Save me from shit UI (you can't be saved)



  • Hey Microsoft. Hey-- hey Microsoft. Umm, hi. You got your copy of Excel 2013 open?  ... Yes, I'm going to fuck on you for Office 2013 again.  Well, you simply haven't learned. Okay, got it open? Excellent. Start a new workbook. Great. Put in something, anything, doesn't matter. ... I don't think that's how you spell that. Okay, now, without touching the mouse, save that workbook.

    ...

    Exactly.

    For anyone who has ever used Excel-- so, umm, everyone in the world at one point?-- ALT-F, S, type a name, enter BOOM done. Maybe CTRL-S. A couple other, I'm sure.  For anyone who hasn't used Excel 2013-- so, I hope, everyone, save your souls-- take a nice gander at this shit. Ranting below.

    1) Entering either of those two above keyboard shortcuts should have just brought up a "Save As..." box. Period. Instead, this flacid monstrosity of wtf.

    2) I just want to enter a file name but where that box thing? What directory is pointing where WHAT?

    3) If I click on one of those folders, is it going to overwrite my Excels from "recent"?  I don't want to overwrite, those are important Excels!  HELP!

    4) Why is Browse? WHY IS BROWSE?  Is not Browse meant to be "Browse...", with ... to mean more dialogs to come? No ..., so I need to save it in a folder called "Browse"?  Also, isn't Browse a grey button used to pick files to open or upload? WHY BROWSE? WHAT BROWSE? AHHHHHHH!

    5) ONEDRIVE WAT IS THIS NO!

    The above numbered list was a rough approximation of what any new, beginner or seasoned Excel user will experience when slapped in the face with this dick of a screen. It took ME an amount of time to figure out how to fucking save a file in Excel 2013. I didn't time it, but if that amount of time was anything >1ms, that's one fail of a save screen. (Hint: it was longer than 1ms).

    First, there are no keyboard controls at this point. You can't arrow through the options. You can't just type a file name. You have to use the mouse, because remeber-- THIS IS A TABLET (it isn't, it's a computer). But since THIS IS A TABLET (it isn't, and all caps are hard to read) you should be afraid of a keyboard. Because no one uses a keyboard when they USE A TABLET (also, no one in the history of ever has used Excel on a tablet).

    Second, the #1 option is "OneDrive". Fine, I get that MS wants to incorporate cloud saving into Office. I can even see a few use cases for it. Make sure there's a button to save into the cloud. What you don't do is break the save process by injecting your shitty Cloud product into it. Roughly 97.8663% of Excel users work in a company, and exactly 0% of those companies want their spreadsheets in Microsoft's soft and fluffy cloud. (Note: there are no rounding errors. It is exactly 0%).  For the other 2.1337% of users, they are casual home users who just want to make a quick spreadsheet to figure out how much everyone owes for pizza. Exactly 0% of them want to save into the cloud either. They just want to save the fucking "Pizza.xls" file for later. On their computer (which isn't a tablet).

    Third, STOP WITH THE FUCKING TABLET UI! As I said, no one is using Excel on a tablet. Excel isn't a "casual, social, retard" program that needs to be dumbed down and Crayon-ified. Maybe you can make that argument for some programs with a, shall we say, "simple" userbase. Those people don't use Excel. All you've succeeded in doing is making it more complex to SAVE A FUCKING FILE-- and any time you make things more complex to do and present less information about what's happening-- you increase the risk of data loss. People working with Excel do not want to lose their data.  It isn't just retyping a grocery list. It's lost manhours. PAID manhours.

    Third point two, speaking of UI-- STOP FUCKING UP YOUR OWN UI!  God fucking damn-- for those of you blessed to not have Excel 2013 to experiment on... you have to click COMPUTER, then BROWSE which opens up a BROWSE dialog, which you have to assume is a SAVE dialog. Since it says BROWSE, you would assume you're browsing for a folder to save your file in. Nope, you are actually saving your file at that point. Hope you didn't browse to a folder with an Excel of the same name as the one you're saving, hoping that after you were done Browsing you could give the Excel a name. BOOM, overwritten, lost data.  That is if you can even figure out that Browse is a button. It doesn't look like a traditional grey button.  Hell, it doesn't look like a button at all-- it isn't colored different, it's edges aren't raised or rounded, it just looks like a label. Hope you guessed to click it.

     Fourth: Fuck it. I'm clicking Post.



  • @Lorne Kates said:

    Yes, I'm going to fuck on you for Office 2013 again.

    Uh... so this is like WTF bukkake?



  • @Lorne Kates said:

    First, there are no keyboard controls at this point.
    Not to detract from an otherwise wonderful rant, I was able to navigate the the Save As dialogue using the keyboard from the spreadsheet; Ctrl-S, right arrow, down a couple of time, right, down a few more to the Browse, enter, and there it was.



    No, I don't think it's acceptable either, but it can be done.



    HOWEVER. No matter how many times you hit left, once you're in that right column you can't decide you want to save it to your OneDrive by keyboard alone.



  • @Lorne Kates: Did you uncheck the "hide keyboard shortcuts" checkbox in the "Pretty Effects" dialog check the "underline keyboard shortcuts" checkbox in the Accessibility control panel before taking this screenshot? I don't have Excel 2013 so I can't know.

    @PJH said:

    HOWEVER. No matter how many times you hit left,
    once you're in that right column you can't decide you want to save it to
    your OneDrive by keyboard alone.

    Have you tried SHIFT+TAB? That would be my first instinct for "go back to the left part of the dialog" .

     



  • @Medinoc said:

    @Lorne Kates: Did you uncheck the "hide keyboard shortcuts" checkbox in the "Pretty Effects" dialog check the "underline keyboard shortcuts" checkbox in the Accessibility control panel before taking this screenshot? I don't have Excel 2013 so I can't know.

    Pressing Alt displays overlays with the shortcut letter against what it will activate. On the page shown in the screenshot, there are associations only with the bit that was cropped out:



    @Medinoc said:

    @PJH said:

    HOWEVER. No matter how many times you hit left,
    once you're in that right column you can't decide you want to save it to
    your OneDrive by keyboard alone.

    Have you tried SHIFT+TAB?

    Ah - that works.@Medinoc said:
    That would be my first instinct for "go back to the left part of the dialog" .
    Wasn't mine, since it was right arrow that got me there to begin with, and since it doesn't look like a dialog, the tab key didn't occur to me.



  • I label you a Change Hater.

    Welcome to the club. There's beer and hard liquor in the fridge.



  •  Beat me to it.

    So, Alt-A,C,B (or 1 if it's a recent location)

    CS is not so good with the image embedding (or saving a post after failing to embed an image),



  • I wish I could so eloquently express my nerd rage at exactly this. It takes so many clicks to save to desktop or save to dropbox. Much more PITA than previous versions.



  • @WernerCD said:

    I wish I could so eloquently express my nerd rage at exactly this. It takes so many clicks to save to desktop or save to dropbox. Much more PITA than previous versions.

    I recommend changing your workflow - right-click on the desktop->New->Microsoft Excel Worksheet->double click the file, rather than opening Excel.


  • mod

     @Buttembly Coder said:

    @WernerCD said:
    I wish I could so eloquently express my nerd rage at exactly this. It takes so many clicks to save to desktop or save to dropbox. Much more PITA than previous versions.

    I recommend changing your workflow - right-click on the desktop->New->Microsoft Excel Worksheet->double click the file, rather than opening Excel.

     

    This.

    Or just go back to Office 2010. The save process is saner there.



  • @anachostic said:

    CS is not so good with the image embedding (or saving a post after failing to embed an image), or anything really, but it's still better than Excel 2013

    FTFY.



  • Screw this.  I'm going back to VisiCalc.


  • Fake News

    @da Doctah said:

    Screw this.  I'm going back to VisiCalc.

    Nah, Lotus 1-2-3 is where it's at.

     



  • Alt-F, A, B. Closed, no repro.



  • @db2 said:

    Alt-F, A, B. Closed, no repro.
     

    "Our industrial can opening machine can't open your cans of paint using the established workflow of 'magnetically remove lid' and 'tip can to empty contents."

    "That's because we put wooden plug in the paint can underneath the lid. The wood allows you to enjoy ads for our wood cutting service we know you'll love."

    "But our workflow is broken now."

    "'magnetically remove lid', then 'manually remove the wood (after reading ad)', then replace tin into machine, then tip can to empty contents. Closed, no repro."



  • @abarker said:

    Or just go back to Office 2010. The save process is saner there.
     

    Yes, that was the solution I went with. I tried Office 2013 for a month. Outlook is unusable shit with changed workflow and a non-intuitive UI that is 50% wasted whitespace and 50% distracting flash.  Word is an unusable shit with changed workflow and a non-intuitive UI that is 50% wasted whitespace and 50% distracting flash. Excel is an unusable shit with changed workflow and a non-intuitive UI that is
    50% wasted whitespace and 50% distracting flash.

    Sadly, didn't have a chance to try Access.



  • Lorne Kates? Griping about UI changes!? Will wonders never cease!



  • @Lorne Kates said:

    Sadly, didn't have a chance to try Access.
    You must have a very different definition of "sad" than most other people.



  • @blakeyrat said:

    Lorne Kates? Griping about UI changes!? Will wonders never cease!
     

    Blakeyrat? Unable to acknowledge sometimes UI changes are for the worse? Will wonders never cease!



  • I think TRWTF is that you're complaining about losing "manhours" because, assuming you are the man whose hours are lost, you still got paid for them and you're going to get paid more to fix the problem Excel caused. Bonus: you can blame point your superiors to this post so they can understand the problem. You'll probably get a high five and a bonus, or fired. Either way Microsoft is still the bad guy so fuck those guys.



  • Good rant, but sad to see that Microsoft tried and missed again. You should never make big changes to a UI. A new version is supposed to bring improvement, not to be a stone chained to your feet.



  • @Lorne Kates said:

    @db2 said:

    Alt-F, A, B. Closed, no repro.
     

    "Our industrial can opening machine can't open your cans of paint using the established workflow of 'magnetically remove lid' and 'tip can to empty contents."

    "That's because we put wooden plug in the paint can underneath the lid. The wood allows you to enjoy ads for our wood cutting service we know you'll love."

    "But our workflow is broken now."

    "'magnetically remove lid', then 'manually remove the wood (after reading ad)', then replace tin into machine, then tip can to empty contents. Closed, no repro."

    Sorry your shitty COM interop tool that pushes a hard-coded sequence of key events doesn't work anymore.



  • We're about a to do a company-wide upgrade from 2007 to 2013. I installed it to test out some of my Office-integration stuff. First thing I was presented with when opening Word was the stupid start screen. For 30 years, the standard convention for opening a word processing program was presenting a new blank document. I predict about 3% of users will like that change. When 97% of your users will hate your program in the first 500ms of the first time opening it, you fucked up.



  • @Nexzus said:

    I predict about 3% of users will like that change. When 97% of your users will hate your program in the first 500ms of the first time opening it, you fucked up.

    Based solely on your ass-pull prediction.

    Did it ever occur to you that maybe, just maybe, Microsoft actually did research? Instead of pulling numbers out of their ass?



  • @blakeyrat said:

    Did it ever occur to you that maybe, just maybe, Microsoft actually did research?
    If so, is their research better than Mozilla's?



  • @Lorne Kates said:

    Why is Browse? WHY IS BROWSE?  Is not Browse meant to be "Browse...", with ... to mean more dialogs to come? No ..., so I need to save it in a folder called "Browse"?  Also, isn't Browse a grey button used to pick files to open or upload? WHY BROWSE? WHAT BROWSE? AHHHHHHH!

     

     

    Battle in your browse.

     



  • @blakeyrat said:

    @Nexzus said:
    I predict about 3% of users will like that change. When 97% of your users will hate your program in the first 500ms of the first time opening it, you fucked up.

    Based solely on your ass-pull prediction.

    Did it ever occur to you that maybe, just maybe, Microsoft actually did research? Instead of pulling numbers out of their ass?



    I remember a tech talk Microsoft did on campus when i was an undergrad. A couple of the Microsoft devs were there talking about the nifty tools they had for user testing. When they rolled around to the (then new) ribbon, every single student looked at them like "WTF, you spent all that time and all that money developer user testing tools and THIS is the best you can come up with?" Almost a decade later, and the ribbon is now tolerated, but I don't know anyone who thinks it's a revolution in UI. Sometimes the research can still lead you down the wrong path.

     



  • @Snooder said:

    Almost a decade later, and the ribbon is now tolerated, but I don't know anyone who thinks it's a revolution in UI.
    Well, there are people on here who will argue strongly that it is more discoverable. Maybe it is for new users. But it was certainly disruptive to experienced users (i.e., the entire existing user base) when it was introduced. I am sure I am not the only one whose productivity dropped for a while due to the fact that "To do task X, click the A menu, expand the B submenu, and click item C," ingrained in muscle memory, no longer worked.



  • @blakeyrat said:

    Did it ever occur to you that maybe, just maybe, Microsoft actually did research? Instead of pulling numbers out of their ass?
     

    Yes, and then it occurs to me that either:

    1) They fucked up their research and did it wrong

    2) They did the research right, but fucked up interpreting it

    3) They researched using a limited pool of brain dead non-users

    4) They researched, but the designer/PM/whoever's pet project this was already had a result in mind and accidentally introduced confirmation bias into the testing and results

    5) As with #4, except the results were intentionally biased

    6) As with #5, except that the results were just ignored or fudged or lied about, because this is MY project and fuck the user I need a success in MY column so I can get promoted / get my bonus / look like I'm earning my salary

    Given the horribly trend of adhering to the bullheaded and poisonous culture of "fuck the user I know what's best" that's prevalent in-- well-- EVERY industry these days, I'd put my money on #6.

    So yeah, Microsoft may have researched, but I put no merit in it. Just because one research doesn't mean they research well, or use their results for the best. It's the same "research" that concluded Metro UI was a good idea. Or removing the Start menu was a good idea. Or XBone "always on spying" was a good idea. Microsoft may want to rethink their research department.

    I mean so far, from this thread alone (certainly not scientifical), but we're 100% of users hate the UI for reasons, and 0% (including you) like it for reasons. If you have a sound defense, go ahead. (ha)



  • @Nexzus said:

    First thing I was presented with when opening Word was the stupid start screen. For 30 years, the standard convention for opening a word processing program was presenting a new blank document.
     

    Fuck, I repressed the memories of that. That was idiotic. Guarenteed Microsoft destoryed creativity with that.

    "Shit, I have an idea I have to write it down for later {click on Word icon} I'll just write it down... what the fuck? {spends time trying to figure out new screen, finally gets blank document}  Fuck, I forgot!"



  • @Snooder said:

    When they rolled around to the (then new) ribbon, every single student looked at them like "WTF, you spent all that time and all that money developer user testing tools and THIS is the best you can come up with?"

    Seriously? Kids are stupid.

    @Snooder said:

    Almost a decade later, and the ribbon is now tolerated, but I don't know anyone who thinks it's a revolution in UI.

    "Revolution" is strong, but it's far, far, far superior to the mess of dialogs, toolbars, and bullshit Office was composed of before.

    @Snooder said:

    Sometimes the research can still lead you down the wrong path.

    That is true, but the Ribbon case study sure as fuck doesn't support that theory.



  • @Lorne Kates said:

    5) As with #4, except the results were intentionally biased

    6) As with #5, except that the results were just ignored or fudged or lied about, because this is MY project and fuck the user I need a success in MY column so I can get promoted / get my bonus / look like I'm earning my salary

    A combination of #5 and #6. Once you've spent a few hundred (or thousand) manhours on your revolutiony new features, you're not likely to admit that you fucked up. Instead you just blame the "stupid users who are afraid of change".

     



  • @blakeyrat said:

    @Snooder said:
    When they rolled around to the (then new) ribbon, every single student looked at them like "WTF, you spent all that time and all that money developer user testing tools and THIS is the best you can come up with?"

    Seriously? Kids are stupid.

    Sure, if you want to call 26-28 year old doctoral candidates "kids."

    @blakeyrat said:

    @Snooder said:
    Almost a decade later, and the ribbon is now tolerated, but I don't know anyone who thinks it's a revolution in UI.

    "Revolution" is strong, but it's far, far, far superior to the mess of dialogs, toolbars, and bullshit Office was composed of before.

     

    No, it isn't. I don't know anyone who considers the Ribbon as having improved their workflow at all. Novice users were fine with the default toolbar before, and power users still have to modify the Ribbon to include all the esoteric commands they used to drag and drop into their toolbars. Or (like me, they just make keyboard macros and shortcuts). It's not even smaller, since the Ribbon is three times the size of one of the old toolbar anyway, and includes pretty much the same number of icons as the equivalent screen real estate in toolbars. It's not worse per se, since it's generally about the same to use, but the only gain that I've noticed is that some icons are bigger.

    Meanwhile every other windows application continues to use toolbars with ZERO problems. The ribbon was a pointless and ultimately dumb idea. 



  • @Snooder said:

    Sure, if you want to call 26-28 year old doctoral candidates "kids."

    Ok well whatever the people who attended that talk were, they're stupid. Which matches up pretty closely with my experience of most Doctorate holders I've known.

    @Snooder said:

    No, it isn't. I don't know anyone who considers the Ribbon as having improved their workflow at all.

    Ok.

    @Snooder said:

    Novice users were fine with the default toolbar before,

    Liar.

    @Snooder said:

    and power users still have to modify the Ribbon to include all the esoteric commands they used to drag and drop into their toolbars.

    So the experience was no worse.

    @Snooder said:

    It's not even smaller, since the Ribbon is three times the size of one of the old toolbar anyway,

    Liar.

    @Snooder said:

    It's not worse per se,

    So... the people in your original anecdote were surprised not because they believed the Ribbon was worse, but because they believed it wasn't enough better? Or... what the fuck is going on now? You've confused me.

    @Snooder said:

    Meanwhile every other windows application continues to use toolbars with ZERO problems.

    Liar. Double-liar, actually.

    @Snooder said:

    The ribbon was a pointless and ultimately dumb idea.

    Because it wasn't enough better? Or... mind boggles


  • SockDev

    @Nexzus said:

    First thing I was presented with when opening Word was the stupid start screen. For 30 years, the standard convention for opening a word processing program was presenting a new blank document. I predict about 3% of users will like that change. When 97% of your users will hate your program in the first 500ms of the first time opening it, you fucked up.
     

    So that's 97% of users too lazy/stupid to spend a few measely seconds unchecking a single checkbox.

    Also, I'm not exactly finding it hard to see the whacking great 'Blank Document' button. It's even highlit by default. Is pressing Enter such an awful hardship for you? It must be torture writing an entire document.


     



  • @RaceProUK said:

    @Nexzus said:

    First thing I was presented with when opening Word was the stupid start screen. For 30 years, the standard convention for opening a word processing program was presenting a new blank document. I predict about 3% of users will like that change. When 97% of your users will hate your program in the first 500ms of the first time opening it, you fucked up.
     

    So that's 97% of users too lazy/stupid to spend a few measely seconds unchecking a single checkbox.

    Also, I'm not exactly finding it hard to see the whacking great 'Blank Document' button. It's even highlit by default. Is pressing Enter such an awful hardship for you? It must be torture writing an entire document

    You've never interacted with average MS Office users, have you? Like the kind that fill the ranks of office drones? Most of them bitch if they open a new document and the zoom level is off by 5%.



  • @Snooder said:

    @blakeyrat said:
    it's far, far, far superior
    It's not worse
    I gotta side with Snooder on this. In fact, I might even say it is worse, but just a little. With the old toolbars, I could have multiple toolbars visible simultaneously, if I chose to use the screen real estate to do so. I could have one-click access to buttons that are now scattered across multiple tabs of the ribbon, so that I have to switch tabs to access the tool. It's not a big deal, or even a medium-size one, but neither is it an improvement.

    I am curious why a change that most (?) users seem to consider, at best, "meh," you consider "far, far, far superior." Is it because it is easier for you to use, with your challenges? If so, ok. It is a significant improvement for a few users, and no real burden on the average user (in the long term). I can live with that; it is superior, but I reserve the right not to consider it "far, far, far" superior. Is it because it is more discoverable* for novice users (in 2014, how many people beyond, say, high-school age are using Office for the first time)? If so, ok. Again, superior, but not IMHO "far, far, far" superior.

     

     * I was going to question whether the ribbon is, in fact, more discoverable, but I just discovered a feature I never knew existed**, so I am willing to concede the issue of discoverability.

    ** Because I don't need to use it, have never needed to use it, and may
    never need to use it: "Start inking with your Tablet PC pen." I don't
    have a tablet. What is "inking***," and if it is really a useful thing,
    WhyTF can't I do it with a real computer?

    *** Office help has a single link relevant to "inking" (as opposed to "linking," which comprise the vast majority of results), half-way down the page, to gottabemobile.com****, which assumes you already know what inking is, but does have one small screenshot that illustrates it in Excel.

    **** Make sure you have Ghostery and Adblock enabled before visiting.



  •  Not to detract too much from the Ribbon bashing (go on, it's great to beat a dea horse - again), but:

     @Lorne Kates said:

    also, no one in the history of ever has used Excel on a tablet

    Well, ok, not Excel, but I have used a couple of spreadsheets on a tablet, when trying to make a graph from some data. Of course, it wouldn't be Excel because it was an Android tablet, and no spreadsheet available could handle the size of the data (I'm not sure Excel would either).

    In the end I solved the problem with Perl and Gnuplot, both of what run quite well on a tablet.



  • @Lorne Kates said:

    no one in the history of ever has used Excel on a tablet
    This appears to be an untrue statement. Excel supports inking. Inking appears to be primarily useful on, and possibly useable only on, tablets. Gottabemobile.com (no, I don't gotta be mobile when I'm sitting at my desk at work) has a screenshot of an inked Excel spreadsheet, so apparently at least one person has used Excel on a tablet at least once. 



  • @RaceProUK said:

    So that's 97% of users too lazy/stupid to spend a few measely seconds unchecking a single checkbox.
     

    So let me get this straight. Users, in order to return their program to it's expected behavior, have to:

    1) Turn to Google

    2) Read some random ass' blog

    3) To find an option three menus deep (which, BTW-- options should be under Tools, not File-- so yay to even less discovery)

    4) To learn about a checkbox that isn't discoverable on it's own, because it requires you to know the name of a new feature you've never seen before, instead of the functionality they're looking for (it says "[x] Show that Start screen when this applicaiton starts", instead of [x] Open with a blank document like you've always done motherfucker"

    ... all that, minutes for an expert at googling who is comfortable fucking around with Word options, a fuck lot longer for the majority of users who aren't... just to restore expected, standard behavior... all the while this STILL doesn't solve the "surprise fuck you" of the user's first time experience with the "upgraded product".

    Yeah, great solution, MS. Great.

     And for the record, the screenshot you provided is just another example of the shit, undiscoverable UI of Office 2013. No, it is not obvious what to do. First, the fucking waste-of-space left blue bar is what your eye is drawn to first.  Instead of instantly getting to use the program, you're like "what the fuck-- loading screen-- umm-- nothing's happening. Okay, do I have to do something? Where's my Word?"  Next your eyes are drawn to the Cryaon shit smeared all over the place in the form of templates that you don't want and asspull 99% of the time will not ever use. Now you're like "umm, is this a slideshot? Tour-- wtf? Why are there no buttons? What do I do?"

    By chance you happen to notice the tiny-as-fuck "blank document" grey-on-white label... and you happen to notice that above it is not just empty white space but indeed an interactable object... then maybe you'll click on it. But then what? I mean this ALMOST looks like Powerpoint's template selection screen, but not. But even if you happened to be familiar with it-- once again THERE ARE NO BUTTONS!  You click something, then you click open. THAT IS HOW SHIT WORKS! Maybe you have to double click it? Maybe there's a hidden context menu?  Not only is this a retarded idea for a PC, it's double-retarded for a Tablet (which is what they're cumming all over themselves to create a UI for)-- because on a tablet you'd accidentally tap one of the other options and BAM now you're taking a fucking tour instead of being productive with a fucking blank document like you were expecting.

    What the fuck is the point of this screen? In every office I've ever worked with (or ANY group of Word users, office, personal, anything), exactly "almost fucking none" of them used a template. Open, type, done.

    Those that DID on a very rare occasion need a template already had one designed, and would open it, on their own, by their choice, as needed. So now that "once in a blue moon" usecase becomes something you need to actively decline every time you start the program.  This is as smart as if every single time you logged in to Windows, you first had to dismiss a modal popup: "Do you want to defrag your hard drive now?"



  • Lorne, have you ever posted anything on this forum that wasn't bitching about UI changes? Ever? Because goddamned it's tiresome. Take up a hobby, please. Like self-mutilation with power tools. That's a good one.



  • @blakeyrat said:

    Because goddamned it's tiresome
     



  • @Lorne Kates said:

    4) Why is Browse? WHY IS BROWSE?  Is not Browse meant to be "Browse...", with ... to mean more dialogs to come? No ..., so I need to save it in a folder called "Browse"?  Also, isn't Browse a grey button used to pick files to open or upload? WHY BROWSE? WHAT BROWSE? AHHHHHHH!

    No, it's not. the ellipsis means that more information is needed to perform the task the button describes. The dialog shown to perform the browse IS the task it is describing, so no ellipsis should be present.

     From the User Interface design guide- this segment has been the same since at least Windows 95:

    Ellipsis are used to Indicate that a command needs additional information. Don't use an
    ellipsis whenever an action displays another window—only when additional
    information is required. 

    In regards to Excel 2013, though.... Press F12, which still has the same action that it has since I first used it (Excel 5).



  • @Lorne Kates said:

    Third, STOP WITH THE FUCKING TABLET UI! As I said, no one is using Excel on a tablet. Excel isn't a "casual, social, retard" program that needs to be dumbed down and Crayon-ified.


  • Winner of the 2016 Presidential Election

    @Mcoder said:

    (go on, it's great to beat a dea horse - again)

    What do you have against mounted drug enforcement agents?



  • @joe.edwards said:

    @Mcoder said:

    (go on, it's great to beat a dea horse - again)

    What do you have against mounted drug enforcement agents?

    He likes to give their mounts handies.


  • Winner of the 2016 Presidential Election

    @Lorne Kates said:

    Not only is this a retarded idea for a PC, it's double-retarded for a Tablet (which is what they're cumming all over themselves to create a UI for)-- because on a tablet you'd accidentally tap one of the other options and BAM now you're taking a fucking tour instead of being productive with a fucking blank document like you were expecting.
    Has no one noticed the stupidity of optimizing for no keyboard in a word processor, where the primary use case is typing a document?



  • @HardwareGeek said:

    @Lorne Kates said:

    no one in the history of ever has used Excel on a tablet
    This appears to be an untrue statement. Excel supports inking. Inking appears to be primarily useful on, and possibly useable only on, tablets. Gottabemobile.com (no, I don't gotta be mobile when I'm sitting at my desk at work) has a screenshot of an inked Excel spreadsheet, so apparently at least one person has used Excel on a tablet at least once. 


    I believe Lorne was talking about iPad-like tablets, not some laptop with a touchscreen. Laptops with touchscreens can use grown-up interfaces like everyone else.


  • SockDev

    @Lorne Kates said:

    @RaceProUK said:

    So that's 97% of users too lazy/stupid to spend a few measely seconds unchecking a single checkbox.
     

    So let me get this straight. Users, in order to return their program to it's expected behavior, have to:

     

    Think for themselves. Of course, that assumes they actually have a brain, and not just some leftover jelly from some birthday party.

    @Lorne Kates said:

    What the fuck is the point of this screen? In every office I've ever
    worked with (or ANY group of Word users, office, personal, anything),
    exactly "almost fucking none" of them used a template.

    You've answered your own question. You're just too stubborn to realise it.

    @Lorne Kates said:

    because on a tablet you'd accidentally tap one of the other options and
    BAM now you're taking a fucking tour instead of being productive with a
    fucking blank document like you were expecting

    Because obviously you've never accidentally clicked the wrong button ever. You're not fallible.

     

    Now excuse me while I reset my bullshit-o-meter - I think i just broke it.

     



  • @blakeyrat said:

    Did it ever occur to you that maybe, just maybe, Microsoft actually did research? Instead of pulling numbers out of their ass?

    This is actually the scariest thought. Imagine the shit they rejected.


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