But it can't be right!



  • We just went through a release of our product with a major piece of new functionality and a whole bunch of bug fixes. One bug in particular caused historical data to be sorted in the wrong order. Downstream code would then take action based upon the five latest items in the list. Naturally, if the list was in the wrong order, then the actions taken wouldn't necessarily be the ones that should be taken.

    I was tasked to fix this bug, which I did.

    This weekend was the release. Last Friday, when they did test runs of the old code and new code, the results were different.

    Now you'd expect differences caused by new functionality. You'd also expect differences due to bug fixes. My particular fix was responsible for anywhere between 0-5 differences (depending upon the data) for every single customer.

    Our customer service reps said it can't be right. A cursory check of random records indicated that these differences were, in fact, correct, and due to the requested bug fix.

    But we can't release the software with this many differences! But these differences are expected and explainable!

    With the permission of my boss I went home Friday night while the argument continued between my boss and the customer service team.

    Several hundred emails of point-counterpoint later, at 1AM this morning, the users were told by management to just deploy the damn thing. so my boss deployed it.

    This morning rolls around and the first production run generates millions of records, many different from what had been getting generated all along.

    The same customers who complained that the data was always wrong were now complaining that while it was no longer wrong, it was different, and could we please explain why. We (dev's) explain to each one that we fixed their problem. They inquired as to why they hadn't been advised of this. There are procedures in place for our customer service folks to provide just this sort of info, but which were not followed because they were busy arguing with my boss.

    Finally, since we were getting bombarded by questions from customers, I sent the email on behalf of the cust service team, and then quietly explained the snafu to senior management.

    Our dev team was treated to breakfast munchies. The customer service team is in the c-suite, hopefully getting "serviced".

     



  • Please, please, please post the "points" made by the customer services folks.



  • @beermouse said:

    Please, please, please post the "points" made by the customer services folks.
    I'm sure it went a little like this: HURR DUUR... Different!  I don't like different!



  • @snoofle said:

    Our dev team was treated to breakfast munchies. The customer service team is in the c-suite, hopefully getting "serviced".

    ... they hired hookers for them? Why?



  • Because clearly, change is bad.

    Kudos to whomever damned the torpedos and gave the deploy order.



  • @snoofle said:

    Our customer service reps said it can't be right.
    Well, I guess you can't argue with logic like [i]that![/i]

    I've dealt with such folks before, who become so accustomed to faulty results that when you fix the root cause, it's a knee-jerk reaction for them to assume (and insist) that something is wrong.  Having management tell you to "just deploy the damn thing" is sometimes the only appropriate solution.

    The worst scenario is when such people [i]are[/i] management - they still want the bugfix (after all, they don't want bugs in their product), but they also want you to make the results look "normal" again.



  • @blakeyrat said:

    @snoofle said:
    Our dev team was treated to breakfast munchies. The customer service team is in the c-suite, hopefully getting "serviced".

    ... they hired hookers for them? Why?

     

    Rather than firing, syphilis.



  • snoofle is some kind of jesus to me, facing so many wtfs a week that i want to hug him or offer a beer or do anything to ease his pain, but at the same time i don't want to do so because snoofle was obviously placed down on earth to attract stupidity and retarded people to him, so although we still face many of them, it remains bearable because of his sacrifice and constant suffering, and i don't want this to stop.

    also it's fun.

     


  • Discourse touched me in a no-no place

    @blakeyrat said:

    @snoofle said:
    Our dev team was treated to breakfast munchies. The customer service team is in the c-suite, hopefully getting "serviced".

    ... they hired hookers for them? Why?

    That's an elegant troll. In this case, we're talking about what a farmer has a bull's...output...do to a cow. (The key point here is the cow doesn't get any say in the matter.)



  • @FrostCat said:

    In this case, we're talking about what a farmer has a bull's...output...do to a cow.
     

    Thanks, you've just given me a new favorite euphemism.  I'm going to work on some "output" jokes for my next open mic.



  • @beermouse said:

    Please, please, please post the "points" made by the customer services folks.
     

    Some of the more interesting ones...

    • In response to "there are differences, but they can be explained": There are too many differences; everything should match up exactly 
    • In response to "we made this change at the request of the customers; they want the data to be different": yes, but there are too many data changes: you only fixed (this) one bug!
    • In response to "based on the rules supplied by the customers, the data is now what it's supposed to be": "how are we supposed to know that? It's changed!"
    ...just three more weeks...



  • Are you leaving?



  • @Sutherlands said:

    Are you leaving?

    Nope, just taking Christmas week off.



  • @snoofle said:

    In response to "we made this change at the request of the customers; they want the data to be different": yes, but there are too many data changes: you only fixed (this) one bug!

    I wonder how many changes are acceptable for one bugfix? Is there a speed limit of 35 changes per bugfix on residential codepaths?



  •  Oh Snoofle, How I wish you were a frontpage writer....



  • @Xyro said:

    Is there a speed limit of 35 changes per bugfix on residential codepaths?
    I think it varies, depending on which state you're in.

    For example, snoofle's customer service reps clearly work in the state of delusion.



  • @blakeyrat said:

    @snoofle said:
    Our dev team was treated to breakfast munchies. The customer service team is in the c-suite, hopefully getting "serviced".

    ... they hired hookers for them? Why?

    It's worth noting that this is also a hooker.



  • @boog said:

    For example, snoofle's customer service reps clearly work in the state of delusion.

    Delunaware?



  • @Ibix said:

    It's worth noting that this is also a hooker.
     

    And this is a bimbo rack.



  • @snoofle said:

    @Sutherlands said:
    Are you leaving?
    Nope, just taking Christmas week off.

    Most of my country takes two or three (or more!) weeks off over Christmas: everything shuts down. Summer is a great time to spend with the kids.

    @da Doctah said:

    @Ibix said:
    It's worth noting that this is also a hooker.
    And this is a bimbo rack.

    I was going to post pictures to "thong on the beach", "man with huge cock" and "pussy and tits" but since I'm at work I don't trust Google image search to display only the non-rude images...

     



  • @Zemm said:

    Most of my country takes two or three (or more!) weeks off over Christmas: everything shuts down. Summer is a great time to spend with the kids.

    I'm on leave from Christmas through to 3rd Feb. :D This has the advantage of not only spending time with the kids, but getting a few days at the end alone with my wife when the kids are back at school.



  • @snoofle said:

    The same customers who complained that the data was always wrong were now complaining that while it was no longer wrong, it was different, and could we please explain why.
     

     

    On two occasions I have been asked [by Members of Parliament], "Pray, Mr. Babbage, if you put into the machine wrong figures, will the right answers come out?"  I am not able rightly to apprehend the kind of confusion of ideas that could provoke such a question.

     



  • @Watson said:

    @snoofle said:

    The same customers who complained that the data was always wrong were now complaining that while it was no longer wrong, it was different, and could we please explain why.
     

     

    On two occasions I have been asked [by Members of Parliament], "Pray, Mr. Babbage, if you put into the machine wrong figures, will the right answers come out?"  I am not able rightly to apprehend the kind of confusion of ideas that could provoke such a question.

     

    Nice quote, but not news that users have been clueless since Babbage's day. :)



  •  @Ibix said:

    @boog said:

    For example, snoofle's customer service reps clearly work in the state of delusion.

    Delunaware?

    Yes, sorry, I forgot they renamed it to make it sound more "place-like".

     



  • @snoofle said:

  • In response to "there are differences, but they can be explained": There are too many differences; everything should match up exactly 
  • In response to "we made this change at the request of the customers; they want the data to be different": yes, but there are too many data changes: you only fixed (this) one bug!
  • In response to "based on the rules supplied by the customers, the data is now what it's supposed to be": "how are we supposed to know that? It's changed!"
  •  

     

    Your boss should've asked them for an example of an output that would satisfy them.

     



  • @snoofle said:

    @beermouse said:

    Please, please, please post the "points" made by the customer services folks.
     

    Some of the more interesting ones...

    • In response to "there are differences, but they can be explained": There are too many differences; everything should match up exactly 
    • In response to "we made this change at the request of the customers; they want the data to be different": yes, but there are too many data changes: you only fixed (this) one bug!
    • In response to "based on the rules supplied by the customers, the data is now what it's supposed to be": "how are we supposed to know that? It's changed!"
    ...just three more weeks...

    How many team members did it take to come up with this shit?



  • @Ibix said:

    @blakeyrat said:
    @snoofle said:
    Our dev team was treated to breakfast munchies. The customer service team is in the c-suite, hopefully getting "serviced".

    ... they hired hookers for them? Why?

    It's worth noting that this is also a hooker.

     

    Most of the customer service staff I know would appreciate a meeting with that sort of hooker more in any case.


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