Scandals in Communist Frenchystan
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@Rhywden said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
I get the distinct feeling that Trump is not done yet pissing off people.
So who was it who invoked Godwin's Executive Order in this thread anyway?
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@remi It is allways amazing to me how right wing extremists can get away with these affairs and it won't even leave a big bulge in their results. Imagine if any other candidate did what she did. They would get ripped appart.
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@Quwertzuiopp said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
these affairs won't even leave a big bulge in their results...
Well, you try keeping your big bulge after completing a rendezvous...
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@Quwertzuiopp said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
One can hope, but I would have a better feeling if I knew Germany would actually invest into a sort of European Marshal plan, even if it is relatively "small"
The big issue with Germany (IIRC) is that the Landesbanken have a huge number of really unwise investments in lots of things that they probably should have avoided. Like lots of southern european institutional debt. This has forced the hand of Germany w.r.t. the euro, pushing them to a policy of “nobody may default on anything, ever” which is just f'ing ridiculous, yet required to ensure that none of the lenders have to fold and convert a vast chunk of German citizens' savings into pure bupkis. Which would in turn convert rapidly into those banks needing huge bailouts from the Länder, and that's mostly forbidden by EU state aid rules; Germany has been historically extremely supportive of those rules to stop other EU countries from protecting their own industries (including lots of legal decisions), so the level of shit that will impact from that particular fan is pretty amazingly deep.
It's a massive mess, and the politicians don't want to talk about it because they really don't want to start a run on those banks, as they're not actually in a fit state to withstand such a financial storm, whatever the massaged figures currently say.
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@izzion said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
@Quwertzuiopp said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
these affairs won't even leave a big bulge in their results...
Well, you try keeping your big bulge after completing a rendezvous...
I am so tired i literally did not see that
coming 
So I deserved it.
Time to fucking go to bed, up for more than 24 hours
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@dkf said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
The big issue with Germany (IIRC) is that the Landesbanken have a huge number of really unwise investments in lots of things that they probably should have avoided. Like lots of southern european institutional debt. This has forced the hand of Germany w.r.t. the euro, pushing them to a policy of “nobody may default on anything, ever” which is just f'ing ridiculous
True, but a lot of this pain is because everyone ignored it when these countries said they were following all the rules about this stuff to begin with and everyone knew they were full of it.
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@remi said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
The sad part is that the only almost certainty is that Le Pen will get upwards of 30% in the first round and will likely come top.
Not sure about 30%. If Valls had taken the PS, probably. I think she'll probably "only" poll around 20%, a bit like her father in 2002. Possibly not enough for first place, but almost certainly enough to get into the second round. The main question, once LR have sorted themselves out, is how much Macron will cannibalise the established parties, and what damage that will do to them.
And the fact that all the other seem more or less resigned to it makes it even more demoralizing.
I know.
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@boomzilla said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
True, but a lot of this pain is because everyone ignored it when these countries said they were following all the rules about this stuff to begin with and everyone knew they were full of it.
To be fair, not only the weaker countries do it. No later than yesterday, I was reading yet another article (*) about how France is borrowing outside of the standard way so that it doesn't count as debt in the debt-to-GDP ratio. A few billions here and there, they start to add...
(*) In the "Canard Enchaîné", the mostly-satirical weekly that does a fair bit of investigative journalism and revealed the story about Fillon's wife false jobs. They are the living proof that journalism still exists -- not perfect, but still... And that the only way to get it is to be uncomprimising in every aspect, including not being owned by anyone with money interest (they are owned by the journalists themselves and don't carry any ads).
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@remi said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
To be fair, not only the weaker countries do it.
Probably few countries manage it consistently for that matter. But when you build up a bigger institution that requires that sort of discipline and removes the traditional ways that countries deal with it...ugh.
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@tufty said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
Not sure about 30%. If Valls had taken the PS, probably. I think she'll probably "only" poll around 20%
If you really think so, get ready for a huge shock.
Look at the numbers: in the last 3 years, she got 25% in the EU elections in 2014, 25% in the "departemental" (county) ones in 2015 and almost 28% in the regional the same year. The only one where she didn't get a huge result is in municipal elections, but it's really a lot of local battles and always give different results. Looking back a bit, in presidential elections she got 18% in 2012, her father got 10% in 2007 and 18% in 2002. At the same time, the FN never got more than 10% in all other elections (including EU ones, that are the closest in my opinion to presidential in that people vote for a single country-wide result rather than a lot of smaller local elections). You'll see similar figures if you go back to the 90's. So she gets consistently higher figures for presidential (I'd say about 5-10% more at least), which is expected for a Dear Leader populist party that relies on a charismatic head.
So based on her 25%+ in the last few years, anything below 35% would not come as a surprise to me. Heck, when I have nightmares I start wondering if the 50% threshold at the first round is really totally out of reach for her! (it probably is, thanks to the leftist Mélenchon taking about 10% on a very similar populist platform, but left-based... if not for that, she would be polling upwards of 40%, I think...)
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@boomzilla said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
But when you build up a bigger institution that requires that sort of discipline and removes the traditional ways that countries deal with it...ugh.
It would also help if the countries did not agree on it on one hand, while screaming that the Big Bad EU is preventing them from doing what they want on the other. Get your shit together, for fuck sake!
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@remi You might be right. I hope not. They consistently poll 25-40% here already.
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@remi said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
Get your shit together, for fuck sake!
The current state of the world in a nutshell.
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@asdf said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
Edit: OMG, has Trump changed Godwin's law?
Nah, he hasn't caused anything near the same level of tragedy. The big thing is that his very existence is moderately humorous.
We'll see later on. I'm hoping he continues to just be laughable.
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@asdf said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
Edit: OMG, has Trump changed Godwin's law?
Funny you should mention it. Godwin himself wrote an article about Trump.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2015/12/14/sure-call-trump-a-nazi-just-make-sure-you-know-what-youre-talking-about/?utm_term=.c4a3c35ae32b
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Here's Penelope Fillon being interviewed by the Torygraph in 2007.
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said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
So, in case anyone's getting fed up with America's new performing monkey
Good way to poison the well. The first fucking sentence.
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@tufty said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
which is probably best described as nazism hidden behind modern populism
Why? you can't just state it and it becomes fact. There is a real problem at the moment with people being labelled as racists and nazis because you don't like them.
There was a guy who shot someone because he looked like Donald Trump and you are adding to the hysteria.
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@tufty said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
Here's Penelope Fillon being interviewed by the Torygraph in 2007
How can anyone take you seriously when you are doing the equivalent of some Linux Fanatic saying M$ (when Oracle is much worse)..
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@lucas1 If I complained every time someone here made a biased political joke, I'd have to literally spend my entire day in the Trolleybus Garage.
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@anonymous234 said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
I'd have to literally spend my entire day in the Trolleybus Garage.
You and @Polygeekery could open a bar there.
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@anonymous234 That isn't the point. The point is that @Tufty is making large bipartisan judgements.
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@loopback0 And I would be LandLord ... the best landlord.
I would be your landlord
I would make drinking great again.
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@lucas1 said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
I would make drinking
greatbelligerent again.FTFY
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@Polygeekery said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
@lucas1 said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
I would make
drinkingbelligerent again.FTFY
Did
youa word?
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@Polygeekery Something that is sorely needed on this forum full of cunts.
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@loopback0 fuck. Mobile
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Oh shit I got a cool name for a Bar
MEDrunkistan
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@lucas1 said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
@Polygeekery Something that is sorely needed on this forum full of cunts.
Tampons? Maxipads? Free bleeding?
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@Polygeekery Getting drunk and doing something dumb and not being up their own ass all the time.
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@loopback0 fixed it.
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@lucas1 Just thought of another stupid name for a bar
@Cuntistan and @Tufty is running it ... He would create the cunts of productions.
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The retards have arrived, time to mute the thread, it was fun while it lasted.
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@remi said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
@asdf said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
@remi said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
It took less than 5 posts for a thread about France to be invaded by Germany.
Sorry, you're just too easy to invade, I guess. ¯\(ツ)/¯
Well, there was no
invasionmention of Belg*** in between, so the rules were not followed.And Poland never had a chance.
@remi said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
@asdf Also, I wouldn't worry about getting hate from the UK. They love nothing more than hating their neighbours, except hating themselves, but that doesn't really change what they actually do. That must come with the weather and tea.
Or the fact that they seem to be a conglomeration of multiple entities that don't really want to have anything to do with one another, but are held together by tradition.
@remi said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
@asdf I know, saying "world stage" was a bit ambitious. But yet at the European level, I feel that Germany is becoming less and less reluctant to speak its voice, without necessarily having to tag along France or another country. Which is good, a country that size shouldn't play second fiddle. Heck, by any measure, they should be the one leading things over here.
Incidentally, speaking as an American, it'd be awfully nice if y'all Europeans could consolidate a bit more. Do you really need that many different states, speaking slightly different dialects of the same few languages? Surely you could consolidate at least a few together, like Austria, Hungary, and Germany. Maybe fold Portugal into Spain. Make one big state of for the various different Slavic countries. Join up all the Nordic countries (and maybe Scotland) into one big union. Even Poland needn't feel left out - I'm sure someone would take them. I understand England will have none of it, but you could probably get London to pair up with France since they've always had such a close relation. Wales could join up with Ireland, and maybe Scotland. None of the them speak proper English anyway, so it's not like they really belong with England.
Of course, England (excepting London, which doesn't truly belong) really shouldn't be left all alone like that to burden the charity of Europe. Additionally, as you may have noticed, the US has been having a bit of difficulty with the whole "United" part of the name and could itself do with a bit of reorganization. So perhaps in exchange for the USA taking England off your hands, Europe could substantially expand its territorial reach and economy by absorbing such states and regions as would find the Brexit-favoring portion of England unwelcome company. A nice side benefit being the amicable solution of each nation's current secession crisis.
(Please direct all flames to a new thread so we can keep this one slightly less tarnished.)
(Shit. Nevermind. It's too late now.)@remi said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
It would also help if the countries did not agree on it on one hand, while screaming that the Big Bad EU is preventing them from doing what they want on the other. Get your shit together, for fuck sake!
It might also help if you treated the EU as a single nation instead of a bunch of competing nations that just happen to share a fiat currency, when it comes to debt and such. Having the EU be able to default to itself and potentially knock the whole thing down is a bit of a problem.
@Magus said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
I'm hoping he continues to just be laughable.
One of the major EO's from his first week isn't really laughable. Reinstating the Mexico City Policy has the potential for a whole lot of people to die or otherwise end up worse off.
A few others can seriously impact other people as well:
A memorandum instructing the Labor Department to delay implementing an Obama rule requiring financial professionals who are giving advice on retirement, and who charge commissions, to put their client's interests first.
An executive order imposing a 120-day suspension of the refugee program and a 90-day ban on travel to the U.S. from citizens of seven terror hot spots: Iraq, Iran, Syria, Libya, Yemen, Somalia and Sudan.
Two orders reviving the Keystone XL pipeline and Dakota Access piplines.
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@Dreikin said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
like Austria, Hungary, and Germany
I would rather die than liven in the same country as Victor Orban. Instead of merging Hungary into anything, we should throw them out of the EU, build a giant wall around the country, throw all nuclear waste and dangerous criminals over that wall and make it a no fly zone noone can escape from. The Hungarian government is the very cancer of Europe, in a more serious way than you might think, they are the culimination of everything that is wrong with Europe.
On a more serious note, I have been thinking for quite a while that if we are not quite willing to throw out those that actively hinder progress like Poland, Hungary and the Czech republic, we should start thinking about merging the very heart of Europe into one nation that would still be a member of the EU as a kind of piecemeal unification. You know, get all the chill countries like Germany, Austria, Slovenia, Belgium, Luxembourg, Sweden, France,Spain, Portugal to merge and when it finally becomes clear that the final unification is going to happen soon those only in it for the easy money can still be shown the door.
Of course what most outsiders forget is that this would be a massive clash of cultures and especially political cultures. The reality is simply that most Europeans have no damn clue about even the political life of their neighbor countries. A coalition of the willing could maybe survive that shock, but merely thinking of the political chaos when all the dozens of political parties realize that they will now have to do more than chose a losely labeled faction in the EU parliament and then mostly ignore the EU is both hilarious and frightening. Which parties would merge? Would they drive a kind of CDU/CSU deal where they have a gentelmans agreement about who competes where and have one faction but everytime shit hits the fan it becomes apparent that they have different political views and agendas? It would be Belgium, but instead of three parts that can't agree on anything and each have five political parts it would be dozens.
The situation is, overall, a LOT more complicated than US states ever were. Also, don't forget that there is still a TON of contention over what overall model to take for a unified EU. Keep the States and accept a Weimaranian level of size and population differences between states? A Europe of Regions? How are those regions defined and do they cross borders of the previous states? How Big do you make those regions, and where do they fit in the balance of power? Are they like states in the US? Or more like Countries in Germany (yes please btw, they have perfect size and ammount of power in relation to local communities and the federal government. While we are at it, can we pretty please just take the German constitution and replace the names? It is objectively the best constitution in the world, as recognized by a majority of countries being founded after the invention of the german constitution taking the german one as base and no longer the french or the american). Or maybe only have cities and muncipalities as binding constituents and divide up the power of the middle level between the EU and the cities?
I had allways hoped the german-french friendship initiatives would ultimately result in their unification and honestly the best testing ground for unification of the EU would be to create France-Germany-Belgium-Luxembourg-Austria-Netherlands as they are the sane heart of the EU and both politically and mentality wise the closest to each other, more so than most there think themselves. (It would also relive Belgium from the torture of existing). And I really mean that. Of all the EU countries they are the most alike politically and day-to-day culture wise and there wouldn't even be much of a problem of matching the political parties to joint ones. Then you just undo the actual countries and dissasemble them into their federal states and boom there you go. If you make them all as powerful as the german Länder nobody has a right to be pissed about losing too much autonomy and the flemish and walloons can rejoice because they just became more independant of each other.
Of course none of that is going to be happening anytime soon because France and Germany are too occupied with themselves and I suspect a lot of french people would be too proud to let their oh so glorious république and tradition die.
Also, didn't I mute this thread? I could have sworn I pushed that button. I wasn't lurking during the time of the switch to the new forums, are they still bugged sometimes?
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@Quwertzuiopp When you mute a thread it only doesn't show up in the main list. You still get notifications.
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@Dreikin said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
Even Poland needn't feel left out - I'm sure someone would take them.
Just give one half to Germany one half to Russia.
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@Rhywden said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
When you mute a thread it only doesn't show up in the main list. You still get notifications.
You can fully mute a thread if you want; the option is there at the bottom on the “Watching” menu.
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@Rhywden meh, bummer
@dkf said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
You can fully mute a thread if you want; the option is there at the bottom on the “Watching” menu.
Ahh, thanks a lot
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@aliceif
As long as we keep the plumbers
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@aliceif said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
@Dreikin said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
Even Poland needn't feel left out - I'm sure someone would take them.
Just give one half to Germany one half to Russia.
You're leaving Austria out this time?
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@Dreikin So recreate the Austrohongrian empire (or the core of it), Yugoslavia, pre-1906 (I think?) Sweden. And someone else already suggested splitting Poland. You know what, don't be so shy, go one step further back in history and recreate the Napoleonian empire. You'll get most of continental Europe, just letting out Britain which is what's happening anyway. And France will get back its rightful place as the leader of all that.
Oh sorry, you said you wanted to avoid the garage? Much too late for that, I'm afraid...
More seriously, I don't think smal local unions of this kind have any chance to ever happen, the cultures are too different. I have more hope in a gradual dissolution of states in an European federal one, while retaining local powers (as suggested by, someone else... i'm on mobile and can't be bothered to look...).
But even that is a long term plan. At the moment, the EU should stabilise what it has and work to make it more acceptable (more accountability of the commission and stuff like that). To make a software analogy, do a feature freeze, debug the existing ones before thinking of adding new ones.
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@remi said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
go one step further back in history and recreate the Napoleonian empire
Can you annex Bavaria this time instead of just allying with them, and throw out the CSU for us? Remember, they betrayed you last time.
@remi said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
But even that is a long term plan. At the moment, the EU should stabilise what it has and work to make it more acceptable (more accountability of the commission and stuff like that). To make a software analogy, do a feature freeze, debug the existing ones before thinking of adding new ones.
+1
Fortunately, politicians seem to be slowly realizing that this is the best course of action. European integration cannot happen without broad support from its citizens, which is lacking ATM.
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@asdf said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
@remi said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
go one step further back in history and recreate the Napoleonian empire
Can you annex Bavaria this time instead of just allying with them, and throw out the CSU for us? Remember, they betrayed you last time.
If we annex all the countries that betrayed us the last time, I think we'll have to annex all the countries (todo: insert meme picture here). Not that I see anything wrong with that.
Fortunately, politicians seem to be slowly realizing that this is the best course of action. European integration cannot happen without broad support from its citizens, which is lacking ATM.
I just hope that they will seriously work on it before it's too late. It is already too late for the UK (which some will claim it's a good thing, but I personnel really don't think it is), it could become too late for France very soon, which would be the end of the EU.
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@remi said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
which some will claim it's a good thing
Based on one of the campaign ads I saw in the run-up to the referendum, those that thought that if and when Turkey join the EU, the entire 72 million population would emigrate to the UK. Of course, they're also unable to see the irony of them thinking that, even though they'll retire to the south of France or the Spanish Mediterranean.
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@Quwertzuiopp said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
The retards have arrived, time to mute the thread, it was fun while it lasted.
Hey! I resemble that remark.
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This election could be, er, interesting.
La Russie pousserait la candidature de Marine Le Pen, selon la DGSE
Les services secrets français s'inquiètent de la menace d'une cyberattaque sur l'élection présidentielle, rapporte "Le Canard Enchaîné".
French intelligence agency is on full alert about Russian hackers and assumes there will be a massive online spam/disinformation campaign. EU actually has a task force on Russian disinformation.
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@anonymous234 said in Scandals in Communist Frenchystan:
This election could be, er, interesting.
DONALD TRUMP ELECTED KING OF FRANCE
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@ben_lubar
NEWS FLASH: Roy Trump to build a wall along the Spanish border. Confused about existing mountains.
'I've never been his assistant', François Fillon's wife Penelope told Telegraph, as French presidential contender faces calls to quit over 'fake job' scandal
