WTF happened to Windows 95?


  • Grade A Premium Asshole

    Windows 10 was apparently announced today, did they forget how to count?



  • To be fair, "7" was pretty arbitrary too, so it's not like 7 - 8 - 8.1 - 9 would have been built on a solid foundation.


  • Grade A Premium Asshole

    To be fair, 9 would have made sense in current context.



  • Terry Myerson actually talked a bit about how/why they went with 10 at the start of the event.
    Basically, they wanted to include the "1" part to not only signify the unity (same core across all platforms), but also to tie in with other current products (OneNote, OneDrive, Xbox One), and because Windows 1 has already been a thing (the first version of Windows).
    Windows 10: Enterprise Features & Core Experience for Businesses – 39:29
    — Windows



  • @Spencer said:

    Terry Myerson actually talked a bit about how/why they went with 10 at the start of the event.Basically, they wanted to include the "1" part to not only signify the unity (same core across all platforms), but also to tie in with other current products (OneNote, OneDrive, Xbox One), and because Windows 1 has already been a thing (the first version of Windows).

    TDEMSYR

    I was actually expecting it to be called "Windows One". It's not like the existence of a previously existing Windows 1.0 really prevents that, and no-one's reading "Windows 10" as "Windows One-Oh", so it doesn't tie anything together.

    They should just go back to using years.



  • If you want to see a man suffering, jump to 4:05 in that video, right after he made the big announcement and got no applause at all.

    Filed under: you guys need a sec?


  • Grade A Premium Asshole

    @trithne said:

    no-one's reading "Windows 10" as "Windows One-Oh", so it doesn't tie anything together.

    QFT, +1, THIS!, etc.



  • Maybe they're hoping the teens will be globbed as 1x, like the nineties were.



  • Just watch the frakking video, that was the exact line of reasoning from it.



  • The next version of Java should be Java "0" to signify the unity of Oracle.



  • Well, they did boxify and decolorize things, so maybe 1.0 is appropriate.

    At least he said it's not one ui to rule them all, maybe they're learning.



  • @trithne said:

    They should just go back to using years.

    So we can all once again see just how far behind schedule they are releasing products.



  • Actually, the probably stopped using years in the consumer versions because they started using it in the server versions.

    Can you imagine saying you need a machine running Windows Server 2016, and some idiot installs Windows 2016 on it instead, thinking they're the same thing?



  • Just release Server editions on off years.



  • Except that MS is moving towards yearly release cycles for both. Even with them using R2 for the in-between version like they have currently been, I still wouldn't trust the idiots of the world not to confuse them.


  • Grade A Premium Asshole

    @Spencer said:

    Can you imagine saying you need a machine running Windows Server 2016, and some idiot installs Windows 2016 on it instead, thinking they're the same thing?

    I really cannot imagine that has ever happened. If so, it is not enough reason to change a naming scheme because it cannot happen much at all.



  • Not least because there's no 2016 version yet? Or because of what I said above

    @Spencer said:

    Actually, they probably stopped using years in the consumer versions because they started using it in the server versions.

    Or because you think that no one in IT would confuse the difference between consumer and server editions? Because not only are there those types of idiots in IT (hell, there are people in IT who don't even know how to use a computer), but it only takes a drone or accountant who is making the purchase to not know the difference and decide the cheaper one will do.



  • Makes perfect sense to me.

    So how about them features? For me, there were no huge surprises.

    A bit pathetic they need to announce pasting into the console as a big improvement. MacOS is eating their lunch in attracting developers by having a *nix environment beneath a nice GUI. And M$ adds paste to their crappy console. Good job guys.

    I still haven't heard much about the phone home and MS account integration crap. Seems they are trying to sneak that bitter pill beneath the flashy start menu presentation. Should expect predictable backlash to start in a few days, once their dev previews go out.



  • What's the Y-axis there supposed to be?


  • area_deu

    But it's wrong. Windows ME = Windows Millennium Edition = 1000


  • :belt_onion:

    @trithne said:

    no-one's reading "Windows 10" as "Windows One-Oh",

    Clearly it should have been "Windows 0b10" then



  • @Spencer said:

    Just watch the frakking video, that was the exact line of reasoning from it.

    Bullshit.

    @Terry Myerson said:

    Based on the product thats coming, and just how different our approach would be overall, it wouldn't be right to call it windows 9.
    So, we're considering our One Microsoft strategy, the names of our products, such as: Xbox One, OneNote and OneDrive, and it's obvious what the name should be: Windows One.
    But unfortunately (picture of young Bill Gates) Windows 1 has been done by the giants that came before us.
    So where does that leave us? We're at a inflection point in the history of Windows. We're at a point where we'll carry forward all that is good in windows and then step across into a new way of doing things, a new Windows, and because we're not building an incremental product, that new Windows, is Windows 10.



  • @cartman82 said:

    A bit pathetic they need to announce pasting into the console as a big improvement. MacOS is eating their lunch in attracting developers by having a *nix environment beneath a nice GUI. And M$ adds paste to their crappy console.
    Well, to be honest it was pretty pathetic that it didn't have a workable paste for quite some time. Where that time is most reasonably measured in decades. But at the same time, it is really nice if they go beyond that and start implementing such revolutionary things as, I dunno, resizing the window by dragging the edges.

    The right response to "MacOS is eating our lunch" isn't to just give up, it's to make improvements. And while it's not a *nix environment, it is a step in the right direction.

    I know I was really disappointed when Powershell still used the same awful console window, and I didn't really play around with it much at all as a result of that. Well, partially as a result of that; I use Windows for my home machines but that requires light administration, and Linux at work, so I don't really get the opportunity to use something else I'm doing as an excuse to play with it. (I'd kind of like to, so I could see what parts I like and don't like; I think it has the potential for being a lot better than the traditional Unix tools at a lot of mundane tasks. I'd say it has the potential to be a lot more Unixy than Unix if you define "Unixy" as "have several programs that each do one thing well, and compose them to do interesting things.") I'm digressing here, but my point is that if they make some good improvements to their console, I'll consider that a very welcome change; I'd almost rather have the usual Windows commands and a decent console out of the box than the usual *nix environment in the crap console Windows has shipped with for years.

    @trithne said:

    What's the Y-axis there supposed to be?

    The marketed version number of the release, with non-numeric names as 0? It was pretty clear to me...


  • Grade A Premium Asshole

    @cartman82 said:

    MacOS is eating their lunch in attracting developers by having a *nix environment beneath a nice GUI.

    I have the best of both worlds by running Ubuntu Gnome in virtualization to do any development work that deploys to *nix systems (we generally deploy to Ubuntu Server, and I hate straight Ubuntu desktop), and I don't have to deal with a fucking Mac. I know it just takes some getting used to, but even the Command and Control buttons annoy me for some reason. I feel like Apple products condescend to me, and I don't like that.



  • @EvanED said:

    Well, to be honest it was pretty pathetic that it didn't have a workable paste for quite some time.

    I don't get that part. You can definitely paste into the console by right-clicking. Maybe they just added a keyboard combo? In which case.... err, how is that not a one-day project for an intern?


  • area_deu

    Here's a list of some changes that MicroSoft is experimenting with:
    http://withinrafael.com/new-experimental-console-features-in-windows-threshold/



  • All sort of "meh, ok".

    What they need is a better shell, not just console window.
    How about going full blown powershell?
    Or if they are too chickenshit, why not add official *nix shell implementation? Wouldn't that be a kicker?
    Either way, Windows standard shell needs to go.



  • @cartman82 said:

    What they need is a better shell, not just console window.How about going full blown powershell?

    Go back and read what has been posted again. The console window is the tingy displaying both old style dos console AND PowerShell. It is obvious that the goal here is not to make it easier for DOS hardheads but for modern PowerShell users.



  • @Luhmann said:

    Go back and read what has been posted again. The console window is the tingy displaying both old style dos console AND PowerShell. It is obvious that the goal here is not to make it easier for DOS hardheads but for modern PowerShell users.

    I know.

    I'm just saying, why am I seeing the old shell as the default option everywhere? It should be relegated to a hidden switch in LocalShellPolicyGroupManager or something. Powershell should be the only icon in my start menu or on desktop.

    Also, completion? Intellisense? Coloring? Come on, Microsoft. Bring out your A game.



  • @cartman82 said:

    Also, completion? Intellisense? Coloring? Come on, Microsoft. Bring out your A game

    Aha yeah, they should roll the PowerShell IDE features into the real thing.
    Have a switch for turning your console into the IDE, now that would be an idea.



  • Like it.

    Do it @Luhmann! You have my blessing.



  • @cartman82 said:

    Like it.

    Do it @Luhmann! You have my blessing.


    Oh thanks but I'm not that insane.



  • @cartman82 said:

    MacOS is eating their lunch in attracting developers by having a *nix environment beneath a nice GUI.

    ...huh? Are you suggesting they should switch Windows to being Unix-based? Are you saying Unix environments are inherently better for developers? Are you saying developers are attracted by a nice GUI? I don't get your point at all.

    And you don't get Visual Studio on Mac OS, so that's -100 points to developer attractiveness right there.

    @cartman82 said:

    What they need is a better shell, not just console window.How about going full blown powershell?

    WTF does "full-blown" mean in this context? Are they supposed to abandon cmd altogether (and break a gajillion of batch scripts)?

    @cartman82 said:

    I'm just saying, why am I seeing the old shell as the default option everywhere? It should be relegated to a hidden switch in LocalShellPolicyGroupManager or something. Powershell should be the only icon in my start menu or on desktop.

    If you want to use Powershell, using it is as simple as starting damn Powershell. What's the point of running every single app under Powershell when all you need is a text window? Is it worth it to alienate all the people who learned their tricks back on DOS just so PowerShell devs can have one less icon in the start menu and a nice blue window?

    @cartman82 said:

    Also, completion? Intellisense? Coloring? Come on, Microsoft. Bring out your A game.

    USE THE FRIGGIN' IDE, as Blakey would say.



  • @Maciejasjmj said:

    ...huh? Are you suggesting they should switch Windows to being Unix-based? Are you saying Unix environments are inherently better for developers? Are you saying developers are attracted by a nice GUI? I don't get your point at all.

    And you don't get Visual Studio on Mac OS, so that's -100 points to developer attractiveness right there.

    You want to play around with the latest & greatest tech, it's assumed you have access to a *nix environment. All tutorials, tooling etc. is made with that assumption.

    As a consequence, there's a massive exodus of developers to *nix systems. 5 years ago, majority of devs ran Windows. Go to a dev conference today, and it's all Macs with an occasional linux. Windows is increasingly becoming a ghetto in terms of developer mindshare.

    That's a huge problem for Microsoft, who are relying on top developers being champions of their platform.

    @Maciejasjmj said:

    WTF does "full-blown" mean in this context? Are they supposed to abandon cmd altogether (and break a gajillion of batch scripts)?

    How about removing cmd and adding something like "cmd compatibility mode for LOSERS because you are LOSER if you use it" to powershell.

    @Maciejasjmj said:

    If you want to use Powershell, using it is as simple as starting damn Powershell. What's the point of running every single app under Powershell when all you need is a text window? Is it worth it to alienate all the people who learned their tricks back on DOS just so PowerShell devs can have one less icon in the start menu and a nice blue window?

    It's a minute to twelve for MS to move forward and catch up. Brave steps are needed. See response 1.

    @Maciejasjmj said:

    USE THE FRIGGIN' IDE, as Blakey would say.

    I dont wanna.



  • BTW, what about this.

    Look at the date.

    Having a little Aprils fools day prank = good.
    Having a prank and PREDICTING THE FUTURE = priceless.



  • @cartman82 said:

    You want to play around with the latest & greatest tech, it's assumed you have access to a *nix environment. All tutorials, tooling etc. is made with that assumption.

    If by "latest and greatest" you mean "stuff hacked together by some FOSStards and hipsters in their basement who didn't give a shit about making it runnable on a system about 90% of people use, because IT'S THE YEAR OF DESKTOP LINUX or whatever".

    @cartman82 said:

    As a consequence, there's a massive exodus of developers to *nix systems. 5 years ago, majority of devs ran Windows. Go to a dev conference today, and it's all Macs with an occasional linux. Windows is increasingly becoming a ghetto in terms of developer mindshare.

    I don't frequent dev conferences, but I'm pretty certain you're just pulling this out of your ass. Sure, cool kids use *nix and bash Windows on every occasion, but as far as actual development goes, .NET is holding out just fine. And the only reason people would shift to *nix is because they have to, since their language's developers are basement dwellers who can't be arsed to make their shit run on Windows without hacking it up.

    @cartman82 said:

    How about removing cmd and adding something like "cmd compatibility mode for LOSERS because you are LOSER if you use it" to powershell.

    What's the point?

    @cartman82 said:

    It's a minute to twelve for MS to move forward and catch up. Brave steps are needed. See response 1.

    Ah, so it's:

    1. Drop cmd
    2. Expose PowerShell
    3. ???????
    4. Developers! Developers! Developers!

    @cartman82 said:

    I dont wanna.

    Your problem, not Microsoft's.



  • @cartman82 said:

    Go to a dev conference today, and it's all Macs with an occasional linux. Windows is increasingly becoming a ghetto in terms of developer mindshare.

    Too busy writing code. Conferences are like meetings: Work goes there to die.



  • I am of the opinion that Windows Threshold is a nice name.
    And it's already being used everywhere.

    So they should stick to that and make it the official name.



  • @Maciejasjmj said:

    If by "latest and greatest" you mean "stuff hacked together by some FOSStards and hipsters in their basement who didn't give a shit about making it runnable on a system about 90% of people use, because IT'S THE YEAR OF DESKTOP LINUX or whatever".

    Whatever, blakey. Like it or not, it's the reality.

    @Maciejasjmj said:

    I don't frequent dev conferences, but I'm pretty certain you're just pulling this out of your ass. Sure, cool kids use *nix and bash Windows on every occasion, but as far as actual development goes, .NET is holding out just fine. And the only reason people would shift to *nix is because they have to, since their language's developers are basement dwellers who can't be arsed to make their shit run on Windows without hacking it up.

    Nothing wrong with .NET. Except there's never been a better technology that has produced less impressive results. One of the reasons Stack Overflow is so unusual is that it's the only publicly popular software built on the NET platform. Everything else is intranet-style stuff. Hell, even MS avoids using NET for their products.

    You can rant however much you like, it won't change this fact. Web is built on linux. And "running well on Windows" is becoming less and less relevant outside of the web browser.

    @Maciejasjmj said:

    Ah, so it's:1. Drop cmd2. Expose PowerShell3. ???????4. Developers! Developers! Developers!

    Yes. See, you get it.

    @Maciejasjmj said:

    Your problem, not Microsoft's.

    Microsoft's problem if they want me to recommend MS platform for the next project instead of *nix.

    @trithne said:

    Too busy writing code. Conferences are like meetings: Work goes there to die.

    Yes. Not the point. All the top people, who set the standards and culture, go there. The stuff on conferences today is the stuff being "adapted" by Microsoft and taught in schools in 5 years and the stuff legacy VB/whatever coders are forced to learn in 10 years.



  • This post is deleted!


  • Bloody hell... I used to joke about how their current naming scheme wouldn't make it past Windows 10... I guess they managed to out-Microsoft themselves by simultaneously keeping it and breaking it.

    "One Microsoft strategy"? So what will they name the successor to the Xbox One, Xbox One Two?
    <ssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssszsssszxxxxxxzzxdddxsdd fuck discourse>



  • Maybe XBox Two, with the next version of Windows being Windows 20?



  • Xbox OneMore


  • area_deu

    I wonder what the next Surface will be named.
    Surface One? Surface 5? Surface 10?


  • area_deu

    I personally would like to see Xbox One² - the same old thing, but square!



  • Xbox One+


  • SockDev

    @Luhmann said:

    Xbox One+

    nah...

    Xbox ++One



  • OneBox X
    (Redirected from: One Xbox)

    Not to be confused with Xbox One

    OneBox X, commonly referred to as One Xbox, is a next-gen video console, successor of OneBox (...)


  • area_deu

    One Box is something from IE9 and all later versions, actually:
    http://windows.microsoft.com/en-US/internet-explorer/products/ie-9/features/one-box



  • OneBox

    Not to be confused with One Box, an IE9 thingy


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