Why is Everybody so clueless on the importance of Desktop Search to the Masses?



  • @Tommie said:

    I'm also very curious about what Mister Swamp would like to see as a fair set of rules to which all desktop search engine could reasonably be compaired against in the Showdown Of The Century.
     

    You know what? Me too. I sense this thread is trolling its last, but we can at least go out with a bang right?

     

    So, Swamp, you claim the rules of the Desktop Search Showdown as laid out earlier were unfair, biased and all-around wrong. So, what rules do YOU want? What do YOU want the Great Desktop Search Showdown of 2008 to entail? 

    Give us your rules, Swamp. We're ready. 



  • SSDS moves with You

    @MasterPlanSoftware said:

    You can't tell from the rest of this thread? Obviously his criteria for Desktop Search applications would be playing random video, music, and displaying random pictures...

     

    Speed would be one criteria along with mobility. My BackUp DVD will be showing me my info and allowing me to surf my favourites on any computer in seconds.

    Search hasn't changed all that much from the 80's other than. Video, music, pictures and random, background and navigation.

    Question: When you find interesting text on the Net. Do you cut/paste them in ONE big file? or 1 file per item? or one per net category? I have about 6 or 8 net text files going. 



  • @SpectateSwamp said:

    Speed would be one criteria along with mobility. My BackUp DVD will be showing me my info and allowing me to surf my favourites on any computer in seconds.

     So would anyone's backup. And they wouldn't be left with only a large text file. The rest of us would all the files, with all their color and formatting so we could enjoy them.

    @SpectateSwamp said:

    Search hasn't changed all that much from the 80's other than. Video, music, pictures and random, background and navigation.

    For YOU it hasn't. The rest of us have evolved and expect more out of a 'search'.

    @SpectateSwamp said:

    Question: When you find interesting text on the Net. Do you cut/paste them in ONE big file? or 1 file per item? or one per net category? I have about 6 or 8 net text files going. 

    I doubt any of us copy the text anywhere. That would be insanely stupid. Par for the course for you though.



  • @SpectateSwamp said:

    @MasterPlanSoftware said:

    You can't tell from the rest of this thread? Obviously his criteria for Desktop Search applications would be playing random video, music, and displaying random pictures...

     

    Speed would be one criteria along with mobility. My BackUp DVD will be showing me my info and allowing me to surf my favourites on any computer in seconds.

    Search hasn't changed all that much from the 80's other than. Video, music, pictures and random, background and navigation.

    Question: When you find interesting text on the Net. Do you cut/paste them in ONE big file? or 1 file per item? or one per net category? I have about 6 or 8 net text files going. 

     

    Speed is essential, you haven't proved SSDS is faster because you refuse to actually give numbers or partake in a challenge. Video, music and pictures have definitely changed how searches work but any modern search tool will search the metadata contained in these files type in-situ.

    Personally when I find interesting stuff on the internet I either just bookmark the site or if it is specific to something I am working on that I may need access to when I do not have internet access then it goes into a One-Note notebook - which is fully searchable from vista (including the text of images).

    What on earth do backups have to do with searching?

    In all honesty you seem to have written a fairly useful (for yourself and your way of doing things - but this isn't in itself a bad thing (tm)) utility; however it isn't a search tool in the accepted sense. Searching obviously isn't it's strong point so why do you insist it is the best search tool?



  • @SpectateSwamp said:

    See all your video clips in 2 second segments. Far far better than any little tiny tiny thumbnail representing the video.
     

    As usual, you don't answer the question and spew out meaningless "marketing" garbage. I'm asking what happens if you mis-index something. So you've got a few hundred video files. You index one but record the filename in your index.txt as "Moose.avi" instead of "mouse.avi". Now SSDS can't play the video, and as far as your search is concerned, that video no longer exists.

    And again, what if you don't have just personal camcorder videos on your drive? Most commercial videos (downloaded, ripped, whatever) start with a few seconds of black video. So you'll have to index where to start playing those 2 second clips... again, what happens if you mis-enter that time index? "Oh, I want mouse.avi to start at 03:07 and play for 5 seconds", but you record "play mouse.avi at 70:03 for 5 seconds". You're not going to get anything unless your mouse.avi is over 70 minutes long.

    @SpectateSwamp said:

     That question is making me dizzy

    It's a simple question.  (P and (Q or R or not(S))). P = all videos of mice. Q = filmed in december, R = filmed in november, S = filmed in october. So, all videos of mice that were filmed in december or november or not filmed in october. Can you do that kind of search RIGHT NOW? Don't say the source can be modified. We know the source can be modified to do anything. I'm asking if SSDS can do it RIGHT NOW.

    @SpectateSwamp said:

    Instead of holding the 'enter' key down. Use the 'pause' command at prompt #2 set the 'tt.1' will cause the displays to pause 1/10 second before displaying the next results screen. Check it out.

    So now we're Gee-hawing with 10 things flashing up every second instead of 20. Again, how is this useful? You saw the video of google search doing its thing. It popped up 10+ results on screen instantly, it showed context, it showed all 10 results at the same time. SSDS only shows one line at a time, you have to enter for more results, and it shows only a single line of text. What if you're holding down enter and go too far? If it takes you 2 seconds to realize that, you've already gone 40+ results too far.

    @SpectateSwamp said:

    The error was flashing up on the screen so fast I couldn't see it.
     

    most people would just add some debugging statements to their program, to make it pause at where you think the bug/error is occuring. If you don't know where the error's occuring, if you can't even guess, then your program is too obfuscated/complicated/spaghetti, and should be thrown out and started over.

    @SpectateSwamp said:

    Sometimes messing with the video brings out more detail.

    If I wanted more detail of an ant colony in slow motion, I'd set up my digital camera to take high-resolution shots every 0.5 seconds, or whatever I wanted. Video is inherently low quality, suffers from artifacts (as you're so fond of pointing out), and has essentially zero ability to capture any detail worth zooming in on. Remember, a standard commercial camcorder you can pick up at the local electronics store will be recording the video at around 640x480. Why zoom in on a postage stamp when you start with a poster at 3000x2000? At that resolution you can see the hairs on the ant's head. With a camcorder you'd be lucky to even see the ant in the first place as anything other than a single pixel.

    @SpectateSwamp said:
    Indexers end up indexing the other indexers indexes. Could tie up the system. Maybe I should try 2 of them at a time?

    You presume that W/GDS would store their indexes as plain text. You presume wrong. It's not plain text. It's proprietary binary formats. I'd be surprised if there was anything in the index files that could actually be viewed as plain text, except perhaps "(c) 2007 Microsoft/Google/Whoever".

    Text file access is inherently slow compared to a properly designed and constructed binary file. You do a few calculations in the program, convert your search terms to a number, look it up in the index's catalog, and it tells you where in the file to look for the results data. So instead of scanning 2 gigabytes of plain text hoping for a result, you read a few hundred kilobytes of data, and poof, you know if what you're looking for is there.

    Remember, W/GDS are there to faciliate access to finding text. They scan your files, extract metadata, convert metadata, etc... all so it's easy to find what you need. YOu don't need to worry if your MP3 ID3 reading routine is working. you don't need to worry if your MP3s have ID3v2 tags (which SSDS doesn't handle, by the way, AT ALL). You don't have to worry about transcription errors when you're building up the index.txt file. The indexers handle all of that for you. All you need to do is punch in a couple words and let it do all the grunt work.

    I know you're advocating returning control to people, but SSDS is not the way to do it. SSDS is the equivalent telling people they don't need an oven, because cooking over a fire in a cave gives them more control.

    Tools exist for a reason. They help us get our work done faster. SSDS is not a tool. It's an anti-tool. It exists only to make things harder and take longer.

    You've seen other people's posts. Even on this page someone had Google Desktop index 300 gigabytes of data. It took 4 hours. How long would it take you to do the same in SSDS? Don't complain that 300gigabytes is way more than anything could ever have. You can go read the post. It's a network drive. It's used by multiple people. Just pretend it's 300 people each storing 1 gigabyte. How long do you think it would you to record all those files in SSDS? It's definitely more than 4 hours. You'd probably still be working on the 1st person's files by the time you die of old age. 



  • @SpectateSwamp said:

    No individual has 300GB  of textual data. Companies maybe.

     

    So you admit that SSDS is bloody useless for companies?

     @SpectateSwamp said:

    Speed would be one criteria along with mobility. My BackUp DVD will be showing me my info and allowing me to surf my favourites on any computer in seconds.

     

     We've already seen a video of SSDS where you spent several seconds plodding through your cryptic options, and a video of GDS where the user spent barely two seconds hitting a hotkey and typing their search terms.  As for mobility, I have a corporate laptop so it's not really an issue for me, but here's a free clue:  del.icio.us

     

     @SpectateSwamp said:

    When you find interesting text on the Net. Do you cut/paste them in ONE big file? or 1 file per item? or one per net category? I have about 6 or 8 net text files going. 

     

    None of the above.  Most things I'm not interested in reading more than once; for the few exceptions, well, that's what bookmarks are for.  (Quick, write a SpectateSwampRandomBookmark add-on for FireFox!  Oh, wait...)

     



  • Your SSDS Rocks.

    @spenk said:

    Personally when I find interesting stuff on the internet I either just bookmark the site or if it is specific to something I am working on that I may need access to when I do not have internet access then it goes into a One-Note notebook - which is fully searchable from vista (including the text of images).

    Sites come and go. If it's good capture the text and maybe a screen capture jpg.

     @spenk said:

    What on earth do backups have to do with searching?

     

    Searching is about accumulating data, video etc etc. When you have data. It better be backed up. Then you can relax.

    @spenk said:

    so why do you insist it is the best search tool?

    It's the accumulation of things. Some things it doesn't do (full screen editor - I use NotePad) things it does real well. Thumbnails of video and music and flash through your pictures in minutes of uploading the exe. It's portable and now that it is open source. It can do even more. I use the search to load URL's and passwords into my ClipBoard. I'll demo my last email to WhiteCourt council re the HomeLessShelter videos. I could just as easily do this email from anybodys computer. The old time searches / greps all did (extracts) this one does it. That opens up sub-searches.

     



  • @Tommie said:

    I'm also very curious about what Mister Swamp would like to see as a fair set of rules to which all desktop search engine could reasonably be compaired against in the Showdown Of The Century.
     

    Let me rephrase that, this sentence was way to too long to keep anyone's attention long enough to remember what I asked for to begin with. Surely the Masses' attention. (He did reply to a reply on my question with fewer words though.)

    Sorry.

     

    To: SpectateSwamp 

    Could you please define your Showdown rules?



  • Can't change my Profile - &%(@$

    How come. On other sites I change the profile all the time. With some of my great sayings and Search Truths...



  • Show-Off for ShowDown

    @Tommie said:

    Could you please define your Showdown rules?
    One important feature. Is simplicity. I can explain everything this search does in poor english. Try that with the others. Search is more than just extract. It's search and (find) and (play) and (organize) and (sample) and (retrieve).... A search 'showdown of the century' would require me showing off and explaining search and moving pc to pc. With video and pics uploaded to the net to archive the trashing the others will take. I need a couple swampies. I can't do video and demo at the same time. A big swampie would be handy in case the opposition gets mad when they are made to look bad.  



  • Wow, that is a fast answer. But not an answer to the question.

    @Wikipedia said:

    Desktop search is the name for the field of search tools which search the
    contents of a user's own computer files, rather than searching the
    Internet. These tools are designed to find information on the user's PC,
    including web browser histories, e-mail archives, text documents, sound files,
    images and video.

    @SpectateSwamp said:

    simplicity

    You Failed.

    @SpectateSwamp said:

    Search is more than just extract

    Depends on who is the reader. But you Failed. You can't extact anything but plain text, show images (3 formats) and show video.

    @SpectateSwamp said:

    ... would require me showing off

    Please don't, just show search capabilities.

    @SpectateSwamp said:

    ... and moving pc to pc ...

    Does not compute... 

    @SpectateSwamp said:

    With video and pics uploaded to the net

    It was Desktop Search we were talking about, right?

    @SpectateSwamp said:

    I need a couple swampies.

    To do the searching for you?

     

    So a re-cap:

    @Tommie said:

    Could you please define your Showdown rules?



  • @SpectateSwamp said:

    @spenk said:

    Personally when I find interesting stuff on the internet I either just bookmark the site or if it is specific to something I am working on that I may need access to when I do not have internet access then it goes into a One-Note notebook - which is fully searchable from vista (including the text of images).

    Sites come and go. If it's good capture the text and maybe a screen capture jpg.

    Like I said, if it is important I save it in a format that preserves more than just the raw text (one note) otherwise  will trust a book mark or www.google.com ...

     

    @SpectateSwamp said:
    One important feature. Is simplicity. I can explain everything this search does in poor english. Try that with the others. Search is more than just extract. It's search and (find) and (play) and (organize) and (sample) and (retrieve).... A search 'showdown of the century' would require me showing off and explaining search and moving pc to pc. With video and pics uploaded to the net to archive the trashing the others will take. I need a couple swampies. I can't do video and demo at the same time. A big swampie would be handy in case the opposition gets mad when they are made to look bad.

     

    Err, searching is actually the art of finding things, http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&safe=off&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&hs=XWY&defl=en&q=define:search&sa=X&oi=glossary_definition&ct=title pretty much agrees. playing, editing, etc are extra features at best and probably better suited to other tools.

    So you are saying your search showdown would involve activities that are secondary to the whole point of searching? Searching involves searching for things, not random, not backup, not cript, not re-installing windows. Could you honestly show SSDS beating other search tools if the challenge boiled down to performing searches for known terms in a given directory tree?



  • @SpectateSwamp said:

    Sites come and go. If it's good capture the text and maybe a screen capture jpg.
     

     

    Set the WayBack Machine to SS's fourth-grade year, Sherman!

     

     



  • @SpectateSwamp said:

    One important feature. Is simplicity. I can explain everything this search does in poor english. Try that with the others. Search is more than just extract. It's search and (find) and (play) and (organize) and (sample) and (retrieve).... A search 'showdown of the century' would require me showing off and explaining search and moving pc to pc. With video and pics uploaded to the net to archive the trashing the others will take. I need a couple swampies. I can't do video and demo at the same time. A big swampie would be handy in case the opposition gets mad when they are made to look bad.  

    Can you please make a list, using bullet points, of every challenge in the showdown? For example:

    • Search for text (first to get to last result wins)
    • Search for text (first to get most relevant result wins)
    • Random video (fastest to get random videos playing)

    Please? I'm itching to take you on using Spotlight 😃



  • @SpectateSwamp said:

    One important feature. Is simplicity. I can explain everything this search does in poor english. Try that with the others.

    I can explain how to use GDS or WDS in very poor french!  But to learn how to use SSDS one needs to view a bunch of videos or visit the swampshack for a half day?!



  • A while ago, I decided that rewriting SSDS with a decent UI would be the only way to end this discussion and a good way to brush up on my VB skills. It seems fitting that 2 weeks and 1.5L of Old Crow whiskey later, I have nothing to show except a very basic understanding of SSDS and a file named "funny code.txt". You'll have to excuse me if this post rambles a little...

    The whole program seems to hinge on the ttt variable, which gets uppercased about 20 times, assigned to temporary variables and back again, etc. Of course there's also aaa, ooo, yyy, temptemp and even a few Roman Numeral variables. There's some logic that depends on the name of the SSDS executable file, along with some hints at what looks like a shareware version and requested customizations. Nothing is ever deleted, just commented out. There's also some stuff about getting the user's logon name, Windows version, and installed service packs for some unknown reason. The first label is line_30 which is at line 1032; luckily he noticed this problem and most of the later labels are at least triple their line number. Does anyone have a book called the Programmer's Guide? Because there're several references to page numbers. I also have to report that there's evidence of at least four people who regularly use this.

    I wanted to do a "Representative Line" type thing, but there's no way to narrow it down to just one. Here are the lines I thought were entertaining:

    'seems to loop if it hits end of file
    'Hint: (place 6 blank lines at end of file
    'so last 3 pictures can be seen in random mode.
    '   Beep        'test the beep bell
    KEEPS1 = SSS1 + ""
    KEEPS2 = SSS2 + ""
    KEEPS3 = SSS3 + ""
    KEEPS4 = SSS4 + ""      '09 june 2002
    KEEPS5 = SSS5 + ""
    KEEPS6 = SSS6 + ""
    

    A few lines later...

    SAVE_KEEPS1 = KEEPS1 + ""
    SAVE_KEEPS2 = KEEPS2 + ""
    SAVE_KEEPS3 = KEEPS3 + ""
    SAVE_KEEPS4 = KEEPS4 + "" '09 june 2002
    SAVE_KEEPS5 = KEEPS5 + ""
    SAVE_KEEPS6 = KEEPS6 + ""

    'pause a bit and do a couple of beeps just to bug them
    '        ForeColor = QBColor(12)        'red
    '        ForeColor = QBColor(10)         'try lime green instead of red above
    '        ForeColor = QBColor(14)         'make this yellow and photo_detail lime green
    '        ForeColor = QBColor(9)         'make this bright blue instead
    '        ForeColor = QBColor(13)         'make this light purple instead
    '        ForeColor = QBColor(14)         'make this yellow instead
    '        ForeColor = QBColor(10)         'make this lime green (10) instead
    ForeColor = QBColor(11)         'make this pale blue (11) instead
    Font.Italic = False
    Font.Size = 72                  'making time huge
    '        Font.Size = 48                  '20 May 2003 switch to this for laptop
    aaa = "dummydummydummydummydummydummy"    'some how forces the full date time to print????
    Print #NewFile, "     " 'this forces it to a plain text file not rich text
     '   Dim SSS1 As String     what the hey why commented out????? ***vip*** it is strange too
    end_cnt = 0         'allow for more than 1 eof in file
    visual_impared = "YES"      'to set up control.txt
    visual_impared = "NO"       'settings for ron windels
    Context = "no"      'june 26/99 what is with this line?
    line_2300:
    'lots need to be done around here in the future.
    

    ' Print Left(ooo, 70)
    ' Print Mid(ooo, 71, 70)
    ' Print Mid(ooo, 141, 70)
    ' Print Mid(ooo, 211, 70)
    ' Print Mid(ooo, 281, 70)
    ' Print Mid(ooo, 351, 70)
    ' Print Mid(ooo, 421, 70)
    ' Print Mid(ooo, 491, 70)
    ' Print Mid(ooo, 561, 70)
    ' Print Mid(ooo, 631, 70)

    'how did line_start_point below ever go negative ????
    If line_start_point < 0.0001 Then line_start_point = 0     '25 October 2004 this did the fix on the short ones.
    If line_start_point < 9.0001 Then line_start_point = 10    '11 March 2007
    'dougheredoughere
    'the following lines of info should print right on top of the photo but
    'somehow it is not. see the smg emulation where a bmp file is displayed as a pict
    'then the text is written and re-written over that image??? langaliers where are you


  • @Cap'n Steve said:

    A while ago, I decided that rewriting SSDS with a decent UI would be the only way to end this discussion and a good way to brush up on my VB skills. It seems fitting that 2 weeks and 1.5L of Old Crow whiskey later, I have nothing to show except a very basic understanding of SSDS and a file named "funny code.txt". You'll have to excuse me if this post rambles a little...

    Perhaps my favorite thing about this post is that you've adopted his VB file extension of .txt.  Clearly, you need to refer to the flowcharts, for the sake of your liver...

    Has anyone ever graphed all of the gotos in there?  A listing of all the variable names would be amusing, too. 

    @Cap'n Steve said:

    I wanted to do a "Representative Line" type thing, but there's no way to narrow it down to just one. Here are the lines I thought were entertaining:

     

    Those were better than most front page stories.  



  •  @Tommie said:

    Could you please define your Showdown rules?

    @SpectateSwamp said:

    A search
    'showdown of the century' would require me showing off and explaining
    search and moving pc to pc. With video and pics uploaded to the net to
    archive the trashing the others will take.

     @elgate said:

    Can you please make a list, using bullet points, of every challenge in the showdown? For example:

    • Search for text (first to get to last result wins)
    • Search for text (first to get most relevant result wins)
    • Random video (fastest to get random videos playing)

    Please?

    Remember the rules that were defined earlier? A series of steps which should be followed, with a description of the victory conditions. That's what we need you to write. We need DETAIL! The rules need to make sure everyone in the showdown is doing the same thing.

     

    Do you understand what we're asking? Just ask if you need it explained. 



  • SSDS fix is IN

    That nasty character pause timer problem is fixed. It would only do 50 or so characters per second MAX. It is now displaying characters at 5 times that. Just about the speed I wanted. You all wouldn't like how I did the fix. So I won't show the code changes just yet. Save some laughs for later.



  • @SpectateSwamp said:

    That nasty character pause timer problem is fixed. It would only do 50 or so characters per second MAX. It is now displaying characters at 5 times that. Just about the speed I wanted. You all wouldn't like how I did the fix. So I won't show the code changes just yet. Save some laughs for later.

     

    Do you even READ what other people are writing? 



  • @SpectateSwamp said:

    That nasty character pause timer problem is fixed.

    WE. DON'T. CARE.

    But show the code changes, please.



  • Data ownership 100% with SSDS

    @rc_pinchey said:

    Do you even READ what other people are writing? 

    Yup. But I was busy taking the dogs for a walk up the Beaver Creek out back.

    Another Feature I'll show in the ShowDown is Data OwnerShip. With SSDS your data is all yours. The cataloging done with SSDS is useful on other systems. With the standard NotePad type editor you can cut and paste the file names and paths anywhere you want. Data ownership 100% with SSDS the others ??. Not so good.

     



  • @SpectateSwamp said:

    With SSDS your data is all yours.

    Can please someone check for how often he's been repeating this phrase? Or equivalent phrases? I'm really curious.



  • @SpectateSwamp said:

    Another Feature I'll show in the ShowDown...

    We want a LIST OF RULES for the Showdown. Otherwise we can't HAVE a Showdown, because WE WON'T KNOW WHAT TO DO.

     

    Do you understand what I mean? 



  • @SpectateSwamp said:

    @rc_pinchey said:

    Do you even READ what other people are writing? 

    Yup. But I was busy taking the dogs for a walk up the Beaver Creek out back.

    Another Feature I'll show in the ShowDown is Data OwnerShip. With SSDS your data is all yours. The cataloging done with SSDS is useful on other systems. With the standard NotePad type editor you can cut and paste the file names and paths anywhere you want. Data ownership 100% with SSDS the others ??. Not so good.

     

    HAHAHAHA This is the kind of marketing you would get by filling a stadium with monkeys and typewriters...

     He isn't going to define a showdown. He doesn't know how to be coherent, and he certainly doesn't want anyone to show what a piece of shit SSDS is directly. If you prove it awful, his delusions become more difficult to maintain in that big bearded head of his.



  • When it comes to Show SSDS has it

    I'll show off SSDS features and the problems with the competition. In quick 2 to 3 minute demonstrations. 10 to 15 such demos per side. With an audience off the street and half geeks. Or the net audience will be fine.



  • @SpectateSwamp said:

    I'll show off SSDS features and the problems with the competition. In quick 2 to 3 minute demonstrations. 10 to 15 such demos per side. With an audience off the street and half geeks. Or the net audience will be fine.

     

    So once again you refuse a showdown? A showdown that everyone seems to be ok with YOU defining?



  • Derula wants to Know

    @derula said:

    But show the code changes, please.

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------

    line_30316:
    'try and slow the delay for character pause. it would not do less than 1/10 sec or so?
        If new_delay_sec > 0.1 Then     '05 February 2008
              DoEvents
            motion_out = Timer
            If motion_out + 43200 < motion_in Then
                motion_in = motion_in - 86400
            End If
            If motion_out - motion_in < new_delay_sec Then
                GoTo line_30316
            End If
        Else                               ' 05 February 2008
            temp_cnt1 = Int(new_delay_sec * 1000)
            For temp_cnt = 1 To temp_cnt1
                For II = 1 To 100
                    DoEvents
                Next II
            Next temp_cnt
       
        End If                              '05 February 2008
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    I have command line #77 set to: "CHARACTERPAUSE==.03"

    That gives me about the speed I want. Speed it up or slow it down to your liking. I am so happy with it I'll leave it active for a while. during my regular searches. having it slow isn't a problem. When the speed switch is cmd(77)



  • @SpectateSwamp said:

    I'll show off SSDS features and the problems with the competition. In quick 2 to 3 minute demonstrations. 10 to 15 such demos per side. With an audience off the street and half geeks. Or the net audience will be fine.

    ANSWER! MY! FUCKING! POST!

    GIVE US A LIST! We want every individual challenge defined - what SPECIFICALLY does the program have to do, and what determines which program won?

    If you can't do that, you're even more worthless than your program. And if you DARE reply to this post with "oh and I'll show off random feature xx" I'm coming up to the swamp shack and blowing your fucking brains out.

    No, not really. But it'd be so nice to.



  • @SpectateSwamp said:

    I'll show off SSDS features and the problems with the competition. In quick 2 to 3 minute demonstrations. 10 to 15 such demos per side. With an audience off the street and half geeks. Or the net audience will be fine.

     

    So what happened to the showdown you kept demanding? You didn't like the proposed one and now refuse to even state what you would accept as a challenge. People are offering you the showdown you want and you refuse to acknowledge them - is this due to some disorder or the realisation that you will lose if put head to head with a search tool for a challenge that involves searching?

    Nobody cares about your demonstrations or useless feature like random length playback of random videos with random text - people want a search tool to search a file system and find files. Why is this so hard for you to understand? Repeated requests have been made for you to show simple things like searching a folder for a file containing a particular word - this is what people want a search tool to do, anything else is just additional 'features' but it must fundamentally be able to search for files.

     Random phrases like @SpectateSwamp said:

    Data ownership 100% with SSDS the others ??. Not so good.
    prove nothing and mean less, with any other tool I can keep my data where I want it and in a format I want and searching works. With SSDS I need to put the data where you want it and in a format of your choosing! How on earth does that give me ownership of my data - that effectively means all my data is owned and controlled by SSDS rather than me.

    You really fail to grasp the utter basic concept of what a search is or even how to respond to a challenge you requested and it would be in your best interest to accept the challenge or stop bothering people.

     



  • Showing Big file searches doesn't cut it.

    @elgate said:

    @SpectateSwamp said:

    I'll show off SSDS features and the problems with the competition. In quick 2 to 3 minute demonstrations. 10 to 15 such demos per side. With an audience off the street and half geeks. Or the net audience will be fine.

    ANSWER! MY! FUCKING! POST!

    GIVE US A LIST! We want every individual challenge defined - what SPECIFICALLY does the program have to do, and what determines which program won?

    If you can't do that, you're even more worthless than your program. And if you DARE reply to this post with "oh and I'll show off random feature xx" I'm coming up to the swamp shack and blowing your fucking brains out.

    No, not really. But it'd be so nice to.

    ShowDown features to be determined by the Swamp Shack Group. You guys figure out what you want to show off. This will be more like a figure skating showdown. Some start out fast with their BIG jumps and spins. 1 demo will be how to use SSDS to determine text file max lines for the competition. Random will be there. Scrolling text. portability. Search masters squaring off with their favorite Desktop Search tool. Tell me what your side will show off. Who will you represent. GDS WDS YDS or some other imposter.


  • @elgate said:

    ANSWER! MY! FUCKING! POST!

    GIVE US A LIST! We want every individual challenge defined - what SPECIFICALLY does the program have to do, and what determines which program won?

    If you can't do that, you're even more worthless than your program. And if you DARE reply to this post with "oh and I'll show off random feature xx" I'm coming up to the swamp shack and blowing your fucking brains out.

     

    No, not really. But it'd be so nice to.

     

    Dude, chill out.  He never really answers anyone's post. 



  • @SpectateSwamp said:

    ShowDown features to be determined by the Swamp Shack Group. You guys figure out what you want to show off.
     

    Alright then. We have decided. 

    We want to see the showdown I described already.

    We will be awaiting your submission.



  • @SpectateSwamp said:

    ShowDown features to be determined by the Swamp Shack Group. You guys figure out what you want to show off. This will be more like a figure skating showdown. Some start out fast with their BIG jumps and spins. 1 demo will be how to use SSDS to determine text file max lines for the competition. Random will be there. Scrolling text. portability. Search masters squaring off with their favorite Desktop Search tool. Tell me what your side will show off. Who will you represent. GDS WDS YDS or some other imposter.
     

    We issued a challenge and you opted to not accept it (remember the linux source code thing), so why are you asking us what we want to show off? We are not even trying to show of odd features - we want to see your sodding application search for files - that is all, end of challenge, no more is required.

    Try these as a simple challenge...

    Step 1 - Download http://subversion.tigris.org/downloads/subversion-1.4.6.zip (not too large so you can't complain about bandwidth).

    Step 2 - extract to a folder of your choosing

    Step 3 - search for a term like print_header_xml and demonstrate the speed to find all matches

    Step 4 - open any of the found files in the default editor.

    is that enough? Notice there is no random, no videos being used - I want to see you alleged search tool search for some files and nothing more.


    All work must be part of the video - if you merge files we need to see it happen, you will see our choice of search tool having to index the files so all is fair.



  • @spenk said:

    @SpectateSwamp said:

    ShowDown features to be determined by the Swamp Shack Group. You guys figure out what you want to show off. This will be more like a figure skating showdown. Some start out fast with their BIG jumps and spins. 1 demo will be how to use SSDS to determine text file max lines for the competition. Random will be there. Scrolling text. portability. Search masters squaring off with their favorite Desktop Search tool. Tell me what your side will show off. Who will you represent. GDS WDS YDS or some other imposter.
     

    We issued a challenge and you opted to not accept it (remember the linux source code thing), so why are you asking us what we want to show off? We are not even trying to show of odd features - we want to see your sodding application search for files - that is all, end of challenge, no more is required.

    Try these as a simple challenge...

    Step 1 - Download http://subversion.tigris.org/downloads/subversion-1.4.6.zip (not too large so you can't complain about bandwidth).

    Step 2 - extract to a folder of your choosing

    Step 3 - search for a term like print_header_xml and demonstrate the speed to find all matches

    Step 4 - open any of the found files in the default editor.

    is that enough? Notice there is no random, no videos being used - I want to see you alleged search tool search for some files and nothing more.

     

    Please add some of the other rules and clauses I had in my challenege, about the indexing needed during searching, etc etc. I know you think you are making this easier, but it would not in anyway show the true issue that he would need to merge all of these files.

    Edit: I guess we both hit that idea at the same time. Sorry to interfere.



  • @SpectateSwamp said:

    ShowDown features to be determined by the Swamp Shack Group. You guys figure out what you want to show off. This will be more like a figure skating showdown. Some start out fast with their BIG jumps and spins. 1 demo will be how to use SSDS to determine text file max lines for the competition. Random will be there. Scrolling text. portability. Search masters squaring off with their favorite Desktop Search tool. Tell me what your side will show off. Who will you represent. GDS WDS YDS or some other imposter.

    WHAT SWAMP SHACK GROUP? You and your inbred cousin?

    No. No figure skating. Sorry, computing doesn't work like that.

    How about this:

    We define a standard set of things that have to be done, for example, Find Text in File (an "event"). For each event, we score out of ten on three things:
    * Load Time - how fast does it get to the point where it's ready to complete the task? For example if you're searching, WDS has to build an index.
    * Speed - how quickly does it finish the task?
    * Ease-of-use - how simple is it to achieve this task? how hard is it for the end-user?
    * Features - extra points for flashy things the program adds to that challenge, for example, auto-playing a video preview when looking for a video.

    Oh, and I still want to kill you.

    EDIT: Never mind, just do what they said.



  • Folks,

    Spectate will never accept any showdown against a real desktop search tool, because even though he calls his tool 'Desktop Search' it really is a replacement operating system to him. I think the showdown should be:

    DEATHMATCH: Spectate Swamp Desktop Search vs Microsoft BOB

    Does anyone know how to do claymation animation?

    Dr. Phil



  • Some slowdowns are OK


     

    See the latest demo of email address and the clipboard.

    http://video.google.ca/videoplay?docid=8002756326845671406

    The scrolling text fix from today is shown later in the video when I enter
    context display. That latest executable search.exe is at:
    http://www.telusplanet.net/public/stonedan/search.exe


     



  • Spectate should learn to use a computer like 'the masses' have.

    GAH! It even abuses the clipboard! WTF!

     @SpectateSwamp said:

    See the latest demo of email address and the clipboard.

    http://video.google.ca/videoplay?docid=8002756326845671406

    I just have to point out (i know it wont change anything)... Spectate,you do realize the rest of us who use the email client the correct way only have to type in the first letter or two of the email address right? The email address then automatically appears for us. No need for anything else.

    Once again you have shown that you have made it possible to spend 10 times too long on a simple computer task.

     

     



  • @SpectateSwamp said:

    See the latest demo of email address and the clipboard.

    http://video.google.ca/videoplay?docid=8002756326845671406

    The scrolling text fix from today is shown later in the video when I enter
    context display. That latest executable search.exe is at:
    http://www.telusplanet.net/public/stonedan/search.exe

     

    Which yet again is another failure to respond to any of the challenges put forward, either respond to one of the challenges or piss off somewhere else, you cannot refuse all challenges and still claim superiority - the world outside of your head doesn't work that way.

     

    Also the quote

    @SpectateSwamp said:

    Desktop Search - Computing's EASY button

    should really be 'Desktop Search - Computing's DIFFICULT 3 input box prompts when sometimes you don't need the first one and all of them take commands even the author himself cannot remember' if we are being honest.

     



  • @spenk said:

    Also the quote

    @SpectateSwamp said:

    Desktop Search - Computing's EASY button

    should really be 'Desktop Search - Computing's DIFFICULT 3 input box prompts when sometimes you don't need the first one and all of them take commands even the author himself cannot remember' if we are being honest.

     

    Not to mention, have you noticed that every time he does a video the prompt boxes automagically are filled in from the start? He actually sets it up before the video this way...

    Probably as a result of us constantly flaming him about the ridiculous prompts.



  • @SpectateSwamp said:

    See the latest demo of email address and the clipboard.

    Wow.  I'm completely flabbergasted.  I cannot even try to explain to my dad what you did over there.  Mostly because he would think it is rediculous, seeing that looking up email addresses in his contacts in his email program works much quicker and easier.



  • SSDS is Fast fast

    @wooter said:

    @SpectateSwamp said:

    See the latest demo of email address and the clipboard.

    Wow.  I'm completely flabbergasted.  I cannot even try to explain to my dad what you did over there.  Mostly because he would think it is rediculous, seeing that looking up email addresses in his contacts in his email program works much quicker and easier.

    Quicker. I don't think so. I had to operate the camera with one hand and do the computer stuff with the other. Its enter alt/tab paste alt/tab enter alt/tab paste. Much quicker than on the video. I can go to the nextdoor neighbor and do it just as easily. You and your old dad's info doesn't move that easily. I am free to reload my OS anytime without losing my favorites or email contacts. My data is mine mine mine.

     



  • @SpectateSwamp said:

    @wooter said:

    @SpectateSwamp said:

    See the latest demo of email address and the clipboard.

    Wow.  I'm completely flabbergasted.  I cannot even try to explain to my dad what you did over there.  Mostly because he would think it is rediculous, seeing that looking up email addresses in his contacts in his email program works much quicker and easier.

    Quicker. I don't think so. I had to operate the camera with one hand and do the computer stuff with the other. Its enter alt/tab paste alt/tab enter alt/tab paste. Much quicker than on the video. I can go to the nextdoor neighbor and do it just as easily. You and your old dad's info doesn't move that easily. I am free to reload my OS anytime without losing my favorites or email contacts. My data is mine mine mine.

     

    Like I already said, it is as easy as typing the first one or two letters in any email client. Sorry, but that will always be quicker than SSDS.



  • @SpectateSwamp said:

    Its enter alt/tab paste alt/tab enter alt/tab paste

    It's typing the first two to three letters of a person's firstname, and enter to add a name in any good email program.

    @SpectateSwamp said:

    You and your old dad's info doesn't move that easily. I am free to reload my OS anytime without losing my favorites or email contacts. My data is mine mine mine.

    My contacts, email, tasks and notes are automatically synced between my two laptops and my smartphone.  One of my laptops stores this information even on a synced external USB drive.  I could reload both laptops' OSes and have my phone stolen, and still wouldn't need to grab an old backup on DVD.  My dad?  He just does a regular backup with the included backup program, which includes his Windows profile with all contacts, notes and files included.  Restoring that information is as simple as... restoring 😃



  • @SpectateSwamp said:

    Its enter alt/tab paste alt/tab enter alt/tab paste

    No, it isn't. YOU STILL HAVE TO TYPE THE NAME OF THE CONTACT, whether you're searching for it or using the email client directly, except with the email client that's ALL you have to do.

     

    EG: (With the email client open, no address entered)

    SSDS:

    1. Double-click search executable

    2. Type "Joe Bloggs" at prompt #1, then hit enter

    3. Type "p" at prompt #2, then hit enter

    4. Type "photo" at prompt #3 (or whatever it was I had to type), then hit enter

    5. Hit enter to progress through the search results until the right address is in the clipboard

    6. Select email client. Click on "to" field.

    7. Ctrl-V to paste email address into "to" field.

    8. Send

     

    Without SSDS:

    1. Select email client. Click on "to" field.

    2. Type "Joe Bloggs"

    3. Send

     

     

    Do you see? DO YOU SEE??? 

     

     

    Also, TELL US THE RULES FOR THE SHOWDOWN, FFS!!! 



  • @rc_pinchey said:

    Without SSDS:

    1. Select email client. Click on "to" field.

    2. Type "Joe Bloggs"

    3. Send

     

    I don't know about you, but I wouldn't have to type more than the first few letters...



  • Cam Studio will show who is quick.

    @MasterPlanSoftware said:

    Like I already said, it is as easy as typing the first one or two letters in any email client. Sorry, but that will always be quicker than SSDS.

    I don't even have to enter any part of their name. This list is a group of 7. I have a news release one that has 30 or so. I just mindlessly hit enter - alt/tab - paste - alt/tab - enter - Alt/tab - paste ----  Checking for names visually. Now that is slow. I may have to use CamStudio to demo this. Being camcorder guy and operator guy makes it slow.

    Your contacts data is stuck in some email client. 

    I keep all my passwords this way. No need to remember them or make them all the same. When you have SSDS.

     



  • @SpectateSwamp said:

    @MasterPlanSoftware said:

    Like I already said, it is as easy as typing the first one or two letters in any email client. Sorry, but that will always be quicker than SSDS.

    I don't even have to enter any part of their name. This list is a group of 7. I have a news release one that has 30 or so. I just mindlessly hit enter - alt/tab - paste - alt/tab - enter - Alt/tab - paste ----  Checking for names visually. Now that is slow. I may have to use CamStudio to demo this. Being camcorder guy and operator guy makes it slow.

    Your contacts data is stuck in some email client. 

    I keep all my passwords this way. No need to remember them or make them all the same. When you have SSDS.

     

    What you describe is NOT beneficial to anyone. You just have no clue how to use any program other than SSDS. The rest of us actually like to be functional, so we will continue using the correct methods.



  • @SpectateSwamp said:

    I keep all my passwords this way. No need to remember them or make them all the same. When you have SSDS.
     

    LMFAO you keep all your passwords in plaintext in a giant text file?

     

    Awesome.

    Maybe you should 'cript' them! HAHAHAHAAHHA Nothing but a dumb redneck.


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