The New PC: Populist Correctness


  • Winner of the 2016 Presidential Election

    From the gender-neutral ashes of political correctness a new sort of PC culture has risen. You could call it populist correctness: a virulent policing of language and stifling of debate that is rapidly and perniciously insinuating itself into daily life in Trump’s America and Brexit Britain.

    Populist correctness is the smearing and silencing of points of view by labelling them “elitist” – and therefore at odds with the will of the people and the good of the country.

    As well as silencing opposing opinions by branding them elitist, populist correctness works to rebrand ideas, creating a new vocabulary for a new world order. The right prides itself on being straight-talking, on calling a spade a spade, but when it comes to calling a Nazi a Nazi or a racist a racist – well then, things are more vague. They are the “alt-right”, please. Use unacceptable terminology and they will get very angry indeed.

    From the vitriol the right heaps on “sensitive snowflakes”, you’d think they have skins as thick as elephants. Far from it: nobody is offended by quite such a wide range of banal things as conservatives. Everything from insufficiently Christmassy Starbucks coffee cups to Budweiser ads to Kermit the Frog’s lack of trousers seems to cause an outpouring of outrage. And, while jokes about minorities or women may be considered just banter, don’t even try joking about white people – that’s reverse-racism! Indeed, many triggered rightwingers recently deleted their Netflix accounts in protest against a new comedy show called Dear White People.

    Conservatives are impressively adept at belittling politically correct snowflakes one minute and flying into fits of ideological outrage the next. Snowflakes are to be mocked because they take things personally; their feelings are hurt. The outrage of populist correctness, however, is framed more as righteous indignation. It is not you who is offended. You are offended on behalf of the people. On behalf of your country. Your outrage is morally superior.

    (I will not be terribly surprised if this ends up in the garage.)


  • Discourse touched me in a no-no place

    @Dreikin said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    (I will not be terribly surprised if this ends up in the garage.)

    So why didn't you post this in the garage?


  • Winner of the 2016 Presidential Election

    @antiquarian said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    @Dreikin said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    (I will not be terribly surprised if this ends up in the garage.)

    So why didn't you post this in the garage?

    I wanted to see if a productive conversation could occur before it got :trolleybus::bomb:d.


  • Discourse touched me in a no-no place

    @Dreikin YMBNH



  • For all the ruckus the right brings up over the "special snowflakes" and "delicate flowers", they're really hardly much better. They're not harder to offend, or better at taking jokes - hell, if they were, I'd be draping myself in a Confederate flag and firing shotguns at the ceiling any time now.

    But no. Desensitized, maybe, but not harder to offend. The difference is that while the left's shtick is getting offended on behalf on other people, the right goes to the other extreme and doesn't care for anything that's not in their set of values. Joke about Hitler anytime you like, but don't you dare squeak about the glorious America.

    Is it better? I dunno - perhaps in some sense it is, since the left has a huge issue with being more offended than the actual groups and people the offences are targeted at. But the right trying to usurp the stoic superiority is a tad bit hypocritical as well.



  • And honestly, it's not really "the new" PC. It's just the same thing - everybody, left, right, and center, doesn't like it when someone talks smack about things they hold dear, and perceives other people doing the same about the things they don't as "whining".



  • Rightwing snowflakes are offended by everything from Kermit

    to holiday greetings

    Remind me, why was Trump's "Merry Christmas" such a big deal?

    Populist correctness is the smearing and silencing of points of view by labelling them “elitist” – and therefore at odds with the will of the people and the good of the country.

    Kinda like calling someone populist. Oh wait.

    @Dreikin said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    populist correctness works to rebrand ideas, creating a new vocabulary for a new world order.

    And phrases like "trigger warning", "cis-gendered" and "cultural appropriation" were used since the dawn of time.

    when it comes to calling a Nazi a Nazi or a racist a racist – well then, things are more vague.

    And it's not at all because liberals added the word "power" to the definition of "racism" and took away "socialism" from "national socialism".

    don’t even try joking about white people – that’s reverse-racism!

    A great example of language-bending by the left - first they created a new term to separate black-on-white racism from white-on-black racism, and then ridiculed this new thing as something that can't possibly exist - all within just two years!

    @Dreikin said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    Indeed, many triggered rightwingers recently deleted their Netflix accounts in protest against a new comedy show called Dear White People.

    And liberals have never called for boycott of any Trump-supporting business.

    @Dreikin said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    Conservatives are impressively adept at belittling politically correct snowflakes one minute and flying into fits of ideological outrage the next.

    Yes, yes they are. Just like all other people.

    @Dreikin said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    It is not you who is offended. You are offended on behalf of the people. On behalf of your country. Your outrage is morally superior.

    For a moment, I thought it's talking about all those white people who criticize other white people for wearing dreadlocks because it's offensive to unspecified someones. Then I remembered that people at The Guardian cannot possibly criticize themselves.



  • @Dreikin said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    Populist correctness is the smearing and silencing of points of view by labelling them “elitist” – and therefore at odds with the will of the people and the good of the country.

    One of the most common arguments I've heard for brexit is "the evil political elites don't want it so it must be good".



  • Also, I feel like this comic fits here, because I've basically seen it happen a few times:

    0_1487555144871_061.jpg



  • @anonymous234 said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    @Dreikin said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    Populist correctness is the smearing and silencing of points of view by labelling them “elitist” – and therefore at odds with the will of the people and the good of the country.

    One of the most common arguments I've heard for brexit is "the evil political elites don't want it so it must be good".

    It's not wrong...


  • Winner of the 2016 Presidential Election

    @Gąska said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    @anonymous234 said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    @Dreikin said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    Populist correctness is the smearing and silencing of points of view by labelling them “elitist” – and therefore at odds with the will of the people and the good of the country.

    One of the most common arguments I've heard for brexit is "the evil political elites don't want it so it must be good".

    It's not wrong...

    It's pretty much the definition of an ad hominem.



  • @Dreikin Or "cutting your nose to spite the face".

    Or "Hitler liked dogs, therefore dogs must be bad".


  • Winner of the 2016 Presidential Election

    @Gąska said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    It's not wrong...

    It's an incredibly stupid and weak argument. Especially since the "political elites" are often criticized for actions they only chose to take because, unlike the majority of the population, they are actually experienced politicians and know what the fuck they're doing. Not because they're trying to fuck over the voters, as is often assumed. Trump is currently - very slowly - learning that.



  • @anonymous234 said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    @Dreikin Or "cutting your nose to spite the face".

    Or "Hitler liked dogs, therefore dogs must be bad".

    Damnit, why did the godwinning of a thread about nazis have to be about liking dogs?


  • Impossible Mission Players - A

    @ben_lubar said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    @anonymous234 said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    @Dreikin Or "cutting your nose to spite the face".

    Or "Hitler liked dogs, therefore dogs must be bad".

    Damnit, why did the godwinning of a thread about nazis have to be about liking dogs?

    Not sure, most dogs like it when I lick them...



  • @Gąska said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    Yes, yes they are. Just like all other people.

    Except they pretend it's not the case. Between all the "autistic screeching" and "TRIGGERED" memes, the right is usurping the position of those stoic grown ups who obviously have better things to do than get offended about things, as opposed to the left's barbaric whining who will just scream at anything that threatens their view.

    And it's so not the case, as your "and you beat the blacks" post demonstrates pretty well.


  • mod

    @Gąska said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    it's offensive to unspecified someones

    psst... it's black people. Many black people are offended by white dreads. There are undoubtedly some who aren't, but acting like it's nebulous who is offended seems disingenuous at best. If you're confused about stuff this, why not do some research and find out what the big deal is?


  • area_deu

    @Yamikuronue
    Cultural Appropriation as a "problem" is an invention by American idiots.



  • @aliceif said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    @Yamikuronue
    Cultural Appropriation as a "problem" is an invention by American idiots.

    Some of it has some merit, though. Like the native American headdress thing - would you accept someone wearing a plastic and badly done Medal of Honor?

    Not sure whether it's worth raising much hassle about, but I guess I can see where they're coming from.


  • area_deu

    @Maciejasjmj said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    would you accept someone wearing a plastic and badly done Medal of Honor?

    Plastic sheriff stars are a common sight along with plastic headdresses.


    The thing that disturbs me is how almost nobody in Germany talks about those kinds of topics, while it seems to be very common in the USA.

    To me that makes it look very much like a "problem" invented in the USA.



  • @aliceif said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    To me that makes it look very much like a "problem" invented in the USA.

    Well, yes, cultural appropriation has probably been literally invented in the USA by some scholars, and the only reason we've heard about it is because the idea spread through the "Tumblr social justice" culture which happens to be mostly in the US.

    However, it's one of those things that wouldn't really be relevant anywhere if it wasn't for the disproportionate amount of people who vocally oppose it, like the Starbucks red cup fake-controversy. Yes, it's a shame that some yoga classes got suspended because idiots, but I suspect the number of people affected by incidents like that is around 0.001% of the population.


  • mod

    @aliceif Clearly your experience of having had your ancestors stolen from their culture, brought to a new country, given new names, forced to learn a new language, indoctrinated into a new religion, and then had their great-grandkids told "We let you go so it's all better now" trumps mine. To a lot of us, white dreads are a final "fuck you, even the little bit of your own culture you kept is mine now".



  • @aliceif said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    Plastic sheriff stars are a common sight along with plastic headdresses

    If you're wearing both, it's probably pretty silly.

    But either way, a sheriff badge isn't a badge of honor, it's just a job emblem. Headdress, not quite. Same reason as to why a stripper cop is fine, but a stripper WW2 veteran is kind of a bad idea.

    As for why it's a problem in America, it's because America has a huge track record of grabbing from others' cultural heritage and turning it into Coca-Cola ads.



  • @Tsaukpaetra said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    @ben_lubar said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    @anonymous234 said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    @Dreikin Or "cutting your nose to spite the face".

    Or "Hitler liked dogs, therefore dogs must be bad".

    Damnit, why did the godwinning of a thread about nazis have to be about liking dogs?

    Not sure, most dogs like it when I lick them...

    You might like this:


  • Winner of the 2016 Presidential Election

    @aliceif said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    The thing that disturbs me is how almost nobody in Germany talks about those kinds of topics, while it seems to be very common in the USA.

    Well, I sure find American pretzels disturbingly gross. I'd never scream "Cultural appropriation!!!", though.



  • @Yamikuronue said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    @aliceif Clearly your experience of having had your ancestors stolen from their culture, brought to a new country, given new names, forced to learn a new language, indoctrinated into a new religion, and then had their great-grandkids told "We let you go so it's all better now" trumps mine. To a lot of us, white dreads are a final "fuck you, even the little bit of your own culture you kept is mine now".

    Does it mean I should be pissed at German people drinking vodka?

    Cultures have been mixing between populations since the dawn of time. It's a natural process. Get over it.


  • Winner of the 2016 Presidential Election

    @Yamikuronue said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    Clearly your experience of having had your ancestors stolen from their culture, brought to a new country, given new names, forced to learn a new language, indoctrinated into a new religion, and then had their great-grandkids told "We let you go so it's all better now" trumps mine. To a lot of us, white dreads are a final "fuck you, even the little bit of your own culture you kept is mine now".

    I understand that for historical reasons, black people in the US are very sensitive in that regard. That's perfectly understandable.

    However, from a practical point of view, this debate is not helping anyone. If anything, it divides society even further by making the rules for acceptable behavior depend on race. In a multicultural society like the US, do you really want to enforce double standards for different ethnic groups? Especially since you're separating those ethnic groups in the process, which is the exact opposite of working towards a society in which race and origin are no longer important.


  • mod

    @asdf I'm not sure we want a society where race isn't important. Or rather, one of the things race stands for, which is to say, cultural differences, should absolutely continue to exist and be valued. I like the analogy that the US is less a melting pot and more a salad. Forced cultural assimilation is bad, while mingling and cultural borrowing is good. But until we stop the former, the latter's going to be done under false pretenses.


  • Winner of the 2016 Presidential Election

    @Yamikuronue said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    Or rather, one of the things race stands for, which is to say, cultural differences

    ^ I disagree with this statement. Equating culture and race is definitely wrong, and frankly, inappropriate. You're doing the exact thing here you're criticizing, namely:

    @Yamikuronue said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    Forced cultural assimilation

    Which I agree is not entirely unproblematic, but if you want to revive what you perceive as the original "black culture", you're essentially trying to reverse history here, which has never been and will never be a good idea. Especially since you're forcing your interpretation of history on the whole group in the process.

    Please excuse the comparison, but what's the qualitative difference to a revisionist nationalist movement here?


  • mod

    @asdf Wait what? I'm saying that one of the things that race has become a stand-in for is culture; latinos, for example, bring some culture with them when they cross the border, which is not a function of their skin tone but instead of their country of origin. Ditto for inner-city black culture, which is different than southern black culture which is entirely different from Nigerian culture. And that's a good thing, and cultural differences bring new and exciting perspectives that I don't want to see erased in the name of "colorblindness".

    I'm in no way advocating that we try to turn time back and revive some African culture that no longer applies to modern US citizens, but I am saying that black people were forbidden from having a culture for a long time, and when they developed a new culture, it tends to be first demonized (see: jazz music being the devil's music, and rap music being held up as misogynist while country music almost never is) and then later adopted wholesale once white people start doing it (and thus blessing it as "mainstream")

    I feel like it's difficult to have 200-level conversations around here because so many people jump in without doing the basic 101-level reading :/ I didn't and don't want to get sucked into the explanation of what cultural appropriation even is all day.


  • Winner of the 2016 Presidential Election

    @Yamikuronue said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    I'm in no way advocating that we try to turn time back and revive some African culture that no longer applies to modern US citizens

    OK, I'm glad we're on the same page, then.

    but I am saying that black people were forbidden from having a culture for a long time, and when they developed a new culture, it has been demonized ever since (see: jazz music being the devil's music, and rap music being held up as misogynist while country music almost never is).

    It's okay if you want to form a subculture, but I don't think it's okay to determine who's allowed to be part of that subculture depending on race. Furthermore, how do you think the rest of the society should react to that subculture? Subcultures are always either adopted or demonized.

    @Yamikuronue said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    I feel like it's difficult to have 200-level conversations around here because so many people jump in without doing the basic 101-level reading

    Well, you can imagine how one might misunderstand the following statement:

    @Yamikuronue said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    Or rather, one of the things race stands for, which is to say, cultural differences

    Without your clarification, don't you?


  • mod

    @asdf I mean, clearly someone can misunderstand it because you did. I'm not sure how you got from there to African Nationalism, but I'm not too bothered by it.

    I'm also not at all sure that white dreads are usually worn by people who are immersed in black subcultures but happen to be white. Usually I see them in an entirely different subculture, one that basically mixes and matches various pieces from other ethnicities (kombucha, kimchee, dreadlocks, yoga) and claims to be more "spiritually enlightened" than the people they took the practices from, while doing nothing to help them with the racism they face. Which feels insulting.



  • @Yamikuronue said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    I'm in no way advocating that we try to turn time back and revive some African culture that no longer applies to modern US citizens, but I am saying that black people were forbidden from having a culture for a long time, and when they developed a new culture, it tends to be first demonized (see: jazz music being the devil's music, and rap music being held up as misogynist while country music almost never is) and then later adopted wholesale once white people start doing it (and thus blessing it as "mainstream")

    Yeah, but that happens to pretty much every $new_thing. Additional examples: listening to electronic music meant that you were a druggie. Metal => you were some sort of social misfit. Computer games were demonized for a long time. But all of these are (to some degree) mainstream now, and thus OK.


  • mod

    @cvi Yeah, but when computer games became cool, they became cool for everyone. Dreads and rap still aren't okay for black people, even as white people are praised for them. Here, have a link, I'm talking mostly about items 2, 3, and 8 on that list. The list which, by the way, shows up on the first page of google for "why is cultural appropriation harmful", so it's not exactly hard to find.


  • Winner of the 2016 Presidential Election

    @Yamikuronue said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    I'm not sure how you got from there to African Nationalism, but I'm not too bothered by it.

    I was simply making a comparison to other types of revisionist movements that justify themselves via historical injustices. You might have misunderstood my reply as well: I wasn't saying "black culture = nationalism".

    I'm also not at all sure that white dreads are usually worn by people who are immersed in black subcultures but happen to be white.

    OK, granted.

    Usually I see them in an entirely different subculture, one that basically mixes and matches various pieces from other ethnicities (kombucha, kimchee, dreadlocks, yoga) and claims to be more "spiritually enlightened" than the people they took the practices from, while doing nothing to help them with the racism they face. Which feels insulting.

    Those people are annoying. I'm also annoyed by Americans of German heritage who celebrate heritage festivals that have absolutely nothing to do with German culture, but are simply commercial events which are supposed to make people feel special because of a heritage they don't even remember. That doesn't mean I find it disgusting on a moral level.

    Yeah, but when computer games became cool, they became cool for everyone. Dreads and rap still aren't okay for black people, even as white people are praised for them.

    And now we're getting to the actual point: Adaption and imitation of culture by itself is not the problem, racism, prejudices and double standards are. You're not doing yourselves a favor by shifting focus away from the actual issues.



  • @Yamikuronue said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    I'm also not at all sure that white dreads are usually worn by people who are immersed in black subcultures but happen to be white. Usually I see them in an entirely different subculture, one that basically mixes and matches various pieces from other ethnicities (kombucha, kimchee, dreadlocks, yoga) and claims to be more "spiritually enlightened" than the people they took the practices from, while doing nothing to help them with the racism they face. Which feels insulting.

    Uh... you do realize dreadlocks aren't exactly something only black people came up with, and people of African descent/ethnicity aren't the only ones for whom it's a part of culture?

    And you realize that what dreadlocks stand for in modern white culture aligns decently well with the community that brought them into the mainstream - namely the Rastafari? Who by my count have any and all right to wear them? And furthermore, dreadlocks are not a mark of honor, and are not used outside of their context (which is pretty much "common hairstyle for all people" in most parts of Africa)?

    Out of all the things you could hold pride about and defend, dreadlocks aren't really that great an idea.

    @Yamikuronue said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    I'm talking mostly about items 2, 3, and 8 on that list.

    As a Black woman, there are many jobs that would bar me if I wore cornrows, dreadlocks, or an afro – some of the most natural ways to keep up my hair.
    So for me, wearing my hair naturally is a meaningful declaration that I believe in my natural beauty. It’s risky to make this declaration in a society that says I must aspire to whiteness have value.
    Compare that to fashion magazines’ reception of white teenager Kylie Jenner’s “epic” cornrows or “edgy” dreadlocks.
    When Black women have to fight for acceptance with the same styles a young white woman can be admired for, what message does that send to Black women and girls?

    That... doesn't make sense. I'm pretty sure that the jobs that would ban a black woman from wearing dreadlocks would ban a white woman just the same. And "being a celebrity" is not one of those jobs, and if you were a celebrity no one would bat an eye about your dreadlocks or cornrows either.

    @asdf said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    Adaption and imitation of culture by itself is not the problem, racism, prejudices and double standards are.

    I would add "stealing from the culture without bothering to understand it" to the list. But that shouldn't mean everything black people came up with is now verboten for whites to take up - when we tried it the other way around, it didn't go very well.


  • Discourse touched me in a no-no place

    @Yamikuronue said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    I feel like it's difficult to have 200-level conversations around here because so many people jump in without doing the basic 101-level reading

    Some of us know more than you think. Painting everyone who disagrees with you as ignorant makes you sound like flabdablet.

    @Yamikuronue said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    rap music being held up as misogynist while country music almost never is

    They are both misogynist, but people who like country music were placed in the deplorable basket a long time ago, so there's no point in demonizing them further.

    @Yamikuronue said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    The list which, by the way, shows up on the first page of google for "why is cultural appropriation harmful", so it's not exactly hard to find.

    Again, assuming that people who are opposed to the idea don't understand it isn't helping your cause, and by the way, neither is that article you linked to.


  • mod

    @antiquarian said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    assuming that people who are opposed to the idea don't understand it

    I'm not. I'm assuming people who act like they don't know basic things don't know basic things. Maybe that's a poor assumption.


  • :belt_onion:

    @Yamikuronue said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    @antiquarian said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    assuming that people who are opposed to the idea don't understand it

    I'm not. I'm assuming people who act like they don't know basic things don't know basic things. Maybe that's a poor assumption.

    That also assumes what "basic things" are. To me, as a person from central Europe, dreadlocks were always just a hairstyle. The outrage at them seemed to me as silly as me yelling at people for wearing ties would seem silly to... well, most of the world, really. Because, to me, the origin of the tie are the basics I learned in history class, but almost no one outside my country has.

    Sometimes, people just enjoy things, and I'd argue that demanding that people have to learn the entire history behind every thing they like is just a bit too much to ask. If they want to, cool, more knowledge, more power to them. But, sometimes, I'm just cool with enjoying a thing for what it is now.


  • mod

    @Onyx Basic things like "why are people upset about cultural appropriation". I'm not going to say anyone outside the US should or shouldn't wear dreads, because I don't know enough about the culture in any given country to make a judgement. But it seems like people want me to simultaneously explain why people are upset at all and also discuss delicate particulars like "how do we make a post-racist culture that is diverse without being appropriative" and I'm struggling to do both at once.



  • 0_1487600825773_upload-b56f91d7-5ee3-4143-8b1f-d163195f6acb


  • Discourse touched me in a no-no place

    @Yamikuronue said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    Basic things like "why are people upset about cultural appropriation".

    This is exactly what I was talking about. Have you considered that people know why cultural appropriation makes some people upset but don't agree with the reasons?


  • :belt_onion:

    @Yamikuronue To me, they seem like polar opposites.

    Consider what you said about music earlier. Yes, jazz and blues were shunned at the start by the crotchety old assholes in the beginning, but it was embraced by the younger generations. That morphed into early rock'n'roll, then rock, then metal rose up from that... Jazz and blues aren't gone, they are still there, but so are things that evolved from it. And if you care to know, or someone wants to explain you the roots of some of those genres, you can follow the rabbit hole and maybe discover something you didn't know and you end up loving afterwards. The new thing that rose up from the old thing is not bad, it's just different, and its roots are still remembered and respected by many people.

    If rock'n'roll was not allowed to grow because it used blues influences, would the world really be better for it? Also, consider how that music helped people from different social circles meet and helped accept them eachother. Because, in their infancy at least, blues and jazz were almost exclusively performed by black musicians. Meaning, any white people who enjoyed the music went to see black musicians play, thus helping, at least in a small way, bridge the racial gap that existed at the time.

    I'm sad that it seems like we're trying to do the opposite these days - claim ownership of things rather than sharing them freely with the world, and using them to speak of their fascinating histories to people, rather than telling them they can't have it.


  • mod

    @antiquarian said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    Have you considered that people know why cultural appropriation makes some people upset but don't agree with the reasons?

    Look at what @Gaska said earlier. It doesn't sound like he knows at all.


  • Discourse touched me in a no-no place

    @Yamikuronue said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    Look at what @Gaska said earlier. It doesn't sound like he knows agrees at all.

    I just looked at his post again, and it seems to me that he's knows more about what's going on than you're willing to admit.


  • mod

    Fine. It's possible I misread his post. I took the part where he seemed uninformed about who was hurt by cultural appropriation to mean that he was uninformed, and attempted to inform him. I won't do that again.


  • Impossible Mission - B

    @aliceif said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    @Yamikuronue
    Cultural Appropriation as a "problem" is an invention by American idiots.

    Anyone who uses the term "cultural appropriation" unironically simply doesn't understand how culture actually works. (Hint: it all comes from somewhere else!)

    And it works in all directions; other cultures borrow from us, too. A while back, I ran across a video of Matz (Yukihiro Matsumoto, creator of the Ruby programming language) talking about stuff, in his native Japanese with English subtitles. One thing I noticed as I listened was that virtually all of the computing and technical terms were recognizable as English loanwords. I don't speak Japanese, but I understood all of those words.

    @Yamikuronue said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    rap music being held up as misogynist

    ...because it is?

    while country music almost never is

    That's a specific sub-genre of country music, known as "bro-country," which grew up in the 2010s out of heavy rap influences. It's been heavily criticized, both in media and blogs and in country music itself. For example, check out these girls and their massive #1 hit on the subject:

    Maddie & Tae - Girl In A Country Song – 03:47
    — MaddieandTaeVEVO

    @Onyx said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    If rock'n'roll was not allowed to grow because it used blues influences, would the world really be better for it? Also, consider how that music helped people from different social circles meet and helped accept them eachother. Because, in their infancy at least, blues and jazz were almost exclusively performed by black musicians. Meaning, any white people who enjoyed the music went to see black musicians play, thus helping, at least in a small way, bridge the racial gap that existed at the time.

    Exactly. For example, Elvis Presley was widely criticized for "performing Negro music" early on. But he (and later the Beatles, who freely admitted that their band would not have existed if it were not for Elvis) managed to popularize the music and create wider interest in it outside the Black community. Was that a bad thing?


  • mod

    @Yamikuronue said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    To a lot of us, white dreads are a final "fuck you, even the little bit of your own culture you kept is mine now".

    Hate to break it to you, but dreadlocks are not an instance of cultural appropriation. Historical evidence of dreadlocks comes from many different cultures, including the the Celts, Vikings, Ancient Egyptians, Ancient Greeks, and perhaps even the Aztecs.

    Basically, dreadlocks don't belong to any one race.


  • Impossible Mission - B

    @abarker said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    Hate to break it to you, but dreadlocks are not an instance of cultural appropriation. Historical evidence of dreadlocks comes from many different cultures, including the the Celts, Vikings, Ancient Egyptians, Ancient Greeks, and perhaps even the Aztecs.

    So people making claims about "cultural appropriation" actually have no idea what they're talking about?

    Gasp! You don't say!


  • Discourse touched me in a no-no place

    @Yamikuronue said in The New PC: Populist Correctness:

    Fine. It's possible I misread his post. I took the part where he seemed uninformed about who was hurt by cultural appropriation to mean that he was uninformed, and attempted to inform him. I won't do that again.

    I give up. At least you're not posting unfunny webcomics.


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