spent 1 billion dollars figuring it out and actually developing processes and R&D.. wouldn't you be pissed that some random company came along, spent 1/50th of your investment and came out with something comparable? Wouldn't you want to protect your billion dollar investment
     

    Ok, that's fair.

     And if you went out and built softwre that aligns colored icons on a grid, figured out all the design to make the icons aligned for everybody else to use... but spent, well, how expensive is it to iterate over each axis? Would you be pissed that some random company came along, spent... well, it can't be cheaper for they, can it? I mean, they also have to write software to iterate over each axis... So, spent 1 time your investiment and came out with something comparable...

    Would you be pissed at them?



  • @Mcoder said:

    @gu3st said:

    If you went and built a jetpack, figured out all the design to make it safe for everyone else to use.. but spent 1 billion dollars figuring it out and actually developing processes and R&D.. wouldn't you be pissed that some random company came along, spent 1/50th of your investment and came out with something comparable? Wouldn't you want to protect your billion dollar investment
     

    Ok, that's fair.

     And if you went out and built softwre that aligns colored icons on a grid, figured out all the design to make the icons aligned for everybody else to use... but spent, well, how expensive is it to iterate over each axis? Would you be pissed that some random company came along, spent... well, it can't be cheaper for they, can it? I mean, they also have to write software to iterate over each axis... So, spent 1 time your investiment and came out with something comparable...

    Would you be pissed at them?

    You're only comparing success though. Whose to say Apple hadn't done hundreds of UI's that they deemed "not good enough".. which does cost money to pay designers/engineers to program/design their failed concepts. Then having Samsung come in and take their successful version and copy it without needing to have the design failures. They accomplish the reward without any of the risk which is what Apple is ultimately defending. The fact that Samsung comes in and tries to reap the rewards of Apple's design risk.



  • @gu3st said:

    You're only comparing success though. Whose to say Apple hadn't done hundreds of UI's that they deemed "not good enough".. which does cost money to pay designers/engineers to program/design their failed concepts. Then having Samsung come in and take their successful version and copy it without needing to have the design failures. They accomplish the reward without any of the risk which is what Apple is ultimately defending. The fact that Samsung comes in and tries to reap the rewards of Apple's design risk.
    What design? The design is minimalist;by thrying to enforce others to have a significantly different design, you force them to artificially cripple it. This is what Dutch court decided.

    As for iOS's UI, it's not fundamentally different from the Apple Lisa, and that was heavily influenced by the Xerox Alto. (I don't know if that had icons, but it did have a mouse.) The one that is fundamentally different is Microsoft's Metro, although you're not supposed to call it"Metro" any longer.

    Apple is not at all good at innovating. I'm hard-pressed to think of any Apple product that was truly innovative. Maybe the Newton? But it didn't work particularly well.

    That's another problem of Apple: they can't write decent software. The number one reason for me not to get an iPhone is iTunes and that horrible QuickTime they install with it. Perhaps they don't do that any longer; I don't know and I don't care. Seldom before have I seen such an intrusive and non-conforming (I'm running Windows) piece of software.

    What Apple are very good at is making a product that is just easy to use, and is really well integrated, that just works and does what you want it to do. And they're very good at marketing it, and covering all the touch points. You can see that "touch point marketing" is the driving force behind their success.

    I'm happy with my Samsung Galaxy S3, but I'd wish that Apple would just sod off with their lawsuits and instead focussed on building better products.

     



  • @Severity One said:

    @gu3st said:

    You're only comparing success though. Whose to say Apple hadn't done hundreds of UI's that they deemed "not good enough".. which does cost money to pay designers/engineers to program/design their failed concepts. Then having Samsung come in and take their successful version and copy it without needing to have the design failures. They accomplish the reward without any of the risk which is what Apple is ultimately defending. The fact that Samsung comes in and tries to reap the rewards of Apple's design risk.
    What design? The design is minimalist;by thrying to enforce others to have a significantly different design, you force them to artificially cripple it. This is what Dutch court decided.

    As for iOS's UI, it's not fundamentally different from the Apple Lisa, and that was heavily influenced by the Xerox Alto. (I don't know if that had icons, but it did have a mouse.) The one that is fundamentally different is Microsoft's Metro, although you're not supposed to call it"Metro" any longer.

    Apple is not at all good at innovating. I'm hard-pressed to think of any Apple product that was truly innovative. Maybe the Newton? But it didn't work particularly well.

    That's another problem of Apple: they can't write decent software. The number one reason for me not to get an iPhone is iTunes and that horrible QuickTime they install with it. Perhaps they don't do that any longer; I don't know and I don't care. Seldom before have I seen such an intrusive and non-conforming (I'm running Windows) piece of software.

    What Apple are very good at is making a product that is just easy to use, and is really well integrated, that just works and does what you want it to do. And they're very good at marketing it, and covering all the touch points. You can see that "touch point marketing" is the driving force behind their success.

    I'm happy with my Samsung Galaxy S3, but I'd wish that Apple would just sod off with their lawsuits and instead focussed on building better products.

     

    iTunes for Windows does suck really hard. On OS X it's not bad because at least Carbon/Cocoa is natively integrated. On Windows it's a bit of a mess. However, Quicktime isn't mandatory for iTunes anymore (they just bundle the required librarys in a DLL).

    Plus, OS X isn't poorly written by anyones imagination (unless you love the taste of Microsoft's cock).



  • @gu3st said:

    You're only comparing success though. Whose to say Apple hadn't done hundreds of UI's that they deemed "not good enough".. which does cost money to pay designers/engineers to program/design their failed concepts. Then having Samsung come in and take their successful version and copy it without needing to have the design failures. They accomplish the reward without any of the risk which is what Apple is ultimately defending. The fact that Samsung comes in and tries to reap the rewards of Apple's design risk.
    Okay, let's turn the knife. Whose to say that Google hadn't done hundreds of UI's for their notification system (which Apple pretty much copied in the last version of iOS) that they deemed "not good enough"?

    @gu3st said:
    Plus, OS X isn't poorly written by anyones imagination (unless you love the taste of Microsoft's cock).
    It's not poorly written, it's just poor... you should see my programming class: all the computers in the room are Macs and most people have booted into the Windows partition. I haven't asked them all why, but I'd bet money on the fact that they can't stand OS X. Hell, even once I've fiddled with the settings to make it behave sanely it still doesn't work the way I would like it to.



  • @gu3st said:

    Plus, OS X isn't poorly written by anyones imagination (unless you love the taste of Microsoft's cock).

    I'm not familiar with Microsoft's cock, but I suppose we all know how well OSX is written based on the flawless upgrade process.



  • @Ben L. said:

    @Iago said:

    @dhromed said:

    Yah, I think the 3D view goofs are unfair. It's kind of difficult to generate a 3D view of the underside of an object. (see chicago bean)
     

    If your product is literally incapable of producing results that your users will not ridicule, you should possibly consider building a different product instead.

     

     

     

     



  • @Mo6eB said:

    1998 called and they want their shitty websites back
    Did you tell them about 9/11 or the Tsunami?

     



  • @Mo6eB said:

    @boomzilla said:
    I'm not familiar with Microsoft's cock, but I
    suppose we all know how well OSX is written based on the flawless
    upgrade process.

     

     

     

    You appear to have mistakenly misquoted someone, so I FTFY.

     



  • @gu3st said:

    Plus, OS X isn't poorly written by anyones imagination (unless you love the taste of Microsoft's cock).

    It's has a better API than Windows, but that's mostly because it's new-ish. It's designed around a better language, unless you count .net as part of Windows.

    It's significantly worse at backwards compatibility. It's pretty feature-bare compared to Windows, but probably comparable to Linux feature-wise. Its dev tools suck shit, but are probably better than Linux dev tools on average.

    Usability-wise, it's a HUGE downslide from Mac Classic and basically throws the millions of man-hours Apple spent on usability research back in the 80s into a dumpster. Then pees on it.

    The usability downslide is why I no longer use it. If my choice is between two OSes that both have mediocre-to-bad usability, I might as well pick the one with a bigger software selection.

    ... oh and none of this changes the fact that the new Maps app is awful and should never have been shipped to the public in its current state.

    They seriously never even tried searching for Berlin to see if the pin was in the right place? Berlin?



  • @blakeyrat said:

    They seriously never even tried searching for Berlin to see if the pin was in the right place? Berlin?
    Also apparently Australia has moved...

    [img]http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mao86oNp1Y1rhptwbo1_1280.png[/img]



  • @Iago said:

    If your product is literally incapable of producing results that your users will not ridicule, you should possibly consider building a different product instead.

     

    Especially when your flagship product is consistently a year or two behind the technology curve because you built your brand waiting for the technology to be 'right' before you include it.



  • @Douglasac said:

    @blakeyrat said:
    They seriously never even tried searching for Berlin to see if the pin was in the right place? Berlin?
    Also apparently Australia has moved...

     

     

    lol apple moves slower than plate tectonics lol

     



  • @gu3st said:

    You're only comparing success though. Whose to say Apple hadn't done hundreds of UI's that they deemed "not good enough".. which does cost money to pay designers/engineers to program/design their failed concepts. Then having Samsung come in and take their successful version and copy it without needing to have the design failures.
     

    Hey, if you have access to all those iterations Apple tried before deciding to align the icons on a grid, please, post them here.



  • @Mcoder said:

    @gu3st said:
    You're only comparing success though. Whose to say Apple hadn't done hundreds of UI's that they deemed "not good enough".. which does cost money to pay designers/engineers to program/design their failed concepts. Then having Samsung come in and take their successful version and copy it without needing to have the design failures.
     Hey, if you have access to all those iterations Apple tried before deciding to align the icons on a grid, please, post them here.
    Also the cost to innovate the same thing decreases over time.  So for an electronics company to make a processor that is of the same power as processors from 5 years ago is going to be much less than what it costs companies 5 years ago to develop it.  The real cost to innovation occurs when you are developing something that is at that top edge.



  • @Severity One said:

    Apple is not at all good at innovating anymore.
    FTFY, innovation is the only thing early apple did!

     



  • @blakeyrat said:

    @gu3st said:
    Plus, OS X isn't poorly written by anyones imagination (unless you love the taste of Microsoft's cock).

    It's significantly worse at backwards compatibility.

    That is its strength is that it's not burdened by 25 years of old crufy garbage that is the Windows API.



  • @gu3st said:

    That is its strength is that it's not burdened by 25 years of old crufy garbage that is the Windows API.

    Until you get lost because, say, the old reliable map application stops working.

    Of course, it's a trade off. Making either decision makes you look stupid at different times.



  • @gu3st said:

    That is its strength is that it's not burdened by 25 years of old crufy garbage that is the Windows API.

    Nobody's going to deny the Windows API is crufty. That's why .net was invented (although things didn't really go as planned there...)

    Apple was awful at breaking applications even when they had the cruftiest API, though. Mac OS 7 broke like a third of my apps. (And before my time, the switch from 24-bit to 32-bit addressing broke apps.) The switch from 68k to PPC broke more. The switch from Classic to OS X broke more (the Classic simulator thing sucked shit), turning off the Carbon API broke more... I got fucking disgusted of it.

    Anyway the quality of the API has little to do with the quality of the OS. It just means if you're smart, you're not talking directly to the API and using something like, say, .net or wxWidgets or whatever to smooth out the issues for you. Even MFC is better.



  • Since we're talking about blakey....

    I just got back and noticed he was up over 7k posts.

    I've implemented code such that when he clicks post, it generates a random number between 0 and 1.  If said number is greater than 2, it allows the post to go through.  If it's less than two, it redirects him to meatspin.


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