TDWTF infringes Programming Praxis trademark





  • What trademark? The phrase isn't on file with the USPTO as a registered trademark, and from what I've seen there has not been any use of the [TM] symbol to identify the phrase as an unregistered trademark.

    Alex naming the feature "Programming Praxis" without Philip's consent isn't trademark infringement, it's just a dick move.

    That being said, I'd prefer it if the guys on both sides of this issue would stop being dicks.

     

     



  • @Rootbeer said:

    That being said, I'd prefer it if the guys on both sides of this issue would stop being dicks.

     

    I agree.  Philip obviously has no legal argument here, and sending a C&D letter... WTF.  But on Alex's side, seriously, there's been what, 3 or maybe 4 articles under the name "Programming Praxis?"  Alex, you changed the name of the whole site once and then changed it back several weeks later.  FFS, it's not that hard to just pick a different name and not burn bridges.  I think the real reason the name is being kept is out of spite, and that's every bit as asstastic as the C&D.


  • Discourse touched me in a no-no place

    Reddit: http://www.reddit.com/r/programming/comments/9a7zr/programming_praxis_accuses_the_daily_wtf_of_name/

    Hey, Alex from TDWTF here...

    There's two sides to this story, and quite clearly only one side has been presented.

    If you can read between the lines on Phil's account, it should be clear who's being unreasonable... I mean, come on... overnighting a C&D letter? Threatening legal action? Are you kidding me?

    I like Phil, and we tried to work together. Our conversation started with having him join TDWTF team and merge pprax if our first exercise or two was successful. If it wasn't, he was going to go is way, I and I was going to go mine.

    Turned out it was successful... and Phil changed his mind, saying something to the effect of, "great, now just link programmingpraxis.com all over the site, and you can continue to publish progrmming exercises."

    That seemed pretty unbalanced to me... so I tried to further our conversation with phone calls, but he was uninterested in talking. So we parted ways, and I continued on. Next thing I know, I get a C&D, and you see this blog post.

    If he wanted to protect his "trademark", he should have told me in the first place, and I would have never used the name in the first place on TDWTF without credit... but coming back a month later and demanding I remove the name.... and then overnighting a C&D letter... and then posting a blog article?

    These are not the actions of a resonable person. Sould I have taken the effort to remove all references to PPrax because he demanded that I do or face legal action? Maybe.

    But I certainly didn't "steal" it.

    Alex




  • ROFL @ 'maliciously'...

     

    Given Alex's statement and the fact this isn't a registered trademark and the fact that it is a very generic term, the PP guy obviously needs to choke on a bucket of cocks.



  •  The fact that the guy is threatening legal action is overwhelmingly stupid, but at the same time, I find it very distressing that I hadn't even HEARD of the site until just now, despite being a regular TDWTF reader. This whole thing stinks of bad faith from both parties.

    Oh, and him publishing their email conversations is kind of lame, also.



  • This whole thing is pretty lame. But hey, kinda cool to be the bad guy for once, right?

    Like I said earlier, this all kinda blew up in the matter of a few days... the whole issue of not using the words "programming praxis" came up when I didn't want to promote him. We were cordial, then BAM - C&D letter and then I'm like the big bad guy on the internet.

    But hey, whatever. I don't get my panties all in a ruffle when other people use "Daily WTF" -- or heck, when other blogs call themselves that (http://www.thedailywtfobama.com/, http://www.wackyarchives.com/category/daily-wtf, and many more).

    Anyway... I honestly don't care one way or another, aside from the fact that I'm now devoting even more time to "meta" stuff. I've got a day job, family, house, garden, websites, and all sorts of other things to do. But no matter, let's change the article titles!

    Am I allowed to use "Programming Practice" or, would that infringe upon this guy’s non-existent trademark and create "confusion in the marketplace of ideas" [sic]?

    And just to be sure... I am still allowed to write programming exercise articles, right? Or would that infringe on a make-believe patent?



  • @PJH said:

    "great, now just link programmingpraxis.com
    all over the site, and you can continue to publish progrmming
    exercises."
    All over the site?  Come on.  Put a link in the PP articles, and maybe put it in the box with the other language TDWTFs, but not all over the site.  PP is not enough of a contributor to this site to warrant having links "all over the site."



  • @PJH said:

    Hey, Alex from TDWTF here...

    ...

    Alex


     

    Personally I like this one:

    Am I allowed to use “Programming Practice” or, would that infringe upon this guy’s non-existent trademark and create “confusion in the marketplace of ideas” [sic]?

    And just to be sure… I am still allowed to write programming exercise articles, right? Or would that infringe on a make-believe patent?

    *EDIT:  Damnit Alex, stop cross-posting!!!



  • @Alex Papadimoulis said:

    I don't get my panties all in a ruffle when other people use "Daily WTF"
     

    I don't necessarily think this is the problem he had. PP got butthurt over the fact that TDWTF got to use some of PP's content, and PP had nothing to show for it, and claiming trademark is the best way he could express his butthurt. Of course TDWTF is seen the bad guy, because PP is smaller and as such is seen as the noble underdog nevermind the fact that that guy was being kind of a jerkass. It's all just bad business, and neither side is the "right" side, and the self-important readers who decide to never read TDWTF (or PP) over something that shouldn't have been a public matter in the first place need to STFU.



  • While I'm a TDWTF regular reader and had never heard of the Programming Praxis site before, I tend to side with the other guy here. My interpretation of what was being proposed in terms of an alliance
    was that he would become sort of a “columnist” for TDWTF, providing
    material based on his own site, which would continue as a separate
    site, with cross-promotions going on between the two sites. The purpose
    in titling the columns in TDWTF “Programming Praxis” would be to
    highlight their origin with that site (and that in fact is the major
    purpose of trademarks: to designate the origin of a product or
    service). Having the columns say that they’re in association with the PP
    site, and link to it, would be a perfectly reasonable thing within this
    context. However, the other side seems to have been under a completely
    different understanding. Why TDWTF insists on continuing use of the name
    after the alliance crumbled is beyond me.



  • @dtobias said:

    Why TDWTF insists on continuing use of the name after the alliance crumbled is beyond me....

    TDTWF only received the nasty email demand letter to remove the words "programming praxis" from TDWTF on Sunday of this week.

    TDWTF was planning on changing the name, but didn't realize it was a life-or-death matter.

    TDWTF was also out of town for three of the past four days.

    TDWTF.



  • @Alex Papadimoulis said:

    TDWTF.


    Does this mean you're going to make WTFy C&D letters a daily occurance?



  • @Alex Papadimoulis said:

    TDWTF was planning on changing the name, but didn't realize it was a life-or-death matter.
    For what it's worth, I give you permission to rename the feature to "bstorer".



  •  Just rename it to "Programming Praxis 2.0: Enterprise Edition" and be done with it.



  • As tempting as it was to use "bstorer" as the feature name... I went with Programming Practice. It was pretty easy.

    I'm not the biggest fan of it though... any suggestions?



  • Just for the record,I agree with morbs, and it should be a very big bucket.

    I'm even tempted to advise sending the guy a bill for teaching him a life lesson, or sending a C&D letter for the slander and defamation.

     

     



  • @Alex Papadimoulis said:

    I'm not the biggest fan of it though... any suggestions?
     

    Nor am I. "Praxis" had a "this is special" feel to it.

    Brain dump (quantity over quality, yo):

     

    The Other WTF

    WTF DIY

    If You Build It, They Will Come

    Bring Your Own Code

    The Practical Euler Project (I bet we all know about The Euler Project, which is the same as Praxis except for it dealing in purely mathematical algorithms. Wait. Maybe they will sue.)

    WTF Workshop

    Entertain Me

    Send Us The Codez

    Coder Challenge  (ew. so... common)

    See What You Can Do

     

    Anyone inspired yet?



  • @dhromed said:

    Send Us The Codez

    +1



    but it has to contain "Plz"




  • The Pragmatic Programmer

    Make It So

    Tests Of Intelligence, Wit And Skill

    Do Our Homework

    And For Your Next Trick,

    Keeping You Busy

     



  • @Nelle said:

    @dhromed said:
    Send Us The Codez

    +1



    but it has to contain "Plz"


     

    Not sure, as it's something of a inside joke, and the category is faced to the public.



  •  This honestly is the most ridiculous thing over a non-existing trademark.  The funniest part is all the people who are expressing such outrage at TDWTF.  I mean, honestly, get a life.



  • Experiments in Wit, Tenacity and Finesse.



  • @Alex Papadimoulis said:

    As tempting as it was to use "bstorer" as the feature name... I went with Programming Practice. It was pretty easy.

    I'm not the biggest fan of it though... any suggestions?

    Well I'm completely out of ideas.


  • @dhromed said:

    The Pragmatic Programmer

     

    Yeah but then Andrew Hunt and David Thomas would be sueing Alex.

     

    You misspelled  the codez one, it should be: Plz Send  Us Teh Codez!?!11!



  • @dhromed said:

    @Nelle said:
    @dhromed said:
    Send Us The Codez

    +1

    but it has to contain "Plz"

    Not sure, as it's something of a inside joke, and the category is faced to the public.
    I don't think of it as an inside joke, except as among users of this site (as in not necessarily forum users).  Who do you expect to read the front page articles?

    That forum thread was featured on the front page, and there are enough users of this site on StackOverflow that the joke has spilled over.



  • Since you like the word Praxis, may I suggest Coding Eupraxia

     

     



  • @dhromed said:

    Bring Your Own Code

    This one really stuck out at me. It's got a fun acronym (though, not a TLA)... and a cool vibe to it. I like it a lot!

    Then again, I also liked (and still like, to some extent!) Worse Than Failure. So you kinow, feel free to talk me out of it.



  • Alex I might recommend just filing to trademark TDWTF and the article categories just to be safe in the future.  Even if you never intend to enforce it.

    I also don't think this will actually ever become a lawsuit. People miscommunicated and pride got hurt. But no more real damage done than that. 



  • @Alex Papadimoulis said:

    @dhromed said:

    Bring Your Own Code

    This one really stuck out at me. It's got a fun acronym (though, not a TLA)... and a cool vibe to it. I like it a lot!

    Then again, I also liked (and still like, to some extent!) Worse Than Failure. So you kinow, feel free to talk me out of it.

    How about "Code Quandary" or "Conundrums of Code"? I personally like the first one better.


  •  Straight road to the queer code.


  • Discourse touched me in a no-no place

    @galgorah said:

    Alex I might recommend just filing to trademark TDWTF and the article categories just to be safe in the future.  Even if you never intend to enforce it.
    Doesn't not enforcing your trademarks mean you cannot then subsequently enforce them?



  • @dhromed said:

    Experiments in Wit, Tenacity and Finesse.

    Brillant.



  • @galgorah said:

    I might recommend just filing to trademark TDWTF and the article categories just to be safe in the future

    I've considered it for the principle of the matter, but registering a trademark costs in the $500 range ($325 + legal fees). And it doesn't really buy me anything, except having some good legal teeth behind enforcing them. But even if we took it all the way to a lawsuit, the only relief you can get from a trademark claim is injunctive, actual, and attorney fees... and that's after a lot of work. I suspect a nicely written letter to an infringer, a few follow-up emails, and finally a nasty lawyer letter would do the trick.

    As for others registering our trademarks and trying to come after me for infringement... it'll probably never happen. And if it ever does, I'll ignore their demand all the way until they file a complaint in federal court ($$$$$$). Then we'll file a motion for summary judgement and change of venue, both of which would almost certainly be granted. In the "absolute worst case scenario", they'd have a huge judgement (attourney costs) against a company with hardly any assets and an injunction that's going to be basically impossible to enforce.

    So, at the end of the day... it would take a highly dedicated and highly spiteful person with a whole lot of money and whole lot of time... even with 6 or 7 billion people, I'm not too woried.

     



  • @Alex Papadimoulis said:

    So, at the end of the day... it would take a highly dedicated and highly spiteful person with a whole lot of money and whole lot of time...

    A scorned and aggreived nerd who posts to an Internet forum meets all of your criteria.  Remember MasterPlanSoftware?  Now imagine someone who was't so poor their revenge had to take the form of insults and scripted DoS attacks.

     

    Not that I'm saying you should bother registering the trademark.



  • @AisA said:

    Coding Eupraxia
     

    +1



  • Thinking some more, how about Codeupraxia

    This is defined as...

    Codeupraxia - A good praxis of coding resulting in code that will appear in the comments on TDWTF, especially in response to coding challenges.

    Programming Praxis - The praxis of programming which might result in code that might appear in the articles or the sidebar on the TDWTF.

    :)

     



  • @AisA said:

    how about Codeupraxia
     

    That would be okay if Eupraxia was pronounced with a vowel at the beginning.


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