When to use chip-enabled card?
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So do you use the chip-enabled card before or after adding the basil?
Before. The chip takes a while to simmer, and you always put fresh herbs in as close to the end of the recipe as possible.
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More on topic: I've had a tap-n-go card for a long time. I love it.
$71.23 after tax
(without opening wallet, without taking card out) beep FUCKING DONE!I don't expose the number to shoulder surfers. I don't have to struggle to cover the PIN. I don't have to worry about forgetting the card in the chip-slot. Transaction time goes down by an order of magnitude.
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@Lorne_Kates said:
I don't have to worry about forgetting the card in the chip-slot.
The terminals I've used don't complete the transaction until you take your card. Also, my bank's ATM machine now makes you take the card before you enter your personal PIN.
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Also, my bank's ATM machine now makes you take the card before you enter your personal PIN.
UK: since they're CnP, the card needs to be in the ATM machine in order to verify the PIN number. OTOH, you don't get your money until you've taken your card.
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That's been the order on ATMs here for ages - First you get the card back, then you get the money, then finally the receipt.
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I was using my chip card at the local Home Depot before they officially flipped the switch. I managed to cause one of their chip reading card readers to reboot and end up in the equivalent of its BIOS. That was amusing. Other times it worked just fine.
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That's been the order on ATMs here for ages - First you get the card back, then you get the money, then finally the receipt.
Bank of America, one of the largest in the US, has been doing that for at least 5 years. Apparently the biggest security problem at ATMs was people leaving cards behind, spitting out the card FIRST lets the machine verify the user has their card before letting them do anything actually useful.
They also added the "fast cash" amount buttons to the same screen as the PIN entry around the same time, which is a nice time-saver.
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This post is deleted!
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The Great EMV Fake-Out: No Chip For You!
Many banks are now issuing customers more secure chip-based credit cards, and most retailers now have card terminals in their checkout lanes that can handle the "dip" of chip-card transactions (as opposed to the usual swipe of the card's magnetic…
Visa CEO Charles W. Scharf said in an earnings call late last month [January 2016] that more than 750,000 locations representing 17 percent of the U.S. face-to-face card-accepting merchant base are now enabled to handle chip-based transactions, also known as the EMV (“Europay, Mastercard and Visa”) payment standard.
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Despite the increased risk of eating the entire loss from counterfeit card use in their stores, many merchants are taking a wait-and-see approach on enabling chip card transactions. Weinberg said some merchants — particularly the larger ones — want to turn the often painful experience of training customers how to use the chip cards and terminals into someone else’s problem.“They see [chip cards] as just slowing down lines and chose to wait until consumers learned what to do — and do it quickly — at someone else’s store,” Weinberg wrote.
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For his part, Weinberg said he’s mad as hell, but he says if consumers get mad about anything chip-card related, it’s probably going to be about the 10-15 extra seconds it will take to dip the chip versus swipe the stripe.
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17 percent of the U.S. face-to-face card-accepting merchant base
Subtracting out the places that will trigger fraud protection on your card and get it disabled...
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I think that's just your card.
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Could be.
When I told the guy on the phone this was the second time it happened at this store, he opined they might have had fraud problems...which would make more sense if the store hadn't only been open since August, and I never had problems with the magstripe (I was going to say "with swiping" but I know what would happen if I did.)
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training customers how to use the chip cards
You Americans are adorable. Next we're gonna show you telephones without a wire and computers you can move around, and it's gonna blow your minds.
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How did you double-post but somehow split them over the 13 Days Later? WTF Discourse?
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I think there was a days later bug before where they included deleted posts in the calculations and it looked wrong. You can only see the deleted post due to being a mod.
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@boomzilla said:
training customers how to use the chip cards
You Americans are adorable. Next we're gonna show you telephones without a wire and computers you can move around, and it's gonna blow your minds.
I think it's more about getting used to the slow transaction process. We talked about that before. That's the main memory I have from the handful of times I've had to use the chip. It feels a lot more inconvenient. And really, I'm not getting any noticeable benefit for it.
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For every 20 year old who gets it instantly, there's a grandma who still writes personal checks everywhere and has trouble with a normal credit card.
What do you do with your old people in Europe? Just not allow them to pay for stuff?
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I think it's more about getting used to the slow transaction process.
It never really takes more than 5-10 seconds here, unless it's a portable terminal with a bad connection. And that's including PIN entry and receipt printing.
And if that's too slow, NFC transactions just get confirmed instantly.
What do you do with your old people in Europe? Just not allow them to pay for stuff?
Cash is still a thing here. Although I'm not sure why chip-and-pin would be more complicated than stripe-and-sig, save for having to remember a four-digit number and to press green at the end, but I dunno, maybe?
It's just funny how you're treating something that's completely ubiquitous in Europe (I think I've paid with a stripe maybe once, and years ago?) like some new tech. It's like if you went to some other developed country, showed them a mobile phone and saw them go "whaaat? A phone without wires?"
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It never really takes more than 5-10 seconds here, unless it's a portable terminal with a bad connection. And that's including PIN entry and receipt printing.
It takes me less than a second to swipe. And then the other stuff happens elsewhere. I can put my card away and be putting stuff back into my cart or whatever.
Although I'm not sure why chip-and-pin would be more complicated than stripe-and-sig, save for having to remember a four-digit number and to press green at the end, but I dunno, maybe?
Damn...I hope we don't go to chip and pin. Though I just had to get a company card for travel, and I just got a letter in the mail with my PIN.
It's like if you went to some other developed country, showed them a mobile phone and saw them go "whaaat? A phone without wires?"
Or showed them a gun?
It's not like it's a confusing technology, just less convenient. You've already gotten used to it, though.
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It's just funny how you're treating something that's completely ubiquitous in Europe (I think I've paid with a stripe maybe once, and years ago?) like some new tech.
To a lot of Americans, it is new tech. But then sometimes it does seem like many Americans think Europe is a single country full of dragons and wizards. Oh, and Communists, because Communists are evil or something.
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Although I'm not sure why chip-and-pin would be more complicated than stripe-and-sig, save for having to remember a four-digit number and to press green at the end, but I dunno, maybe?
It wouldn't, but older people here don't do that either, they write personal checks. Pay attention to what I'm typing.
It takes me less than a second to swipe. And then the other stuff happens elsewhere. I can put my card away and be putting stuff back into my cart or whatever.
That bugs me too. Especially when people said you have to KEEP the card in the machine all the way to the end of the transaction. I swipe, put my wallet away, then punch in the pin and such. Chip cards sound WAY less convenient than that.
But then sometimes it does seem like many Americans think Europe is a single country full of dragons and wizards.
Europe has a KKK too?
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Oh, and Communists, because Communists are evil or something.
They're definitely evil. Some of them are stupid. The best ones are dead.
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Damn...I hope we don't go to chip and pin.
If you're going to have a chip card, pin is supposedly more secure than signature, so hopefully you'd prefer that.
The argument that people are too dumb to remember a pin, which is what I've heard is the argument for chip-and-sig--is insulting, since it's obviously not true.
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The argument that people are too dumb to remember a pin which they use all the time at ATMs
Which only goes to prove how ludicrous the reasoning is.And I use the term 'reasoning' extremely loosely...
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It's not like it's a confusing technology, just less convenient. You've already gotten used to it, though.
IIRC, most of Eastern Europe missed out on swipe cards thanks to Communism, and about the time they got access, the chip cards were starting to come out, so they skipped swiping completely.
Communists are evil
They are! It's like you've never heard about the Holodomor, or all the waiting in food lines in Communist countries, or the constant spying on everyone, etc., etc., etc.
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.,...And I don't get reply notifications for whispers?!
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Reply to mark whisper as read.
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If you're going to have a chip card, pin is supposedly more secure than signature, so hopefully you'd prefer that.
Yes, but security is pretty much always a trade off with convenience. I now have 2 cards (one is my ATM) with a PIN. I don't need more. As I understand it, the PIN may end up putting liability on me (ISTR @PJH talking about that sort of switcheroo). Currently all of the liability for fraud is on the card issuer or the merchant.
Getting a PIN seems like the worst of it all to me.
The argument that people are too dumb to remember a pin, which is what I've heard is the argument for chip-and-sig--is insulting, since it's obviously not true.
I can remember a PIN. Can I remember several? Probably. Why should I need to?
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I can remember a PIN. Can I remember several? Probably. Why should I need to?
More seriously, if you already have a card with a pin and it gets replaced with one with a chip, the pin doesn't change, any more than it did the last time[1] you got a new card. Did you think otherwise?[1] or in your case, the last few dozen times.
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More seriously, if you already have a card with a pin and it gets replaced with one with a chip, the pin doesn't change, any more than it did the last time[1] you got a new card. Did you think otherwise?
No. Why did you think I thought that?
[1] or in your case, the last few dozen times.
It's been several years since I've had a card replaced due to fraud (the expiration has passed on a couple since the last time that happened). I thought I was going to get a new card after the Target breach...I think I even got a letter from my bank saying that they might do it...but I don't think they ever followed through on that.
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I thought I was going to get a new card after the Target breach...I think I even got a letter from my bank saying that they might do it...but I don't think they ever followed through on that.
That's 'cause the guy at the bank who sent you that letter was living it up in Cancun with your money.
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More seriously, if you already have a card with a pin and it gets replaced with one with a chip, the pin doesn't change, any more than it did the last time[1] you got a new card. Did you think otherwise?
[1] or in your case, the last few dozen times.
I don't think you understood @boomzilla's gripe (which I share, BTW). In the US, it is not uncommon for an individual to have multiple credit cards. I have about a half dozen for various reasons, that get used with varying degrees of frequency. I don't want to have PINs on each of those cards because I'd end up forgetting the PINs on the cards I use less frequently. Now, you could say that I could try getting the same PIN for all my cards, but that sounds like a security problem waiting to happen. No thanks. I'll just stick to having PINs on 2 of my cards, and sign for the rest.
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That's cause the guy at the bank you send you that letter was living it up in Cancun with your money.
I'll excuse your gibberish because I still chuckled at what you wrote.
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I edited it so now it's not gibberish.
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False, but amused.
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Oh.
Wow. Two gibberish typos.
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Why did you think I thought that?
Because you mentioned a new pin. Having already gone though this last year, all that happens is if your card expires, the next one you get will have the chip, and it'll have the same pin.
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Because you mentioned a new pin. Having already gone though this last year, all that happens is if your card expires, the next one you get will have the chip, and it'll have the same pin.
He meant a new PIN on a card that didn't previously have a PIN.
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I don't think you understood @boomzilla's gripe (which I share, BTW). In the US, it is not uncommon for an individual to have multiple credit cards. I have about a half dozen for various reasons, that get used with varying degrees of frequency. I don't want to have PINs on each of those cards because I'd end up forgetting the PINs on the cards I use less frequently. Now, you could say that I could try getting the same PIN for all my cards, but that sounds like a security problem waiting to happen. No thanks. I'll just stick to having PINs on 2 of my cards, and sign for the rest.
So you'll resort to using the same signature on all of them instead?
I see your concern though - I have a bank card and a credit card with PIN, they claim you can change PIN at any ATM for your own bank, but somehow I cannot.
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What do you do with your old people in Europe? Just not allow them to pay for stuff?
They're all on pensions, so the Glorious State pays for everything.
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@boomzilla said:
Why did you think I thought that?
Because you mentioned a new pin. Having already gone though this last year, all that happens is if your card expires, the next one you get will have the chip, and it'll have the same pin.
Oh. I see the confusion. I meant a new PIN because one of my cards suddenly requires one.
So you'll resort to using the same signature on all of them instead?
I'm pretty sure my signature never looks the same twice. The point is that the PIN is just a PITA AFAIC.
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So you'll resort to using the same signature on all of them instead?
I see your concern though - I have a bank card and a credit card with PIN, they claim you can change PIN at any ATM for your own bank, but somehow I cannot.
There's a difference: with signature, I'm not liable for fraud at any point. Not to mention that, in practice, it is difficult to accurately forge a signature.
With a PIN, however, anytime a card is used at a Chip & Pin terminal, the card holder is at least partially liable for credit card fraud. Ouch. I think I'd prefer to stick with the signature and avoid the liability.
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Not to mention that, in practice, it is difficult to accurately forge a signature.
Hahaha wat? On a touchpad with MAYBE 300x200 pixel resolution? And a fat-ass magnetic pen that draws 4 pixels wide, with a 200ms refresh? And when half the country's citizens never even learned cursive and don't even have a consistent signature?
You are high on the good shit, man. The goooood shit.
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with signature, I'm not liable for fraud at any point.
A situation banks are clearly not comfortable with. Plus what @blakeyrat said.
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I'll be utterly surprised whenever my bank gets around to actually sending me a chip card. Most likely it won't be until my current card expires in 2018. Maybe by that point there might be a retailer around me that will actually accept them, along with contactless payments.
Stupid thing is, there were actually a couple places around here that DID contactless. I remember being able to use Google Wallet at several different locations, but now the only place I can use the damn thing is at the local Wegmans's grocery store. Even the "tap and pay" consoles on the vending machines here at work for some reason won't work with the phone NFC. The phone will react like it's supposed to, but the contact point just sits there like "Durr, wat's dat?"
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He meant a new PIN on a card that didn't previously have a PIN.
I could see that, but it seems a relatively unlikely event, especially for
.
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Oh. I see the confusion. I meant a new PIN because one of my cards suddenly requires one.
Ok, so that makes sense, as I said above. I've never had a credit or debit card that didn't have a pin, I don't think, but no
here.
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The point is that the PIN is just a PITA AFAIC.
If you didn't already have one on a given card, I guess that makes sense. In my case, though, it's just switching from swipe to insert, and while I'd rather it didn't take the extra few seconds, I'm not so old I feel it's a noticeable portion of my remaining lifespan.
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As far as I know, all of my credit cards probably have a PIN, but I'm sure I don't know the PIN for any of them, because none of the ways in which I use them requires a PIN.
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? Wouldn't you need the PIN to use them in an ATM? Or you've never done that?
