Zeldathong hype





  • Nintendo sucks.



  • So they're just... playing a game?

    I'll wait for AGDQ.



  • playing all the games

    the appeal of zeldathon is that the chat isn't shit



  • All of the streams you've linked me too so far have been like 57 bored guys all sitting around a couch saying nothing in creepy silence. You know, like the preview picture of that YouTube of the trailer.

    I'm all for donating to charity, but you know those telethons they used to have on TV? They were actually... entertaining.

    I think the problem is that while there are a lot of people who can do live entertaining comedy during a stream (Slowbeef and ChipCheezum come instantly to mind), none of them can do it for like 6 hours at a time. And who can blame them; especially playing Zelda games! You'd be out of material in like a half hour. "Oh look, here's the next shitty Zelda game of the roughly 58361 identical titles Nintendo released."

    Besides all that, the only good Zelda game is Zelda II: Adventures of Link.



  • @blakeyrat said:

    Besides all that, the only good Zelda game is Zelda II: Adventures of Link.

    This from the guy that thinks the fundamentally mis-designed Sonic games are the "best platformer(s) ever".



  • @Bort said:

    This from the guy that thinks the fundamentally mis-designed Sonic games are the "best platformer(s) ever".

    Them's fighting words!



  • Only because they're true words? There's a reason Nintendo is still around and that other company isn't...

    Nintendo may be behind the curve in a lot of areas, but they have an arsenal of games that people crave.


  • SockDev

    @WernerCD said:

    There's a reason Nintendo is still around and that other company isn't

    Sega's still around; they're planning to release some Yakuza and Persona stuff this year. And the blue furball's getting a game this year too, albeit a mobile title. Well, already got; it was soft-launched in Canada a few months back.



  • @WernerCD said:

    There's a reason Nintendo is still around and that other company isn't...

    Sega? They released a game like a month ago.

    And yes there is a reason, that reason is Nintendo fans are really stupid and nostalgic.

    @WernerCD said:

    Nintendo may be behind the curve in a lot of areas,

    Are there any areas where they're not?

    I was actually thinking about buying a Wii-U until I found out:

    1. You can't buy it without the stupidly-expensive dumb TV controller. (I don't need a SECOND screen and I'm not a little kid begging for TV time from my parents, how about selling a version with the Pro controller instead of making me pay $150 for a dumb controller I'd never use, then having to spend MORE money on top of that to get the normal controller.)

    2. Downloaded games are tied to the hardware, not your account. Meaning, if Nintendo's shitty hardware fails, YOU JUST LOSE ALL YOUR MONEY FOREVER. WHAT THE FUCK!? Even the original Xbox Live download service on the original Xbox wasn't that fucking idiotic! How has Nintendo not been sued over thi-- oh right, nostalgic and stupid fans.

    @WernerCD said:

    but they have an arsenal of games that people crave.

    Right; and it's all remakes of the same 5 games over and over and over and over and over and...

    The only reason anybody buys any of them is nostalgia for the gaming system they had as a kid.

    I have to admit, at least Splatoon is original.



  • @blakeyrat said:

    Right; and it's all remakes of the same 5 games over and over and over and over and over and...

    I will admit it. I bought a Wii U recently just for smash bros, but I like that game. Sure, it's all the same game, but I only have the latest one.

    @blakeyrat said:

    the stupidly-expensive dumb TV controller.

    I actually like this thing in some ways. They use it for some AR features sometimes, which I approve of. But yeah, when used as just another TV like smash bros does, it's worthless.


  • SockDev

    Lego City Undercover makes good use of the pad as a scanner/utility pad/map/shop thing. And Affordable Space Adventures uses it for the ship control panel, for engine settings, landing gear, stuff like that.



  • Wind Waker HD makes good use of it, but that's yet another Nintendo remake.



  • So it has features you don't/wont use. Maybe quite a few people won't use (I'd be happier with just a plain ole controller, but I have used the "tablet" features just often enough to not be useful, personally). But it's a fine line between an add-on that won't ever get developed for due to Chicken-Egg issues (360 Kinect)... and a standard feature that's somewhat unwanted and underutilized (X-Bone Kinect). Good reasons all around to include them, but possibly overkill. I also don't like their account system and hardware ties - like I said, Nintendo does have issues.

    You can bemoan people being tied to nostalgia and known IP - but those ties are strong and they continually rehash those games in interesting and fun ways. Mario, Metroid and Zelda alone are games that have matured in great ways over the years.

    Those ties to established IP is why Final Fantasy continues to print money (Final Fantasy 7 now on Android with shinier pixels!!!) as does remakes/rehashes of old movies (Fast and the Furious 87: Race to the Depends Factory) or brands like the Marvel Universe: They work. People want it.

    Compared to new IP that underwhelms like Futureland (or whatever that new movie is) and it's very easy to see why companies reuse brands over and over and over...



  • To be fair, the "tied to the device, not your NNID" is a pretty raw deal. (3DS has System Transfer but that doesn't work if the device doesn't work.)


  • Discourse touched me in a no-no place

    @hungrier said:

    Wind Waker HD makes good use of it

    Does it do anything more than plugging a GBA into a GC did? Because that was purely optional and a convenience feature.



  • @Magus said:

    I actually like this thing in some ways. They use it for some AR features sometimes, which I approve of. But yeah, when used as just another TV like smash bros does, it's worthless.

    That's fine for you, but I don't want it, I'd never use it, and they charge extra to get the perfectly normal controller I'd want.

    I mean, yeah, Microsoft pulled the same shit when they initially sold the XBone with Kinect and no option to opt-out of Kinect, but here's the difference: Microsoft FIXED THE SITUATION. Nintendo's still doing the shitty ass thing. And probably will until the end of time, since they generally have NO clue what the fuck they're doing and are just propped-up by moron nostalgic fans and (apparently?) toy sales now.

    (And when you bought a Xbone with a Kinect, they gave you the normal controller too.)

    @WernerCD said:

    So it has features you don't/wont use.

    But I have to pay for.

    @WernerCD said:

    I also don't like their account system and hardware ties - like I said, Nintendo does have issues.

    SO STOP GIVING THEM MONEY UNTIL THE ISSUES ARE FIXED.

    This is the problem: the "invisible hand" of capitalism doesn't fucking WORK if morons keep giving the company with defective products more money.

    @WernerCD said:

    You can bemoan people being tied to nostalgia and known IP - but those ties are strong and they continually rehash those games in interesting and fun ways.

    Right; nostalgia. How does that change anything I said?

    @WernerCD said:

    Mario, Metroid and Zelda alone are games that have matured in great ways over the years.

    Oh right. Metroid: Other M was a masterpiece of storytelling, as we've discussed on this forum many times.

    @WernerCD said:

    Those ties to established IP is why Final Fantasy continues to print money (Final Fantasy 7 now on Android with shinier pixels!!!)

    Nostalgic morons. Yes, yes, I already said this. Stop repeating it.

    @WernerCD said:

    Compared to new IP that underwhelms like Futureland (or whatever that new movie is) and it's very easy to see why companies reuse brands over and over and over...

    Tomorrowland failed because it's a terrible movie, according to every review I've seen. It has nothing to do with it being new IP.

    @riking said:

    To be fair, the "tied to the device, not your NNID" is a pretty raw deal. (3DS has System Transfer but that doesn't work if the device doesn't work.)

    It's not a "pretty raw deal", it's a "this is so fucking customer-hostile HOW IS IT LEGAL?" kind of thing.



  • This topic would be so much more interesting if it were zeldathong hype.


  • Discourse touched me in a no-no place

    @blakeyrat said:

    Tomorrowland failed because it's a terrible movie, according to every review I've seen.

    The first half of it was perfectly servicable if not groundbreaking. You'd probably hate it because of that last part, though.



  • @FrostCat said:

    @hungrier said:
    Wind Waker HD makes good use of it

    Does it do anything more than plugging a GBA into a GC did? Because that was purely optional and a convenience feature.

    It's totally different. The gamepad shows the menu in WWHD, letting you switch items and do stuff without pausing the game.

    You can also play the game on the gamepad, in which case you do have to pause.



  • @blakeyrat said:

    This is the problem: the "invisible hand" of capitalism doesn't fucking WORK if morons keep giving the company with defective products more money.

    No, it still works.

    The morons want defective products by demand.

    And Nintendo is delivering.



  • @blakeyrat said:

    Tomorrowland failed because it's a terrible movie, according to every review I've seen. It has nothing to do with it being new IP.

    It also took its headliner star way outside of his element.

    The movie would have been better with the captain of Serenity.



  • Every review I read independently said the movie turns into an extremely unsubtle Objectivist propaganda film. I don't think any cast change could save that.



  • @blakeyrat said:

    extremely unsubtle Objectivist propaganda film.

    Funny that, Rand opposes anarchy.

    Meh, I don't get the connections.

    I suppose you can say that casting off government is what happens to people that inhabit tomorrowland?

    However, I can't draw the line from objectivism to the idea that government is bad.



  • I haven't seen the movie.



  • @blakeyrat said:

    But I have to pay for.

    Then don't pay for it? I paid for it because, as I said, I've used it enough that it's not worthless. Is it worth the premium? probably not... but it's not totally worthless as you seem to be convinced it is.

    @blakeyrat said:

    SO STOP GIVING THEM MONEY UNTIL THE ISSUES ARE FIXED.

    This is the problem: the "invisible hand" of capitalism doesn't fucking WORK if morons keep giving the company with defective products more money.

    Right; nostalgia. How does that change anything I said?

    Oh right. Metroid: Other M was a masterpiece of storytelling, as we've discussed on this forum many times.

    Nostalgic morons. Yes, yes, I already said this. Stop repeating it.

    Tomorrowland failed because it's a terrible movie, according to every review I've seen. It has nothing to do with it being new IP.

    The problem is that it's not a black/white issue. I don't like the hardware tie and think the controller is a feature that isn't completely needed - as well as other issues - BUT I think the platform and games have a big enough draw to overcome those issues so I bought it. I like to think I weighed the pro's and con's and made an informed decision.

    You don't like 1 or 2 things (or 10) about a company, so you refuse all business to that company. Good for you. golf clap Good for you. You hate nostalgia... we get it (Stop repeating yourself as well? Doctor, take your own medicine?)...

    Capitalism is obviously working because it's not based on one mans opinion. Rightly or wrongly - and amazingly enough - companies seem to have an easier time monetizing stuff people want. Despite having millions of people that hate Sony, MS or Nintendo, each company seems to STILL sell millions of consoles...



  • @WernerCD said:

    Then don't pay for it?

    I'm not.

    @WernerCD said:

    but it's not totally worthless as you seem to be convinced it is.

    I never said it was "totally worthless".

    @WernerCD said:

    Capitalism is obviously working because it's not based on one mans opinion. Rightly or wrongly - and amazingly enough - companies seem to have an easier time monetizing stuff people want. Despite having millions of people that hate Sony, MS or Nintendo, each company seems to STILL sell millions of consoles...

    If Nintendo makes a profit taking advantage of stupid people, that's fine with me. I'm just disappointed that it's possible.



  • Perfect markets can't exist with incomplete information. Unfortunately, Nintendo won't tell us how to write games for their consoles.



  • @WernerCD said:

    You hate nostalgia.

    He hates your nostalgia. And my nostalgia. Blakeystalgia is where everything is awesome.



  • @blakeyrat said:

    I'm just disappointed that it's possible.

    Well, we could execute people for failing aptitude tests, but...



  • @Magus said:

    Well, we could execute people for failing aptitude tests, but...

    But we're too busy executing people who clip their toenails in public? Right.



  • Mostly just people who take up too much space on trains, because that's rape.


  • Discourse touched me in a no-no place

    @blakeyrat said:

    Every review I read independently said the movie turns into an extremely unsubtle Objectivist propaganda film. I don't think any cast change could save that.

    I wouldn't put it that way. The movie subjects you to a barrage of "we're destroying the environment and it's going to destroy us". The main character--the teen girl, not Clooney--disagrees. It turns out, just like many recently-publicized college rape stories, [spoiler]that the whole thing was ginned up by the Tomorrowland people[/spoiler]. I don't know if that's really Objectivist.


  • Discourse touched me in a no-no place

    @xaade said:

    I suppose you can say that casting off government is what happens to people that inhabit tomorrowland?

    No, not really. [spoiler]The Tommorowland people are supposed to be "the best and brightest" and they're the ones who precipitated the coming catastrophe[/spoiler].



  • Which seems to be the opposite of what Objectivism proposes, which is to stop hindering the best and brightest through excessive force.


  • Discourse touched me in a no-no place

    @xaade said:

    Which seems to be the opposite of what Objectivism proposes, which is to stop hindering the best and brightest through excessive force.

    Hrm. Ok, in that case, the Tomorrowland people were Objectivist, because that's what they were doing by not [spoiler]stopping the Apocalypse[/spoiler].



  • @Magus said:

    Mostly just people who take up too much space on trains, because that's rape.

    I actually get pretty pissed off about this.

    Because some whiny fat bitch is claiming that her experience is just as traumatizing as getting actually raped.

    It's a very selfish disservice to people who have literally "survived" an actual life-threatening situation.

    Their bitching is taking up more than its share of internet space, and according to them, that's rape!



  • The worst thing you've ever experienced is still the worst thing you've ever experienced. I can see how a person who's had an easy life would have a hard time with things that someone who's had a hard life would effortlessly ignore. I just don't see how complaining about it helps.



  • Not stopping the apocolypse, which kills everyone, is "to stop hindering the best and brightest through excess force"?

    Allowing everyone to die would be hindering the best and brightest, because not all of the best and brightest would be in Tomorrowland.

    Does not compute.


  • Discourse touched me in a no-no place

    House's character made it clear he didn't care about our world getting wiped out. That leaves the T'land people the ability to keep doing whatever they were doing, without worrying about the our world. They broke off contact once they "realized" the apocalypse was inevitable.

    Rand's Galt's Gulch people didn't care about what happened to the people left behind in the rest of the world--they exacerbated the problem, in fact, by taking the "best and brightest" away.

    Call T'landers loosely Objectivist, if you want. Or not at all if you have a problem with the idea. I'm just saying you could make a case. General House was all in on the apocalypse.



  • @Magus said:

    The worst thing you've ever experienced is still the worst thing you've ever experienced.

    Which is fine, in your own vacuum.

    But that doesn't give you a right to say it's equal to everyone else's worse experience, even to the point where you say its systemic.

    I mean, they're claiming that there's a system in place through the subconscious minds of men everywhere, that purposefully takes up more than average space in an attempt to subjugate women.

    It's like, if I spread my legs on the train, it's an objective of mine to put fear in the hearts of women throughout the train.

    I mean, I'd have to believe that SJW live in absolute paranoia, which they are causing to themselves.

    But even still, to say that compares to rape, is offensive.



  • So you're saying

    "They refused to go down with the rest of the ship, based on objectivist principles, of preserving the ability of the best and brightest to continue their work unhindered."

    That's a very big stretch.

    In a way, that makes Handsome Jack objectivist also, in the context that he believes himself to be the best and brightest.


  • Discourse touched me in a no-no place

    @xaade said:

    They refused to go down with the rest of the ship

    Did you see the movie? That's not an accurate description of the events. [spoiler]they precipitated the catastrophe.[/spoiler].



  • @xaade said:

    But that doesn't give you a right to say it's equal to everyone else's worse experience, even to the point where you say its systemic.

    I both agree and disagree. Different people have different things they consider awful. Something could be just as bad to one person as rape is to another. I wouldn't label anything objectively worse than another.

    But calling it systemic or part of a heteropatriarchal transmysoginistic rape illuminati is just plain stupid.



  • @Magus said:

    Something could be just as bad to one person as rape is to another

    If the situations are relatively close in level.

    Once you get so far apart as rape and wide-sitting-in-train, that no longer applies.



  • @xaade said:

    If the situations are relatively close in level.

    What is this 'level'? Who assigns it?

    I do agree that it's dumb to take people in front of a judge over this. I just can also imagine people feeling hurt over it.



  • @Magus said:

    What is this 'level'? Who assigns it?

    @Magus said:

    take people in front of a judge

    Funny that you answered your own question.

    I wonder if someone kidnapping me and torturing me and making permanent physical changes to my body, is as traumatizing as having to experience fart rape.

    But, levels aren't even important.

    It's more revealing that these women are being intellectually dishonest if they claim that they feel fart rape is worth the same frustration as actual rape.

    So even if you were right about everyone's worst experience being equal, these girls are outright intellectually lying.



  • @xaade said:

    I wonder if someone kidnapping me and torturing me and making permanent physical changes to my body, is as traumatizing as having to experience fart rape.

    Arguably it is. It really might be just as painful to someone else as that is to you, because they will never experience anything worse. It's unlikely, and they're probably lying. But it's certainly not impossible.

    But law isn't about pain. It's about punishing the worst offenses for the greatest outcome. so if there are only three people in the world who have a problem, if they aren't the president, they aren't going to be able to pass a law for it.



  • @hungrier said:

    It's totally different. The gamepad shows the menu in WWHD, letting you switch items and do stuff without pausing the game.

    Uh... last I checked, humans only have two hands and no tail. So, you'd either need a second human, set down your Pro controller, or awkwardly try to use the tablet while holding the Pro controller.

    Not to mention you have to look away from the TV to do it.

    Not exactly game changing... arguably the 3DS versions of Ocarina of Time and Majora's Mask are more game changing because the touch screen (right next to where you hands already are) allows you to both see maps and stuff, plus have access to 4 inventory items instead of 3.

    @hungrier said:

    You can also play the game on the gamepad, in which case you do have to pause.

    ...which Blakey specifically said he didn't care about.



  • @xaade said:

    It's more revealing that these women are being intellectually dishonest if they claim that they feel fart rape is worth the same frustration as actual rape.

    The fart rape thing was satire. Not that you couldn't find other outrageous things.


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