Mongolia WTF



  • The State Department with great fanfare on Tuesday signed an agreement with landlocked Mongolia that will allow Mongolian ships to be boarded and searched if they are suspected of carrying weapons of mass destruction.

    This despite the fact that Mongolia -- home to the Gobi Desert, windswept steppes and largely populated by nomadic yak herders -- has no navy and lies thousands of miles from open waters.

     

    http://www.suntimes.com/news/nation/616835,CST-NWS-mong24.article



  • It's kind of like persuading countries with no interest in whaling to join the IWC and vote the way you want them to. There's probably a purpose to this.



  • My guess would be that this is simply a way to tell Iran, North Korea, etc    "Look, Mongolia lets us search THEIR ships... What are you hiding?"



  • If you were Iran or North Korea, wouldn't it be great to transport your contraband in one of a handful of ships sailing under the flag of a minor land-locked country?  Now that option is out.



  • @Pap said:

    The State Department with great fanfare on
    Tuesday signed an agreement with landlocked Mongolia that will allow
    Mongolian ships to be boarded and searched if they are suspected of
    carrying weapons of mass destruction.

    This despite the fact that
    Mongolia -- home to the Gobi Desert, windswept steppes and largely
    populated by nomadic yak herders -- has no navy and lies thousands of
    miles from open waters.

    http://www.suntimes.com/news/nation/616835,CST-NWS-mong24.article

    You
    can't grasp the concept of non-naval ships?  Or somebody owning a
    vehicle that they don't keep garaged right where they live?

    The real WTF is that you didn't bother to read just one more sentence:

     

    Still, its tiny merchant marine is recognized as one of 32 ''flag of convenience'' countries by international maritime authorities.

    Heh.  Actually the real WTF is that you did, and therefore knew perfectly well that this isn't a wtf, but deliberately spun the presentation of a misleading out-of-context quote to try and make it look like one.  FAIL.

     



  • @DaveK said:

    @Pap said:
    The State Department with great fanfare on
    Tuesday signed an agreement with landlocked Mongolia that will allow
    Mongolian ships to be boarded and searched if they are suspected of
    carrying weapons of mass destruction.

    This despite the fact that
    Mongolia -- home to the Gobi Desert, windswept steppes and largely
    populated by nomadic yak herders -- has no navy and lies thousands of
    miles from open waters.

    http://www.suntimes.com/news/nation/616835,CST-NWS-mong24.article

    You
    can't grasp the concept of non-naval ships?  Or somebody owning a
    vehicle that they don't keep garaged right where they live?

    The real WTF is that you didn't bother to read just one more sentence:

     

    Still, its tiny merchant marine is recognized as one of 32 ''flag of convenience'' countries by international maritime authorities.

    Heh.  Actually the real WTF is that you did, and therefore knew perfectly well that this isn't a wtf, but deliberately spun the presentation of a misleading out-of-context quote to try and make it look like one.  FAIL.

     

    I'm pretty sure TRWTF is that you're a huge killjoy.



  • The Real WTF(tm) is that Mongolia agreed to that. Would the US sign a similar agreement that allows the EU, Russia or China to board and search US ships if they are suspected of carrying weapons of mass destruction?
     (even if ships of the US armed forces are excluded from the agreement)



  • @ammoQ said:

    The Real WTF(tm) is that Mongolia agreed to that. Would the US sign a similar agreement that allows the EU, Russia or China to board and search US ships if they are suspected of carrying weapons of mass destruction?
     (even if ships of the US armed forces are excluded from the agreement)

    Pfft, what's Mongolia going to do?  Tear down our wall?



  • @vt_mruhlin said:

    @ammoQ said:

    The Real WTF(tm) is that Mongolia agreed to that. Would the US sign a similar agreement that allows the EU, Russia or China to board and search US ships if they are suspected of carrying weapons of mass destruction?
     (even if ships of the US armed forces are excluded from the agreement)

    Pfft, what's Mongolia going to do?  Tear down our wall?

    Haha, awesome response! Damn Mongolians tear down my shitty wall!



  • Do US citizens really think it is a good idea for the US to play world police?



  • @ammoQ said:

    Do US citizens really think it is a good idea for the US to play world police?

    Do US citizens really think? Ever? 



  • @ammoQ said:

    Do US citizens really think it is a good idea for the US to play world police?

    Would you rather trust the guys in blue helmets?
     



  • @asuffield said:

    @ammoQ said:

    Do US citizens really think it is a good idea for the US to play world police?

    Do US citizens really think? Ever? 

    A good portion of US citizens take offense at blanket statements like that, but not the ones you're referring to.



  • @asuffield said:

    @ammoQ said:

    Do US citizens really think it is a good idea for the US to play world police?

    Do US citizens really think? Ever? 

    I think you're a dolt.  Does that count? 



  • @djork said:

    @ammoQ said:

    Do US citizens really think it is a good idea for the US to play world police?

    Would you rather trust the guys in blue helmets?
     

    Actually, yes. 



  • @ammoQ said:

    Do US citizens really think it is a good idea for the US to play world police?

    Yes.  Every single one of us has the exact same opinion on everything and we think that we should be the world police. Now, go put on your lederhosen, ski out to pick some edelweiss and then get back to work at the bank.



  • @djork said:

    @ammoQ said:

    Do US citizens really think it is a good idea for the US to play world police?

    Would you rather trust the guys in blue helmets?
     

     

    Hmm, such a hard choice. Should I trust a peacekeeping force run by an organisation specifically set up to mediate between nations, or the armed forces of a single nation, outwardly warmongering and inflammatory, run by a drug abusing trust fund baby with an IQ lower than his shoe size?

    Decisions, decisions...



  • @drinkingbird said:

    @djork said:

    @ammoQ said:

    Do US citizens really think it is a good idea for the US to play world police?

    Would you rather trust the guys in blue helmets?
     

     

    Hmm, such a hard choice. Should I trust a peacekeeping force run by an organisation specifically set up to mediate between nations, or the armed forces of a single nation, outwardly warmongering and inflammatory, run by a drug abusing trust fund baby with an IQ lower than his shoe size?

    Decisions, decisions...

    Not even the US government can come close to the level of corruption in the UN.

    Another thing:

    The United States has really gotten a bad wrap on the internet.  Every internet forum I visit has tons of posts by people just like you, that make stupid claims just like yours.  The truth is, George Bush is actually a smart guy.  I have noticed a heightened level of US bashing in the last couple weeks here, and it's really kind of annoying.  Rarely do I see on a forum an American going around making blanket statements about Europeans or the people of another country.  However, the stereotype of the "stupid American" who doesn't know anything outside the United States is pretty common.  For one thing, most people on the planet don't know as much about foreign culture as they do their own culture.  Secondly, if the United States is so filled with knuckle dragging, Neanderthal-like morons, then why is our higher education system undeniably the best in the world?  How come that system and our society produces more Nobel prize winners (in science) than the rest of the world combined (note, a lot of them are not from the US originally, but came here because there was more opportunity here than anywhere else)?  If our culture is so shitty, then why does it attract more than twice as many tourism dollars than the next highest country (which is Spain BTW)?

    Another thing I hear a lot is the "lazy American."  Yet for some reason our GDP/capita is the 10th highest in the world.  That's quiet impressive considering our size, which makes us by far the largest economy in the world (as measured by GDP (and yes, I know that there are some problems with GDP, but it's a pretty good measurement non-the-less)).  The GDP of the United States is roughly equal to the GDP of the entire European Union, which has 66% more people.   

     

    Why did I write that tirade?  Because I wanted to let some of you know that some people in the United States are actually smart enough to read these forums, and to many of us, it is both annoying and pathetic that many people on internet forums bash the United States relentlessly.  In some ways it looks like jealousy (like a little brother jealous of his big brother), in other ways it looks like spiteful vitriol.  In both cases it is fairly ignorant since the average American is no more stupid, lazy or ignorant than the average citizen of any other country.
     



  • @tster said:

    The United States has really gotten a bad wrap on the internet.  Every internet forum I visit has tons of posts by people just like you, that make stupid claims just like yours.  The truth is, George Bush is actually a smart guy.  I have noticed a heightened level of US bashing in the last couple weeks here, and it's really kind of annoying.  Rarely do I see on a forum an American going around making blanket statements about Europeans or the people of another country.  However, the stereotype of the "stupid American" who doesn't know anything outside the United States is pretty common.  For one thing, most people on the planet don't know as much about foreign culture as they do their own culture.  Secondly, if the United States is so filled with knuckle dragging, Neanderthal-like morons, then why is our higher education system undeniably the best in the world?  How come that system and our society produces more Nobel prize winners (in science) than the rest of the world combined (note, a lot of them are not from the US originally, but came here because there was more opportunity here than anywhere else)?  If our culture is so shitty, then why does it attract more than twice as many tourism dollars than the next highest country (which is Spain BTW)?

    Another thing I hear a lot is the "lazy American."  Yet for some reason our GDP/capita is the 10th highest in the world.  That's quiet impressive considering our size, which makes us by far the largest economy in the world (as measured by GDP (and yes, I know that there are some problems with GDP, but it's a pretty good measurement non-the-less)).  The GDP of the United States is roughly equal to the GDP of the entire European Union, which has 66% more people.  
     

    Why did I write that tirade?  Because I wanted to let some of you know that some people in the United States are actually smart enough to read these forums, and to many of us, it is both annoying and pathetic that many people on internet forums bash the United States relentlessly.  In some ways it looks like jealousy (like a little brother jealous of his big brother), in other ways it looks like spiteful vitriol.  In both cases it is fairly ignorant since the average American is no more stupid, lazy or ignorant than the average citizen of any other country.
     

     

    Granted, much of the "bashing" the US currently faces is out of jealousy. On the other side, seeing how some (not all!) of the US politicians are preparing another war in the middle east, against Iran, makes some people - including me - nervous. The pointless agreement with Mongolia seems like a part of the game to me.



  • If you think this was a pointless political exercise, maybe you missed Congress recently arguing semantics about an event that happened almost 100 years ago.  I'm sure the few remaining Armenians from that time are very grateful that we've labeled it properly, but Turkey is kind of annoyed.



  • @djork said:

    @ammoQ said:

    Do US citizens really think it is a good idea for the US to play world police?

    Would you rather trust the guys in blue helmets?
     

    [url=http://www.transnational.org/Resources_Treasures/2007/Oberg_SecondUN.html]Yes.[/url]



  •  

    Rarely do I see on a forum an American going around making blanket statements about Europeans or the people of another country.

    We had one here just a few weeks ago.

    Secondly, if the United States is so filled with knuckle dragging, Neanderthal-like morons, then why is our higher education system undeniably the best in the world?

    Consider it denied. That's so subjective that it doesn't even resemble data. Besides, most of the US population never enters the higher education system.


    How come that system and our society produces more Nobel prize winners (in science) than the rest of the world combined (note, a lot of them are not from the US originally, but came here because there was more opportunity here than anywhere else)?  If our culture is so shitty, then why does it attract more than twice as many tourism dollars than the next highest country (which is Spain BTW)?

    Size. Divide those numbers by population to get more meaningful figures.

    Why did I write that tirade?  Because I wanted to let some of you know that some people in the United States are actually smart enough to read these forums, and to many of us, it is both annoying and pathetic that many people on internet forums bash the United States relentlessly.

    Well, to many of the rest of us, it is both annoying and pathetic that the US uses political leverage to spread its own corruption around the rest of the world. Until you round up all your lobbyists and have them shot, expect more bashing.

    When you're the guy in the neighbourhood who plays loud music and sets off fireworks at 3am, you should not expect to be popular.



  • @Cap'n Steve said:

    If you think this was a pointless political exercise, maybe you missed Congress recently arguing semantics about an event that happened almost 100 years ago. I'm sure the few remaining Armenians from that time are very grateful that we've labeled it properly, but Turkey is kind of annoyed.

    I'm pleasantly surprised that the Congress was courageous enough to do that even though Turkey is an important strategic partner and the Armenians probably are not. That said, I fail to see the connection between that and the Mongolian agreement...?



  • @tster said:

    The truth is, George Bush is actually a smart guy.

    He doesn't act smart, his image is that of a stupid texan. And that not just the internet, if you watch his speeches he makes quite a lot of pronunciation mistakes  and comes over as a stupid guy. Now he might be real smart and does al that on purpose because the majority of american voters thinks that makes him more human or something, however to me it just makes him look stupid.

    However, the stereotype of the "stupid American" who doesn't know anything outside the United States is pretty common.
     

    Seeing americans on the internet saying stupid things is also pretty common, perhapses there's some kind of connection. 

    For one thing, most people on the planet don't know as much about foreign culture as they do their own culture.

    Of course, but seeing american's who swear by god that macaroni is a american dish doesn't really score many points. 

    then why is our higher education system undeniably the best in the world?

    Your universities might be ranked with the best, but your average education system sucks for as far as i know.




  • @tster said:

    Not even the US government can come close to the level of corruption in the UN.

    Corruption which is more often than not originating from the US representatives themselves, who don't mind using every tool possible to sway the UN decisions their way. 

    @tster said:


    Another thing:

    The United States has really gotten a bad wrap on the internet.

    Could it be that the US (as an entity relating to other similar entities in the world) deserves it? (no, it couldn't be, could it?)

    @tster said:

    Every internet forum I visit has tons of posts by people just like you, that make stupid claims just like yours.  The truth is, George Bush is actually a smart guy.

     

    Well, he got me there then. His impersonation of a complete moron incapable of a single meaningful sentence without a horde of advisers helping him is pretty good I must say.

    @tster said:

    I have noticed a heightened level of US bashing in the last couple weeks here, and it's really kind of annoying.  Rarely do I see on a forum an American going around making blanket statements about Europeans or the people of another country.

    Some people seem to have quite a selective vision it would seem. When I read people uttering blanket statements about people of other countries, they are usually Americans. Europeans usually add disclaimers or make it clear they are talking about specific groups (like the US government itself). YMMV. 

    @tster said:


    However, the stereotype of the "stupid American" who doesn't know anything outside the United States is pretty common.

    In my experience, this view is also held by most Americans who do have a clue about what's happening outside the US. I'd expect they know what they are talking about.

    @tster said:

    For one thing, most people on the planet don't know as much about foreign culture as they do their own culture.  Secondly, if the United States is so filled with knuckle dragging, Neanderthal-like morons, then why is our higher education system undeniably the best in the world?

    "Undeniable"? Your higher education system is far from the best in the world. And even if it was, it's so difficult of access for people without rich parents that it would still be irrelevant.

    @tster said:


    How come that system and our society produces more Nobel prize winners (in science) than the rest of the world combined (note, a lot of them are not from the US originally, but came here because there was more opportunity here than anywhere else)?

    somebody else already replied to that, so I have nothing to add here, except that the only reason highly educated people still move to the USA is the aggressive immigration policy the US use for those people. When you're promised complete freedom of work, gargantuan budgets, and salaries to go with them, you usually don't think twice. Also, those are people who are already successful in their original country, and would probably have received a Nobel Prize anyway, wherever they went.

    @tster said:


    If our culture is so shitty, then why does it attract more than twice as many tourism dollars than the next highest country (which is Spain BTW)?

    It's easy to go to, it does have nice landscapes and varied climates, it's slightly less dangerous than a lot of other holiday destinations, and it's big. It doesn't have anything to do with how great the country is.

    @tster said:


    Another thing I hear a lot is the "lazy American."  Yet for some reason our GDP/capita is the 10th highest in the world.  That's quiet impressive considering our size, which makes us by far the largest economy in the world (as measured by GDP (and yes, I know that there are some problems with GDP, but it's a pretty good measurement non-the-less)).  The GDP of the United States is roughly equal to the GDP of the entire European Union, which has 66% more people.   

    Except that the repartition of wealth is so skewed in the USA that it looks like a 3rd world country in that respect, and that the US economy drives on only thanks to all its debts to the rest of the world.

    @tster said:


    Why did I write that tirade?  Because I wanted to let some of you know that some people in the United States are actually smart enough to read these forums, and to many of us, it is both annoying and pathetic that many people on internet forums bash the United States relentlessly.  In some ways it looks like jealousy (like a little brother jealous of his big brother), in other ways it looks like spiteful vitriol.  In both cases it is fairly ignorant since the average American is no more stupid, lazy or ignorant than the average citizen of any other country.

    Oh, I'm pretty sure that the "average" (whatever that means) American is a nice, decent, relatively well-educated person (so is the "average" Moslim, by the way, unlike what the media of the world and especially the American media would like us to believe). The thing is, that decent American is nowhere to be seen outside of the USA, has absolutely no political power (no, your leaders are not nice, decent people, not by any stretch of the word), and is never heard anywhere. The American people we hear are mostly religious bigots, heartless neocons, violent rednecks or moronic puppets. They may be a minority, but they are a vocal minority, and they get to set the course of the US policy. They are the ones giving your country a bad name. So take care of them first, or be prepared for the US image in the world to get even worse with time.



  • 1.  mispronouncing words does not make you stupid.

    2.  Assufeld, if you know of a better higher education system, would you be so kind as to enlighten us.  Out of the top 20 universities in the world, 17 are in America.  If there is another place that is even close, then why do so many people come flocking to the United States to attend college instead of these other places?

    3.  The US primary and secondary education isn't nearly as good as the higher education system, and there are tons of problems with it, but it is better than some people make it out to be.  I attended the public schools here in the states, and I don't consider myself a "mongolian" compared to my international coworkers.  Just because you don't have to learn advanced topics like calculus, bio-chemistry, computer science, etc.  doesn't mean that you can't.

     4.  Seeing Europeans on the internet make arrogant, pompous, blanket statements is pretty common.  But that doesn't mean that Europeans are arrogant.  With 300,000,000 people, there are bound to be lots of dumb people. 

    5.  I don't believe I've ever seen an American say that macaroni is an American dish.  The worste offense I've seen along these lines is probably all the people that think the hamburger was invented in the US.

     

    http://ed.sjtu.edu.cn/rank/2007/ARWU2007_Top100.htm (University rankings)



  • @tster said:

    1.  mispronouncing words does not make you stupid.

    But makes you look stupid - that's what stratos said in the post you replied to.

     


    5.  I don't believe I've ever seen an American say that macaroni is an American dish. 

    That doesn't mean there aren't any: http://www.davidaigner.com/blog/mac-cheese.html

    I don't care much about its origin or the various types one can find of this all-American dish.

     http://blog.littleredbikecafe.com/2007/06/excuses-excuses.html

    ...the quintessential American dish...





  • @Tsela said:

    @tster said:

    Not even the US government can come close to the level of corruption in the UN.

    Corruption which is more often than not originating from the US representatives themselves, who don't mind using every tool possible to sway the UN decisions their way. 

    Please look up the oil-for-food scandal (arguably
    the largest financial scandal in recent history).  The chief
    beneficiaries were France and Russia.  Koffi Annan is also not an
    American.

    @Tsela said:

    @tster said:


    Another thing:

    The United States has really gotten a bad wrap on the internet.

    Could it be that the US (as an entity relating to other similar entities in the world) deserves it? (no, it couldn't be, could it?)

    Please provide some kind of reasoning to your arguments in the future. If you have half a brain you will realize that simply stating something repeatedly does not make it true.

    @Tsela said:

    @tster said:

    Every internet forum I visit has tons of posts by people just like you, that make stupid claims just like yours.  The truth is, George Bush is actually a smart guy.

     

    Well, he got me there then. His impersonation of a complete moron incapable of a single meaningful sentence without a horde of advisers helping him is pretty good I must say.

    You're right.  He can't make a single sentence.  Next time, leave the hyperbole in the closet when you are trying to prove a serious point.

    @Tsela said:

    @tster said:

    I have noticed a heightened level of US bashing in the last couple weeks here, and it's really kind of annoying.  Rarely do I see on a forum an American going around making blanket statements about Europeans or the people of another country.

    Some people seem to have quite a selective vision it would seem. When I read people uttering blanket statements about people of other countries, they are usually Americans. Europeans usually add disclaimers or make it clear they are talking about specific groups (like the US government itself). YMMV. 

    I'm sorry...  Would you please point those posts out to me here on TDWTF.com?  Other than tunnelrat, who I've already pointed out is wrong in many ways, I don't know what your talking about. 

    @Tsela said:

    @tster said:


    However, the stereotype of the "stupid American" who doesn't know anything outside the United States is pretty common.

    In my experience, this view is also held by most Americans who do have a clue about what's happening outside the US. I'd expect they know what they are talking about.

    There is a large "hate the US" movement here in the US.  Also, A lot of people put down other people to make themselves look good.  You probably would have considered me one of the select few Americans who "has a clue" if I would have just posted something like, "yup, Americans' are truly the dumbest people in the world."

    @Tsela said:

    @tster said:

    For one thing, most people on the planet don't know as much about foreign culture as they do their own culture.  Secondly, if the United States is so filled with knuckle dragging, Neanderthal-like morons, then why is our higher education system undeniably the best in the world?

    "Undeniable"? Your higher education system is far from the best in the world. And even if it was, it's so difficult of access for people without rich parents that it would still be irrelevant.

    Sorry, once again, to make statements like this you need to have some kind of reasoning.  I provided mine, now it's your turn.  BTW, I attend one of the most expensive universities in the world (my college ranks 1st in average student debt load) and my parents are rich.  I worked my ass off and got a scholarship.  Then I worked my ass off during college and paid my own bills.  The best schools might be harder to attend for the lazy poor people, but even they can attend a pretty good state school and end up with perhaps $10,000 in debt after 4 years.

    @Tsela said:

    @tster said:


    How come that system and our society produces more Nobel prize winners (in science) than the rest of the world combined (note, a lot of them are not from the US originally, but came here because there was more opportunity here than anywhere else)?

    somebody else already replied to that, so I have nothing to add here, except that the only reason highly educated people still move to the USA is the aggressive immigration policy the US use for those people. When you're promised complete freedom of work, gargantuan budgets, and salaries to go with them, you usually don't think twice. Also, those are people who are already successful in their original country, and would probably have received a Nobel Prize anyway, wherever they went.

    You just proved my point.  My point was that our society and culture give them the kind of opportunity that they don't have anywhere else.  In fact, you quoted that part and then completely ignored what I was saying.

    @Tsela said:

    @tster said:


    If our culture is so shitty, then why does it attract more than twice as many tourism dollars than the next highest country (which is Spain BTW)?

    It's easy to go to, it does have nice landscapes and varied climates, it's slightly less dangerous than a lot of other holiday destinations, and it's big. It doesn't have anything to do with how great the country is.

    How is being safer not a major plus for our society?

    @Tsela said:

    @tster said:


    Another thing I hear a lot is the "lazy American."  Yet for some reason our GDP/capita is the 10th highest in the world.  That's quiet impressive considering our size, which makes us by far the largest economy in the world (as measured by GDP (and yes, I know that there are some problems with GDP, but it's a pretty good measurement non-the-less)).  The GDP of the United States is roughly equal to the GDP of the entire European Union, which has 66% more people.   

    Except that the repartition of wealth is so skewed in the USA that it looks like a 3rd world country in that respect, and that the US economy drives on only thanks to all its debts to the rest of the world.

    US External debt is the highest.  But not if you go in relation to it's GDP.  Also, before you go complaining about the United States owing other countries money, you might want to research the Marshall Plan and what happened after World War 2.


     



  • @PJH said:

    @tster said:

    1.  mispronouncing words does not make you stupid.

    But makes you look stupid - that's what stratos said in the post you replied to.

     


    5.  I don't believe I've ever seen an American say that macaroni is an American dish. 

    That doesn't mean there aren't any: http://www.davidaigner.com/blog/mac-cheese.html

    I don't care much about its origin or the various types one can find of this all-American dish.

     http://blog.littleredbikecafe.com/2007/06/excuses-excuses.html

    ...the quintessential American dish...



    all-American is a term that implies how much Americans like something and how it is among the best in it's class.  Like an All-American athlete. Or the All-American hamburger.



  • @tster said:

    2.  Assufeld, if you know of a better higher education system, would you be so kind as to enlighten us.  Out of the top 20 universities in the world, 17 are in America.  If there is another place that is even close, then why do so many people come flocking to the United States to attend college instead of these other places?

    I dispute that you have a meaningful method to determine which higher education system is "better", and furthermore that it is even possible to have such a thing. It is therefore rather silly to ask me to offer an alternative method or result.

    The methodology used to produce tables like the one you point to is about as meaningful as adding the date and subtracting the time of day. Most of the columns in that table are just measurements of the number of papers published - regardless of quality, size, or significance, and the rest are just measures of rate-limited prizes (such as the Nobel), which are naturally biased towards larger institutions with better marketing, and completely ignore the performance of everybody other than the top few people. Every university is comprised mainly of people who did not receive a Nobel prize - the few who did are not statistically significant as a measure of the whole institution.

    This particular table (the STJU ranking) is routinely panned by everybody except the universities who come top on it - it is highly biased towards science and technology, and the weightings of the various categories are essentially arbitrary and combined in a statistically meaningless fashion.

    "So many people" come "flocking" to the US because you have a lot of universities. We certainly get similar rates of overseas students here, and I expect most other wealthy nations are the same - we just don't have as many universities, and the ones we do have are physically smaller, because our population is smaller.



  • @tster said:

    @PJH said:
    @tster said:

    [snip]

    5.  I don't believe I've ever seen an American say that macaroni is an American dish. 

    That doesn't mean there aren't any: http://www.davidaigner.com/blog/mac-cheese.html

    I don't care much about its origin or the various types one can find of this all-American dish.

    [snip]

    all-American is a term that implies how much Americans like something and how it is among the best in it's class.  Like an All-American athlete. Or the All-American hamburger.

    That's one of the definitions, yes: http://m-w.com/dictionary/all-american . It's not clear from the context which definition David Aigner implies however.

    And as a non-american myself, it is not the one I would have chosen for that example (well, clearly I didn't; I quoted it in my last post.)




  • @PJH said:

    That's one of the definitions, yes: http://m-w.com/dictionary/all-american

    In my understanding, none of the defintions given in the link, as far as they can be applied to noodles, implies that said noodles were invented in the US.

    E.g. 2: All-American noodles - made of American flour, American eggs (if any) and American water. Seems plausible to me. 



  • @ammoQ said:

    American flour, American eggs and American water.

    ?



  • @ammoQ said:

    Do US citizens really think it is a good idea for the US to play world police?

    I for one don't.  I think that just about everything we've done since 2000 has been complete horseshit.   



  • @tster said:

    all-American is a term that implies how much Americans like something and how it is among the best in it's class.  Like an All-American athlete. Or the All-American hamburger.

    So you're saying that Americans consider themselves best by definition at everything?



  • @ammoQ said:

    I'm pleasantly surprised that the Congress was courageous enough to do that even though Turkey is an important strategic partner and the Armenians probably are not.

    I fail to see how it was remotely courageous, timely, or (pleasantly) surprising that they would spend their time passing resolutions about something that happened 90 years ago.



  • @sootzoo said:

    @ammoQ said:

    I'm pleasantly surprised that the Congress was courageous enough to do that even though Turkey is an important strategic partner and the Armenians probably are not.

    I fail to see how it was remotely courageous, timely, or (pleasantly) surprising that they would spend their time passing resolutions about something that happened 90 years ago.

    I also fail to see that.  It was a gigantic waste of time.  Besides, the people that they were talking about are all dead and gone.  Furthermore, do you really think that what they did has anything to do with an honest hatred of oppression or genocide?  There are cases in the world right now that they could focus on and actually make a positive difference in the lives of thousands of people.  But those cases won't further their political motives. 



  • @dhromed said:

    @ammoQ said:

    American flour, American eggs and American water.

    ?

     

    Definition 2: composed wholly of American elements



  • @iwpg said:

    @tster said:

    all-American is a term that implies how much Americans like something and how it is among the best in it's class.  Like an All-American athlete. Or the All-American hamburger.

    So you're saying that Americans consider themselves best by definition at everything?

    Oh, the term is just a bit of nationalism. Nothing to bunch up yer panties about, I think.



  • @ammoQ said:

    @dhromed said:

    @ammoQ said:

    American flour, American eggs and American water.

    ?

     

    Definition 2: composed wholly of American elements

    As opposed to "flour", "eggs" and "water"?

    It's a completely void expression, is what I'm saying -- unless the object consists of components that are truly only found within US national borders.

    Nationalism is a bit of a peeve of mine, in the sense that I don't care.

     



  • American flour = flour from America

    American eggs = eggs from America

    American water = water from America

     

    What's the problem? 



  • @tster said:

    American flour = flour from America

    American eggs = eggs from America

    American water = water from America

    What's the problem? 

    The/my problem is the fact that, unless the term "all-American" has some patriotic meaning, it's entirely meaningless, null, void, empty, bankrupt. You can call some instance of pumpkin pie an "all-American" pumkin pie, but... for heaven's sake, why? Why not call it "pumpkin pie"?

    If you call that "dhromed's problem", instead of "humanity's problem", then I'd be okay with that. I still feel it's part of humanity's obsession with bullshit.



  • @dhromed said:

    @ammoQ said:
    @dhromed said:

    @ammoQ said:

    American flour, American eggs and American water.

    ?

     

    Definition 2: composed wholly of American elements

    As opposed to "flour", "eggs" and "water"?

    It's a completely void expression, is what I'm saying -- unless the object consists of components that are truly only found within US national borders.

    Nationalism is a bit of a peeve of mine, in the sense that I don't care.

     

    As opposed to "Chinese flour", "Mexican eggs" and "American water". 



  • I think that what make some recipes hard to follow. I mean how the hell am i going to get mexican eggs?



  • @stratos said:

    I think that what make some recipes hard to follow. I mean how the hell am i going to get mexican eggs?

    Go to Mexico, find a hen, wait. Can't be that difficult. 



  • @dhromed said:

    As opposed to "flour", "eggs" and "water"?

    It's a completely void expression, is what I'm saying -- unless the object consists of components that are truly only found within US national borders.

    Nationalism is a bit of a peeve of mine, in the sense that I don't care.

     

    I also don't understand patriotism, however it is certainly useful to know where the flour, eggs and water came from (though I doubt that 'all-American' would really be used for this purpose.) It's generally better for the environment to use locally-grown products rather than wasting fuel transporting water from Evian, eggs from Sicily and flour from Australia to make noodles in the USA. In fact usually the foods which countries and regions are most identified with came to be simply because (originally) they were made of whatever grew well in the area, so in a sense this does merit the patriotism-tinged term 'all-American' in some cases.





  • @ammoQ said:

    @Cap'n Steve said:

    If you think this was a pointless political exercise, maybe you missed Congress recently arguing semantics about an event that happened almost 100 years ago. I'm sure the few remaining Armenians from that time are very grateful that we've labeled it properly, but Turkey is kind of annoyed.

    I'm pleasantly surprised that the Congress was courageous enough to do that even though Turkey is an important strategic partner and the Armenians probably are not. That said, I fail to see the connection between that and the Mongolian agreement...?



    You really can't see a similarity?  How about the fact that they're both pointless political posturing with no real effect on anything?  One generates some publicity for Mongolia, the other pisses off an ally, but makes a few people feel slightly better about an event that happened when they were a child.



  • @dhromed said:

    @ammoQ said:

    American flour, American eggs and American water.

    ?

    They're what Americans hatch out of, of course!

     



  • @PJH said:

    ...the quintessential American dish...



    Apple pie I thought? 


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