There is a God



  • My sister in law comes from a long line of alcoholics. After 45 years, she finally succumbed and got in way too deep. We finally persuaded her to go to AA. She now goes to 3 meetings a day and blindly does what they tell her to do (a little too cult-like IMHO, but whatever). Unrelated, she is also a S-L-O-B.

    They have 6 small-to-modest sized dogs and a cat. As near as I can tell, the cat is a chew-toy for the dogs. The only one of them that is house-broken is the first dog they got, that I trained, 14 years ago. Mostly, they (the dogs) use the kitchen floor as a bathroom.

    This past weekend, the kids dragged us to a local school football game. We were out for most of the day. When we got back, the kitchen was mostly covered in piddle. My sister in law sloshes - sans shoes - through this. When we pointed out that maybe, just maybe, she might consider cleaning it up, she goes off on us so we decide to leave.

    As we turn to go, we hear her slip and a loud *splat* - she landed face down in it.

    There is a God!



  •  Snoofle, nothing against you, I know it's theraputic to vent (and believe me I can commiserate), but:

     What the fuck is with all the depressing stories I've come across on the web lately (penny-arcade?). Are the holidays bringing out everybody's skeletons?  Cold weather, maybe? Lack of daylight?



  • 'tis the most miserable time of the year.  It's hell here too.



  • I love winter; hate the heat.  Unfortunately, I also hate "The Holidays."  I reserve the right to remain miserable year-round.

    Maybe I should move to the southern hemisphere.



  •  Say what you want, I've been waiting for this time of the year since May. Godawful never-ending heat. Last week it was 20 f*cking degrees Celcius. Some sort of messed up weather system in Europe where half of the continent is buried in snow and the other half is stuck in spring. I can't wait for the holidays; it's bound to be cold by then.



  • @EJ_ said:

     Snoofle, nothing against you, I know it's theraputic to vent (and believe me I can commiserate), but:

     What the fuck is with all the depressing stories I've come across on the web lately (penny-arcade?). Are the holidays bringing out everybody's skeletons?  Cold weather, maybe? Lack of daylight?

    This has been going on for 8 months. We've tried to be supportive, but this girl stopped feeding her children around Thanksgiving so that she can spend 4 hours at a 1 hour AA meeting, 3 times a day - it's a 15 minute drive from the house. She already told her kids there will be no Christmas decorations, cookies, cakes (she used to bake) - or presents because she's too busy.

    I don't appreciate a mother effectively abandoning her kids. My brother (they're divorced and he works in another state), my wife and I have been taking turns leaving work early so we can go over there daily to take care of the kids.

    We all have our problems, but you DON'T take it out on your kids.

     



  • @snoofle said:

    This has been going on for 8 months. We've tried to be supportive, but this girl stopped feeding her children around Thanksgiving so that she can spend 4 hours at a 1 hour AA meeting, 3 times a day - it's a 15 minute drive from the house. She already told her kids there will be no Christmas decorations, cookies, cakes (she used to bake) - or presents because she's too busy.

    I don't appreciate a mother effectively abandoning her kids. My brother (they're divorced and he works in another state), my wife and I have been taking turns leaving work early so we can go over there daily to take care of the kids.

    We all have our problems, but you DON'T take it out on your kids.

    You know, there's a government program that can put a lot of pressure on her to shape up... if she's skipping meals for the kids, and has a kitchen covered in dog shit, you should (anonymously) call Child Protective Services. Or your nearest hospital; ask for the social worker's office.

    Because, really.



  • @blakeyrat: We considered that, but the kids are just old enough to understand and don't want Mommy to go away, As such, we push HER and cover when it doesn't work. My brother would love to get the kids, but the child advocate from the divorce still feels she qualifies as a "good mother" (yet again, NJ is TRWTF).

    Personally, I'd take the kids in too, but that'll never happen with two living parents, one of whom (useless though she may be) is still in the house.

    So we go over there and feed the kids, clean their rooms, do some laundry, and tell them to stay away from the disgusting stuff.

     



  • @blakeyrat said:

    @snoofle said:

    This has been going on for 8 months. We've tried to be supportive, but this girl stopped feeding her children around Thanksgiving so that she can spend 4 hours at a 1 hour AA meeting, 3 times a day - it's a 15 minute drive from the house. She already told her kids there will be no Christmas decorations, cookies, cakes (she used to bake) - or presents because she's too busy.

    I don't appreciate a mother effectively abandoning her kids. My brother (they're divorced and he works in another state), my wife and I have been taking turns leaving work early so we can go over there daily to take care of the kids.

    We all have our problems, but you DON'T take it out on your kids.

    You know, there's a government program that can put a *lot* of pressure on her to shape up... if she's skipping meals for the kids, and has a kitchen covered in dog shit, you should (anonymously) call Child Protective Services. Or your nearest hospital; ask for the social worker's office.

    Because, really.

    Perhaps you might consider talking to your brother about taking custody of the kids.  If the situation is this bad then she it will probably lead to even more problems down the road.  I work in mental health and it definitly sounds like a bad bad situation. CPS will put the kids in a foster home, which is definitly the not ideal outcome.  However they may be willing to work with your brother to get the court to grant your brother temporary, or permanent custody.


  • @snoofle said:

    @blakeyrat: We considered that, but the kids are just old enough to understand and don't want Mommy to go away, As such, we push HER and cover when it doesn't work. My brother would love to get the kids, but the child advocate from the divorce still feels she qualifies as a "good mother" (yet again, NJ is TRWTF).

    Personally, I'd take the kids in too, but that'll never happen with two living parents, one of whom (useless though she may be) is still in the house.

    So we go over there and feed the kids, clean their rooms, do some laundry, and tell them to stay away from the disgusting stuff.

     

    With CPS on your side the divorce lawyer will not have any ground to stand on.  They will come in and do a review.  The court will value CPS over a divorce lawyers opinion any day.  Especially if there is pee on the floor when they arrive.  CPS is very very hard to fight.


  • @snoofle said:

    @blakeyrat: We considered that, but the kids are just old enough to understand and don't want Mommy to go away, As such, we push HER and cover when it doesn't work. My brother would love to get the kids, but the child advocate from the divorce still feels she qualifies as a "good mother" (yet again, NJ is TRWTF).

    Personally, I'd take the kids in too, but that'll never happen with two living parents, one of whom (useless though she may be) is still in the house.

    So we go over there and feed the kids, clean their rooms, do some laundry, and tell them to stay away from the disgusting stuff.

     

    CPS aren't monsters, they don't just drive up in a van and snatch kids up. I really don't know how people get this idea, although I imagine it's from cheesy sitcom plots.

    Seriously, give them a call... if you're really concerned, don't give their name or address until you're satisfied that they won't take the kids. (But believe me, they won't.) At least talk to them, see what they have to say.



  • @snoofle said:

    @blakeyrat: We considered that, but the kids are just old enough to understand and don't want Mommy to go away, As such, we push HER and cover when it doesn't work. My brother would love to get the kids, but the child advocate from the divorce still feels she qualifies as a "good mother" (yet again, NJ is TRWTF).

    Personally, I'd take the kids in too, but that'll never happen with two living parents, one of whom (useless though she may be) is still in the house.

    So we go over there and feed the kids, clean their rooms, do some laundry, and tell them to stay away from the disgusting stuff.

    I totally feel for you - I can't even imagine being in a situation like that, especially since this is family. I think that if this was just another neighbour, you'd have called in the authorities.

    So I understand what you're doing; but to protect both you, the kids and your sister, maybe draw a line in the sand somewhere and explain that if she crosses that line, you will have to do something. If you don't, at some point somebody will ask: why didn't you do <something> and you'll wonder yourself: yes, how did we slip all the way down there?

    But man, this is hard.



  •  I think the CPA also has other resources.  At one point my wife and I went through foster parent training (in another state), but they mentioned that they had other opportunities for people wanting to help.  One of those other opportunities was for someone to go in and train people how to be parents.  They start with the basics, cook a meal, clean your house, etc.  They work with the person on an ongoing basis until they have the basics of parenting down.  That may be worthwhile to look into and she may respond better.

     Good luck



  •  I'm really confused as to why a lazy slob alcoholic would want to get 6 dogs. I love dogs, but I am a lazy slob so the idea of getting one is highly unappealing, because you have to take care of them.



  • @Bumble Bee Tuna said:

     I'm really confused as to why a lazy slob alcoholic would want to get 6 dogs. I love dogs, but I am a lazy slob so the idea of getting one is highly unappealing, because you have to take care of them.

    Unless you are Korean, then it makes perfect sense, yummy.



  • @Bumble Bee Tuna said:

     I'm really confused as to why a lazy slob alcoholic would want to get 6 dogs. I love dogs, but I am a lazy slob so the idea of getting one is highly unappealing, because you have to take care of them.

    Why would any single parent have more than 2 dogs? How do you even walk 6 dogs? (I mean, the answer here is "she doesn't". But ... for normal people.) You have to either be really rich (hire a dog babysitter) or really poor (leeching off the government, lots of free time) to take care of 6 dogs. Hell I have enough trouble keeping my one cat entertained.



  • (...Or you just keep the animals outside.)

    One of my friend's family had trouble with too many pets, as in the "crazy cat lady" manner.  One day, while people were out, my friend just took a ton of the cats to the humane society.  Needless to say there was a lot of strife, but in the end it was probably a good idea.

    Are you able to just ... remove 5 of those dogs?

    Not that the pets are the source of the problem, but I'm sure they're a source of nonzero stress.



  • Also, many states and cities have a limit on the number of dogs or cats you can keep for an extended period of time. I many cases it's on the order of 2. I'd bet that if you live anywhere near civilization, having 6 dogs is illegal. And believe me, the dogs obviously aren't doing any better than the kids. Honestly, I consider what she's doing to the pets just as bad as what she's doing to the kids. You should call the animal welfare department, too.



  • Have you considered that she might still be drinking, or has switched to some other substance? That sounds like the behavior of an intoxicated person.



  • @smxlong said:

    Have you considered that she might still be drinking, or has switched to some other substance? That sounds like the behavior of an intoxicated person.

    Depending on the severity and duration of her problem she may already be encountering permanent organic dammage to her brain. <FONT color=#000080>Wernicke–Korsakoff Syndrome</FONT>

    Can you talk her into letting you take the kids for an extended "holiday visit"?



  • @Medezark said:

    @smxlong said:

    Have you considered that she might still be drinking, or has switched to some other substance? That sounds like the behavior of an intoxicated person.

    Depending on the severity and duration of her problem she may already be encountering permanent organic dammage to her brain. <FONT color=#000080>Wernicke–Korsakoff Syndrome</FONT>

    Can you talk her into letting you take the kids for an extended "holiday visit"?

    And then "visit" a nice country with no extradition?



  • The title of this might just be "There is a Dog".



  • Having come from a similar situation (no pets, but lazy as fuck single mom of a single child - house/kitchen not being cleaned, hoarding, etc), it messes you up. You can't have friends over because of embarassment. As you mature, resentment builds up as you begin to understand the situation. When you're in the single digit age range, and there's 6 month old food in the fridge, it's because "mom's busy". As you reach your early and then middle teens, you begin to understand that your mom has a problem, and there's not really anything you can do about. You can only pray that you don't turn out similar, but you will, and it will be very tough to break out of it.



  • My sister works in the juvenile court (concerning mostly crimes commited against children).  This isn't the worst story of neglect I've heard, but you definitely shouldn't be covering for her either.  You're trying to help, but telling the kids to "Stay away from the nasty stuff," rather than removing either the nasty stuff or the children, isn't helping.



  •  Snoofle, if there's consistently dog piss in the kitchen, there isn't a court in the USA that won't grant your brother custody. Seriously.



  • @blakeyrat said:

    Why would any single parent have more than 2 dogs? How do you even walk 6 dogs? (I mean, the answer here is "she doesn't". But ... for normal people.) You have to either be really rich (hire a dog babysitter) or really poor (leeching off the government, lots of free time) to take care of 6 dogs. Hell I have enough trouble keeping my one cat entertained.
     

     

    Not completely true, I've got 5 dogs (4 inside and 1 outside) and work full-time. There are situation, like mine, where since we live so far out I have the luxury of working from home (as does the wife) which afford us the opportunity to take care of our animals. Granted what you said is true for most instances, but there are times where it is incorrect, such as my situation.

     



  • @PsychoCoder said:

    Granted what you said is true for most instances,



  • Seriously, sometimes people realise that they should change something when something important to them is been taken away. Also I do think it is way much better for the children.



  • What you are doing is basically allowing abuse to continue.

    As far as I am concerned this makes you partly responsible for it.

    This family need professional help. Now.



  • In all seriousness now that I tried the mandatory joke statement let me give you some advice.

    1. Have a long talk with the family and gather as much information as possible in order to make an informed choice
    2. Make an informed choice

    This is one of those situation where there is a possibility to fuck it no matter what you do, but what you will regret the most is doing nothing.

    Final piece of advice, do not put much weight on what internet imaginary friends tell you, we are not there, you are, we don't have to live with that decision, you have.

    Have a good day and hope you resolve this.



  • @serguey123 said:

    Final piece of advice, do not put much weight on what internet imaginary friends tell you, we are not there, you are, we don't have to live with that decision, you have.

    Full Ack



  • @hallo.amt said:

    @serguey123 said:

    Final piece of advice, do not put much weight on what internet imaginary friends tell you, we are not there, you are, we don't have to live with that decision, you have.

    Full Ack

    QFT.

    Also that applies to everything I ever type here, ever.



  • @blakeyrat said:

    @hallo.amt said:

    @serguey123 said:

    Final piece of advice, do not put much weight on what internet imaginary friends tell you, we are not there, you are, we don't have to live with that decision, you have.

    Full Ack

    QFT.

    Also that applies to everything I ever type here, ever.

    I do not put much weight on this comment.



  •  I agree with whatever Quietust posted above.



  • @dhromed said:

     I agree with whatever Quietust posted above.

    ...but I haven't posted anything in this thread until now...



  • @Quietust said:

    @dhromed said:

     I agree with whatever Quietust posted above.

    ...but I haven't posted anything in this thread until now...

    Dhromed is psychic. Also, he has a bad sense of direction.



  • There is a god and apparently he is talking to us.

    Dear Signature Guy please resolve this matter so that we can stop being serious.

    Thanks

    PS: Please send me your credit card number, I'll buy myself a nice present and pray to you



  • You're not God!



  • All theseTNG episodes seem awesome in memory, but it's been quite a while since I saw them, and they may not huld up to my current state of scrutiny.



  • Of course he is god, look he has infinite post count and as we know this forum is where all wisdom is stored, the only problem is that I can't worship him until he proves it by granting me infinite money and happiness and a poptart. In the god race the PC is winning so far.



  • @serguey123 said:

    he has infinite post count


    109 != ∞



  • @Cad Delworth said:

    @serguey123 said:

    he has infinite post count


    109 != ∞

    We can never be friends.



  •  @dhromed said:

    All theseTNG episodes seem awesome in memory, but it's been quite a while since I saw them, and they may not huld up to my current state of scrutiny.

    The first season episodes, with beardless Riker and Troi's mini-beehive, are pretty roundly awful.  The second season may have been better but still ultimately fails due to the lack of Dr. Crusher.  Starting around what I think was the third season (the one with the cliffhanger where Picard got Borg-ified) the quality went up quite a bit.  Some of those later episodes still hold up really well IMHO.



  • @cconroy said:

    fails due to the lack of Dr. Crusher
     

    Let it be known that I hated all TNG doctors.



  • @dhromed said:

    @cconroy said:

    fails due to the lack of Dr. Crusher
     

    Let it be known that I hated all TNG doctors.

    Trek universe doctors in decreasing order of WTFness:

    • Bashir
    • Pulaski
    • Phlox
    • Voyager Emergency Medical Hologram
    • McCoy
    • Crusher

     



  • I question your list!  The EMH doctor was the only good character on Voyager!  Not to mention the far and away the best actor!  The best episodes on Voyager were the ones where he was the central character. Or at least where he is able to wedge in a significant amount of bitter sarcasm.

    Anyway, Tapestry is an excellent episode, even being so many years old.  It really uses the core of sci-fi to tell a great story with great moral value.  (It also does a lot of justice to the depth and motivations of the otherwise unlikely Q character.)  It was excellently crafted to the Trek audience, and I hold the episode in the highest regards.  Take risks, kids, it's what life is about.



  • @da Doctah said:

    @dhromed said:

    @cconroy said:

    fails due to the lack of Dr. Crusher
     

    Let it be known that I hated all TNG doctors.

    Trek universe doctors in decreasing order of WTFness:

    • Bashir
    • Pulaski
    • Phlox
    • Voyager Emergency Medical Hologram
    • McCoy
    • Crusher

     

    Why is Bashir at the top? That genetic engineered brain thing? I liked Bashir. Plus he's the only Arab in the ENTIRE UNIVERSE (apparently), so respect!



  • @blakeyrat said:

    Plus he's the only Arab in the ENTIRE UNIVERSE (apparently), so respect!
     

    He didn't like it himself, apparently, because halfway through the show, his name changed from Siddig El Fadil to Alexander Siddig. I really blinkded twice when I saw that.



  • @dhromed said:

    @blakeyrat said:

    Plus he's the only Arab in the ENTIRE UNIVERSE (apparently), so respect!
     

    He didn't like it himself, apparently, because halfway through the show, his name changed from Siddig El Fadil to Alexander Siddig. I really blinkded twice when I saw that.

    Arabs Anonymous?   Personally though, I would love to have McCoy as my doctor. 


  • @blakeyrat said:

    Why is Bashir at the top? That genetic engineered brain thing? I liked Bashir. Plus he's the only Arab in the ENTIRE UNIVERSE (apparently), so respect!

    Captain Robau was played by an Arab actor, though the character was supposedly born in Cuba and raised in the Middle east.


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