Short and Sweet: Steam's Schrödinger's messages, and dishonest lying liars who lie



  • When Steam can't query its message server, it lies to you and tells you there are no messages. When there are clearly two of them. The WTF here isn't that Steam's server is down (that happens like clockwork), its that the error message lies to the user. I hate liars.



  • Oh shit it gets worse-- Steam might have cleaned-out my uploaded Workshop items! Or at least lost the link between them and my account...

    If you go to one of my mods, it works fine: http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=66907293&searchtext=

    But if you click on the "Mecha Gamera's Workshop" breadcrumb at the top, suddenly it's all "no items in workshop": http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561197966444513/myworkshopfiles?appid=72850

    AFAICT, no other accounts are affected.

    Fuck you, Steam. Fuck you.



  • I hate Steam for so many reasons.



    Say you've suddenly lost your internet connection. You want to play an offline Steam game. You think "Oh no! Steam probably won't let me play that game offline!" but you decide to try anyway. You launch Steam and get this:



    [img]http://oi44.tinypic.com/2vv88sj.jpg[/img]


    "Oh great! It says "start Steam in "Offline Mode", and there's a button that says "START IN OFFLINE MODE", so I can probably start in offline mode! Steam is not so bad after all!".

    Fool. You click the button. A window appears: "Connecting Steam account: ...". You get slightly confused. Suddenly:


    [img]http://oi44.tinypic.com/jl339l.jpg[/img]
    "Wait what? You just told me this, I told you to ignore it. WTF Steam?"
    You drag the window to one side to discover a smaller one hidden under it (and unresponsive until you close the other one), and then you understand why that picture of Gabe Newell as trollface exists:
    [img]http://oi43.tinypic.com/2ym6ih1.jpg[/img]
    [img]http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_loyj16Gx1r1qjudon.gif[/img]

    Then I joined GOG.com, got 8 free games, bought Spacechem for less than it costs on Steam ($10 instead of 10€) with soundtracks, manuals and all, and no DRM crap. Too bad it doesn't have more games.


  • sorry, the care train didnt stop



  • Do people have these posts queued up waiting to go the instant someone posts on a vaguely related topic?

    If you have your own wtf, post it in your own damn thread. Don't hijack mine. Ass.



  • @blakeyrat said:

    Do people have these posts queued up waiting to go the instant someone posts on a vaguely related topic?

    If you have your own wtf, post it in your own damn thread. Don't hijack mine. Ass.

    Could be worse, they could be posting vaguely related xkcd comics.



  • @blakeyrat said:

    Oh shit it gets worse-- Steam might have cleaned-out my uploaded Workshop items! Or at least lost the link between them and my account...

    If you go to one of my mods, it works fine: http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=66907293&searchtext=

    But if you click on the "Mecha Gamera's Workshop" breadcrumb at the top, suddenly it's all "no items in workshop": http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561197966444513/myworkshopfiles?appid=72850

    AFAICT, no other accounts are affected.

    Fuck you, Steam. Fuck you.

    Your workshop seems to have 8 items in it right now, so it must have been transitory.



  • @Strolskon said:

    GOG.com
     

    At first I was like, cool!

    Then I saw they naively try to offload junk like Blake Stone (!!!) for six bucks (!!!!!$#%#@!!), instead of zero bucks or minus six bucks.

    So I guess I'd rather give my money to Steam than to these gog boys.



  • Yeah I don't like GOG for a few reasons, most of them being that stunt they pulled awhile ago where they pretended to have closed down completely and removed access to everybody's games. Wow, you got a lot of press from that stunt! Now I'm never, ever, ever, ever going to trust you again.

    The few things I have bought from GOG, I keep in my own personal backups. Because God knows when they'll shut down for real. I don't do that with Steam-- despite the software's bugginess and shittiness and general-unusability, I still trust them more with my data.



  • @blakeyrat said:

    Do people have these posts queued up waiting to go the instant someone posts on a vaguely related topic?

    If you have your own wtf, post it in your own damn thread. Don't hijack mine. Ass.

    I am really sorry. I did actually have these screenshots saved from before (from another forum). I saw your post about Steam lying, remembered them, and thought it was acceptable moment to post them, since they are about Steam lying. I feel so stupid now. I apologize for all emotional damages I might have caused.



  • @Strolskon said:

    Stuff about Steam's offline mode

    I for one have never had a problem with Steam's offline mode.

    I attended a small college which blocked the Steam port, saying they didn't have enough bandwidth for games (yea yea, I know, the place was WTF central. We found ways around it). Whenever I transported my computer from my parent's house to campus, I'd get the same error message - "Can't connect, start in offline mode?". I started it in Offline Mode. It came up with no problems. I played all the games I was playing at home with no problems. That was in 2008.

    I must have been doing something different or acting more sensibly than the rest of the Internet, though, because you can't go 10 posts in a thread about Steam without someone complaining about Offline Mode.



  • @blakeyrat said:

    ...

    The few things I have bought from GOG, I keep in my own personal backups. Because God knows when they'll shut down for real. I don't do that with Steam-- despite the software's bugginess and shittiness and general-unusability, I still trust them more with my data.

    Except of course when Steam got hacked and thus leaked everyone's credit card numbers.  My card ended up getting some unauthorized charges on it shortly after that leak, and I had to get a new card issued.  Ironicly I found a WTF (actually several) in my credit card company's process of after they issue a new card...

    In my case my credit card and car issurance are done through the same company so they charge my deductible directly to the credit card.  My new card meant I got a new number, and they did not automatically update the car insurance to use the new credit card (Note they have no problem updating it automatically when the card naturally expires).  So skip ahead 60 days later I get a call from them saying they are about to drop my car insurance.  I of course quickly rectified it, but I was curious as to how they did not send me a bill after 30 days stating oh BTW you have not paid us last month.  Aparantly when I went with paperless billing they went all out paperless, even to the point of not telling me when something was wrong.  Oh and they did not even bother to send me an email at all during all of this.



  • @Anketam said:

    Except of course when Steam got hacked and thus leaked everyone's credit card numbers.

    Getting hacked and leaking CC numbers is, sadly, just a cost-of-business when doing business online at this point. And they handled it well.

    GOG, on the other hand, PURPOSEFULLY took down their website, PURPOSEFULLY prevented people from accessing/downloading their purchased games, and didn't tell ANYBODY what was happening, for several days as a publicity stunt. It's apples and oranges. Plus GOG is run by Europeans.



  • @lettucemode said:

    [...] you can't go 10 posts in a thread about Steam without someone complaining about Offline Mode.

    "For some reason, my totally legit games won't start. I'm trying to run them in offline mode because... uh... my internet sucks. Yes, let's go with that. Anyway, is there any way to bypass this shitty feature and play the games that I did not steal without having to connect to the internet a single time?"



  • @pkmnfrk said:

    @lettucemode said:

    [...] you can't go 10 posts in a thread about Steam without someone complaining about Offline Mode.

    "For some reason, my totally legit games won't start. I'm trying to run them in offline mode because... uh... my internet sucks. Yes, let's go with that. Anyway, is there any way to bypass this shitty feature and play the games that I did not steal without having to connect to the internet a single time?"

    Totally! Those DRM assholes won't know what hit them


  • I love Steam, but the community section really is a bug infested p.o.s.

    But usually if you report a bug they fix it, even tough the steam client updates are not very frequent.

    The only thing worst than that is the Source SDK, I don't know who inside of Valve is responsible for mantaining it but i bet they are drunk most of the day/week/month/year.



  • @blakeyrat said:

    Plus GOG is run by Europeans.
    Meaning, they dine on good food, dress well, and drive decent cars? I can see how that could cause offence if you're from Redneckville.

     



  • @blakeyrat said:

    The WTF here isn't that Steam's server is down (that happens like clockwork), its that the error message lies to the user. I hate liars.
    Wel, we're talking Valve Software here. They like lying. They even made a game around it.

     



  • @Severity One said:

    @blakeyrat said:

    Plus GOG is run by Europeans.
    Meaning, they dine on good food, dress well, and drive decent cars? I can see how that could cause offence if you're from Redneckville.

     

    <trolling>
    No, it means that their streets and buildings are small, old and obsolete, they smoke, they have retarded power outlets, their GPS replacement is a joke, and their economy is crumbling because the countries that they used to rape and pillage shamelessly as colonies are now independent and the decadent citizens of the metropolis are like deers in the headlights when it comes to do actual work themselves. As for cars, not everyone in Europe is driving a Porsche - mainstream cars in Europe are way behind Asian and American cars, they look like toys and sound like they all have scooter engines. Also I have yet to hear a European police car siren that does not sound gay.
    </trolling>



  •  Looks like you only went to Denmark then, in which case your assessment is largely correct.



  • @Severity One said:

    Meaning, they dine on good food, dress well, and drive decent cars?

    Europeans are fucking retarded when it comes to food. As for clothing, you look like homeless Americans with bad fashion sense. Some of your cars are better. But then again you have Fiat, which cancels out any positives.

    Edit: Oh, yeah, forgot about Italians. Italians can cook well. The rest of European food is made of inedible garbage animal parts and overboiled vegetables, complemented with mild cheese curds. It's an entire continent of nursing home inhabitants.



  •  Those animal parts are the food. The world would be a less happy place without things like black pudding, sausages and haggis in it!



  • @pkmnfrk said:

    @lettucemode said:

    [...] you can't go 10 posts in a thread about Steam without someone complaining about Offline Mode.

    "For some reason, my totally legit games won't start. I'm trying to run them in offline mode because... uh... my internet sucks. Yes, let's go with that. Anyway, is there any way to bypass this shitty feature and play the games that I did not steal without having to connect to the internet a single time?"

    If you're in Offline Mode and install a game that needs to connect to Steam's servers to validate, the game install will fail with a completely useless and nondescript message because Steam won't allow the game to connect to the Internet because it's in Offline Mode. No "You need to go online to complete installation, would you like to do this now?" dialog, nothing, nada - the install fails and rolls back. I hate Steam.



  • @Severity One said:

     Looks like you only went to Denmark then, in which case your assessment is largely correct.

     

    I thought he was talking about France D:

     



  • At home, we call this type of food  "dead things in gravy" or "muck from the sea" - as offered by holiday resort hotels all around Europe.



  • @morbiuswilters said:

    @Severity One said:
    Meaning, they dine on good food, dress well, and drive decent cars?

    Europeans are fucking retarded when it comes to food. As for clothing, you look like homeless Americans with bad fashion sense. Some of your cars are better. But then again you have Fiat, which cancels out any positives.

    Edit: Oh, yeah, forgot about Italians. Italians can cook well. The rest of European food is made of inedible garbage animal parts and overboiled vegetables, complemented with mild cheese curds. It's an entire continent of nursing home inhabitants.

    Given that the best-known American cook is Colonel Sanders and that his sous-chef is Ronald McDonald, that is somewhat of a risky statement to make.

    The fact is that rubbish food in Europe is largely limited to the British Isles and, it pains me to say, the Netherlands - with the exception of the southern province of Limburg, where I happen to be from. Everything south of the Dutch-Belgian border has good food indeed.

    I can't vouch for Scandinavia or eatern Europe, because I've never been there. I would imagine Scandinavia to be more or less on the same lines as Britain. (How many Swedish restaurants can you name? Outside Sweden?)

    Germany is a bit of a special case. The food is generally simple, a bit like the people living there, but of good quality, like some of their products.

     And another fact is that, whatever you have in northern America (let's pretend for a moment that Canada has anything interesting to offer) that's great and all that, somewhere in Europe you'll find something better.

    Want to legally drive 100 mph or faster? Go to Germany.

    Want to go 220 mph in a train? Go to Spain. (And yes, trains do make sense here, because of the shorter distances. Also, they take you to the city centre, not some airport in the middle of nowhere.)

    Want a beautiful supercar? Go to Italy.

    Want to legally buy drugs? Go to the Netherlands (whilst it lasts).

    Want to see some original Greek, Roman, medieval or gothic architecture? Take your pick, there are gothic cathedrals all over the place.

     Want to see subway stations that look like palaces? Go to Russia.

     Want to be given an assault rifle by the government? Be Swiss. And male. And between ages 18 and 30.

    Admittedly, if you like tornadoes, hurricanes, earthquakes, excessive homicide rates or being eaten by sharks, you're better off in the USA.



  • @Severity One said:

    [quote user="morbiuswilters] Given that the best-known American cook is Colonel Sanders and that his sous-chef is Ronald McDonald, that is somewhat of a risky statement to make.

    The fact is that rubbish food in Europe is largely limited to the British Isles and, it pains me to say, the Netherlands - with the exception of the southern province of Limburg, where I happen to be from. Everything south of the Dutch-Belgian border has good food indeed.

    I can't vouch for Scandinavia or eatern Europe, because I've never been there. I would imagine Scandinavia to be more or less on the same lines as Britain. (How many Swedish restaurants can you name? Outside Sweden?)

    Germany is a bit of a special case. The food is generally simple, a bit like the people living there, but of good quality, like some of their products.

     And another fact is that, whatever you have in northern America (let's pretend for a moment that Canada has anything interesting to offer) that's great and all that, somewhere in Europe you'll find something better.

    Want to legally drive 100 mph or faster? Go to Germany.

    Want to go 220 mph in a train? Go to Spain. (And yes, trains do make sense here, because of the shorter distances. Also, they take you to the city centre, not some airport in the middle of nowhere.)

    Want a beautiful supercar? Go to Italy.

    Want to legally buy drugs? Go to the Netherlands (whilst it lasts).

    Want to see some original Greek, Roman, medieval or gothic architecture? Take your pick, there are gothic cathedrals all over the place.

     Want to see subway stations that look like palaces? Go to Russia.

     Want to be given an assault rifle by the government? Be Swiss. And male. And between ages 18 and 30.

    Admittedly, if you like tornadoes, hurricanes, earthquakes, excessive homicide rates or being eaten by sharks, you're better off in the USA.

    Problem is that you cant be in all of those different places at the same time, yet you are taking a lot of regional issues that USA has combining them all together.  I could easily take all the worse elements from the countries you list and come up with the same argument against Europe.  USA not only has a large number of good things about it, it also at an overall level is much better than any country in Europe.


  • @Severity One said:

    @blakeyrat said:

    The WTF here isn't that Steam's server is down (that happens like clockwork), its that the error message lies to the user. I hate liars.
    Wel, we're talking Valve Software here. They like lying. They even made a game around it.

     

    Two, actually. But that's neither here nor there, as we're all ignoring Valve's greatest lie.



  • @The_Assimilator said:

    If you're in Offline Mode and install a game that needs to connect to Steam's servers to validate, the game install will fail with a completely useless and nondescript message because Steam won't allow the game to connect to the Internet because it's in Offline Mode. No "You need to go online to complete installation, would you like to do this now?" dialog, nothing, nada - the install fails and rolls back. I hate Steam.

    1) Why are you installing a game in Offline Mode?

    2) Why are you surprised that a program running in something called "Offline Mode" would actively refuse to connect to the internet?

    A dialog would be nice, sure, but I'll argue that you're not using the software properly, even though you know that the game needs to be validated via the internet.



  • @Speakerphone Dude said:

    they smoke

    Is that bad or good? I don't smoke but the holy war on smoking on most place in the US seems more retarded to me.



  • @Severity One said:

    Given that the best-known American cook is Colonel Sanders and that his sous-chef is Ronald McDonald, that is somewhat of a risky statement to make.

    So now we're judging a people's cooking by which fast food restaurants popular? You just walked right into that fallacy.

    @Severity One said:

    Want to legally drive 100 mph or faster? Go to Germany.

    Which is cool, but our roads are more utilitarian, which makes high speed limits unsafe. We can't just exclude all of the poor people from driving like Germany does.

    @Severity One said:

    Want to go 220 mph in a train? Go to Spain. (And yes, trains do make sense here, because of the shorter distances. Also, they take you to the city centre, not some airport in the middle of nowhere.)

    Why the fuck would I want to ride a train? Our trains go to the city center, too, so I have no idea WTF you're talking about there.

    @Severity One said:

    Want a beautiful supercar? Go to Italy.

    You are aware that I don't have to be in Italy to buy an Italian car, right? Also, I don't really care for Italian or French cars; I really like German cars, though.

    @Severity One said:

    Want to legally buy drugs? Go to the Netherlands (whilst it lasts).

    Or California (well, for marijuana, but IIRC they stopped selling mushrooms in Amsterdam a few years ago). And it's not like it's difficult to get illegal drugs here.

    @Severity One said:

    Want to see subway stations that look like palaces? Go to Russia.

    Oh man, you're scraping the bottom of the barrel here.

    @Severity One said:

    Want to be given an assault rifle by the government? Be Swiss. And male. And between ages 18 and 30.

    "Come to Europe for the ornate subway stations, stay because you've been forcibly conscripted." Sounds like a real paradise you folks have going there.

    I could fire back all the reasons why the US is better than Europe, but that would be pointless. See, the best thing about Americans is that we can win Internet fights simply by wishing for it.



  • @lettucemode said:

    1) Why are you installing a game in Offline Mode?

    2) Why are you surprised that a program running in something called "Offline Mode" would actively refuse to connect to the internet?

    A dialog would be nice, sure, but I'll argue that you're not using the software properly, even though you know that the game needs to be validated via the internet.

    Maybe he forgot? The problem seems to be that it doesn't offer to connect to the Internet to validate the game and proceeds to uninstall. This isn't difficult stuff. That's just plain broken.



  • @serguey123 said:

    @Speakerphone Dude said:
    they smoke

    Is that bad or good? I don't smoke but the holy war on smoking on most place in the US seems more retarded to me.

    I'm torn. As someone who was a heavy smoker until recently, I do think a lot of the antagonism towards smoking is stupid; if someone wants to gamble with their life, who cares? And people who are worried about small exposure to secondhand smoke are nuts.

    At the same time, I understand not wanting every bar or restaurant to smell like smoke. It's a fine line.



  • Ok the problems in my post actually fixed themselves after a time, but I figured I'd keep the support ticket open anyway because Steam support is so incompetent it amuses me.

    Shockingly, they replied to the ticket in less than a week. Not-shockingly, they either didn't read it, or didn't understand what they read.

    @Steam Support said:

    Hello,

    Thank you for contacting Steam Support.

    Technical support for this title is handled by a third party support department - please follow the instructions below to contact the support provider to troubleshoot this issue:

    Title: The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim
    Link: http://support.steampowered.com/kb_article.php?ref=5580-WEID-4389

    For additional assistance, please visit our forums, found here:

    http://forums.steampowered.com



  • @morbiuswilters said:

    we can win Internet fights simply by wishing for it.

    He didn't even mentioned the africanized bees, poised to destroy the US any day now.



  • @serguey123 said:

    @morbiuswilters said:

    we can win Internet fights simply by wishing for it.

    He didn't even mentioned the africanized bees, poised to destroy the US any day now.

    "Africanized"? Are you saying they drink malt liquor and flirt with the white lady bees? Racist.



  • @morbiuswilters said:

    @serguey123 said:
    @Speakerphone Dude said:
    they smoke

    Is that bad or good? I don't smoke but the holy war on smoking on most place in the US seems more retarded to me.

    I'm torn. As someone who was a heavy smoker until recently, I do think a lot of the antagonism towards smoking is stupid; if someone wants to gamble with their life, who cares? And people who are worried about small exposure to secondhand smoke are nuts.

    At the same time, I understand not wanting every bar or restaurant to smell like smoke. It's a fine line.

    I, personally, am very allergic to cigarette smoke. If you want to smoke, by all means -- they're your lungs -- but don't do it near me. For other reasons, also don't do it inside, standing directly underneath a smoke detector.



  • @pkmnfrk said:

    I, personally, am very allergic to cigarette smoke. If you want to smoke, by all means -- they're your lungs -- but don't do it near me.

    Which is fine, but I still think it should be up to the restaurant/bar owner if they want to permit smoking. I'd prefer they didn't, though.

    @pkmnfrk said:

    For other reasons, also don't do it inside, standing directly underneath a smoke detector.

    The weird thing is, I've never seen a smoke detector that was affected by cigarette smoke. I have no idea why that might be, but I've smoked quite a lot indoors and had the smoke detector surrounded by a thick haze of smoke, and yet it was silent. And there's nothing wrong with the detector; if I so much as turn on the stove the tiny bit of burned food at the bottom will set the detector off in no time, even though there's no visible smoke and only a faint burnt smell.



  • @pkmnfrk said:

    I, personally, am very allergic to cigarette smoke.

    My personal experience shows that approximately 75% of people who say they're allergic to something are lying liars who lie.

    I don't deny that allergies exist, nor do I deny that you have it. But your position is weakened by the millions of people who spend every day pretending to be allergic to things because they are apparently psychologically unable to say, "I don't like that thing" without adding, "BECAUSE IT MIGHT KILL ME! *dramatic music sting*"



  • @blakeyrat said:

    @pkmnfrk said:
    I, personally, am very allergic to cigarette smoke.

    My personal experience shows that approximately 75% of people who say they're allergic to something are lying liars who lie.

    I don't deny that allergies exist, nor do I deny that you have it. But your position is weakened by the millions of people who spend every day pretending to be allergic to things because they are apparently psychologically unable to say, "I don't like that thing" without adding, "BECAUSE IT MIGHT KILL ME! *dramatic music sting*"

    There's only one way to be certain: we tie pkmnfrk down and blow smoke in his face. If he dies, he was telling the truth. If he lives, he's a witch.


  • Discourse touched me in a no-no place

    @pkmnfrk said:

    I, personally, am very allergic to cigarette smoke.
    Which reminds me - when are we banning peanuts for the 0.00001% of the population who are 'very allergic' to them?


  • Discourse touched me in a no-no place

    @morbiuswilters said:

    The weird thing is, I've never seen a smoke detector that was affected by cigarette smoke.
    The ones in toilets on planes?



  • @PJH said:

    @morbiuswilters said:
    The weird thing is, I've never seen a smoke detector that was affected by cigarette smoke.
    The ones in toilets on planes?

    I guess, since people apparently disable them, but I've never tried smoking on a plane, so I wouldn't know.



  • @Anketam said:

    Problem is that you cant be in all of those different places at the same time, yet you are taking a lot of regional issues that USA has combining them all together.  I could easily take all the worse elements from the countries you list and come up with the same argument against Europe.  USA not only has a large number of good things about it, it also at an overall level is much better than any country in Europe.
    Yeah, but Europe and the USA are more or less the same size. I'm being generous by not including Canada, because North America is significantly larger than Europe.

    So when I point out the positive aspects of Europe, now country borders all of a sudden become an issue? And perhaps you missed the irony in my post and the previous one, because I've insulted the Germans, the Danes and the Canadians as well. OK, I'll admit, they are easy targets.

     There are plenty of problems with Europe. One could mention the reckless spending, corruption and nepotism that seems endemic to southern Europe. Or the fact that there are 50 countries there, ranging from Vatican City (covering 0.17 sqm) to Russia, without a single person to talk business to. The closest we have to a 'president' is a self-deprecating Belgian who writes haikus and basically arranges for coffee and sandwiches during meetings. I'm saying 50 countries, but it could be that tomorrow some or other region decides it needs to be independent. There are still dictatorships and regular armed conflicts.

    All true. But the image of the lazy European who depends on state benefits is one created by US politicians, for political purposes. Suppose that this gay-basher becomes president, is he still going to be so deprecating about Europe? Not very likely. And when it comes to state benefits, one could of course point out that 20% of the federal US budget goes to defence spending, leading to a lot of spending on companies that would otherwise have no right to exist, if it weren't for government subsidies. So there's not so much difference there.

    And then I read about the supposedly crap food in Europe... I mean, WTF? Visit a London fish and chips shop and you know European food?

    So I honestly do wonder what they teach you guys over there.

     



  • @morbiuswilters said:

    So now we're judging a people's cooking by which fast food restaurants popular? You just walked right into that fallacy.
    Put it another way: what significant contribution have the USA made to world cuisine, other than fast food? And even the fast food comes from Europe: hamburgers, frankfurters and wieners are all named after German or Austrian cities; then there are French fries (also sometimes known as freedom fries) and pizza. You're the one who claimed that the food in Europe is crap, which is somewhat difficult to maintain. No, it's not just Italy that has good food.

    @morbiuswilters said:

    Which is cool, but our roads are more utilitarian, which makes high speed limits unsafe. We can't just exclude all of the poor people from driving like Germany does.
    Utilitarian? Meaning what? Are you guys still going around in wagon trains? It's not like there aren't any trucks on German motorways, you know.

    @morbiuswilters said:

    Why the fuck would I want to ride a train? Our trains go to the city center, too, so I have no idea WTF you're talking about there.
    Well, usually people take a train to go from A to B. Say, Paris to London. You could go by plane, and be packed like sardines with someone who last had a bath when Carter was still president, starting from and ending up at some horrible airport, or you could just take a train from Gare du Nord to St. Pancras.

    @morbiuswilters said:

    You are aware that I don't have to be in Italy to buy an Italian car, right? Also, I don't really care for Italian or French cars; I really like German cars, though.
    Sigh... and where do you think that Italian supercars are manufactured? Hint: it's not in Bulgaria. And as for German cars, let's face it, a Porsche is just a flattened Volkswagen Beetle. German cars are nice if your favourite colours are grey, beige and taupe. I drove a rented Volkswagen Golf with some very clever engine a few years back, and whilst it was wonderful to drive, it also had all the charisma of a tree trunk. 'Boring' doesn't even begin to describe it.

    My dream car, unless I win the lottery, is a Renault Mégane RS, fastest front-wheel drive car around the Nordschleiffe of the Nürburgring. With my measly salary, it might just be affordable, and it wipes the floor with any car in its class. And when I say "fastest front-wheel drive car around the Nordschleiffe", it's faster than a BMW M6, Audi RS4 or Porsche Boxter - all cars that are considerably more expensive. (Interestingly enough, one of the fastest cars around the Nordschleiffe is the Corvette C6 ZR1.)

    @morbiuswilters said:

    Or California (well, for marijuana, but IIRC they stopped selling mushrooms in Amsterdam a few years ago). And it's not like it's difficult to get illegal drugs here.
    It's also not difficult to get illegal drugs anywhere else in Europe, but the point is, they're illegal. You could end up getting arrested and stuff, which is always somewhat embarrassing (or downright dangerous if you get arrested in Russia).

    @morbiuswilters said:

    I could fire back all the reasons why the US is better than Europe, but that would be pointless. See, the best thing about Americans is that we can win Internet fights simply by wishing for it.
    Better start wishing then. :)

     Look, as I pointed out in another post, there's plenty wrong with this continent - but no more than where you're living.



  • @Severity One said:

    Suppose that this gay-basher becomes president, is he still going to be so deprecating about Europe?

    When has Obama been "so deprecating" about Europe? I guess we should add how clueless Europeans are?

    @Severity One said:

    But the image of the lazy European who depends on state benefits is one created by US European politicians, for political purposes.

    FTFY



  • @Severity One said:

    Put it another way: what significant contribution have the USA made to world cuisine, other than fast food? And even the fast food comes from Europe: hamburgers, frankfurters and wieners are all named after German or Austrian cities; then there are French fries (also sometimes known as freedom fries) and pizza.

    I'd say that our biggest contribution was in figuring out how to make enough safe food to feed lots and lots of people. Fast food is a part of that, of course. I'd rather be stuck eating McDonalds and KFC for the rest of my life than the best European gourmet food while having to rely on shitty (organic!) farming and preservation practices. Of course, Europe leads the way in trying to keep the brown man hungry and malnourished (viz protests against GMOs).

    The main reason why there's a lot of good food in America (talking recipes and menus now) is, of course, all of the immigrants who bring different ideas about food, which then get combined and spread around. It doesn't matter who invented some sort of food, but whether you can get it or not. Not that there aren't some uniquely awesome American dishes, like BBQ. I like caesar salads, too.

    @Severity One said:

    Look, as I pointed out in another post, there's plenty wrong with this continent - but no more than where you're living.

    The utter shittiness of Europe's political economy is about all that's keeping our public fisc from completely tanking. There's a lot more wrong with Europe than the US, which is part of why my European ancestors came here in the first place.



  • @Severity One said:

    The closest we have to a 'president' is a self-deprecating Belgian who writes haikus and basically arranges for coffee and sandwiches during meetings.

    You have a Joe Biden, too!?

    @Severity One said:

    But the image of the lazy European who depends on state benefits is one created by US politicians, for political purposes.

    Well, it's certainly true that Europe is full of useless, lazy "public servants". And your labor laws are stupid. But both of those apply to the US, too.

    @Severity One said:

    And when it comes to state benefits, one could of course point out that 20% of the federal US budget goes to defence spending, leading to a lot of spending on companies that would otherwise have no right to exist, if it weren't for government subsidies. So there's not so much difference there.

    Yeah, but our defense spending is only 4.7% of GDP, which isn't so bad. True, it's more than Malta, but Malta could spend 100% of its GDP on defense and still end up conquered by an ambitious Boy Scout troop. And if we hadn't been spending on defense, today we'd be paying tribute to Germany or the Soviet Union, so I'd say it was a net gain. Also, a lot of European defense was augmented by our expenditures, which let you spend less.

    @Severity One said:

    And then I read about the supposedly crap food in Europe... I mean, WTF? Visit a London fish and chips shop and you know European food?

    I would say fish and chips is probably one of the better Eurofoods.

    @Severity One said:

    So I honestly do wonder what they teach you guys over there.

    I don't think most Americans have an opinion on Europe; it's about as inconsequential as, like, New Zealand (which, ironically, Chrome does not recognize as a legitimate word). Unlike you, I didn't have to be taught about other countries, I learned on my own. I like to give Europeans crap, but it's not such a bad place. But the only place I have even the slightest interest in visiting is England. That doesn't change the fact that Europeans suck at cooking. Your gyros and foie gras pale in comparison to a good jambalaya. Escargot can't hold a candle to an honest-to-God, I-think-I'm-shitting-fire Texas chili.

    You seem to forget that America was settled by Europeans. Your food is heavily integrated into our cooking. And most of the stuff that came from Europe (as opposed to that which came from Mesoamerica, Asia, Africa, Polynesia, etc..) is flavorless junk.



  • @blakeyrat said:

    When Steam can't query its message server, it lies to you and tells you there are no messages. When there are clearly two of them. The WTF here isn't that Steam's server is down (that happens like clockwork), its that the error message lies to the user. I hate liars.
    Today Firefox 6.0 told me "you have the latest version available".

    What it actually should have told me was "this computer's ethernet cable is unplugged, so I can't check if there are any updates".

    @blakeyrat said:

    If you have your own wtf, post it in your own damn thread. Don't hijack mine. Ass.
    Whoops.



  • @Severity One said:

    And even the fast food comes from Europe: hamburgers, frankfurters and wieners are all named after German or Austrian cities; then there are French fries (also sometimes known as freedom fries) and pizza. You're the one who claimed that the food in Europe is crap, which is somewhat difficult to maintain. No, it's not just Italy that has good food.

    The modern hamburger is American. French fries are European in origin, but didn't become so widespread until sold by Americans. Pizza has old origins (it's just flatbread with cheese and tomatoes on it) but the modern variants are mostly American. And, seriously, these are your examples? I wouldn't say hamburgers and french fries count as particularly good food. Pizza can be sublime, but that's mostly because Americans made it so.

    @Severity One said:

    Utilitarian? Meaning what? Are you guys still going around in wagon trains? It's not like there aren't any trucks on German motorways, you know.

    Utilitarian, as in, meant for average folks to drive everywhere on. Driving in Germany is a significantly different concept than driving in America.

    @Severity One said:

    Well, usually people take a train to go from A to B. Say, Paris to London. You could go by plane, and be packed like sardines with someone who last had a bath when Carter was still president, starting from and ending up at some horrible airport, or you could just take a train from Gare du Nord to St. Pancras.

    This presumes I'd be in Europe for some goddamn reason. And if I'm going to go, I'd rather drive.

    @Severity One said:

    Sigh... and where do you think that Italian supercars are manufactured?

    Um.. how is that relevant? You seem to be under the impression that just because I want to buy something from Europe, that I give a shit about the continent. I don't.

    @Severity One said:

    And as for German cars, let's face it, a Porsche is just a flattened Volkswagen Beetle.

    Okay, you are just straight-up retarded now.

    @Severity One said:

    And when I say "fastest front-wheel drive car around the Nordschleiffe", it's faster than a BMW M6, Audi RS4 or Porsche Boxter - all cars that are considerably more expensive.

    I call extreme bullshit. 1) FWD drive is shit for high-performance cars. 2) The biggest powerplant on that Renault is 221hp. 3) The M6 is RWD w/ 560hp. There is no way in hell it's getting smoked by a goddamn FWD Renault. I should know, I'm probably going to buy one soon.

    @Severity One said:

    Interestingly enough, one of the fastest cars around the Nordschleiffe is the Corvette C6 ZR1.

    That's not surprising. It has a huge displacement, high torque and sharp handling. I don't care for American sports cars, though; I find the styling of the Vette particularly off-putting, and the high-end models are all manual gearboxes.

    @Severity One said:

    Look, as I pointed out in another post, there's plenty wrong with this continent - but no more than where you're living.

    I think Europe is mostly okay, but it's still several notches below the US. If I had to live in Europe, I'd probably kill myself, which might explain the widespread ennui your miserable little continent suffers from.


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