Programming Certifications



  • Because government...I need to have a programming certification, soon, or risk losing my job.

    I might be able to find my old Java 2 certification from 2000, it might count.

    As a backup plan, as web programmer what certification would take the least amount of time to achieve?

    I was looking at the Microsoft Intro to C# exam and that just looks too broad. I can't even find anything on current ColdFusion certs.

    Maybe the Microsoft JavaScript/HTML5/CSS or Microsoft Querying Microsoft SQL Server 2012?



  • @karla said in Programming Certifications:

    Because government...I need to have a programming certification, soon, or risk losing my job.

    If they have a requirement, they must have a list of certifications that meet the requirement, yes? Or is that too sane for government thinking?

    Here's an article that compares a few of them and how often they show up on job boards: http://www.tomsitpro.com/articles/web-certifications,2-423.html

    Unless you're doing Google Analytics, it looks like the best bet based on that article is the MCSD. IIRC that's the kind of generic Microsoft "app developer" one. Yeah, here it is: https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/learning/mcsd-app-builder-certification.aspx

    May not be 100% relevant to you, but could help in the future.



  • @blakeyrat said in Programming Certifications:

    @karla said in Programming Certifications:

    Because government...I need to have a programming certification, soon, or risk losing my job.

    If they have a requirement, they must have a list of certifications that meet the requirement, yes? Or is that too sane for government thinking?

    Exactly my thought. What's the point of a Java 2 certification if the job is going to entail something else?

    Then again, I could totally see certain branches of government still working on Java 2.

    If you're a web programmer, I'd go with the Microsoft JavaScript/HTML5/CSS certificate. In my cursory research, it looks like you can just take an exam to be certified, so if you already know that stuff, it'd probably be the easiest way to not just get certified, but certified in something current and relevant.



  • @blakeyrat said in Programming Certifications:

    @karla said in Programming Certifications:

    Because government...I need to have a programming certification, soon, or risk losing my job.

    If they have a requirement, they must have a list of certifications that meet the requirement, yes? Or is that too sane for government thinking?

    Probably.

    Here's an article that compares a few of them and how often they show up on job boards: http://www.tomsitpro.com/articles/web-certifications,2-423.html

    Unless you're doing Google Analytics, it looks like the best bet based on that article is the MCSD. IIRC that's the kind of generic Microsoft "app developer" one. Yeah, here it is: https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/learning/mcsd-app-builder-certification.aspx

    May not be 100% relevant to you, but could help in the future.

    I'm just looking for what I can pass quickly.



  • @the_quiet_one said in Programming Certifications:

    @blakeyrat said in Programming Certifications:

    @karla said in Programming Certifications:

    Because government...I need to have a programming certification, soon, or risk losing my job.

    If they have a requirement, they must have a list of certifications that meet the requirement, yes? Or is that too sane for government thinking?

    Exactly my thought. What's the point of a Java 2 certification if the job is going to entail something else?

    The point is the certification.

    Then again, I could totally see certain branches of government still working on Java 2.

    No one here is working on Java 2 but it was just something I did actually pass.

    If you're a web programmer, I'd go with the Microsoft JavaScript/HTML5/CSS certificate. In my cursory research, it looks like you can just take an exam to be certified, so if you already know that stuff, it'd probably be the easiest way to not just get certified, but certified in something current and relevant.

    Yeah, that was where I was leaning just looking for something I may have missed.



  • I am all for improving the professional standards of the IT industry, but this sounds like a "we've got to do something but we don't know anything, and this would make it look like we are making progress even if it isn't, so this is now policy and damn the torpedoes" sort of rule. The lack of any specific guidelines about which certifications would qualify, and which ones are required for which jobs, is a pretty telling indicator of this.

    Especially since anyone who knows anything about IT could tell you that most of the existing certifications are worth about as much as a handful of wet sand (which is already an improvement over the 'bucket of warm piss' they were worth eighteen years ago, when your couldn't throw a rock on Market Street without hitting an MCSE).

    What, if any, lead time do you have on this? Is this measure 'implement ASAP', and if so, what rules (again, if any) do they have for retention of staff?

    Conversely, is elimination of staff the real goal here, and the certification requirement just an excuse clause? If so, you're SOL, because they will almost certainly refuse to give you enough time, for Excellent Raisins. Especially if they've already lined up an expensive contract with a consulting firm who just happen to have a large number of employees who just happen to be pre-vetted to fit the new criteria. In such a case, you might find it more productive to spend your remaining time peering under rocks in the hope of finding a buried skeleton or two, because I'm pretty sure that wouldn't be on the up and up.



  • @blakeyrat said in Programming Certifications:

    If they have a requirement, they must have a list of certifications that meet the requirement, yes? Or is that too sane for government thinking?

    :laughing:



  • @anotherusername Is there a list of valid certificate givers? Requirements for creating certificates? Can "Karla's Centre For Programmers Who Can’t Program Good And Who Wanna Learn To Do Other Stuff Good Too" give out programming certificates?



  • @kian doubtful, but it'll need to be something that the pencil pushers in HR are willing to buy in on.



  • @scholrlea said in Programming Certifications:

    I am all for improving the professional standards of the IT industry, but this sounds like a "we've got to do something but we don't know anything, and this would make it look like we are making progress even if it isn't, so this is now policy and damn the torpedoes" sort of rule.

    The issue is I don't have a Civil Service Title, so I am what is called a provisional employee.

    Management is trying to get everyone to have a Civil Service Title because overall the government wants to phase out provisional employees. This has been technically happening for over 5 years.

    This is not specific to IT.

    We had a round of Civil Service Exams but I was disqualified because I didn't spell out my experience in the exact manner the non-tech graders expected. (There is actually a lawsuit going on about this because basically everyone who completed it was disqualified.)

    The external IT cert is to provide possible protection until I can re-take the Civil Service (which won't be available until May 2018).

    The lack of any specific guidelines about which certifications would qualify, and which ones are required for which jobs, is a pretty telling indicator of this.

    Especially since anyone who knows anything about IT could tell you that most of the existing certifications are worth about as much as a handful of wet sand (which is already an improvement over the 'bucket of warm piss' they were worth eighteen years ago, when your couldn't throw a rock on Market Street without hitting an MCSE).

    For the sake of government bureaucracy this is irrelevant.

    What, if any, lead time do you have on this? Is this measure 'implement ASAP', and if so, what rules (again, if any) do they have for retention of staff?

    ASAP but government moves slow.

    Provisional will be let go before someone with a civil service title. A title guarantees you a job if there are cuts.

    Conversely, is elimination of staff the real goal here, and the certification requirement just an excuse clause?

    No. Eliminating staff is very difficult in government. and would only occur if there were major budget crisis in the government.



  • @anotherusername Getting buy in from HR should be easy. This is supposedly a company* that employs programmers and like every company most likely claims they are interested in the continuing professional development of their developers. So they can claim to have internal certifications they give to their developers for completing internal courses in different technologies or processes. Makes them look good and costs nothing. They could even actually implement the idea. You get something new to add in your recruitment adverts too.

    *Reading further, looks like she works FOR government. I misunderstood the problem, figuring she worked for a company contracted by government.



  • @karla
    Make one up. Seriously.
    If there is a contractor or someone who you know with a IT related company ask them to provide a training 'product' whereby you get a certification that is made up too look professional, but worded in a way that doesn't let people know the content of the training.

    I am sure someone here could do it.



  • Here you go, you need to be a certified internet engineer:

    Can You Spell "TCP/IP"?
    Can you tell a packet from a turnip?
    Do you think IPX is a Sun Computer?
    Why isn't "Cisco" is a town in the Sierra Nevada?
    Do you use a router to move packets or to cut grooves in wood?
    
    
    If you answered yes to these questions, YOU may have the makings of CERTIFIED INTERNET ENGINEER!
    
    Do you want to impress "the suits"?
    Want to use our cool logo?
    
    Then YOU should be a CERTIFIED INTERNET ENGINEER!
    

    As discussed here:
    https://what.thedailywtf.com/topic/7336/certified-internet-engineer/23



  • @helix said in Programming Certifications:

    @karla
    Make one up. Seriously.
    If there is a contractor or someone who you know with a IT related company ask them to provide a training 'product' whereby you get a certification that is made up too look professional, but worded in a way that doesn't let people know the content of the training.

    I am sure someone here could do it.

    I'm not really comfortable with the ethics of that.



  • @helix said in Programming Certifications:

    Here you go, you need to be a certified internet engineer:

    Can You Spell "TCP/IP"?
    Can you tell a packet from a turnip?
    Do you think IPX is a Sun Computer?
    Why isn't "Cisco" is a town in the Sierra Nevada?
    Do you use a router to move packets or to cut grooves in wood?
    
    
    If you answered yes to these questions, YOU may have the makings of CERTIFIED INTERNET ENGINEER!
    
    Do you want to impress "the suits"?
    Want to use our cool logo?
    
    Then YOU should be a CERTIFIED INTERNET ENGINEER!
    

    As discussed here:
    https://what.thedailywtf.com/topic/7336/certified-internet-engineer/23

    That thread didn't help much as the domain has been taken over.



  • @helix said in Programming Certifications:

    Here you go, you need to be a certified internet engineer:

    Can You Spell "TCP/IP"?
    Can you tell a packet from a turnip?
    Do you think IPX is a Sun Computer?
    Why isn't "Cisco" is a town in the Sierra Nevada?
    Do you use a router to move packets or to cut grooves in wood?
    
    
    If you answered yes to these questions, YOU may have the makings of CERTIFIED INTERNET ENGINEER!
    
    Do you want to impress "the suits"?
    Want to use our cool logo?
    
    Then YOU should be a CERTIFIED INTERNET ENGINEER!
    

    As discussed here:
    https://what.thedailywtf.com/topic/7336/certified-internet-engineer/23

    There's a question missing from the first half

    How many syllables are there in the word coax?


  • @karla said in Programming Certifications:

    @scholrlea said in Programming Certifications:

    Conversely, is elimination of staff the real goal here, and the certification requirement just an excuse clause?

    No. Eliminating staff is very difficult in government. and would only occur if there were major budget crisis in the government.

    I hear certain sectors in government have had their budgets slashed by a certain orangy fellow.

    @kian said in Programming Certifications:

    Is there a list of valid certificate givers? Requirements for creating certificates? Can "Karla's Centre For Programmers Who Can’t Program Good And Who Wanna Learn To Do Other Stuff Good Too" give out programming certificates?

    Just make sure they can fit in the building.



  • @pjh said in Programming Certifications:

    How many syllables are there in the word coax?

    Yes.


    Filed under: am I an engineer now



  • @the_quiet_one said in Programming Certifications:

    @karla said in Programming Certifications:

    @scholrlea said in Programming Certifications:

    Conversely, is elimination of staff the real goal here, and the certification requirement just an excuse clause?

    No. Eliminating staff is very difficult in government. and would only occur if there were major budget crisis in the government.

    I hear certain sectors in government have had their budgets slashed by a certain orangy fellow.

    We've experienced no discernible effect. Our IT department is about the same size as last year and we are significantly larger than we were 4 years ago.

    Also wasted 2 years and lots of money on HPCs to deliver software that we are effectively rewriting.



  • @karla said in Programming Certifications:

    Also wasted 2 years and lots of money on HPCs to deliver software that we are effectively rewriting.

    If only they had Java 2 certification.



  • @the_quiet_one said in Programming Certifications:

    I hear certain sectors in government have had their budgets slashed by a certain orangy fellow.

    I believe @Karla is in state government rather than federal. And my sector's gotten increases, so I'm not complaining. :D



  • @the_quiet_one said in Programming Certifications:

    @karla said in Programming Certifications:

    Also wasted 2 years and lots of money on HPCs to deliver software that we are effectively rewriting.

    If only they had Java 2 certification.

    Microsoft Dynamics CRM



  • @heterodox said in Programming Certifications:

    @the_quiet_one said in Programming Certifications:

    I hear certain sectors in government have had their budgets slashed by a certain orangy fellow.

    I believe @Karla is in state government rather than federal. And my sector's gotten increases, so I'm not complaining. :D

    City government. But NYC government is probably as bigger than many state governments.



  • @karla said in Programming Certifications:

    @the_quiet_one said in Programming Certifications:

    @karla said in Programming Certifications:

    @scholrlea said in Programming Certifications:

    Conversely, is elimination of staff the real goal here, and the certification requirement just an excuse clause?

    No. Eliminating staff is very difficult in government. and would only occur if there were major budget crisis in the government.

    I hear certain sectors in government have had their budgets slashed by a certain orangy fellow.

    We've experienced no discernible effect. Our IT department is about the same size as last year and we are significantly larger than we were 4 years ago.

    Also wasted 2 years and lots of money on HPCs to deliver software that we are effectively rewriting.

    You don't work for MN DVS by chance do you? They released software to all the license stations that isn't complete. For instance, for a while they couldn't process new custom plates. They also deployed the new stuff in such a way that they can't roll back.



  • @mikehurley said in Programming Certifications:

    @karla said in Programming Certifications:

    @the_quiet_one said in Programming Certifications:

    @karla said in Programming Certifications:

    @scholrlea said in Programming Certifications:

    Conversely, is elimination of staff the real goal here, and the certification requirement just an excuse clause?

    No. Eliminating staff is very difficult in government. and would only occur if there were major budget crisis in the government.

    I hear certain sectors in government have had their budgets slashed by a certain orangy fellow.

    We've experienced no discernible effect. Our IT department is about the same size as last year and we are significantly larger than we were 4 years ago.

    Also wasted 2 years and lots of money on HPCs to deliver software that we are effectively rewriting.

    You don't work for MN DVS by chance do you? They released software to all the license stations that isn't complete. For instance, for a while they couldn't process new custom plates. They also deployed the new stuff in such a way that they can't roll back.

    And I just saw her comment at the bottom about working for a city.



  • @mikehurley said in Programming Certifications:

    @karla said in Programming Certifications:

    @the_quiet_one said in Programming Certifications:

    @karla said in Programming Certifications:

    @scholrlea said in Programming Certifications:

    Conversely, is elimination of staff the real goal here, and the certification requirement just an excuse clause?

    No. Eliminating staff is very difficult in government. and would only occur if there were major budget crisis in the government.

    I hear certain sectors in government have had their budgets slashed by a certain orangy fellow.

    We've experienced no discernible effect. Our IT department is about the same size as last year and we are significantly larger than we were 4 years ago.

    Also wasted 2 years and lots of money on HPCs to deliver software that we are effectively rewriting.

    You don't work for MN DVS by chance do you? They released software to all the license stations that isn't complete. For instance, for a while they couldn't process new custom plates. They also deployed the new stuff in such a way that they can't roll back.

    Yeah, our legacy app that we must still maintain because the HPC are at least a year behind schedule. In addition, they had to re-up a contract for another app that is maintained externally because they couldn't go live with what they had.

    We are also talking about Plan Bs for NEXT fiscal year, July 2018, knowing there is a possibility the new software won't be ready then.

    The person responsible for initiating this clusterfuck, left for another agency back in January.

    Please read up in my lounge thread.



  • @karla said in Programming Certifications:

    @helix said in Programming Certifications:

    Here you go, you need to be a certified internet engineer:

    Can You Spell "TCP/IP"?
    Can you tell a packet from a turnip?
    Do you think IPX is a Sun Computer?
    Why isn't "Cisco" is a town in the Sierra Nevada?
    Do you use a router to move packets or to cut grooves in wood?
    
    
    If you answered yes to these questions, YOU may have the makings of CERTIFIED INTERNET ENGINEER!
    
    Do you want to impress "the suits"?
    Want to use our cool logo?
    
    Then YOU should be a CERTIFIED INTERNET ENGINEER!
    

    As discussed here:
    https://what.thedailywtf.com/topic/7336/certified-internet-engineer/23

    That thread didn't help much as the domain has been taken over.

    Link at the top includes wayback:
    http://web.archive.org/web/20120302040114/http://www.cie.com/



  • @helix said in Programming Certifications:

    Why isn't "Cisco" is a town in the Sierra Nevada?

    Gibberish.



  • @karla Do you have a link? I don't see a lounge category.



  • @mikehurley said in Programming Certifications:

    @karla Do you have a link? I don't see a lounge category.

    Lounge is under Meta and is restricted.

    It requires membership to "trust_level_3" which is a holdover from Discourse.

    I'm not sure what the requirements are for membership.

    @mods ?



  • @karla said in Programming Certifications:

    I'm not sure what the requirements are for membership.
    @mods ?

    Well under Discourse they were software controlled and didn't require work on our behalf.

    Sadly, under NodeBB, it requires work. And you know how much we love work on here.

    The first bit of work involves said victim to manually apply for membership.

    Following that, some more work will involve contemplation by the moderators (past experience indicates that of only one of them is required) to determine acceptance.

    This last bit generally involves determining whether said member should have access. This bit normally involves common sense.

    In fact, with the possible exception of one outlier, it 'normally' works.

    I shall allow the peanut gallery to discuss the merits, or otherwise, of whether this works....



  • @pjh said in Programming Certifications:

    I shall allow the peanut gallery to discuss the merits, or otherwise, of whether this works....

    Over here before this thread gets derailed. Please.

    https://what.thedailywtf.com/topic/24027/lounge-certifications-was-re-programming-certifications


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