If Windows is Updated, Only Windows Users Will Have Updated Windows
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You're on 8. You launch a "modern app" from the start screen. Suddenly your taskbar is gone, you can see some other apps on the left if you do a certain weird new mouse gesture but not all of them, and everything is generally different.
And most importantly, 10 doesn't do that. It launches in a window. 8 was unnecessarily different.
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No, most people were neutral or positive.
Are you fucking retarded?
37.72% - "No, I tried it and hated it. Back to Windows 7"
8.33% - "In hindsight I'd say no, but I got used to it and now I'm living with it"Those are negative reactions, for those who are unable to read. 46.05%
16.98% - "What hassle? Windows 8 is great!"
5.38% - "Yes, but I don't like having to relearn so many basic functions." (I would call that one neutral, but I gave you the benefit of the doubt. That is definitely a negative reaction to the new UI though.)Those are the positive reactions, mostly, with the one caveat.
8.68% - "Not sure yet."
22.91% - "I haven't tried Windows 8 yet."So who's ass are you pulling your:
No, most people were neutral or positive.
Goddamn, the numbers are right there and you still dispute them. You are living in your own little fucking world.
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Besides, regardless of what 8 and 10 do, corporations can be expected to stay with 7 until it's no longer supported. Change is costly.
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8 was unnecessarily different.
I disagree. I think they needed to do it to get to the point they're at now. Largely, that was a matter of convincing people to make applications that work in more screen configurations. I agree that it's better now, but I think it was an important step.
Goddamn, the numbers are right there and you still dispute them. You are living in your own little fucking world.
And as for you, that's 10k votes from ???. I don't know who the typical users of ??? are, or whether ??? is representative of the population at large. But the question itself assumes that there is hassle.
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Goddamn, the numbers are right there and you still dispute them. You are living in your own little fucking world.
No, I'm simply saying that I'm disputing your evaluation, a common problem with being so enamoured with numbers that you're losing sight of reality. The bigger group with your poll is the neutral and positive group at roughly 53.95%.
See why statistics can be so much fun?
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And as for you, that's 10k votes from ???. I don't know who the typical users of ??? are, or whether ??? is representative of the population at large. But the question itself assumes that there is hassle.
I did not cherry pick information to come up with that, and I do not have the time or resources to poll every single Windows user to get perfect numbers. I simply Googled "Windows 8 opinion poll" and started looking through it. You can do the same yourself.
10K votes is statistically significant. It is not like I am posting a poll of my 10 closest friends here.
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10K votes is statistically significant. It is not like I am posting a poll of my 10 closest friends here.
Only if the sample is representative.
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The bigger group with your poll is the neutral and positive group at roughly 53.95%.
No, the biggest group is the negative reactions. How about I put the neutral ones in the negative group since we are just making shit up at this point? I will assume that those who have not tried it yet have not done so because they heard from everyone else that it sucked.
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Only if the sample is representative.
Go find a better sample then. Go find something that supports your assertion that everyone loves Win8 and wants to have its babies. Blakey.
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i am detecting a lot of ruffled feathers in this thread.
maybe a cute picture will help defuse the situation?
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No, the biggest group is the negative reactions. How about I put the neutral ones in the negative group since we are just making shit up at this point? I will assume that those who have not tried it yet have not done so because they heard from everyone else that it sucked.
Your "biggest" group actually consists of two groups. Thus you have no right to criticise me for conflating groups - you did it yourself first and as such, my point is quite valid.
And you're showing again why you shouldn't be let within 5 feet of a statistic - your opinions cloud your judgment, you're attacking anyone who dares to disagree with you and you're unable to see that it's not as clearcut an issue as you make it out to be.
At this point I'm rather wondering: When will you have this stroke you seem to be building up towards? :)
Go find a better sample then. Go find something that supports your assertion that everyone loves Win8 and wants to have its babies. Blakey.
I'm not sure where you got that from. Maybe you should try this "reading" thing from time to time and recognize that, just because I disagree with your findings, it doesn't mean that I'm of the opposite opinion.
Some things are not exactly binary, y'know?
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Your "biggest" group actually consists of two groups. You have no right to criticise me for conflating groups - you did it yourself first and as such, my point is quite valid.
I did not conflate groups. You are choosing to throw people in on your side of the argument that are either completely neutral or have not even tried the OS when they were polled. That is intellectually dishonest.
And you're showing again why you shouldn't be let within 5 feet of a statistic - your opinions cloud your judgment
No it doesn't, I just don't see neutrals as a positive. You are putting people on your side of the argument that have not even tried Win8 yet, and you accuse me of having my opinions cloud my judgment.
Pot, meet kettle. Kettle, this is pot.
you're unable to see that it's not as clearcut an issue as you make it out to be.
Actually, no. Find me a statistic that supports you argument, where you don't have to cherry pick things. Go find it. It is not as though I Googled "opinion polls that say Windows 8 sucks".
At this point I'm rather wondering: When will you have this stroke you seem to be building up towards?
Meh, my feathers are not nearly as ruffled as you might think they are. I speak with strong language. I have been told that I seem angry, even when I am not at all. And besides, what is worth discussing if you do not feel strongly about it? I feel strongly about people looking at a poll and then saying the exact opposite of what the data does. ;)
I'm not sure where you got that from. Maybe you should try this "reading" thing from time to time and recognize that, just because I disagree with your findings, it doesn't mean that I'm of the opposite opinion.
Fair enough.
Some things are not exactly binary, y'know?
True. I am a business person. We tend to work in the gray. Looking out from that viewpoint, things tend to look black or white. ;)
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My point is as follows: 10k responses on The Register will be different than 10k responses from the Windows Insider website. That's why you need a representative sample. This could be, but we have no way of knowing.
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The bigger group with your poll is the neutral and positive group at roughly 53.95%.
Please report to the NULL disaster thread. A "no opinion because I haven't tried it" isn't a neutral reaction.
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My point is as follows: 10k responses on The Register will be different than 10k responses from the Windows Insider website. That's why you need a representative sample. This could be, but we have no way of knowing.
Yeah, but I did not cherry pick the data. I just Googled what I told you and then reported the data. I did not exclude anything that said people loved the OS.
Admittedly, absence of evidence is not evidence of absence, but goddamn I should have found something.
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Please report to the NULL disaster thread. A "no opinion because I haven't tried it" isn't a neutral reaction.
Are you trying to pass your opinions as definitions again?
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37.72% - "No, I tried it and hated it. Back to Windows 7"
8.33% - "In hindsight I'd say no, but I got used to it and now I'm living with it"I did not conflate groups. You are choosing to throw people in on your side of the argument that are either completely neutral or have not even tried the OS when they were polled. That is intellectually dishonest.
I'm counting two groups here.
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Why are you acting like I'm accusing you of cherry picking? How about you read the things I type?
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@boomzilla said:
Please report to the NULL disaster thread. A "no opinion because I haven't tried it" isn't a neutral reaction.
Are you trying to pass your opinions as definitions again?No, dear. I just know the difference between "no reaction" and "neutral reaction." Please explain why you think "haven't tried it" is a reaction at all, let alone a neutral reaction.
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They're still both negative.
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No, dear. I just know the difference between "no reaction" and "neutral reaction." Please explain why you think "haven't tried it" is a reaction at all, let alone a neutral reaction.
If it was "no reaction" they wouldn't have voted at all. A vote is an (re)action, after all.
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I'm counting two groups here.
Then throw them out. More people disliked it than liked it. Now, how are you going to conflate things to support the opinion that you posit?
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Then throw them out. More people disliked it than liked it. Now, how are you going to conflate things to support the opinion that you posit?
Which opinion would that be?
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If it was "no reaction" they wouldn't have voted at all. A vote is an (re)action, after all.
Not necessarily.
If we post a poll in the New York Times of "What do you think of @Rhwyden?", most people will respond "Who the fuck is he?". That is not positive, and it is not negative, but it is a reaction.
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If we post a poll in the New York Times of "What do you think of @Rhwyden?", most people will respond "Who the fuck is he?". That is not positive, and it is not negative, but it is a reaction.
Hence neutral.
That the data shows that people like Win8.
Please don't expect me to hold my breath while you comb through this forum trying to support that particular view.
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@boomzilla said:
No, dear. I just know the difference between "no reaction" and "neutral reaction." Please explain why you think "haven't tried it" is a reaction at all, let alone a neutral reaction.
If it was "no reaction" they wouldn't have voted at all. A vote is an (re)action, after all.
TDEMSYR
It's not about a reaction to the poll, but a reaction to Win 8. But if we want to interpret it, a reasonable one would be that they're avoiding it, which sounds pretty negative.
Hence neutral.
You must be really confused by this topic:
https://what.thedailywtf.com/t/null-the-worst-mistake-of-computer-science/50906?u=boomzilla
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Hence neutral.
But it is not a reaction to that opinion. They are not neutral on their opinion of you, they have no opinion of you. That is not the same. You are conflating again.
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If we post a poll in the New York Times of "What do you think of @Rhwyden?", most people will respond "Who the fuck is he?". That is not positive, and it is not negative, but it is a reaction.
Even @Rhywden would answer "Who the fuck is Rhwyden?"
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Why would that be "reasonable"? You're making the same mistake as Polygeekery, so desperate to prove me wrong and support your oh-so-lofty reasoning that you're grasping at straws now.
Well, carry on. We already know that you're full of it.
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Even @Rhywden would answer "Who the fuck is Rhwyden?"
Or, "How dare those fucking bastards misspell my name??" ;)
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Well, carry on. We already know that you're full of it.
Do you have data to support that opinion?
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But it is not a reaction to that opinion. They are not neutral on their opinion of you, they have no opinion of you. That is not the same. You are conflating again.
Depends on your definition of neutrality. To use math as an example, you're currently assuming that only 1 (one) is a neutral element.
But 0 (zero) is a neutral element as well.
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You're making the same mistake as Polygeekery, so desperate to prove me wrong and support your oh-so-lofty reasoning that you're grasping at straws now.
No. He was wrong to say that most people had a negative opinion of Windows in that poll. If he'd said that most people who participated in the poll who had experienced Windows had a negative opinion, he'd be on pretty solid ground. That's what I presume he was thinking of. Certainly a plurality of responses were negative.
You're just wrong about what the "haven't tried it" response means.
Well, carry on. We already know that you're full of it.
If that makes you feel better. Someday you may understand how to interpret null. I won't hold it against you if you don't come back and apologize.
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And some day you may understand the word "neutral". Oh well.
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No. He was wrong to say that most people had a negative opinion of Windows in that poll.
How?
46.05% negative, 22.36% positive, 31.59% neutral (assuming we give the benefit of the doubt on part of that percentage). Most people (46.05%) were negative. If we shift it to:
If he'd said that most people who participated in the poll who had experienced Windows had a negative opinion, he'd be on pretty solid ground.
More solid ground. That would put it at ~2/3 negative. But still, most responses were negative.
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Please don't ever go into a profession where you need to interpret statistics.
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And some day you may understand the word "neutral". Oh well.
And some day you will stop interpreting neutrals as positive.
When you are post-coital and you ask her how it was and she responds, "Meh", do you think she had a positive response? I bet you do.
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Where did I interpret neutral as positive?
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And some day you may understand the word "neutral". Oh well.
It's funny how you don't give up on teh stupid.
How?
46.05% negative, 22.36% positive, 31.59% neutral (assuming we give the benefit of the doubt on part of that percentage). Most people (46.05%) were negative
I think most requires 50%+. You have 46.05%, which is less than that.
More solid ground. That would put it at ~2/3 negative. But still, most responses were negative.
Yes, most responses that expressed an opinion. But there were some responses that did not express an opinion. Their opinions were null.
Please don't ever go into a profession where you need to interpret statistics.
It's funny because while he misses a qualifier, he's still right.
And some day you will stop interpreting neutrals as positive.
And then some day he'll notice that he was over counting neutrals.
Where did I interpret neutral as positive?
Yes, you're right. You didn't do that. You just made up some neutrals that didn't exist.
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I think most requires 50%+. You have 46.05%, which is less than that.
Hmmmm, that may be up for interpretation, and I may be wrong in my interpretation of that. I would say that I had been wrong if I had said "a majority" as a majority in my opinion (and I believe by definition) requires 50%.
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You're trying to pass your opinion as a god-given definition again.
Newsflash: Your opinion on what words mean doesn't make you right. It's a bit more complicated that computer science, y'know?
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Good point. I think most people interpret it as majority, but it's the second definition below. It's certainly a bit ambiguous here in your usage referring to a plurality.
Dictionary.com | Meanings & Definitions of English Words
The world's leading online dictionary: English definitions, synonyms, word origins, example sentences, word games, and more. A trusted authority for 25+ years!
most
[mohst]
Spell Syllables
Synonyms Word Origin
adjective, superl. of much or many with more as compar.
1.
in the greatest quantity, amount, measure, degree, or number:
to win the most votes.
2.
in the majority of instances:
Most operations are successful.
3.
greatest, as in size or extent:
the most talent.
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You're trying to pass your opinion as a god-given definition again.
...and when you just make shit up whole cloth, it does not make you right.
But, FWIW, I honestly don't see how he did that. Society agrees on a set of definitions, you choose to consider those opinion. You prerogative, but you are wrong.
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You're trying to pass your opinion as a god-given definition again.
What opinion is that? Please specify.
Your opinion on what words mean doesn't make you right.
I'm talking about how to interpret the poll. It's not just about the definition of a word.
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@Rhywden said:
You're trying to pass your opinion as a god-given definition again.
...and when you just make shit up whole cloth, it does not make you right.
But, FWIW, I honestly don't see how he did that. Society agrees on a set of definitions, you choose to consider those opinion. You prerogative, but you are wrong.
I have yet to see such a set of definitions which prove him right.
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Good point. I think most people interpret it as majority, but it's the second definition below. It's certainly a bit ambiguous here in your usage referring to a plurality.
...and #1 is:
in the greatest quantity, amount, measure, degree, or number:to win the most votes.
The greatest quantity is the 46.05%.
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I have yet to see such a set of definitions which prove him right.
I am not going to spoon feed you. I have a newborn at home. I will be doing enough of that very soon.
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I have yet to see such a set of definitions which prove him right.
Look, I'm not the person trying to classify an opinion that doesn't exist. You haven't justified your practice of making up opinions for these people yet.
LMGTFY - Let Me Google That For You
