I only own a Windows Phone, should I make a Windows Phone game?



  • Kind of want to get into mobile development, since I have some time right now, but the only mobile device in my house is a Windows Phone 8.1 (Lumia 1020.) Is it even worth learning on this, considering it's 90% likely nothing I learn will be applicable to iOS or Android?

    I have a couple touchscreen game ideas.


  • Winner of the 2016 Presidential Election

    I'd think a fair bit would be applicable anyway... like just dealing with size constraints and general limitations of a mobile platform.

    Something > nothing, right?



  • are you one of the people that resolved that unity was a crock of shit?

    if not, that might be something to consider - you can develop for windows mobile and then (providing you separate your input controls well enough) roll out to other platforms subsequently?

    or maybe just work with xamarin? or is that a crock of shit too? I dunno.



  • It might get you some practice that isn't super portable (though as @royal_poet pointed out somethings would be). Plus if you end up actually selling things you aren't competing with 50 million competitors.



  • @algorythmics said:

    are you one of the people that resolved that unity was a crock of shit?

    I have absolutely no idea what you're talking about. So... no? Or maybe... yes?

    I am trying to do this for free/extremely cheap, though. If I wanted to spend money, I'd buy an Android and write it there. (I doubt my old iBook is capable of running any iOS dev software at this point.)

    @algorythmics said:

    or maybe just work with xamarin? or is that a crock of shit too? I dunno.

    I don't know what you're talking about, again.

    @locallunatic said:

    Plus if you end up actually selling things you aren't competing with 50 million competitors.

    That's a point.


  • Discourse touched me in a no-no place

    @algorythmics said:

    are you one of the people that resolved that unity was a crock of shit?

    Unity-based games really boil my Note II's cpu. That and a stubborn refusal to stop playing them while charging the phone caused my wife's battery to swell up, which was a bit disturbing to see.


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    @locallunatic said:

    BUT if you end up actually selling things you have like 20 potential customers.

    FTFY

    Android tablets are not that expensive really. You would not need the best hardware. That might even work against you if you did. You would want to know how your code runs on middle of the road hardware anyway. Developing for Android would really open up your market for you.


  • Discourse touched me in a no-no place

    @blakeyrat said:

    I have absolutely no idea what you're talking about.

    If you were not one of those people, you could use Unity to develop a game and then it would (in theory) be portable across platforms. So you wouldn't have to worry about Windows Phone's market share.


  • sockdevs

    go for it. if you manage to make it support tablets i'll even help test it (i have windows tablet but android phone)


  • Discourse touched me in a no-no place

    @Intercourse said:

    Android tablets are not that expensive really.

    You can get cheap ones on sale for like $50. I don't know how bad they would be for gaming; I'm kind of tempted to get one to see how they are in general. Obviously they're not going to be a Galaxy Pro, but they might be acceptable for some purposes.



  • @Intercourse said:

    FTFY

    That is a point, but I'd think that actually getting someone to download your game is a huge hurdle when you are completely buried in the listings.


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    Most projects like this are buried unless they are effectively marketed. It is hard to break into a market as diluted as mobile gaming is, but it can be done. Look at Flappy Bird. Absolutely stupid, ridiculously hard game, that hit it big. You just have to get people playing.

    Build it and start looking to the bloggers. They are always looking to be the first to talk about the next big thing. If you have a truly original idea, get it in the hands of the Extra Credits guys. Etc.


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    @FrostCat said:

    You can get cheap ones on sale for like $50.

    Android Tablet vs Double-Barreled Shotgun: Crush Test 1x03 – 01:59
    — Tom Scott

    I will just leave this here...



  • @Intercourse said:

    Developing for Android would really open up your market for you.

    But consider, using Eclipse and Java-based tools, my risk of suicide would go up about 450,000%. If it was released and successful, I could always port (or pay someone to port) it.

    No, if I did an alternative, it would be iOS. But I don't have the spare cash to spent $650 on a Mac Mini and another $200 on a iOS tablet at the moment.

    The only other programmable stuff in my house is a Xbox One and a Roku. I'm guessing the Roku app store is ... tumbleweeds.app. It probably makes the Windows Phone app store look vibrant. And of course PC.


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    @blakeyrat said:

    But consider, using Eclipse and Java-based tools, my risk of suicide would go up about 450,000%.

    I am just not seeing a downside here. (seriously, j/k)

    @blakeyrat said:

    No, if I did an alternative, it would be iOS. But I don't have the spare cash to spent $650 on a Mac Mini and another $200 on a iOS tablet at the moment.

    eBay is always an option, but older Apple hardware seems to really retain its value for some silly reason. Any C2D Mac would serve your purpose though. You do not need anything super heavy duty. iOS tablets would be another story though. Older iPads with newer versions of iOS run like dog shit.

    I know you are currently between jobs, etc., so it does not make sense to go out and spend that kind of money until you know where your next paycheck is coming from and how big (or small) it will be.

    @blakeyrat said:

    The only other programmable stuff in my house is a Xbox One and a Roku. I'm guessing the Roku app store is ... absolute shit.

    FTFY

    @blakeyrat said:

    And of course PC.

    Which is where your passion lies, but their mobile market share is crap and not really improving.



  • I would love to see whatever kind of game you create.


  • sockdevs

    So would I.



  • @Intercourse said:

    I am just not seeing a downside here. (seriously, j/k)

    Fuck you. You spent 24 solid hours following me around and harassing me, and now you're making jokes "hey wouldn't Blakeyrat killing himself be really funny? Ha ha guyz!" About a person you know has been suicidal in the past.

    Even for this forum, your shit is unacceptable. You're fucking lucky I'm not the kind of crybaby that runs to the moderators every time someone conspires to send me 57,000 emails a day or posts that they want me dead.

    If you don't want to read my posts, don't read them. Following me around like a hungry dog and posting the Discourse equivalent of, "hey Blakeyrat, pay attention to me. Hey. Pay attention to me. Pay attention to me. Hey. Hey. Pay attention to me." is both virtually intolerable (for me) and fucking pathetic as shit for you. You really don't have anything better to do with your time? Get a life.

    Listen carefully, because this is only coming once: fuck you.


  • Winner of the 2016 Presidential Election

    Hey, don't run off our forum mascot. We'll be hard pressed finding someone else to do the job at this community.


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    So you're saying we should become good drinking buddies?

    @blakeyrat said:

    "hey wouldn't Blakeyrat killing himself be really funny? Ha ha guyz!" About a person you know has been suicidal in the past.

    That seriously was a tongue-in-cheek reference to my constant trolling you in the past few days. I did not know you had been suicidal, or else I would have never made the joke.

    As for the rest, you spend your time trolling people and being a total ass most of the time and then you get upset when someone else does it to you? You do not see the hypocrisy there?

    @blakeyrat said:

    Listen carefully, because this is only coming once: fuck you.

    I sincerely doubt this will be the last time you say that to me, unless you or I leave. ;)


  • sockdevs

    @Intercourse said:

    (seriously, j/k)

    ...

    if you find yourself putting that anywhere in a comment, do us all a favor and just delete the comment before posting. it's never funny.


  • BINNED

    @Intercourse said:

    you spend your time trolling people and being a total ass most of the time and then you get upset when someone else does it to you

    there's a difference between arguing a point and making every single post about annoying one person


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    Fair enough. I sincerely apologize to blakeyrat for that particular comment.

    (no @-mention, to show my sincerity)


  • sockdevs

    Appreciated. Thanks.



  • I wanted to say something earlier, but didn't want to speak in your name (in the remote case that you're secretly enjoying it). The whole @blakeyrat mention thing was fun once, but seriously, @everyone, enough already. Blakeyrat isn't your windup doll to amuse you whenever you feel like it. Constant pinging is starting to feel like bullying.

    Back to the main issue.

    Someone mentioned it, but I'll bring it up again. Check out xamarin. Multi-platform development in C#. Target windows phone, iphone and android from one project. Native on each device. If you're not doing anything insane and want a wide mobile reach, IMO this is the way to go.


  • sockdevs

    Seriously, though, give Unity a go. The base editor is a free download, you can build stuff in C#, even though it's an older version due to dependencies with Xamarin I think it is (since they're cross platform)

    As far as pushing to Windows Phone goes, you can't do that in the free version but you can at least get an idea about whether the environment would suit you, and you can compile to WinPho with Unity Pro, which is one-time $1500 or $75/month which also gets you things like profiling and stuff, which is pretty neat.

    I'm certainly curious about what you have in mind, because while there's a certain amount of asshattery and banter going on... you and I have had our differences, but I got a fair amount of respect for you and your skills - and even on the occasions you've given me advice that others tried and failed to get me to listen to.

    Shit's hard right now, I know - but you'll get through this. You'll find something that works for you. And we're here for you. May not seem like it but we are here for you in our own various little ways.



  • @cartman82 said:

    The whole @blakeyrat mention thing was fun once,

    No. It. Fucking. Wasn't.

    Get the fuck out of my thread so I can talk about my game idea. In fact, why don't you and Intercourse just get the fuck out of my life entirely.

    @cartman82 said:

    Constant pinging is starting to feel like bullying.

    "Starting to?" What has it been the last 2 months?! How long does it take in your brain to "start" bullying someone?

    Are you a fucking sociopath? Is that the problem? You people need help. You people need pills. I'm not fucking kidding. Talk to someone.



  • @blakeyrat said:

    No. It. Fucking. Wasn't.

    Get the fuck out of my thread so I can talk about my game idea. In fact, why don't you and Intercourse just get the fuck out of my life entirely.

    Err... I found it amusing, but I never participated myself. Whatever.

    @blakeyrat said:

    "Starting to?" What has it been the last 2 months?! How long does it take in your brain to "start" bullying someone?

    Are you a fucking sociopath? Is that the problem? You people need help. You people need pills. I'm not fucking kidding. Talk to someone.

    Dude. I'm not pinging you.


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    It was fun for us, just because we know how much Discourse in general winds you up.


  • sockdevs

    @Intercourse said:

    It was fun for us

    some of you anyway. I never found it terribly amusing. been on the receiving side of it once too many times to derive much, if any joy from it.


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    @blakeyrat said:

    "Starting to?" What has it been the last 2 months?! How long does it take in your brain to "start" bullying someone?

    I am not going to take the moral high ground here, because I do not have it obviously, but you have been trolling and bullying people for years. We all dismiss it as, "Oh, that's just how blakeyrat is..." like you are the grandmother who spouts hateful bullshit and we should ignore it because she is senile. If you want to dish out trolling and bullying, you should be able to take it as well...


  • Discourse touched me in a no-no place

    @Intercourse said:

    I will just leave this here...

    I will admit I had testing more than actual use in mind. 512MB ram is lame, for one thing.

    I've seen more name-brand-sounding ones in stores.


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    @blakeyrat said:

    Get the fuck out of my thread so I can talk about my game idea.

    And actually, I am in this thread to shed my viewpoint on it. I made an off-hand joke that was, in retrospect and with further details brought to my attention, extremely callous and rude. I sincerely apologize.


  • Discourse touched me in a no-no place

    @blakeyrat said:

    But consider, using Eclipse and Java-based tools, my risk of suicide would go up about 450,000%. If it was released and successful, I could always port (or pay someone to port) it.

    I feel compelled to point out you don't actually have to use Eclipse. I'm not sure that's helpful to know, but it's true.

    @blakeyrat said:

    The only other programmable stuff in my house is a Xbox One and a Roku. I'm guessing the Roku app store is ... tumbleweeds.app.

    Did you mean to put ".app" there?



  • The concept I have, and I'm sure it's unoriginal as shit, is an "infinite runner"-type game. (Except it won't be infinite, it'll be like the original Tetris where the difficulty is timed so that games last around 10-ish minutes.)

    The story is that humans finally figured out dinosaurs have feathers, and so they decide to go back in time and hunt dinosaurs so they can make outrageous hats, except it will be cartoony and ridiculous. (Think more Off-Road Rapter Safari, and less Turok.) Your character will be a little raptor (or something cuter) at the bottom center of screen who has to dodge various obstacles, starting out with things like trees and rocks, then as the game progresses becoming things like jeeps or nets, then becoming things like laser guns and bombs. (The mechanics won't change, just the graphics. Think of it like "biomes" in Terraria.)

    Here's my super-high-quality mock-up:

    Phone stuff in black, game stuff in dark grey. (You can't see the difference in Discourse, apparently. Eh. Zoom in maybe?)

    The theory is that there's three "lanes", and your dinosaur is in one lane at a time. You make your dodging moves by dragging in the grid at the top of the screen. Early on you only have to drag left and right to dodge things, but later you'll have to drag forward (to jump over something) or forward-left, or forward-right. The game graphics will show beneath the grid.

    The actually game will be "procedural" (I hate to use that word for something so simple, but whatever.) Basically the obstacles will be randomized, with difficulty being kept track of internally by measuring basically decreasing the reaction time a player needs to get past a certain obstacle. Like I said above, the game will be paced so that max difficulty is hit in about 10 minutes. It's possible someone might be able to play infinitely at the hardest difficulty-- oh well, it happens in Pac-Man too.

    That's about it, it's pretty simple, but probably still to complicated for a first game. Haha. Also, I have zero artistic skill, so I'm going to need to figure out how to provide graphics that aren't ass and music that isn't audible-ass. But first getting something working and on my phone.



  • @blakeyrat said:

    I am trying to do this for free/extremely cheap, though. If I wanted to spend money, I'd buy an Android and write it there. (I doubt my old iBook is capable of running any iOS dev software at this point.)

    Unity's free to use setup is perfectly good enough to work with, I would give it a go if this is the kind of thing you are thinking of


  • Discourse touched me in a no-no place

    @Intercourse said:

    So you're saying we should become good drinking buddies?

    Sure, that's the only possible alternative.


  • sockdevs

    @blakeyrat said:

    Early on you only have to drag left and right to dodge things, but later you'll have to drag forward (to jump over something) or forward-left, or forward-right. The game graphics will show beneath the grid.

    i would tend towards implementing as tapping, but dragging also works. I like the idea, and given viral media this could be a hit if you happen to release it at exactly the right time.


  • sockdevs

    http://www.lostgarden.com/search/label/free game graphics might help as far as art goes, there's things in there that aren't necessarily what you're looking for but quite suitable as proof of concept things. And it might inspire you in other ways.


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    @FrostCat said:

    I will admit I had testing more than actual use in mind. 512MB ram is lame, for one thing.

    I've seen more name-brand-sounding ones in stores.

    Something like:

    should be more than enough to get started, and the price is right. 1GB of RAM and a 7" screen for <$100.


  • Discourse touched me in a no-no place

    @Intercourse said:

    Something like:

    should be more than enough to get started,

    What I had in mind was specifically something like this: http://www.walmart.com/ip/RCA-9-Tablet-8GB-Memory-Dual-Core/28806790 instead of the crapfest you linked to. I did notice it claims twice the battery life, although it's more expensive.

    There's a whole bunch in that price range. Obviously a refurb will get you higher specs for the same price.


  • sockdevs

    if the pictures are accurate, that appears to be the 2012 NEXUS7 specs are about right for it too.

    good tablet, but totally blown out of the water by the 2013 version.



  • @accalia said:

    i would tend towards implementing as tapping, but dragging also works.

    The problem with tapping is that there's two possible horizontal moves, you can dodge one square or two.

    I guess tapping could work if I put an icon of the player character in the square he's currently in.



  • @FrostCat said:

    Did you mean to put ".app" there?

    Yes, it's called "humorous wordplay."


  • Discourse touched me in a no-no place

    @blakeyrat said:

    Yes, it's called "humorous wordplay."

    It was funny, but I was kind of hoping Discurse did it to you. Or possibly a failed autocorrect.



  • @blakeyrat said:

    The concept I have, a...

    That's about it, it's pretty simple, but probably still to complicated for a first game. Haha. Also, I have zero artistic skill, so I'm going to need to figure out how to provide graphics that aren't ass and music that isn't audible-ass. But first getting something working and on my phone.

    Well, I'm confused about your path of replies to me, but I actually did mean to ask what kind of game you had in mind, so... cool.

    That's sounds fun.

    Would read again.
    Considering purchasing the pre-release ;).



  • @blakeyrat said:

    You make your dodging moves by dragging in the grid at the top of the screen.

    You may want to instead try detecting the move commands either anywhere on the screen (assuming no other controls) or if only in one spot then put it at the bottom. Otherwise your hand will cover the screen.


  • sockdevs

    you were talking about overlaying the grid right? if you do that i'd personally tend to assume that you want me to tap the grid square i wanted to move to.

    if you want drag I would, personally, go for having a tutorial popup and allow the drag gesture anywhere on the play surface. would allow for one handed operation, even with some really odd hand positions.

    but that's my stylistic astetics, which i freely admit are not necessarily correct nor representitive of any population larger than myself.


  • Discourse touched me in a no-no place

    BTW if for some reason you didn't mind the idea of Android dev, the built-in emulator runs like it was a 486, but BlueStacks works just fine.

    If you use BlueStacks, and you don't want to pay for it, but also don't like the crap games it spams on you, you can replace the launcher with something like NovaLauncher. You still get nags about "pay $2/mo or have our sponsored games automatically installed" but the games don't actually get installed.

    $2/mo isn't very expensive, though. And sometimes you can get it for free--I did once somehow by virtue of having an AMD video card.



  • @locallunatic said:

    You may want to instead try detecting the move commands either anywhere on the screen (assuming no other controls) or if only in one spot then put it at the bottom. Otherwise your hand will cover the screen.

    That's a good point. It does reduce the "usable" space of the screen (now stuff passing below the UI is irrelevant to gameplay), but the thumb might have blocked that anyway.

    @accalia said:

    you were talking about overlaying the grid right? if you do that i'd personally tend to assume that you want me to tap the grid square i wanted to move to.

    Well the theory was the grid was just an abstract "move list". So you can move left, jump left (swipe two squares), move right, jump right, jump forward, jump forward-left, jump forward-left-a-lot, etc.

    In the original concept, the dinosaur wasn't *in" a grid necessarily, definitely not graphically on the screen. But now I'm rethinking that.

    @accalia said:

    if you want drag I would, personally, go for having a tutorial popup and allow the drag gesture anywhere on the play surface. would allow for one handed operation, even with some really odd hand positions.

    There's definitely at least going to be a movie (if not an interactive tutorial) showing how to make the dodging moves.


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