"Implicit" vs. "inherent" - do you know the difference?



  • Very true. Unfortunately.

    Filed under: Does Amazon have a Dash button for brain bleach?



  • In many video games, enemy healers can't revive enemies whose corpse is blown up into many little pieces.



  • Is that something like a from you?!


  • Discourse touched me in a no-no place

    @aliceif said:

    while(a != 0 ? a --> b/b++ : false);

    What language are you using? That's UB in C and C++ because of the evaluation order issues with b/b++; you don't know whether the numerator will be the same as the denominator in those languages…



  • C# (<- how the F is that not descriptive)



  • Um,

    1. They haven't figured out east-asians are sexy.
    2. Just in case a guy's biology stops working, dress the character you want them to be attracted to in red.
    3. In case you can't tell the black guy isn't the leader since he's front and center, make the white guy use a power pose, and give the other guy a slacker pose.
    4. Fit in uninteresting characters that you want the audience to notice by having them stand sideways.
    5. If you're taller than the leader, you must sit.
    6. Comedy characters must wear scenery camouflage, just in case you mistakenly notice them when the scene isn't funny. And they must smile, in case you forget that.

    Because all these things aren't inherently built into our day to day stereotypes.


  • Discourse touched me in a no-no place

    @aliceif said:

    C# (<- how the F is that not descriptive)

    OK, that's well-defined. (That's got a strict left-to-right evaluation order.)


  • Banned

    @aliceif said:

    In many video games, enemy healers can't revive enemies whose corpse is blown up into many little pieces.

    But how many games have blowing up corpses?


  • FoxDev

    @Gaska said:

    But how many games have blowing up corpses?

    According to the Daily Mail, all of them


  • Discourse touched me in a no-no place

    @RaceProUK said:

    According to the Daily Mail, all of them

    According to me, not enough of them!


  • FoxDev

    My Little Pony: Apocalypse Ponies?


  • Discourse touched me in a no-no place

    Sesame Street 5: The Face of Death


  • FoxDev

    Teletubbies: Zombie Invasion


  • Discourse touched me in a no-no place

    @RaceProUK said:

    Teletubbies: Zombie Invasion

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nov6o2ib93k

    (You can stop watching that one at 1m 12)

    http://i.imgur.com/jWVm2.jpg


  • Discourse touched me in a no-no place

    Pingu 5: Assignment Miami Beach

    OK, that one's just strange.



  • @Gaska said:

    @aliceif said:
    In many video games, enemy healers can't revive enemies whose corpse is blown up into many little pieces.

    But how many games have blowing up corpses?

    If I made a mod that created an ability in Fallout that executed resurrect on a target, then I'd have a spell which could revive ally/enemy/yourMom even if their body was plastered across the desert. They'd come out whole, all limbs and head attached.



  • Preface: shut up about long post, last time discourse said it's better that replying to each post separately, so just find the part relating to you.

    @Gaska said:

    It must be pretty tough to write correctly if your keyboard has no Shift key.

    My Shift key is fine, thank you, it's the Conrol under it that got broken.
    (Yes, I know, capitalising the I and similar, and first words of sentences, I do that fully intentionally, and only in some cases (it's my difference between "informal/partial statement that is a comment within a discussion" and "formal/full standalone article". It's an arbitrary distinction that is not gramatically, I just decided so, because I'm a special snowflake ;) ))

    @EvanED said:

    Though it does remind me of a joking comment from one of my high school teachers, which was about the phrase "less lethal." How is something "less lethal"? It's lethal, or it's not lethal! What's it going to do, leave someone partially dead?!

    (Of course, one definition of lethal is something along the lines of "more likely to be lethal.")

    Nice one, though the distinction seems clear and logical to me - suffocating is lethal. Getting vaporized by nuclear explosion is more lethal, because it is quicker and stronger (more destructive).
    And everyone else disagrees because they know a formalised official meaning. Nevermind. I'm a special snowflake.

    @aliceif said:

    int add(int a, int b){
    while(a != 0 ? a --> b/b++ : false);
    return b;
    }

    I'd prefer

    int add(int a, int b){
      int res = 0;
    

    for(int c1 = 0; c1 < a; c1++) res++;
    for(int c2 = 0; c2 < b; c2++) res++;

    //check we got the most correct result
    if(res == a + b) return res;
    //else return 0; NO! nobody wants to get an incorrect result!
    }


    @Gaska said:

    Random fact: Polish language has separate words for general ability to memorize things, and ability to memorize bad things other people have done so you can call them out on it years after.

    Funny fact: every language has that. In english, for example, it's "memory" versus "you're a dick".

    @tar said:

    What is this topic even about any more? I just skim read a whole load of stuff about random Polish facts, bad math and sautéed dicks...

    95 posts in and you still care? What are you?!?

    @Gaska said:

    But of course - moralniak. Short for "kac moralny", ie. "moral hangover". The name comes from fact that both regular and moral hangover are usually preceeded by two bottles of vodka.

    In my case, the only thing that would be preceeded by two bottles of vodka is death. The very lethal kind.

    ("What did you do last night?"
    "I drank two bottles of vodka..."
    "And then?"
    "Then I died. It was very embarrassing, I don't think I can show up in life anymore.")

    @xaade said:

    Um, [the list that discourse fucks up when quoting to suggest to me it's stupid to quote it whole]

    1. yes they did, they just didn't want to get flak for being sexist if both women in the pic were styled as sex objects.
    2. I love the show so I'm going to rebut this by explaining it's a symbolism expressing she's a direct opposite to the rest of them, philosophically, mentally, culturally, opinion-wise, etc.
    3. ...because having two men and the most distinct women standing above everyone else doesn't scream "lead trio" loud enough? The poses themselves are (imo) more of an attempts at statements about their personalities.
    4. Hoshi and Malcolm uninteresting? A prefectionist intellectual unable to handle pressure confronted with dangers of a first mission into deep space, and a guy brought up to be a privileged prick but then suffering condemnation by his own father for not priviledgepricking his way to the top? I wouldn't call that uninteresting at all.
    5. He's not taller, he's just "the cool, laid back guy".
    6. Never thought of him as a comedy character (though yes, he was), always seemed to me more like... eh, can't describe it, really, well, I can, his primary function was "the one that takes everything as an adventure and learning opportunity". Let's call it "stand-in for Data". I always percieved Malcolm as a primary comedy character.


  • @xaade said:

    1. If you're taller than the leader, you must sit.

    I can't see anyone who's sitting in that photo...



  • @sh_code said:

    I love the show so I'm going to rebut this by explaining it's a symbolism expressing she's a direct opposite to the rest of them, philosophically, mentally, culturally, opinion-wise, etc.

    However, I think Travis is the only male officer who has no sexual tension between him and T'Pol. And that may only be that I suck at spotting that kind of thing if it isn't spelled out.

    @sh_code said:

    Never thought of [Phlox we're talking about here?] as a comedy character (though yes, he was), always seemed to me more like... eh, can't describe it, really, well, I can, his primary function was "the one that takes everything as an adventure and learning opportunity". Let's call it "stand-in for Data". I always percieved Malcolm as a primary comedy character.

    I dunno, I wouldn't disagree with your description of Phlox but I find it's presented in a comic way. I guess Malcolm kind of is as well - he's English, we excel at being the butt of jokes. I don't think anyone is a comedy character in the sense that they're there primarily to be comic relief, bu if comic relief is called for it's often one of those two.

    I like Malcolm anyway, he's my favourite after Trip. And the two of them are quite adorable.


  • Banned

    @sh_code said:

    discourse

    Discourse*

    @sh_code said:

    that

    than*

    @sh_code said:

    Conrol

    Control*

    @sh_code said:

    sentences,

    ;*

    @sh_code said:

    gramatically,

    gramatically correct*, or something, I think.

    @sh_code said:

    vaporized

    @sh_code said:
    formalised

    Make up your mind about which English you use.

    @sh_code said:

    Funny fact:

    And get your idioms right.

    @sh_code said:

    int add(int a, int b){
    int res = 0 and so on

    Good thing you use Egyptian braces, because I was about to call you out on making unnecessarily long C snippet. But since it's Java, everything's good.

    @sh_code said:

    ?!?

    If you feel confused about which one goes first, just use the :interrobang: emoji.

    @sh_code said:

    In my case, the only thing that would be preceeded by two bottles of vodka is death.

    That's okay because your beer is damn great.



  • @sh_code said:

    Preface: shut up about long post, last time discourse said it's better that replying to each post separately, so just find the part relating to you.

    If Discourse says it's better to do something, that means it's not actually better.



  • @sh_code said:

    yes they did, they just didn't want to get flak for being sexist if both women in the pic were styled as sex objects.
    blah blah blah

    This was more or less, an explanation of the statement to viewers before they watch the show.

    You always want the viewers to be able to identify the primary lead.
    You always want the viewers to be able to identify the sex attraction.
    Most of the time the lead trio is in the front center, which means that you have to give the power pose to the leader, even though you could have main leaders who would never use a power pose (especially the captain of an exploratory vessel).
    That's my point, uninteresting characters in the image, are given interest by the side pose. Indicating "don't forget me, I'm here too. Look at me, yeah you know you want to know why I'm on the outside of this group".
    Laid back guy, can lay back in other ways. The pose does suit both purposes. You always want your leader visually higher up.
    Always always comedy characters in drama wear scenery camo. If the show is bright, the comedy character looks like a clown. If the show is dark, the comedy character has a lot of detail in dull colors so they blend in with the trees. Your main hero will wear the complete black, white, red, blue uniform.

    But ultimately, the entire post was satirical.



  • @xaade said:

    They haven't figured out east-asians are sexy.

    True dat.

    @xaade said:

    Just in case a guy's biology stops working, dress the character you want them to be attracted to in red.

    She's not Starfleet, so she has a different uniform. Or maybe those are civvies. I don't know really.

    @xaade said:

    In case you can't tell the black guy isn't the leader since he's front and center, make the white guy use a power pose, and give the other guy a slacker pose.

    He was the best character on that damned show (and the only HUMAN in the cast with space travel experience), and used in... what... 3 episodes? WTF were they thinking.

    @xaade said:

    Fit in uninteresting characters that you want the audience to notice by having them stand sideways.

    Malcolm's pretty cool. Hoshi... yeah, she's as boring as white bread. (Don't get me wrong; I liked the actress, but the character is so dull.)

    @xaade said:

    Comedy characters must wear scenery camouflage, just in case you mistakenly notice them when the scene isn't funny. And they must smile, in case you forget that.

    He's not Starfleet so he's not wearing a Starfleet uniform. The green is either scrubs or civvies.



  • @sh_code said:

    Never thought of him as a comedy character (though yes, he was), always seemed to me more like... eh, can't describe it, really, well, I can, his primary function was "the one that takes everything as an adventure and learning opportunity". Let's call it "stand-in for Data".

    Phlox was definitely intended to be comic relief, he actually turned-out pretty good all-told. The "joke" was basically that he was a really, really good doctor but his methods were all crazy tribal medicine-type stuff. So in a normal Star Trek, they wave a little metal tool and you are healed, but this dude's like collecting frog dung in a paper bag or whatever. Ha ha.

    @sh_code said:

    I always percieved Malcolm as a primary comedy character.

    Malcolm had the best dead-pan humor in Star Trek, except perhaps Tuvok.



  • Stop thinking in terms of story context, and start thinking in terms of tropes and visual convenience.

    What's preventing his civies from being red, and the red girl's from being a tone that blends into the mechanical structure?

    It's what the director wants you to notice.

    The reasons why are MacGuffins.

    @blakeyrat said:

    Phlox was definitely intended to be comic relief

    The fact that I can identify these things, given I've watched few enough episodes to not meet half the characters, lends some credence to the fact that poster images are trope driven, and context is made up as excuses.



  • @xaade said:

    What's preventing his civies from being red, and the red girl's from being a tone that blends into the mechanical structure?

    Well why not remove her clothes altogether then?



  • @blakeyrat said:

    Well why not remove her clothes altogether then?

    Because, believe it or not, red attracts the eyes more than skin tone. Especially for straight females enjoying the show.

    TV is more impatient these days, and doesn't want to spend the time to develop the characters, they want to exploit stereotypes so they shorten the boring introduction of characters.



  • Then I guess they need like big neon arrows pointing at her.



  • You mean like the brightly lit pole in front of her, or the formation of perspective lines, by the reflective light from the ceiling. All screaming "See guys, we have fanservice too."

    ST:TNG spent time on characters, building up traits like sexuality of characters and the relationships and interactions.

    When that didn't work, they unzipped the counselor's shirt.

    When even that didn't work, they made future women wear red.



  • No I meant big neon arrows, what are you, a retard?



  • What do you think the visuals of that image are trying to accomplish.

    If they made literally arrows, it was actually turn people off, because they consciously realize what the intent was.

    The fact that I know the tropes and visual marketing, allows me to see these things, and I get thrown off by it.

    In fact, I'm less attracted to her because I'm being told to be attracted to her. Thus I quickly noticed the asian in the corner.



  • @xaade said:

    What do you think the visuals of that image are trying to accomplish.

    Considering the general quality of the show, I wager there was zero artistic vision behind it and the only impetus for creating it was for a few guys to take home a paycheck for yet another month.

    @xaade said:

    In fact, I'm less attracted to her because I'm being told to be attracted to her. Thus I quickly noticed the asian in the corner.

    Well aren't you a special little snowflake.



  • @blakeyrat said:

    Well aren't you a special little snowflake.

    No. This is how people operate.
    Maybe you're special and these things don't affect you.

    The success of incorporating a trope, depends on whether people see it as a trope, or a overused cliche.
    Woman in red = sex, is an incredibly boring cliche. People pick up on that and think, another 2d character to ignore.



  • @xaade said:

    The success of incorporating a trope, depends on whether people see it as a trope, or a overused cliche.Woman in red = sex, is an incredibly boring cliche. People pick up on that and think, another 2d character to ignore.

    Yeah, well, it was a boring cliche-ridden show. What are you expecting here?



  • @blakeyrat said:

    Yeah, well, it was a boring cliche-ridden show. What are you expecting here?

    That's my point.

    I can tell without watching the show, because the poster is there to shortcut having the watcher learn about the characters.

    How can you manage to argue with the people you are agreeing with?



  • @blakeyrat said:

    She's not Starfleet, so she has a different uniform. Or maybe those are civvies. I don't know really.

    She does have a different uniform - or at least, different clothes and always the same thing so I presume it's a uniform - but that's not it and it's black and grey. At least, in the first two seasons which is all I've seen.


  • FoxDev

    But that's in the series itself. In the promo art above, the choice of red is essentially a 'look we have this hot chick!' choice. And it's emphasised by the outfit being so tight.



  • I'm pretty sure she switches to the red at some point in the actual series. There's a part where she has a falling-out with the Vulcan military and maybe loses her rank? I can't remember anymore.


  • FoxDev

    @Gaska said:

    It must be pretty tough to write correctly if your keyboard has no Shift key.

    i have one on my keyboard but rately use it..... i seem to get along just fine..



  • @accalia said:

    rately

    *rarely, normally wouldn't bother but:

    @accalia said:

    i seem to get along just fine


  • FoxDev

    @locallunatic said:

    normally wouldn't bother but:

    if you want a falg for spellar from me you need to pick on someone elses spelling. too esay of a target with me.

    ;-p


  • FoxDev

    @accalia said:

    falg

    @accalia said:
    esay

    I'll say… 😏


  • FoxDev

    beileve it or not those two were on porpoise.

    😆



  • There is a reason that when people typo we refer to it by the spamfox's name, was just pointing out that you claiming to type fine is bullshit.


  • FoxDev

    @locallunatic said:

    was just pointing out that you claiming to type fine is bullshit

    i think you'll find that i claimed to "get along" fine, not type fine.

    😆

    self admitting to rarely using shift rather undermines the good typing "claim"(that i did not in fact make... ;-))



  • @accalia said:

    i claimed to "get along" fine, not type fine.

    in reference to keyboards "get along fine" can be taken to mean with regards to typing if you don't use blakey's "I only know what you type" bullshit.


  • FoxDev

    @locallunatic said:

    blakey's "I only know what you type" bullshit.

    ....

    DO NOT WANT!



  • @blakeyrat said:

    I'm pretty sure she switches to the red at some point in the actual series. There's a part where she has a falling-out with the Vulcan military and maybe loses her rank? I can't remember anymore.

    So far where I'm at there's been about three parts where she's fallen out with the Vulcan military and either almost lost her rank or almost had to quit to stay on Enterprise. But maybe it happens for real at some point; I shall find out at some point, I suppose.



  • It's been a lot of years since I watched it.

    However, I just finished Voyager (which BTW, my opinion of it has improved actually from last time), and I guess therefore Enterprise is next? Or maybe I'll do SG-1. Or something else entirely. Third Rock from the Sun is back on Netflix.



  • Well I've only ever watched 2 seasons of Enterprise and a couple of odd episodes of the rest, and the films. I'm a recent convert. Going through them in in-universe order, partly because it seems logical and mainly because a chunk of Enterprise was on TV on weekdays a while back and that's how I got into it. And I accidentally spoilered myself about the fact that [spoiler]Tucker dies[/spoiler] at the end of the series and I need to get resolution on it.


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