Windows 10 can-of-worms



  • Reading an article on howtogeek about why win 10 is so much better than the predecessors. Key paragraph, which they come back to again later in the article:

    I’ve started sitting down at stable, solid windows 8.1 and missing features of 10. I find myself wishing for the Start Menu, which I haven’t used (or missed) for over a year. I groan when I open a Modern/Metro app and it demands to eat an entire screen. I don’t care about the voice command aspect, but Cortana’s information is useful and really handy. Because I miss these things when they’re gone, I know they’re good. That’s the sign of a good update.

    :wtf: :question: the best thing with win 10 is that it does away with two debated "features" in win 8?? That's the sign of a good update indeed.

    Article url:



  • So http://www.classicshell.net/ gets you half-way to Windows 10


  • sockdevs

    ##High End Performance on Low End Hardware

    .... since when was an i5 with 8GB of ram low end hardware? call me back when you get good performance out of a Atom Z27xx based tablet with only 2GB of ram.


  • Winner of the 2016 Presidential Election

    @Mikael_Svahnberg said:

    I’ve started sitting down at stable, solid windows 8.1 and missing features of 10. I find myself wishing for the Start Menu, which I haven’t used (or missed) for over a year. I groan when I open a Modern/Metro app and it demands to eat an entire screen.

    Probably against the point of this topic, but QFT.


  • Winner of the 2016 Presidential Election

    @accalia said:

    .... since when was an i5 with 8GB of ram low end hardware? call me back when you get good performance out of a Atom Z27xx based tablet with only 2GB of ram.

    XD I was thinking that too. I think the point of the screenshot was to... make a connection with performance? I dunno...
    It does seem to be fairly faster on my crappy test Windows tablet though, so I'd be inclined to believe the article writer

    ED: Discotiming strikes again. This is after a reload, by the way...

    EDIT EDIT: And it fixed itself before the screenshot. Bleh


  • sockdevs

    oh i know it's faster and more performant. i use W10 myself in all my windows VMs now because of that.

    my issue is the juxtaposition of the title and the image which appears to be making the claim that low end hardware is an i5 with 8GB of ram.


  • :belt_onion:

    @Mikael_Svahnberg said:

    the best thing with win 10 is that it does away with two debated "features" in win 8?? That's the sign of a good update indeed.

    TLDR:

    Win 10 has some good things from Windows 8 without some of the bad things about Windows 8, then some other stuff was added but in the end it's the same shit

  • Winner of the 2016 Presidential Election

    @accalia said:

    an i5 with 8GB of ram

    An i5 released in 2013, with a sub-2GHz clock speed isn't super low end, but it's not cutting edge either.


  • sockdevs

    it's a hell of a lot higher end than an Atom processor and even tablets sold today are getting fitted with those things if you want sub $400 prices. if you're going to claim low end then go low end.

    :-P


  • sockdevs

    @accalia said:

    go low end

    :giggity:



  • @JoeCool said:

    So http://www.classicshell.net/ gets you half-way to Windows 10

    I thought that was "classics hell" and was like "what the hell?"


  • Winner of the 2016 Presidential Election

    The version for Win10 will be called toxichellstew.



  • @accalia said:

    call me back when you get good performance out of a Atom Z27xx based tablet with only 2GB of ram.

    Huh? Both 8.1 and 10 work decently. Any problems happen when an application itself has higher demands, but Windows works nearly without any lag.

    The real issue with those tablets is storage (also, what retarded tablet makers do with it - yes, sure, I totally need 2 partition on a 32-gig system, plus a 5-gig recovery), but AFAIK Win10 isn't any better in that regard.

    @JBert said:

    then some other stuff was added

    Mostly bugs, from what little I've seen. And the system was utterly confusing from Metro standpoint from what I've seen.

    For desktop, it's been the same shit since Vista.


  • Winner of the 2016 Presidential Election

    @Maciejasjmj said:

    Windows works nearly without any lag

    It doesn't crash either


  • sockdevs

    @Maciejasjmj said:

    Both 8.1 and 10 work decently.

    if IE lags displaying even a simple site (i'm talking like google.com simple not discourse simple) i'd hesitate to call that decent" performance.

    However my point stands. a two year old I5 at sub 2.0ghz is not exactly high end hardware but it's still a hell of a lot better than the Atom and Celeron, or the AMD A8 processors that most tablets get and it's better than an i3.

    an i5, even a two year old one, is not low end hardware.



  • @accalia said:

    an i5, even a two year old onw, is not low end hardware.

    I'm still using an old Sandy Bridge i5 from 2011 and it's certainly nowhere near low-end.


  • sockdevs

    my point exactly!



  • It's the classic Harkonnen Beast Rabban / Savior Feyd-Rautha gambit.



  • @Jaloopa said:

    It doesn't crash either

    Actually, I haven't managed to crash it yet. The WiFi driver is moronic and requires an adapter restart after waking up from sleep, and the touchscreen occasionally shits itself and has to be disabled and re-enabled in Device Manager, but Windows itself? Nah.

    Well, once, when it turned out deleting a recovery partition means you need it right away.

    @accalia said:

    if IE lags displaying even a simple site (i'm talking like google.com simple not discourse simple) i'd hesitate to call that decent" performance.

    Can't reproduce (at least on Metro IE). All sites work well, except for Discourse, but Discourse is... special.

    And even then it doesn't lag, it just breaks shit.


  • Winner of the 2016 Presidential Election

    I have a 2010 i5, and I don't think I've had anything be cpu bound in some time.



  • * TwelveBaud waves enthusiastically at his Pentium 4 Extreme Edition and 2GB DDR2



  • Windows 10 has been slow and buggy on my phone so far, but I expect that from unoptimised beta software.



  • @TwelveBaud said:

    * TwelveBaud waves enthusiastically at his Pentium 4 Extreme Edition and 2GB DDR2 space heater

    FTFY.


  • Winner of the 2016 Presidential Election

    Shit. Now I want to watch Dune again. I don't have three hours!

    I should probably finish reading that book, too. But I don't have... hmmm... 900ish pages... A lot of hours!


  • sockdevs

    @TwelveBaud said:

    * TwelveBaud waves enthusiastically at his Pentium 4 Extreme Edition and 2GB DDR2

    Retro :smile:



  • There is no version of Dune on Netflix Streaming.

    If you search for it, though, it recommends Tank Girl...

    ...

    Eh, what the hell.



  • @TwelveBaud said:

    * TwelveBaud waves enthusiastically at his Pentium 4 Extreme Edition and 2GB DDR2

    Liar. No way you're browsing Discourse on this thing.



  • Having seen all I could find of one of these two, and by the name of the other, I can only assume equal quality.



  • The Imdb page for Tank Girl shows Lori Petty in the starring role, whom I immediately recognized as a guest star in "Gravity", epsiode 13 of season 5 of Star Trek: Voyager. Also in Tank Girl is Malcolm McDowell, who co-starred in Star Trek: Generations.

    Small world.



  • Malcolm McDowell is in everything everywhere. His IMDB page breaks the Internets.

    I totally forgot Tank Girl had the Shaft theme in its soundtrack, and uses it when she first finds the tank she's later going to steal.



  • Tank Girl is a better movie than I remember.

    The funny thing is I think it's so unpopular because it was too faithful to the weird, frantic, plot-less comic it was adapted from. Also the ripper makeup is pretty awful, and even worse when they do animated segments that show what the rippers are supposed to look like.



  • @Maciejasjmj said:

    @TwelveBaud said:
    * TwelveBaud waves enthusiastically at his Pentium 4 Extreme Edition and 2GB DDR2

    Liar. No way you're browsing Discourse on this thing.

    My P4 not-Extreme Edition with, I think 3GB, runs it surprisingly well. Surprising that it runs at all, sure, but amazingly it isn't all that much worse than more modern hardware.



  • In an ironic twist:

    TAKE THIS SHIT OUT OF MY THREAD!

    $INSULT!



  • @Mikael_Svahnberg said:

    $INSULT!

    COMPLAIN!



  • @JoeCool said:

    So http://www.classicshell.net/ gets you half-way to Windows 10

    I used several of these and none are quite the same as native start menu (especially regarding search).

    @Onyx said:

    Shit. Now I want to watch Dune again. I don't have three hours!

    I should probably finish reading that book, too. But I don't have... hmmm... 900ish pages... A lot of hours!

    The first one is worth the read. I could never get into sequels.

    @blakeyrat said:

    There is no version of Dune on Netflix Streaming.

    If you search for it, though, it recommends Tank Girl...

    He was probably planning some "Balkan streaming", if piratebay has stabilized yet on their new domains.


  • Winner of the 2016 Presidential Election

    @cartman82 said:

    He was probably planning some "Balkan streaming", if piratebay has stabilized yet on their new domains.

    I tried proper streaming once (after going through a proxy, of course). Anyone else remember that Dr. Who episode that mostly featured a silent spinner? That episode suuucks.



  • @Mikael_Svahnberg said:

    Reading an article on howtogeek about why win 10 is so much better than the predecessors. Key paragraph, which they come back to again later in the article:

    I’ve started sitting down at stable, solid windows 8.1 and missing features of 10. I find myself wishing for the Start Menu, which I haven’t used (or missed) for over a year. I groan when I open a Modern/Metro app and it demands to eat an entire screen. I don’t care about the voice command aspect, but Cortana’s information is useful and really handy. Because I miss these things when they’re gone, I know they’re good. That’s the sign of a good update.

    :wtf: :question: the best thing with win 10 is that it does away with two debated "features" in win 8?? That's the sign of a good update indeed.


    Reading comprehension is apparently something you find difficult. He means that when he goes back to using Win8, he misses things that are in Win10 but not in Win8, like the Start Menu.

    He then says, paraphrasing slightly, that a good update is one where things they add are things you miss when you downdate and therefore you don't have them anymore.


  • Winner of the 2016 Presidential Election

    @Steve_The_Cynic said:

    he misses things that are in Win10 but not in Win8, like the Start Menu.

    The one that was there before but got removed in 8? So it's now new because... amnesia?

    Yes, I know, tiles in the start menu are new, but I doubt that's the reason the author of the article really misses on 8



  • @Onyx said:

    @Steve_The_Cynic said:
    he misses things that are in Win10 but not in Win8, like the Start Menu.

    The one that was there before but got removed in 8? So it's now new because... amnesia?

    Yes, I know, tiles in the start menu are new, but I doubt that's the reason the author of the article really misses on 8


    People forget stuff often, even people who were there in a way that should burn it indelibly into their memory. But yes, that's more or less it...



  • Thank you for a nice summary. You may not be aware that windowed applications and a start menu were things that existed in previous versions of windows. They were removed in Win8, and apparently re-added in Win10.

    So the "good update" reverts to a previous state.

    Glad to help!


  • sockdevs

    @Mikael_Svahnberg said:

    You may not be aware that windowed applications and a start menu were things that existed in previous versions of windows. They were removed in Win8, and apparently re-added in Win10.

    *is currently using a windowed app on Windows 8.1*

    I know what you mean though; fullscreen MetroModern UI apps ;)



  • @RaceProUK said:

    you

    And by "you" you mean the author of the article...

    I haven't really used Windows in ages, and don't keep up with what's allowed or not, or where to place your files or not. If I ever need to use it these days it's just an obnoxious shell to emacs.


  • sockdevs

    @Mikael_Svahnberg said:

    And by "you" you mean the author of the article

    Apparently so :smile:
    @Mikael_Svahnberg said:
    If I ever need to use it these days it's just an obnoxious shell to emacs.

    @Mikael_Svahnberg, the Swede who turned an entire OS into a shell for emacs :laughing:


    You're Swedish. yes? I forget :blush:



  • @RaceProUK said:

    @Mikael_Svahnberg, the Swede who turned an entire OS into a shell for emacs :laughing:

    Tried once to create a user with emacs as the default shell. Worked fine until I wanted to compile something and it launched the default shell for the compilation. :-(

    @RaceProUK said:

    You're Swedish. yes? I forget :blush:

    As native as they get. :-) Except for the 1/16 Indian and the 7/16 English.


  • Winner of the 2016 Presidential Election

    @Mikael_Svahnberg said:

    windowed applications

    To be fair, I don't think that "modern" apps ever had a windowed mode. So that's "new", in the context of modern apps, at least.


  • sockdevs

    @Onyx said:

    To be fair, I don't think that "modern" apps ever had a windowed mode.

    ISTR that that was going to be a feature of 8.1 but it got pulled for some rasin.


  • sockdevs

    @accalia said:

    pulled for some raisin

    Why do people insist on blaming a raisin for things like this‽
    <I'll be here all week!>


  • sockdevs

    <because it's funny, taking you serious>

    well for me at least i'm referencing Phillip J. Fry from this eppisode:

    not sure about everyone else.


  • sockdevs

    .... why is that image broken? it shows just fine when i open it in a new tab.


  • sockdevs

    <Good thing I remembered to check the raw first! :smile:

    Well… OK then.


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