Thinking about outsourcing?



  • You might wanna change your mind.

    http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/dxs8kws7(v=VS.100).aspx#CommunityContent

    Code sample:

    XPathExpression expression = navigator.Compile("bookstore/book");
    ISBN isbn = new ISBN();
    expression.AddSort("@ISBN", (IComparer)isbn);

    Community content:

    Just like a microsft exampe 
    It tells you everything except what ISBN means in this artical 
    

    6/16/2010
    GKDFDFDFDF

    i haven't heard about this free function though i am good in C programming. Please give
    us the enough information about that funcion like its syntax or the header file for that function.
    So we can understand what you talking about.

    :|



  •  thread moved to sidebar wtf



  • @garyniger said:

    i haven't heard about this free function though i am good in C programming. Please give
    us the enough information about that funcion like its syntax or the header file for that function.
    So we can understand what you talking about.

    Dude can't RTFM nor google it, he doesn't know the free function, and claims to be "good in C programming"? Maybe for a given, arbitrary value of good...

    Checking this guy's profile in Yahoo! Answers, I found a couple more gems:

    Which of these are better in REAL JOB WORLD?C#.NET or VB.NET?

    "I am using VB.NET and I really like it and it is best now a days coz every one wants the better Grapgical user Interface for their system. Other thing about VB.NET is, you don't need to do much more coding. Software will do every thing for you and in built classes and objects would support every thing that you wanna do.

    I prefer VB.NET."

    Software will do everything for you? For real? Then why ask something like this, mr.?

    Code to rotate [animation] a picture in Visual Basic.NET /// Urgent ///?

    Hi

    I have one picture and I want to rotate that picture to 360 degree for some time like 10 sec. I wanna do this in in Visual Basic.NET.

    So if any one know the code then please pass it to me. If it is possible then explain how that code gonna work.

    This is not a visual basic 6 problem but this is much more higher so if you know any good internet link for website or good forum board for Visual Basic.NET then please let me know.

    Thanks.

    For more information contact me : [removed, but you can see it in the link]

    Also this: How i can conver English Text in to Binary Language ic C or C++ programming?; And this one, which sounds like he'd got a contract via Rent-a-Coder and was then trying to figure how to do it: How can we convert English language in to Hindi language in C and C++ programming?



  • @garyniger said:

    Thinking about outsourcing?

    You might wanna change your mind.

    Yes, because there are no bad programmer wannabes in $YOURCOUNTRY.



  • @Zecc said:

    Yes, because there are no bad programmer wannabes in
    $YOURCOUNTRY.

    The questions of outsourcing and trusting foriegn workers are orthoganal. Frequently, they're answered at the same time, and one goes with cheap outsourcers from a country that has rampant poverty. However, one can outsource within ones own country, and one can hire foreign workers without outsourcing. For example, I've heard of at least one US company opening a major development campus in India, so they could hire more Indians than the US government would allow them to import. At the lower end of things, you can also import workers or hire foriegn people who are already in your country.

    The real decision one makes when one outsources is, "Do you want to allow someone who does not answer to you to make your hiring decisions for you?"

    Of course, the answer to that question should always be "Yes", because, honestly, who wants to bother with all the nuisance of hiring people? Especially since, as many incompetents are out there, you're probably going to hire some anyway. Not only does it relieve work *now*, but it also eliminates liability when the contractors mess up - it wasn't your fault, but the contracting *company*. It wasn't any *person*'s fault. So everyone can just get on with their lives.



  • @Who_the_Fuck said:

    ...but it also eliminates liability when the contractors mess up - it wasn't your fault, but the contracting company. It wasn't any person's fault. So everyone can just get on with their lives.

    I think that's the single worse reason to make a business decision I've ever heard.  It limits your personal liability, but doesn't limit the company's exposure to failure at all.  You're buying a scapegoat with the company's money!  I find that as professionally reprehensible as buying personal gifts (for yourself) with company money.

    However, I do agree that idiots are just as available here as "there".  The line is so blurred where I work that not only does the quality of people not vary between insourcing and outsourcing, the actual people don't differ.  I work in the US and I haven't seen a resume for a candidate that wasn't educated in India for the past two years.  Hundreds of resumes have crossed my desk, none of them were born within ten thousand miles of the job site.  Not even one.



  • @Who_the_Fuck said:

    @Zecc said:
    Yes, because there are no bad programmer wannabes in
    $YOURCOUNTRY.

    The questions of outsourcing and trusting foriegn workers are orthoganal.

    Yes, I misunderstood and read more than what was written. I guess I've seen too many articles on outsourcing to other countries.


  • @Who_the_Fuck said:

    Of course, the answer to that question should always be "Yes",
    because, honestly, who wants to bother with all the nuisance of hiring
    people? Especially since, as many incompetents are out there, you're
    probably going to hire some anyway. Not only does it relieve work now,
    but it also eliminates liability when the contractors mess up - it
    wasn't your fault, but the contracting company. It wasn't any
    person's fault. So everyone can just get on with their lives.
     

    I can assure you that that's not how things work. I recently was working on a project in which we were working together with another company. This other company had made use of a sub-contractor, the sub-contractor failed. This actually resulted in the company almost losing a large and important customer. This actually ended with a few developers from said company to be yanked from their yearly company trip to fix something. (I sort of feel guilty for that because I was the one that pointed out the problems)

    Anyway, when you sub-contract, you are resposible for the level of quality your sub-contractor delivers. Your client won't care that it was their fault, they don't deal with them, they deal with you.

    If you are talking legally, then yes, you can probably pass the buck to the sub-contractor. But even then the client will still deal with you, you just have the ability to extend the sueing chain and hold your sub-contractor liable.
    But good business means keeping your clients, so you've already lost really.



  • @stratos said:

    If you are talking legally, then yes, you can probably pass the buck to the sub-contractor. But even then the client will still deal with you, you just have the ability to extend the sueing chain and hold your sub-contractor liable.

    But good business means keeping your clients, so you've already lost really.

     

    depends which country, just ask BP for advice on this issue.



  • @Helix said:

    depends which country, just ask BP for advice on this issue.
    BP's contract with the US government specifically stated that they (BP) would be liable if anything happened, even if the subcontractor (Transoceanic) screwed up. In this case, though, it really is BP's fault anyway, in truth as well as in contract.



  • @Jaime said:

    However, I do agree that idiots are just as available here as "there".  The line is so blurred where I work that not only does the quality of people not vary between insourcing and outsourcing, the actual people don't differ.  I work in the US and I haven't seen a resume for a candidate that wasn't educated in India for the past two years.  Hundreds of resumes have crossed my desk, none of them were born within ten thousand miles of the job site.  Not even one.

    What the... where in the US do you work? Seriously?



  • @blakeyrat said:

    @Jaime said:
    However, I do agree that idiots are just as available here as "there".  The line is so blurred where I work that not only does the quality of people not vary between insourcing and outsourcing, the actual people don't differ.  I work in the US and I haven't seen a resume for a candidate that wasn't educated in India for the past two years.  Hundreds of resumes have crossed my desk, none of them were born within ten thousand miles of the job site.  Not even one.
    What the... where in the US do you work? Seriously?

    We're in the top half of the Fortune 50.  I think that all of the IT workers in India who want to work in the US mail out resumes to the entire fortune 50.  These resumes swamp the local resumes.  Add this effect to the fact that I work 500 miles from coporate headquarters and HR is centralized, so they don't even know/care how to hire for my locality.

    Normally I wouldn't care, after all, I'm getting resumes.  However, they all seem to be indentical to each other, so I have to do at least a phone interview to even begin to decide who should go to the next round.  Every time I interview one of these people, I find out that something they listed on their resume as at least "proficient", they don't have the first clue about.  Yes, every resume has a blatant technical lie on it.  It also seems like these people study for the interview and try to fool me in to hiring them even if they are not qualified.



  • @Jaime said:

    @blakeyrat said:

    @Jaime said:
    However, I do agree that idiots are just as available here as "there".  The line is so blurred where I work that not only does the quality of people not vary between insourcing and outsourcing, the actual people don't differ.  I work in the US and I haven't seen a resume for a candidate that wasn't educated in India for the past two years.  Hundreds of resumes have crossed my desk, none of them were born within ten thousand miles of the job site.  Not even one.
    What the... where in the US do you work? Seriously?

    We're in the top half of the Fortune 50.  I think that all of the IT workers in India who want to work in the US mail out resumes to the entire fortune 50.  These resumes swamp the local resumes.  Add this effect to the fact that I work 500 miles from coporate headquarters and HR is centralized, so they don't even know/care how to hire for my locality.

    Normally I wouldn't care, after all, I'm getting resumes.  However, they all seem to be indentical to each other, so I have to do at least a phone interview to even begin to decide who should go to the next round.  Every time I interview one of these people, I find out that something they listed on their resume as at least "proficient", they don't have the first clue about.  Yes, every resume has a blatant technical lie on it.  It also seems like these people study for the interview and try to fool me in to hiring them even if they are not qualified.

    Phew. So it's not a "we're in a city with zero technical people" but more of a "our HR department is lazy."

    I mean, our company is spoiled being in Seattle, but I didn't think we were *that* spoiled.



  • @Helix said:

    @stratos said:

    If you are talking legally, then yes, you can probably pass the buck to the sub-contractor. But even then the client will still deal with you, you just have the ability to extend the sueing chain and hold your sub-contractor liable.

    But good business means keeping your clients, so you've already lost really.

     

    depends which country, just ask BP for advice on this issue.

     

    What I meant with pass the buck isn't that you can point at the subcontractors and say "go sue them", but that while being sued for damages by your client you can sue your sub-contractor for damages as well. 



  • @riloyavic said:

    Having sub-contractors is a tricky process. This is also difficult when it comes to suing because your contracts will be examined if there are legal issues involved. 

    Always be careful if you enter into a contract whether it's IT, SEO Outsourcing, IT enabled services, back office support or all others, the same thing applies.

    Since morbius hasn't been around, I feel free to post a classic:

    http://xkcd.com/810/

    Edit: Wow, you guys removed the spam quick. My edit timeout didn't even expire.



  • @Who_the_Fuck said:

    The real decision one makes when one outsources is, "Do you want to
    allow someone who does not answer to you to make your hiring decisions
    for you?"

    I won't comment on actual reasons people have for outsourcing, but the correct question to ask is simply "Is this something we do?" If it's not, you get an outside specialist in to do it. All the rest is just purchasing decisions like any other purchase, be it a new office block or a new pencil. You have to do a cost-benefit analysis to work out what compromises to make.

    It's normal in the business world to hire in outside contractors for all kinds of things - lawyers, training staff, building maintenance, web hosting, PC building, etc etc. - unless it's one of their core business activities. Programming is no different - even though a company may work in a closely related field, if it's not their speciality, it's sensible to bring in a specialist.



  • @davedavenotdavemaybedave said:

    I won't comment on actual reasons people have for outsourcing, but the correct question to ask is simply "Is this something we do?" If it's not, you get an outside specialist in to do it.

    Or even if it is something you do, but sending it outside lets you focus on the important part of what the task is (I work for a BPO company, one of the things we do is open and sort mail for insurance firms).


Log in to reply
 

Looks like your connection to What the Daily WTF? was lost, please wait while we try to reconnect.