Vote of No Confidence



  • Let's move the forums to PhpBB. Sure it's equally old and creaky, but here's the deal:

    1. It's actively maintained, which seems to be one of Alex's things
    2. It supports WYSIWYG editors (proper ones) and every other feature CS supports, as far as I know-- selective quoting maybe not
    3. No endless scrolling broken bullshit, no strange toaster windows whenever you try to type a post, and everybody already knows how to use it (or, if they used CS, they can figure it out damned quick)

    Unless Alex's goal is literally to implement another WTF forum (which it seems like from his posts, it isn't... but God knows how he tried this endless scrolling and said it was acceptable!) vBulletin or PhpBB are the best options remaining.

    The only chance to recover this Discourse clusterfuck is to disable the endless scrolling, which is sounds like is impossible. But as long as that "feature" remains, this forum is entirely fucking broken.


  • Winner of the 2016 Presidential Election

    You're just a Luddite and fear change.



  • Blakey;
    Seconded, thirded and fourthded.

    Joe; I am not a luddite, but if this horrible mistake can be undone then now is the time to do it.


  • Winner of the 2016 Presidential Election

    @skotl said:

    Joe; I am not a luddite, but if this horrible mistake can be undone then now is the time to do it.

    Filed under: Woosh



  • I know change is hard, but the nature of forums and discussion on the web has changed. We too must change with the passing of the boards.

    Resistance is futile, you will be assimilated....

    To be honest though I actually like the feel of the new forums. Its not perfect but it works way better than CS.



  • Roger (salute smiley) - I've noticed your other posts now and have concluded that you're of a similar mind to me :smile:



  • galgorahl "but it works way better than CS"

    Indeed, it certainly addresses some of the plain daft WTFs of CS. I guess the recurring point here is that there are plenty of maintained forum platforms out there that are not trying to be different, just for the sake of being different, because there are plenty ways where Discourse works way worse than other forums.



  • Just wanted to chime in and let it be known that my vote is for sale. I will vote in favor of Discourse, despite its flaws, if I get my mod powers back. I don't even care what they do; I simply cannot go back to being a plebian after having such phenomenal power.



  • I like the endless scrolling, esp on mobile. That's a pretty minor gripe, and i'm sure someone can submit a patch for it as a user setting. Maybe it already is a setting.

    AFAIK, a proper/usable WYSIWG does not exist for the web. Every one is terrible. Even the new HTML 5 ones.

    Regardless, unless someone else is wiling to reimplement the sidebar, comments, and feature comment integrations, get hosting, backups, all those things, then this is what we have.


  • Winner of the 2016 Presidential Election

    @apapadimoulis said:

    Regardless, unless someone else is wiling to reimplement the sidebar, comments, and feature comment integrations, get hosting, backups, all those things, then this is what we have.

    I'm a web developer professionally (and so are a few of us). I'd be glad to take a crack at it in my spare time.

    Get it into GitHub.



  • @apapadimoulis said:

    AFAIK, a proper/usable WYSIWG does not exist for the web. Every one is terrible. Even the new HTML 5 ones.

    Why can't we just post entirely in LaTeX? That would be \emph{super awesome}!



  • @galgorah said:

    Its not perfect but it works way better than CS.

    I feel it's a lot clunkier, and it flickers and swoops and scoots all over the place. It's an unstable UI.



  • @vote4sale said:

    Why can't we just post entirely in LaTeX? That would be \emph{super awesome}!

    You disgusting miscreant.



  • Yeah I fucking knew this would happen the first time you posted about this.

    @apapadimoulis said:

    I like the endless scrolling, esp on mobile. That's a pretty minor gripe, and i'm sure someone can submit a patch for it as a user setting. Maybe it already is a setting.

    Do you know the fact that extremely basic browser features, like the SCROLLBAR and HOME and END buttons do not work?

    Look: like is one thing. "Do you like X?" Whatever. You like it, fine. I'm not talking about like. I'm talking about broken. This product is BROKEN. It's broken regardless of how much you like or dislike it.

    @apapadimoulis said:

    AFAIK, a proper/usable WYSIWG does not exist for the web.

    I don't share that opinion.

    @apapadimoulis said:

    Every one is terrible. Even the new HTML 5 ones.

    Right; and the answer to that is... Markdown? To just give up?

    @apapadimoulis said:

    Regardless, unless someone else is wiling to reimplement the sidebar, comments, and feature comment integrations, get hosting, backups, all those things, then this is what we have.

    Why the fuck did you ask us our opinion those months ago if you didn't give a shit what we had to say?

    I said I'd be fine with Discourse if the endless scrolling were removed and if it worked on mobile. As it turns out, neither of those were done. Because you didn't give a shit about my opinion. And that's really the worst thing about all of this.


  • :belt_onion:

    @galgorah said:

    I know change is hard, but the nature of forums and discussion on the web has changed.
    Bullshit. The only thing that has happened is a few people (such as the mental midgets responsible for Discourse) have tried to invent new things that didn't need to be invented and are demonstrably worse than what is already available.


  • :belt_onion:

    @blakeyrat said:

    Why the fuck did you ask us our opinion those months ago if you didn't give a shit what we had to say?

    QFT.


  • Winner of the 2016 Presidential Election

    @blakeyrat said:

    if it worked on mobile

    But… You just said… It works great on your phone. *head asplode*


  • :belt_onion:

    @apapadimoulis said:

    AFAIK, a proper/usable WYSIWG does not exist for the web. Every one is terrible.
    And yet, somehow, people have managed to make more than 229,000 posts on the original site here. Wow. That's really terrible.



  • @joe_edwards said:

    But… You just said… It works great on your phone. head asplode

    Yeah, but that's a Windows 8 phone. As we all know, if it works on Windows 8, it must be broken.



  • @joe_edwards said:

    But… You just said… It works great on your phone. head asplode

    Right now I own a Windows Phone. Maybe next year I won't. I want a forum that works on all mobile. Which isn't fucking hard, unless it's programmed by morons. CS managed it, and I doubt the developers of that version of CS had even SEEN a smartphone. (What was it, from 2007?)



  • @vote4sale said:

    Just wanted to chime in and let it be known that my vote is for sale. I will vote in favor of Discourse, despite its flaws, if I get my mod powers back. I don't even care what they do; I simply cannot go back to being a plebian after having such phenomenal power.

    I also wants my mod powers back. Intercourse is like Communism: I'm okay with it, so long as I have a slightly larger horde of Bulgarian tractor parts than the proles.

    I'll do pstorer one better, though: not only is my vote for sale, but I'll throw in his vote for free. If he doesn't like it there's a Latvian turnip farm with his name on it.

    Filed under: The pstorer, united / will not be divided!



  • Hey Alex, I know we're not paying for this but I'd have hoped our views would count.

    Pretty much everyone canvassed was against discourse before you migrated and now that you have, I'm pretty sure no-one is actually pleased that they turned out to be right.

    A proper usable forum does exist on the web. Decent WYSIWIG editors are there, too. It's not just that we don't like it, but that the whole premise is fundamentally broken - as described at length on the frist topic.
    As I said over there, if you're going to back away from discourse (and I personally hope that you do) then better to do it early on than to persevere and then have to move heaven and earth to move to another platform.



  • When you're on the "main" thread view, it will pop up "X new topic(s)". But if you click that, it's just a new reply to a topic.

    Not a huge bug, but dang Discourse feels half-baked.

    Filed under: Discourse them before they Discourse you



  • @blakeyrat said:

    Do you know the fact that extremely basic browser features, like the SCROLLBAR and HOME and END buttons do not work?

    What's really interesting about this is that if you hover over the green up arrow dealie, it says, "jump to first post (home key)." So it really does seem like a bug and not an oversight, because clicking it works to actually take you there.



  • @morbiuswilters said:

    When you're on the "main" thread view, it will pop up "X new topic(s)". But if you click that, it's just a new reply to a topic.

    Except when it doesn't. Sometimes it puts a colored number next to the thread title. Sometimes it just moves the title to the top of the list. Sometimes, it seems, the only way to tell if a thread has new posts is to actually go to the thread — "I remember reading that post, so nothing new," or "I don't remember reading that post, so I guess there are new posts in the thread." @morbiuswilters said:

    Discourse feels half-baked.
    Being in an oven for an hour at 200C is not equivalent to 10 hours at 20C. One is baking; the other is incubating E. coli.

    Filed under: Guess which oven Discourse has been baking in



  • Nice :)



  • @dhromed said:

    I feel it's a lot clunkier, and it flickers and swoops and scoots all over the place. It's an unstable UI.

    Maybe I'm just to used to this type of interface



  • @dhromed said:

    I feel it's a lot clunkier, and it flickers and swoops and scoots all over the place. It's an unstable UI.

    I hate it, too, but I've already moved on to Stage III of the Grief Process: Trying to finagle my way back to the top, doing whatever it takes.

    Filed under: And I do mean whatever. :wink: :wink:



  • @morbiuswilters said:

    Trying to finagle my way back to the top, doing whatever it takes.

    How about clicking the button that points to the top of the page?



  • @ben_lubar said:

    How about clicking the button that points to the top of the page?

    Ben will be the first one I send to the gulag.



  • @ben_lubar said:

    How about clicking the button that points to the top of the page?

    Just don't try using the Home key.



  • @galgorah said:

    Maybe I'm just to used to this type of interface

    That's not something to brag about. Or mention in mixed company. Or say out loud. Or even think, really.



  • @morbiuswilters said:

    Filed under: And I do mean whatever.

    Don't threaten me with a good time.

    ...Although, knowing you, it might not actually be a good time. It might be an emotionally scarring horrorshow, leaving me catatonic, trapped in the prison of my mind, staring but not seeing, unresponsive, floating in darkness.


    Filed under: purple dildos, emoticons don't quote, Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn



  • @blakeyrat said:

    Why the fuck did you ask us our opinion those months ago if you didn't give a shit what we had to say?

    I did. You said it was acceptable. Barely, but acceptable. Then the conversation turned to debating about markdown, endless scrolling, and .9 version numbers.

    I've asked for help implementing a new forum, doing a data migration, all that for years. To date, no one has helped. Suggesting "oh just go set up phpbbs, and do a plug-in for X" is not helping. I hate PHP, linux, and all other tech things I don't know and understand. Especially if they don't come with a completely intuitive GUI that I can click through, or require reading any instructions. Fuck that.

    In the months it's been set-up, I've already seen some improvements. I think, @dhromed already fixed some weird things by changing settings. More will come. I saw they already accepted a patch that someone submitted based on this site, and I'm pretty sure the forum auto-updates.



  • @vote4sale said:

    Just don't try using the Home key.

    There will be no going home.


  • Winner of the 2016 Presidential Election

    @mikeTheLiar said:

    ...Although, knowing you, it might not actually be a good time. It might be an emotionally scarring horrorshow, leaving me catatonic, trapped in the prison of my mind, staring but not seeing, unresponsive, floating in darkness.

    Sounds like a good time to me.



  • @apapadimoulis said:

    blakeyrat said:
    Why the fuck did you ask us our opinion those months ago if you didn't give a shit what we had to say?

    I did. You said it was acceptable. Barely, but acceptable.

    He doesn't remember that and will either ignore that you've pointed it out or will deny it.

    I think I'm starting to get used to the infinite scrolling thing.


  • Winner of the 2016 Presidential Election

    @boomzilla said:

    I think I'm starting to get used to the infinite scrolling thing.

    I rarely have to deal with it because I mostly keep up with the conversations, and usually only have to read a handful of posts per thread at a time. Otherwise, if I fall behind, it is kind of painful, especially because it loads slower than I read.



  • @apapadimoulis said:

    I hate PHP, linux

    You are a good man, Alex.



  • Yep - what did it for me was having to go and do some actual work between lunchtime and hometime and then having to scroll through it all on my return.
    Maybe it's a secret plot to get us all sacked, because we can't spend more than 3 minutes away?

    If so, then we also all need to agree a time at night where we all stop posting at the same time, so we don't face the same problem when we wake up.



  • @boomzilla said:

    He doesn't remember that and will either ignore that you've pointed it out or will deny it.

    I think I'm starting to get used to the infinite scrolling thing.

    It's kinda Blakey's thing to be the cranky forum muppet. I'm pretty sure if he wrote the code for discourse he'd still be upset.



  • Yeah - cos he'd know it was shit and would have the decency to say so!



  • @joe_edwards said:

    I rarely have to deal with it because I mostly keep up with the conversations, and usually only have to read a handful of posts per thread at a time. Otherwise, if I fall behind, it is kind of painful, especially because it loads slower than I read.

    It's clunky and just awful UI design. That said, I might be willing to write a patch to make it do proper pagination as a user setting if:

    1. We're going to be stuck with Intercourse; and
    2. I had any thought it might be accepted upstream.

  • Winner of the 2016 Presidential Election

    @morbiuswilters said:

    1) We're going to be stuck with Intercourse; and2) I had any thought it might be accepted upstream.

    I'm going to reiterate my request for a TDWTF git fork of Discourse.


    Filed Under: [I love how it mangles the quoted text.](#tag)


  • Another bug. If you hit reply to another post, and someone else posts at roughly the same time, your link to that earlier post is lost. It's happened to me a couple of times and I thought I had mis-UI'd, but realise that it's now when someone else posts in the thread at pretty much the same instant,

    I'd post a bug-report but, meh.



  • Hmm.. had a few Intercourse tabs open and it caused my browser to shit the bed. Memory usage went crazy which caused the CPU to start going wild, ending up having to kill Chrome and restart..



  • @morbiuswilters said:

    ending up having to kill Chrome and restart..

    Just restart Chrome or restart the entire wang-dang-doodle?


    Filed under: fucking hell, truly god has cursed the blind, depending on where the --- goes it can be an hr or turn the line above it into an h1



  • @mikeTheLiar said:

    Just restart Chrome or restart the entire wang-dang-doodle?


    Filed under: fucking hell, truly god has cursed the blind, depending on where the --- goes it can be an hr or turn the line above it into an h1

    Only Chrome. It takes a really catastrophic website to crash the whole OS.



  • @morbiuswilters said:

    Only Chrome. It takes a really catastrophic website to crash the whole OS.

    Yeah, but popular opinion seems to think this might be that website. I figured it would be wise to double-check.



  • @joe_edwards said:

    You're just a Luddite and fear change.

    That is the word I want to use against all people afraid of discourse.


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