The new forum software will still be a WTF...



  • So, I figured out why the login form for the CS 2.0 test forum didn't work in Lynx - it uses JavaScript to submit your login details. (Apparently, it's supposed to send a normal form if it detects a User-Agent that doesn't support JS, but it doesn't). But it gets worse...

    I also had a problem where the login form only worked in Konqueror with user-agent faking enabled. By diffing the HTML, I tracked down the problem - it doesn't bother to include the JavaScript function used to submit the form if your User-Agent is unknown. After all, your browser probably doesn't support JavaScript anyway, so what's the point of sending some code that'll most likely never get used...

    WTF?



  • The WTF is that someone out there still uses Lynx...



  • @shnar said:

    The WTF is that someone out there still uses Lynx...

    I don't normally - I usually stick with Konqueror or Firefox, or use Links 2 if I must browse from the command line. (Incidentally, Links doesn't work either, probably also due to the forum software omitting a vital chunk of JavaScript from the login form because it doesn't recognise its User-Agent string. Since Links works on the current forum software's login page, which has similar code but doesn't automatically screw over users of obscure browsers, it'd probably work otherwise.)



  • @shnar said:

    The WTF is that someone out there still uses Lynx...


    No, the WTF is that logging into a forum requires JavaScript. 
    What part of authentication and session management requires JavaScript?



    It also makes it impossible to use a lightweight browser with the
    forums (perhaps posting from your cellphone?  I know, they all
    have Java these days, but that's another WTF...).




  • @shnar said:

    The WTF is that someone out there still uses Lynx...

    Hardly.  Lynx is an essential part of any web developer's toolkit, since it provides the closest thing you can get to the experience of a user with impaired vision without actually buying a screenreader and browsing with your monitor off.

    If a site is usable in Lynx, it's probably accessible for users with any disability.  If it's not, it's probably not, which is now illegal for certain types of website in many parts of the world.

    Oh, and most search-engine bots don't parse JavaScript or OCR pictures, either.  So if your site isn't even vaguely usable in Lynx, it's stupidly unoptimised and your search-engine rankings will be total crap.



  • THE WEBCODING MANIFESTO
    DRAFT WTF-0

    1. CODE LIGHT HTML
    If you are aware of all those wonderful CSS-selectors, you can seriously reduce the amount of classes, ids and wrapper elements you need. Code your HTML as sparse as possible, while keeping it "semantic", which is another word for "descriptive". Prevent Tag Soup.

    2. DO NOT REINVENT BASIC WHEELS
    The core of web interaction consists of links, form elements, and form submissions. These are robust and will always work, every single time. If they do not work at some point, then the fault lies with the developer, and the developer only. Never must your site fail to operate because one such a feature has been removed and replaced with something that does not always work.

    You will never sacrifice this basic functionality to achieve a graphic effect or visual style of some kind.

    3. DEGRADE GRACEFULLY.
    When built upon the robust interaction features mentioned in 2., any site should perform in a content-complete manner when CSS, Javacript and any third-party plugins are disabled. Granted, it'll look like crap and Javascript has its merits -- but no structure should collapse if the decorations are stripped from the walls.

    In a shop without walls, people should still be able to buy things.


    [i][b]disclaimer[/b]:
    I wrote this crap in ten minutes, on a whim. It's not really a document. I welcome discussion. Open Content, baby![/i]



  • @Iago said:

    @shnar said:
    The WTF is that someone out there still uses Lynx...

    Hardly.  Lynx is an essential part of any web developer's toolkit, since it provides the closest thing you can get to the experience of a user with impaired vision without actually buying a screenreader and browsing with your monitor off.

    If a site is usable in Lynx, it's probably accessible for users with any disability.  If it's not, it's probably not, which is now illegal for certain types of website in many parts of the world.

    Oh, and most search-engine bots don't parse JavaScript or OCR pictures, either.  So if your site isn't even vaguely usable in Lynx, it's stupidly unoptimised and your search-engine rankings will be total crap.

    You can use Opera 8+ to crash-test your website too, it includes a basic reader.

    Nothing fancy, but it does manage to read websites somewhat (probably far under JAWS and such though)



  • Now that the air's been cleared of negative thoughts, let's wait for Community-WTF 2.0 to be installed here and get used real badlike.


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