What are the pros/cons to upgrading to Windows 10?



  • I'm seeing a lot of fanboy and anti-fanboy commentary out there, but no concrete information.

    Suggestions?

    And try not to hype, just state plainly.

    I want to know if my machine will perform better.


  • sockdevs

    • if you are not on a touchscreen device and that device is running 8 or 8.1 upgrading gets you a massive improvement in usability as 10 doesn't appear to assume touchscreen devices.
    • I've noticed marked improvements in boot times on all devices i upgraded to W10, this is more noticable on low end devices, but it is present on my gaming rig as well.
    • W10 will by default schedule reboots for updates at a time you won't likely be using the computer. the default time is 3AM local IIRC but that will self adjust over time based on your usage patterns or you can set it yourself.
    • Cortana is actually pretty cool. she's not all that the fanboys and girls make her out to be, but still pretty cool.
    • "metro" apps can be windowed, not just split screened.
    • If you're privacy paranoid W10 will phone home for quite a lot of things (live tile updates, cortana, stuff like that) I personally don't consider that a critical issue, but some do.

  • Grade A Premium Asshole

    Con: It makes you a basic bitch.



  • @accalia said:

    W10 will by default schedule reboots

    :wtf:


  • sockdevs

    that is an awkward phrasing is it not?

    maybe if i add some commas?

    W10, will, by, default, schedule, reboots

    ouch. went too far there...

    W10 will, by default, schedule reboots

    there, is that better?



  • So, you'll be able to disable a feature that shouldn't exist.

    Anyway, requiring a reboot after an upgrade will always remain Windows biggest WTF


  • sockdevs

    -shrug-

    you can't disable the reboots, not unless you're running enterprise.

    but you cna choose when they are forced to happen, and you do get three days to reboot at your own convenience.

    I'm not a fan of windows implementation of the reboots, but i get where they are coming from making it so you are forced to stay up to date with security patches and stuff...


  • Discourse touched me in a no-no place

    @accalia said:

    you can't disable the reboots, not unless you're running enterprise.

    TRWTF…



  • Yeah, they (accalia) are not making things better.



  • LPT: When your system has to "reboot" daily, you've got a problem.

    This requires jeffing


  • sockdevs

    @dkf said:

    TRWTF

    be that as it may, you must admit the stated purpose of the forced reboots for workstation editions of their software is at least made with good intentions.

    server editions do not have forced reboots.


  • sockdevs

    @Eldelshell said:

    LPT: When your system has to "reboot" daily, you've got a problem.

    the update release cycle is not that frequent. on w8 it was once a week at the worst, usually once every month or so. not every update pack requires a reboot, so no reboot is scheduled if the updates don't need one.



  • I feel like 10 gives me back all the stuff 8 took away.

    I have a hierarchical start menu, and can actually find applications again. I don't have the jarring switch to full screen metro. I can run a dozen apps at once, and I can use a mouse instead of a touchscreen.

    Most of the stuff people complain about is relatively minor. The update reboot isn't what I'd prefer, but I understand how it will help most people. Wifi Sense doesn't share your networks by default.

    The insider builds were a bit wonky in low-bandwidth environments- I'm often on 1.54 Mbps, and sharing even that. This has improved significantly in recent builds. In RTM, I think the only thing I notice is Cortana turning off parts of herself.


  • mod

    Does anyone have any insight as to the pros/cons of upgrading from 7?


  • sockdevs

    Remove my first and the second from last bullet points and my comment will apply to Windows 7.

    also it's free. :-P


  • mod

    Sure, but if it takes 50% more computing resources, that's a net loss for me >.>


  • sockdevs

    i havent done any scientific research or anything, but i nopticed that w8 is generally more performant than tw7 on the same hardware and the same is true for W8=>w10 in my experience.

    therefore i can infer that it's likely that w7=>w10 will give a net performacne improvement

    and in the case that it does nto give a performance improvement if you upgrade in place you have 30 days to decide to roll back to Windows 7 before you're stuck on W10. ;-)



  • I upgraded two of my machines from W7 recently. W10 seems a bit more responsive to me. Both machines are 2-3 year old entry level laptops. I didn't have the guts to upgrade my work machine yet.


  • Discourse touched me in a no-no place

    @Eldelshell said:

    When your system has to "reboot" daily, you've got a problem.

    That's pretty unusual.



  • I'm on 7 too.

    So ultimately the news is good.


  • Grade A Premium Asshole

    @accalia said:

    you can't disable the reboots, not unless you're running enterprise.

    Not even with Group Policy?

    I am feeling more than a bit fucked by this upgrade. As we run the Enterprise version, there is no easy upgrade path. Also, the Win10 ISOs are not available for me on VLSC yet for some damned reason. I could install a Win7 or Win non-Enterprise version and upgrade right now though. But then I would have to suffer their reboots, which piss me off and I have to update on Microsofts schedule.

    The entire debacle annoys me



  • @xaade said:

    I want to know if my machine will perform better.

    Perform better in what way? Do you have any specific concerns?

    If you have games that support DirectX 12, they'll get a pretty huge framerate boost from Windows 10.



  • Pro: Upgrading would probably get rid of that unmovable, always-on-top reminder window that's been annoying me for a while.



  • @Eldelshell said:

    Anyway, requiring a reboot after an upgrade will always remain Windows biggest WTF

    It would be a bigger WTF if it wrote the files and didn't reboot-- meaning the vulnerable code was still running on the system. We've talked about this ad nauseum. Windows does what it do because of design decisions made long before "the Internet" was a thing people even vaguely anticipated getting updates from. (Actually before "the Internet" was a thing at all.)



  • @Eldelshell said:

    LPT: When your system has to "reboot" daily, you've got a problem.

    WTF? Have you ever used Windows? It doesn't have to "reboot" daily.

    Nominally, it reboots once a month on Patch Tuesday (or one or two days afterward, depending.) Unless there's an issue considered too critical to wait for the patch window, those are pushed out immediately. But probably 9-10 months out of the year, it only patches one time during that month.

    How is it possible you're posting on this site and so ignorant about how Microsoft updates work?

    That said, this new Windows 10 development style might mean more frequent patches, I don't know yet. Microsoft's given no indication I'm aware of that the Patch Tuesday concept is going away.



  • @accalia said:

    you can't disable the reboots, not unless you're running enterprise.

    Win10Pro gives you the "Defer upgrades" option. So you can get a little more control.

    In general, I'm happy with the upgrade... Except

    • There's a couple shell32 bugs that are extremely annoying. One affects pinning a program (you'll get 2 icons, and jumplists won't work). The other is SHBrowseForFolder. (Using certain options, the dialog doesn't start where you tell it to. Since we filter non-local drives, that causes a problem since we're no longer in CSIDL_DRIVES)
    • Some of the MS games run like crap. They were all very nice on Win8
      -- Solitaire: Runs like crap. Locks up often.
      -- Sudoku: The ad actually covers part of the screen
      -- Solitaire/Sudoku/Minesweeper/Mahjong/Jigsaw: Not nearly as pleasant on a hidpi system (Yoga2Pro). Usable, but things like their start screens only use 1/2 the screen


  • @Yamikuronue said:

    Sure, but if it takes 50% more computing resources, that's a net loss for me >.>

    Windows 7 is more performant than Vista.

    Windows 8 is more performant than Windows 7. (Except disk usage.)

    So far, I think it's safe to say Windows 10 is more performant than Windows 8.

    Things swung around the other direction quite some time ago. Each new version of Windows runs faster on the same hardware than the previous.

    Other than perhaps disk, there's no way Windows 10 takes 50% more computing resources than Windows 7.



  • @blakeyrat said:

    How is it possible you're posting on this site and so ignorant about how Microsoft updates work?

    Because the updates are convenient enough that he can't remember the frequency.



  • That's weird, as I think Enterprise is available on MSDN. Which is odd since MSDN isn't really designed for VL.


  • mod

    Good to know. I went from XP to 7 and it required a lot more hardware, and I haven't upgraded in place since.



  • @Yamikuronue said:

    Good to know. I went from XP to 7 and it required a lot more hardware, and I haven't upgraded in place since.

    That's actually not true from my experience. Windows 7 actually ran significantly better on my shitty little netbook than the XP it shipped with originally. (Vista, however, was a complete non-starter.)

    Anyway, the point is: your concerns are really out-of-date. AS IS YOUR STEAM-POWERED ANCIENT OS! ZIING!



  • @blakeyrat said:

    WTF? Have you ever used Windows? It doesn't have to "reboot" daily.

    I didn't say "Windows" but "your system" as that application that eats all of the memory of a server and has to be rebooted daily. Got it? Reading comprehension required.


  • mod

    @blakeyrat said:

    AS IS YOUR STEAM-POWERED ANCIENT OS!

    You got me, this is my machine:



  • Ok well I guess I'm just Mr. Fucking Stupid! DERP DERP DERP!!!!! Time to eat gravel!!!



  • I'm impressed that you can run Steam on that.

    I would think that Big Picture mode would be a bit of a stretch.



  • More like a shrink.

    A stretch would be running an SNES emulator on my HD monitor.



  • @blakeyrat said:

    Ok well I guess I'm just Mr. Fucking Stupid!

    I think you've hit a record number of people agreeing with you with that phrase :wink:



  • Remember when people were saying that thing "windows versions are alternatively good and shit" and other people were saying "that's not true"?

    Well, it was true. Windows 7 was Vista with the mistakes fixed, and Windows 10 is 8 with the mistakes fixed.


  • sockdevs

    Which release was it that XP was with the mistakes fixed?

    :trolleybus:



  • @Eldelshell said:

    @accalia said:
    W10 will by default schedule reboots

    :wtf:

    Um, I'm pretty certain all Windows have done this.

    Go check your Windows Update settings, if it's set to automatically install you'll also be able to set the time it reboots at.


  • sockdevs

    Windows 7, if i was domain admin i'd be able to set when they are installed, not when the system reboots for the install.

    Anyone with Windows 8 or 8.1 care to provide similar SS for comparison?


  • Grade A Premium Asshole

    @accalia said:

    Which release was it that XP was with the mistakes fixed?

    XP was just a prettier version of 2000, and 2000 fixed the clusterfuck that was Windows ME. :trolleybus:



  • @accalia said:

    i'd be able to set when they are installed, not when the system reboots for the install

    I always assumed "install" actually meant "reboot and install", which is why it's set at 2 AM.



  • @Polygeekery said:

    Windows ME

    Godwin's law (window's version)



  • @Polygeekery said:

    2000 fixed the clusterfuck that was Windows ME.

    You got your timeline mixed up here.



  • Windows 2000 (released February 17, 2000) came out before Windows ME (released September 14, 2000) did.


  • sockdevs

    @anonymous234 said:

    I always assumed "install" actually meant "reboot and install", which is why it's set at 2 AM.

    not in windows 7 and not in windows 8 to my experience, but i don't have a machine with 8 in front of me to verify right now

    that's just selecting when to install, not when the reboot should happen.

    windows 7 wouldn't reboot automatically, it'd just start nagging you at some point about wanting to reboot. Windows 8 would nag too, but much lower key and eventually (at about 2 days) just go ahead and reboot anyway


  • Grade A Premium Asshole

    @blakeyrat said:

    You got your timeline mixed up here.

    Holy shit, you are right. ME was general availability 7 months after 2000 was.

    Regardless, ME should have been aborted. :trolleybus:


  • Grade A Premium Asshole

    @blakeyrat said:

    You got your timeline mixed up here.

    What was the fucking point of ME then? Did they just want to release an "also-ran" operating system?



  • I wonder if I should call in winGod's Law?


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