Mozilla have lost their mind - The 4 part trilogy continues



  • So today I accidentally I discovered a new "feature" of Firefox.  It's called "tear-off tabs".  Despite the fact that I've used Firefox for several years, I never heard of this feature, which apparently has been in Firefox since version 3.1, circa November 2008.   If you drag a tab, it opens that tab in a new window.  Not just a new window, but another complete instance of Firefox.

     WTF?   Seriously?  Why would I want to do this?   Isn't the whole point of tabs to have all your pages in a single window?  If I'm going to have a shit load of separate windows all over the place, why not just use Internet Explorer 6?



  • It's handy for multiple monitors.




  • This is a useful thing. The problem with FF is that it reloads the page when you do this (IIRC). Compare this to Chrome, which simply puts the tab in its own window. Of course, in that case, it's already in its own process, so I guess it's easier to do.

    Sometimes, you want to see two tabs at once. With the standard tabbed interface, there's no way. Tearing the tab off is a lot easier than starting up another browser instance and going from there.



  • Opera does this too - it's a handy way to group related tabs. As well as dragging tabs directly between windows you can see them all in one place using the Windows panel, which allows multiple selection for easier management:

    [img]http://i51.tinypic.com/4l11ko.gif[/img]

    Less useful (IMO) is the ability to drag tabs on top of eachother to form a "stack" which can be collapsed or expanded as you see fit. It's a decent enough idea, I guess, but it feels a bit clunky to use.



  • @El_Heffe said:

     WTF?   Seriously?  Why would I want to do this?   Isn't the whole point of tabs to have all your pages in a single window?  If I'm going to have a shit load of separate windows all over the place, why not just use Internet Explorer 6?

     

    I found that hilarious, because not five seconds ago I opened TDWTF in a new tab, tore the tab off and put it on my main monitor.

    It's useful for when you want to start a new train of thought in terms of tabs, but don't want to lose your previous one.

     



  • @MiffTheFox said:

    It's handy for multiple monitors.

    I could also see it being useful if you want to look at two pages side-by-side.  Unless it's very well hidden indeed, they still haven't implemented tiling of multiple tabs.

     



  • Yet another vote for "that's a useful feature, and I use it all the time in Chrome."

    It makes browser tabs work like BeOS tabs. Making something more like BeOS is always a good idea.



  • I really fail to see how it's a bad thing, it's a feature and you can decide for yourself whether to use it or not. If you don't like it, don't use it. But there are a lot of easily imaginable use cases for this features (some of which are mentioned in this topic already), so it's nice to have.

    So what's the WTF, actually? You?

    ED: Quoting the entire OP makes this moderator a sad panda.  Love, BTK



  • I have to agree, the feature is welcome. I've torn off a tab in Opera to watch some streaming video while also having another page up. Also note that in Opera at least you can drag a tab onto another and "stack" them, quite useful also. I imagine Fx/Chrome have similar features.



  • @El_Heffe said:

    So today I accidentally I discovered a new "feature" of Firefox.  It's called "tear-off tabs".

    Wut? I thought this feature is like 5 years old. Wasn't this in Firefox one dot fucking null?

    @El_Heffe said:

    Not just a new window, but another complete instance of Firefox.

    Okay, that's new to me. tries it Nope, doesn't open new instance for me. Doesn't reload tab either. (Firefox 5.0 on Linux 64-bit)

    @El_Heffe said:

    Isn't the whole point of tabs to have all your pages in a single window?

    Clearly you haven't used Firefox when it was shiny and new. Back then, it had settings to determine whether to open target:"_blank" links in new windows or tabs; and even then, some javascript: links still opened new Windows. Nowadays these will open new tabs, which breaks things like phpBB2's new PM notifier (surely nobody should be using phpBB2 anymore anyway).

    Also, have you never right-clicked a link? It has "open in new tab" as well as "open in new window". [cue obvious "multiple windows can be useful"]



  • @pbean said:

    I really fail to see how it's a bad thing, it's a feature and you can decide for yourself whether to use it or not. If you don't like it, don't use it. But there are a lot of easily imaginable use cases for this features (some of which are mentioned in this topic already), so it's nice to have.

    So what's the WTF, actually? You?

    It's useful, yes, until you start dragging tabs to an Explorer window. Then you have to slap yourself in the head and think "dang, I forgot again: to create internet shortcuts you need to drag the favicon, not the tab".

    So I kind of agree with the OP on this one. It's annoying but not really a WTF. And yes, it's quite old.

     



  • @Zecc said:

    It's useful, yes, until you start dragging tabs to an Explorer window.

    WHY WOULD YOU WANT TO DO THAT???

    @Zecc said:

    to create internet shortcuts

    Oh.



    WHY WOULD YOU WANT TO DO THAT???



  • BTW, has anyone mentioned yet they are planning to build their own "web OS"?

    Because competing with their main sponsor Google wasn't enough on the browser.

    But don't worry:

    - How is this different from Chrome OS?

    We’re aiming at mobile/tablet devices rather than a notebook form factor. This is an early-stage project to expose all device capabilities such that infrastructure like phone dialers can be built with Web APIs, and not only “high level” apps like word processors and presentation software. We will of course be happy to work with the Chrome OS team on standards activities, and indeed to share source code where appropriate.

    Yes, expose my phone's innards to the "open web", why don't you? It's not like your code is likely to have security bugs, is it?



  • @derula said:

    @Zecc said:
    to create internet shortcuts

    Oh.



    WHY WOULD YOU WANT TO DO THAT???

    To create bookmarks in a pen drive so I can use them at home without envolving my personal email at work. I'm weird that way.



  • I liked the rest of the series so far, all the nice Mozilla ranting / venting.

    This part has seriously let me down, though.



  • @derula said:

    Wut? I thought this feature is like 5 years old. Wasn't this in Firefox one dot fucking null?
     

    Nope.

     

    As of 4 or 5 (I don't know) Firefox no longer reloads the page, as far as I can tell.



  • @derula said:

    @Zecc said:
    to create internet shortcuts

    Oh.



    WHY WOULD YOU WANT TO DO THAT???

    The only thing I can think of is he wants to keep his bookmarks in sync with Internet Explorer, and doesn't know about XMarks.



  • @Zecc said:

    BTW, has anyone mentioned yet they are planning to build their own "web OS"?

    Because competing with their main sponsor Google wasn't enough on the browser.

    Now THAT is a WTF. Here's a link.

    All this flailing so they can survive after Google inevitably pulls the plug, and the solution is obvious... approach Microsoft about duplicating Google's deal, but with Bing. You know Microsoft would be willing. Of course, Mozilla would never do that, but man it would save everybody there a lot of headaches.



  • @Zecc said:

    @derula said:

    @Zecc said:
    to create internet shortcuts

    Oh.



    WHY WOULD YOU WANT TO DO THAT???

    To create bookmarks in a pen drive so I can use them at home without envolving my personal email at work. I'm weird that way.

    Opera Link is very nice for that. There's a shitload of sites on the Internet that offer similar functionality, and I bet at least some of them have Firefox plugins.



  • @derula said:

    @El_Heffe said:
    So today I accidentally I discovered a new "feature" of Firefox.  It's called "tear-off tabs".

    Wut? I thought this feature is like 5 years old. Wasn't this in Firefox one dot fucking null?

    Introduced in 3.5 AFAIK.

    Bonus: drop the tab somewhere between the tabs on another FF window, and the tab is added to that window. (You can reorder tabs as well.)

    @derula said:

    @El_Heffe said:
    Not just a new window, but another complete instance of Firefox.

    Okay, that's new to me. tries it Nope, doesn't open new instance for me. Doesn't reload tab either. (Firefox 5.0 on Linux 64-bit)

    I'm pretty sure FF has never created a new process for this. (In Windows Task Manager,check the "processes" tab. "Applications" givesone entry for each window.)




  • @ggeens said:

    I'm pretty sure FF has never created a new process for this. (In Windows Task Manager,check the "processes" tab. "Applications" givesone entry for each window.)


    I don't think his Linux distro comes with Windows Task Manager.



  • I'd just like to point out that I don't even use firefox and I knew about that feature.

     

    That is all.



  • @Zecc said:

    To create bookmarks in a pen drive so I can use them at home without envolving my personal email at work. I'm weird that way.
     

    You can drag links and URLS from the address bar to the desktop, fyi. Not quite as easy as dragging the tab itself to the desktop to do it, but it's better than nothing.



  • Where does the idea that Tab = Link come from any way? Do you also expect that when you drag a window to the desktop, it creates some kind of link on the desktop?



  • @pbean said:

    Where does the idea that Tab = Link come from any way?
     

    Because it's handy.

    @pbean said:

    Do you also expect that when you drag a window to the desktop, it creates some kind of link on the desktop?

    That would be awesome.

     



  • So if you drag a tab containing content from Google's "cached" pages, do you create a link to the past? And if you then click that link and hit the back button, do you go back to the future?



  • @ekolis said:

    So if you drag a tab containing content from Google's "cached" pages, do you create a link to the past? And if you then click that link and hit the back button, do you go back to the future?

     

    I'm revoking your license to humor.

    Rubber Badge and gun with the popout BANG! flag on my desk by 13:00, please

     



  • @blakeyrat said:

    Yet another vote for "that's a useful feature, and I use it all the time in Chrome."
    Only thing I have to add to the conversation is that in Chrome, each tab is a new process anyway, and that for me, it's always been a pain in the ass to get two FF processes going, involving some convoluted instructions from someone on this forum.  Even new window opens in the same process.  

    For added fun, drag a favicon from Chrome to FF.  Boom, page opens in FF.  Also in reverse.  Only use I ever had for this was when some plugins were broken in Chrome but I forgot and opened pages in Chrome anyway.  



  • @derula said:

    @El_Heffe said:
    Isn't the whole point of tabs to have all your pages in a single window?

    Clearly you haven't used Firefox when it was shiny and new.

    I've been using Firefox since before it was called Firefox.  You mean it was shinier and newer before that?@derula said:
    Back then, it had settings to determine whether to open target:"_blank" links in new windows or tabs;
    Just like it does now in the newest latest version.@derula said:
    have you never right-clicked a link? It has "open in new tab" as well as "open in new window".
    Yes I have.  I frequently right click on a link and select "open in new tab".  It has never once occured to me to select "open in a new window".   I suppose it's a matter of personal prefence but to me tabs make multiple winodws unneccessary.  Of course in keeping with their grand tradition of making random changes for no good reason, beginning with Firefox 4.0 Mozilla changed the order of the items in the right click menu.  "Open link in new window" was the first item and "Open link in new tab" was second.  Starting with Firefox 4.0 they are now reversed, resulting in a lot of accidentally opening a new window when I wanted a new tab.

    @ggeens said:

    @El_Heffe said:
    Not just a new window,
    but another complete instance of Firefox.

    Okay, that's new to me. tries it Nope, doesn't open new instance for
    me. Doesn't reload tab either. (Firefox 5.0 on Linux 64-bit)

    My  terminolgy was incorrect.  Dragging a tab to new window creates what appears to be another instance of Firefox, complete with al the buttons, toolbars, menus, etc. completely indistinguishable from the main Firefox window.  However, you are correct, Task Mangler only shows one instance of Firefox.exe running.

     



  • @derula said:

    @El_Heffe said:
    So today I accidentally I discovered a new "feature" of Firefox.  It's called "tear-off tabs".

    Wut? I thought this feature is like 5 years old. Wasn't this in Firefox one dot fucking null?

    Version 3.1, November 2008.  Googol is your friend.  And I mentioned this in my orignal post.

     



  • @da Doctah said:

    @MiffTheFox said:

    It's handy for multiple monitors.

    I could also see it being useful if you want to look at two pages side-by-side.  Unless it's very well hidden indeed, they still haven't implemented tiling of multiple tabs.

     

     

    Opera has this.  You can tile horizontally, vertically, or cascade tabs within a window.



  • @ShatteredArm said:

    Opera has this.  You can tile horizontally, vertically, or cascade tabs within a window.
    Opera had this before it had tabs, since it's been a full MDI application since the beginning.



  • @ender said:

    @ShatteredArm said:
    Opera has this.  You can tile horizontally, vertically, or cascade tabs within a window.
    Opera had this before it had tabs, since it's been a full MDI application since the beginning.

    Opera also single-handedly won the Cold War and saved a baby puppy from being run over by a bus full of nuns, I read that somewhere too



  • @blakeyrat said:

    Opera also ... saved a baby puppy from being run over by a bus full of nuns
     

    And that's why you shouldn't use Opera, it saved the evilest puppy ever.



  • @blakeyrat said:

    @ender said:
    @ShatteredArm said:
    Opera has this.  You can tile horizontally, vertically, or cascade tabs within a window.
    Opera had this before it had tabs, since it's been a full MDI application since the beginning.

    Opera also single-handedly won the Cold War and saved a baby puppy from being run over by a bus full of nuns, I read that somewhere too

    Fun fact: Opera users are, on average, more intelligent than users of other browsers.


    source: http://www.aptiquant.com/IQ-Browser-AptiQuant-2011.pdf



  • @Lord abletran said:

    Fun fact: Opera users are, on average, more intelligent than users of other browsers.


    source: http://www.aptiquant.com/IQ-Browser-AptiQuant-2011.pdf

    Fuck I knew that piece of shit "study" would show up here sooner or later. How does something so obviously flawed, and even more obviously AN ADVERTISEMENT go viral? I hate people.



  • @blakeyrat said:

    @Lord abletran said:
    Fun fact: Opera users are, on average, more intelligent than users of other browsers.


    source: http://www.aptiquant.com/IQ-Browser-AptiQuant-2011.pdf

    Fuck I knew that piece of shit "study" would show up here sooner or later. How does something so obviously flawed, and even more obviously AN ADVERTISEMENT go viral? I hate people.

    There are worse studies we could link to.



  • @boomzilla said:

    @blakeyrat said:
    @Lord abletran said:
    Fun fact: Opera users are, on average, more intelligent than users of other browsers.


    source: http://www.aptiquant.com/IQ-Browser-AptiQuant-2011.pdf

    Fuck I knew that piece of shit "study" would show up here sooner or later. How does something so obviously flawed, and even more obviously AN ADVERTISEMENT go viral? I hate people.

    There are worse studies we could link to.

    Did you know that Opera users on average have 1.21" shorter penises than Firefox users?



  • @derula said:

    @boomzilla said:
    @blakeyrat said:
    @Lord abletran said:
    Fun fact: Opera users are, on average, more intelligent than users of other browsers.


    source: http://www.aptiquant.com/IQ-Browser-AptiQuant-2011.pdf

    Fuck I knew that piece of shit "study" would show up here sooner or later. How does something so obviously flawed, and even more obviously AN ADVERTISEMENT go viral? I hate people.

    There are worse studies we could link to.

    Did you know that Opera users on average have 1.21" shorter penises than Firefox users?

    That may be, but Chrome users are the biggest dicks.



  • @Lord abletran said:

    @derula said:
    @boomzilla said:
    @blakeyrat said:
    @Lord abletran said:
    Fun fact: Opera users are, on average, more intelligent than users of other browsers.


    source: http://www.aptiquant.com/IQ-Browser-AptiQuant-2011.pdf

    Fuck I knew that piece of shit "study" would show up here sooner or later. How does something so obviously flawed, and even more obviously AN ADVERTISEMENT go viral? I hate people.

    There are worse studies we could link to.

    Did you know that Opera users on average have 1.21" shorter penises than Firefox users?

    That may be, but Chrome users are the biggest dicks.



  •  If you have muliple mon...

    @fucking everyone else said:

    Sound of everyone using the same point to gang-humped El Heffe's post the armpit

    [url="http://www.spin.com/articles/free-album-spin-tribute-nirvanas-nevermind"]Never mind.[/url]



  • @Lord abletran said:

    Fun fact: Opera users are, on average, more intelligent than users of other browsers.

    So are you smart if you use Opera, or do you NEED to be smart in order to operate it?



  • @steenbergh said:

    @Lord abletran said:
    Fun fact: Opera users are, on average, more intelligent than users of other browsers.

    So are you smart if you use Opera, or do you NEED to be smart in order to operate it?

    Or maybe Opera renders the IQ test differently, or fills it out for the user



  • @Lord abletran said:

    @steenbergh said:
    @Lord abletran said:
    Fun fact: Opera users are, on average, more intelligent than users of other browsers.

    So are you smart if you use Opera, or do you NEED to be smart in order to operate it?

    Or maybe Opera renders the IQ test differently, or fills it out for the user


    OH GEE WHAT A SHOCKER IT TURNS OUT THAT "STUDY" WAS COMPLETE BULLSHIT FROM SCAMMERS!



  • @blakeyrat said:

    OH GEE WHAT A SHOCKER IT TURNS OUT THAT "STUDY" WAS COMPLETE BULLSHIT FROM SCAMMERS!

    I really wonder how many people's opinion of the "study" was changed after confirmation of this.


  • Discourse touched me in a no-no place

    @blakeyrat said:

    @Lord abletran said:
    @steenbergh said:
    @Lord abletran said:
    Fun fact: Opera users are, on average, more intelligent than users of other browsers.

    So are you smart if you use Opera, or do you NEED to be smart in order to operate it?

    Or maybe Opera renders the IQ test differently, or fills it out for the user


    OH GEE WHAT A SHOCKER IT TURNS OUT THAT "STUDY" WAS COMPLETE BULLSHIT FROM SCAMMERS!
    .... So uh, where's the part about the hoax?

    All I see is a headline saying it was and a recap of events and no supporting information or comments for the hoax claim.



  • @Weng said:

    ... So uh, where's the part about the hoax?

    All I see is a headline saying it was and a recap of events and no supporting information or comments for the hoax claim.

    Oops, meant to post this much better link.


  • Discourse touched me in a no-no place

     ... Well, fuck. I never read the original shit because I figured it was just dumb, poorly conducted science relying on a stupid on line test of dubious quality, but just one look at that graph told me the whole thing was an ass-pull. Any group of diverse people averaging out to either 80 or 120 is near as makes no difference impossible.



  • What could possibly be the point of this?

    Mozilla have lost their mind - Part 3A

    So Firefox used to  cache everything in a directory called . . .  no surprise at all . . . . "cache".  Makes sense.  Then somewhere along the way they changed the layout of the disk cache.  I only discovered this when trying to use the old fashioned method of retrieving a YouTube video I had watched from the browser cache.  Instead of dumping everything into a single "cache" directory, Firefox now creates 16 subdirectories named 0 thru F.  In each of those subdirectories are more subdirectories with hexadecimal numbers as names (2F,  5B, etc.).  Inside each of those subdirectories is exacty one file.  In other words, every file cached by Firefox goes into its own subdirectory.

    Now, I'll admit, looking at the contents of your browser cache isn't something that you normally want or need to do, so it really doesn't matter how things are organized.  But what possible benefit would there be to this new layout (versus the old way tof doing it)?  It seems like an odd design decision.



  • @El_Heffe said:

    trying to use the old fashioned
    method of retrieving a YouTube video I had watched from the browser
    cache.
    If on Linux: http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2010/09/saving-flash-videos-in-linux-tmp-no-longer-works/#comment-145254389

    Edit: actually, scroll down a little lower: #comment-147724117


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